skinsn24 Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 Generally, I agree with you Hap, but something has happened here. The Stadium is being built, but I haven't seen anyone pony up yet...so where's the money coming from...and if it's a bank, who's collateral is it?I know my bank gets a bit upset when I suggest spending some of my cash assets I have tied up as collateral. I just don't think Jerruh is very liquid these days. tr1, honestly cowboys aside, let me give you this scenerio: A man has a net worth of around 1.1 billion dollars. He wants to build a new shopping mall. A very expensive shopping mall. Do you think he is going to take all his cash and build that mall or do you think he is going to get multi investors, and multiple banks giving him loans agaisnt the building and property itself. You know the answer as do I. When you have assets, getting cash is not hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corrupt3d Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 Found the problem... EDIT: These threads are pointless, because at the end of the day, the Cowboys fans will think they are the **** and the Redskins fans will think that the Cowboys are ****. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tr1 Posted March 6, 2008 Author Share Posted March 6, 2008 tr1, honestly cowboys aside, let me give you this scenerio:A man has a net worth of around 1.1 billion dollars. He wants to build a new shopping mall. A very expensive shopping mall. Do you think he is going to take all his cash and build that mall or do you think he is going to get multi investors, and multiple banks giving him loans agaisnt the building and property itself. You know the answer as do I. When you have assets, getting cash is not hard. Do you understand liquidity? None of you know what collateral he put up. I'm thinking he put up a lot...so much so, that the guy isn't very liquid right now...hence, his inability to do much in free agency. Jerruh is having a cash problem. Oh, and if you puke fans think that stadium will always be full, here's some easy reading for you: http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=940DEFDF1E3FF935A35752C1A96E948260 Also, here's a little picture of your fan base in Texas: 8) finally I have to say that yesterdays crowd was the worst I have ever seen...I dont go to alot of games at Texas Stadium because I live in Atlanta, but of the 10 or so games I have been to there that was by FAR the worst...1000's of no shows, even in the lower levels...the fans that were there rarely made any noise, and with 6 1/2 minutes left the crowd started a mass exodus, almost like we were losing 41-0 or something...people sitting around us seemed amazed that we wanted to stand and yell the entire game...several times I actually yelled "come on people, make noise" and the sad thing was virtually everyone in the endzone section could actually HEAR me...worst atmosphere I have ever been in for a live sporting event...local fans should be ashamed... http://cowboyszone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=39429 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tr1 Posted March 6, 2008 Author Share Posted March 6, 2008 Again, i simply said how do you agree with Tr1's notion that Jerry Jones is: 1. Paying for the stadium out of his own liquid cash (not a loan or anything) 2. The stadium will not sell 3. He will be so broke that he is forced to sell the team. Please, if you para-phrase me, do it correctly. First, if one takes out a loan "or anything", one must have collateral. That collateral then becomes bound...one can't use it for ANYTHING. If you're telling me Jerruh hasn't put up ANYTHING, then you're a nut... Second, Texas Stadium has a history of not selling when the pukes lose. If anyone thinks the pukes aren't about to go on a losing jag, they're not good football fans... Third, these are tough times...Texas is most vulnerable to contractions in our economy. I'm thinking the whole NFL experience has about peaked. The league is likely to have some hard times in the very near future. And when an owner has just thrown a billion dollars into the process, when the economy is faltering, it's a huge gamble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coolbeans Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 Please, if you para-phrase me, do it correctly.First, if one takes out a loan "or anything", one must have collateral. That collateral then becomes bound...one can't use it for ANYTHING. If you're telling me Jerruh hasn't put up ANYTHING, then you're a nut... Second, Texas Stadium has a history of not selling when the pukes lose. If anyone thinks the pukes aren't about to go on a losing jag, they're not good football fans... Third, these are tough times...Texas is most vulnerable to contractions in our economy. I'm thinking the whole NFL experience has about peaked. The league is likely to have some hard times in the very near future. And when an owner has just thrown a billion dollars into the process, when the economy is faltering, it's a huge gamble. I see you ignored my last post so I'll post it again. "You can't be this dense so just stop it. The F'n stadium itself is the collateral. When you get a loan to build a house, do you give the bank some other collateral? No, they hold the note against the house. Its the same with any commercial project, the numbers are just larger. Jerry Jones is as broke as you are smart. Translation, he's got lots and lots of money." If you honestly think that a person has to put up $500 million in collateral to get a $500 million dollar loan to build a commercial project, then you are seriously hopeless. This routine you are on this time is beyond stupid and you cannot honestly believe a word you are typing. Let me give you an idea of how things work in the real world, not the Cowboys-hate world you have created for yourself. The day Jerry announced plans for a new stadium, he probably fielded phone calls from every bank in town and dozens from out of town wanting to land the financing of the stadium. That stadium represents a goldmine for a bank. A longterm return on a large sum of money that is about as safe as it gets. The Cowboys aren't going anywhere, they make tons of money, and are not going to default on any loan. Dozens of banks were probably trying to outbid each other for the deal. There is 0% chance that Jerry Jones is using any of his personal money to build the stadium. Want to know what he did do with some of his personal money? Before contruction began, he bought a ton of steel futures to hedge against the price of steel going up. If that happened, he would profit just as much as the increased cost of the stadium. If steel went down, the cost of the stadium would go down and he would be financing less of it. Back to your idiotic notion that he isn't restructuring because he doesn't have any cash. First, lets see some evidence. Show me a statement or article where he makes reference to this. Show me somewhere where someone with knowledge of his finances makes this claim. Problem is, you can't because its just somesthing you made up. Second, the reason he hasn't restructed anyone is because he doesn't have to at this time. With the money being thrown around to free agents right now, it makes no sense to sign them now for top dollar. Everyone wants $6-8 million a year right now. Dallas cannot sign everyone to those types of deals and still be able to keep guys like Newman and Ware in the future. No team could. There is also the chance that he is waiting to see a team is willing to give up draft picks for Hamlin, Barber, or Canty. If they are, he will decide if he'd rather have the picks or the player. Bottom line is, they isn't one shred of evidence that he is cash strapped and cannot do deals. In fact, he just did Flo's deal and gave him a bunch of cash. So go ahead and repond and tell me again how he used all his money as collateral and Dallas hasn't won a playoff game in more than a decade. I mean its been almost 2 hours since you reminded us all! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coolbeans Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 First, if one takes out a loan "or anything", one must have collateral. That collateral then becomes bound...one can't use it for ANYTHING. If you're telling me Jerruh hasn't put up ANYTHING, then you're a nut... This statement tells me you have no idea how the financing of real estate projects works. Financing for any building project, be it residential or commercial, is not tied to some form of outside collateral. The collateral is the building project itself. The bank who is financing the project releases money to the builder at various stages of the project after thorough inspections to make sure that a certain percentage of the project is complete. Once the project is complete, the bank simply holds a note against the project just like the mortgage for your house. Are you really trying to convince everyone that every single commercial project or building had someone put up cash or other collateral before gaining financing. Seriously man, read a real estate book or something. It called OPM, other people's money. Its how wealthy people get wealthier. They never use their own money for anything. Their own money is tied up in interest earning investments that are shielded from government taxes. I just have to say this really is one of your dumbest ideas yet! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doncherry Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 Third, these are tough times...Texas is most vulnerable to contractions in our economy. I'm thinking the whole NFL experience has about peaked. The league is likely to have some hard times in the very near future. And when an owner has just thrown a billion dollars into the process, when the economy is faltering, it's a huge gamble. Banking on the NFL's continued success and prosperity is a huge gamble? Really? After reading all of your posts in this thread its pretty clear that you are not a forensic accountant. Its also clear that you have no idea about what constitutes good vs. bad odds. I now understand why you refuse to accept even a sig bet... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE ONCELER1 Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 It's really hard to believe that this tr1 "guy" is 50-something years old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE ONCELER1 Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 There is also the chance that he is waiting to see a team is willing to give up draft picks for Hamlin, Barber, or Canty. If they are, he will decide if he'd rather have the picks or the player. Bottom line is, they isn't one shred of evidence that he is cash strapped and cannot do deals. In fact, he just did Flo's deal and gave him a bunch of cash. So go ahead and repond and tell me again how he used all his money as collateral and Dallas hasn't won a playoff game in more than a decade. I mean its been almost 2 hours since you reminded us all! I don't think this is true. He placed tenders on both Canty and Barber for the same reason he did on Hamlin: he wants to keep them. If he hadn't tendered Barber and Canty, both of them would have become UFAs. Hamlin is already one. By doing this, he can negotiate a long-term settlement with them. By doing that, as someone mentioned will in fact, give the Cowboys additional cap space. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE ONCELER1 Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 So basically we have more than double the space the Cowboys have.And WE are in cap hell. At this point, they probably don't even have enough cap space to cover the rookie pool, so they need to make a long term deal with Hamlin. Judging by TN41's response, this is a sore subject for Cowboys fans. Have you guys considered as to why EVERY year you are more and more OVER the cap, and then EVERY year, you have to go to your players and have them restructure just to get under the cap. Have you considered that no other team DOES this except the Redskins? Eventually, you will reach the breaking point, and all the restructurings will not help. In fact, all it take but one player to refuse to restructure to bring down that house of cards. And then you happen to have the OLDEST and most expensive roster and underperforming roster in the league. The Cowboys had $15 million OUTRIGHT and then they tendered some of their players, re-signed one, and franchised the other. All of that and in combination with your numerous restructures is why you have more cap space. It'd make alot more sense to brag about having cap space WITHOUT having to restructure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE ONCELER1 Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 But...but...but...Jerruh obviously isn't into restructuring (i.e., paying guaranteed money in exchange for contract extensions into out years.)You see, Jerruh makes a lot of money, but he hates spending it on players. I doubt anyone on the pukes will re-structure...though, after this year, Romo sits to pee may be forced to since he'll likely lose his starting job. How much you be willing to wager that Campbell loses his starting job before Romo sits to pee? Let's be real, the reeason why Collins re-signed with you was because he knew he had a better chance of starting by staying with the Redskins, despite what Zorn has said. Who do you guys think you're kidding? Campbell got hurt and was placed on IR, but that was to save face, because he knew when he got healthy---and he was, he would not have re-taken his starting spot under Gibbs. Campbell was healed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE ONCELER1 Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 You guys don't like to win playoff games either.:laugh: Well maybe you can't hope that another player on your team dies, so that your team can rally around that and ride their corpse to make the playoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigMike619 Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 How much you be willing to wager that Campbell loses his starting job before Romo sits to pee?Let's be real, the reeason why Collins re-signed with you was because he knew he had a better chance of starting by staying with the Redskins, despite what Zorn has said. Who do you guys think you're kidding? Campbell got hurt and was placed on IR, but that was to save face, because he knew when he got healthy---and he was, he would not have re-taken his starting spot under Gibbs. Campbell was healed. stick to the topic. the topic is NOT Campbell vs Romo sits to pee and the topic is NOT Campbell losing his starting job. The topic is cap room and whether the Pukes are in Cap Hell or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elkabong82 Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dallas_Cowboys_New_Stadium The stadium costs are projected to be in excess of 1 billion dollars. That is almost double the original estimated cost of construction, and the stadium isn't complete yet, meaning the total cost figure of 1 billion could easily rise higher. The NFL will provide 150 million. The city of Arlington will provide 325 million in funding to be covered by tax increases. That gives Jones a total of 425 million in aid for the construction costs. Meaning Jones is left with at least 575 million in construction costs, and that figure will rise before construction is complete. However, a more recent article (dated back in November) says the stadium will cost Jones personally in excess of 700 milion dollars. (bottom of page 2) http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/giants/2007/11/11/2007-11-11_cowboys_jerry_jones_now_the_face_of_mode.html?page=1 However, I can't find any articles talking about how Jones' plans to finance the stadium costs, or if it will be solely out of pocket. I see a lot of posturing on here, and fact-based assumptions, but has anyone been able to find an actual article detailing Jones' personal payment plans for the new stadium? This would surely clear up the argument. Although I do have to admit, for 700 million, Jones is going to have to do a lot to to get help if he isn't paying out of pocket. With any loans, Jones' would have to use the stadium as collateral, and possibly fork over a certain portion of stock options in areas of the Cowboys franchise, and possibly have to promise a certain portion of revenues over as well. Hope this helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elkabong82 Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 How much you be willing to wager that Campbell loses his starting job before Romo sits to pee?Let's be real, the reeason why Collins re-signed with you was because he knew he had a better chance of starting by staying with the Redskins, despite what Zorn has said. Who do you guys think you're kidding? Campbell got hurt and was placed on IR, but that was to save face, because he knew when he got healthy---and he was, he would not have re-taken his starting spot under Gibbs. Campbell was healed. How about some actual facts to back up your lame theories? You are way off topic, troll. Come talk when your team can win a playoff game this century. St. Louis was interested in Collins, as well as Jax. Both teams have QBs with injury histories (Garrard and Bulger both injured last year, and previously) meaning those spots would be much more favorable to Collins than backing up a young QB who the owner wants to be the franchise QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elkabong82 Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 Well maybe you can't hope that ... Adios loser. Tasteless comment, and not even the other Dallas fans on here are going to back you up on that trash. Get a life dude, or at least seek therapy if you have to resort to that on a football forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigMike619 Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 How about some actual facts to back up your lame theories? You are way off topic, troll. Come talk when your team can win a playoff game this century. St. Louis was interested in Collins, as well as Jax. Both teams have QBs with injury histories (Garrard and Bulger both injured last year, and previously) meaning those spots would be much more favorable to Collins than backing up a young QB who the owner wants to be the franchise QB. First off, great facts with the stadium. 700 mil?!!! Holy cow!! And you nailed it perfect with "troll". He is in another thread right now saying that we are in trouble with Campbell as our QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coolbeans Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 Adios loser. Tasteless comment, and not even the other Dallas fans on here are going to back you up on that trash. Get a life dude, or at least seek therapy if you have to resort to that on a football forum. Agreed, I cringed a little when I read that. Not called for at all and doesn't help make any point related to the topic at hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigMike619 Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 Well maybe you can't hope that another player on your team dies, so that your team can rally around that and ride their corpse to make the playoffs. you outta be ashamed of yourself. There isnt one fan of ANY team in the NFL that will support you on that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OWUeagleMD Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 I'm still searching for any actual evidence that Jerry Jones is broke over the construction of this stadium. I've read plenty of hopeful speculation, but nothing even remotely convincing has been offered yet. It's curious that three teams in the division have abstained from the ludicrous free agent spending spree currently going on, yet only one is being referred to as a team in "cap hell." Very curious indeed, especially after two weeks ago the "puke" criticism was over the way they "overpaid" Flozell Adams. This thread is effing stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elkabong82 Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 http://www.wfaa.com/sharedcontent/dws/wfaa/latestnews/stories/wfaa080131_mo_cowboysstadium.78cb8324.html Interesting stuff in here too. Jones will apprently pay the cost of construction back throguh price hikes, stadium naming rights, personal seat licenses, etc. Some fans don't seem to happy about this, especially since it will cost $750 a year for parking alone (including the 2 home preseason games that is $75 a game just for parking). The team had also extended the sign up for club seats by 10 days because they weren't selling. The org. claimed 70% were sold, but it really is only 1800. The seat tickets were $129 each at Texas Stadium, here they will be $340. Panthers had the highest seat license cost average at $12,000. Cowboys are #1 now at $16,000. Still can't find anything about exactly how Jones is personally financing his side of the construction costs, but unless the Cowboys have a couple succesful seasons in a row, it looks like Jones could be in trouble. High prices demanded of a fickle fan base means Jones could lose a lot of money at the first signs of the team struggling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OWUeagleMD Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 Wait an owner is paying for the construction of a new stadium with price hikes, PSLs, and naming rights? Someone notify the newspaper industry of 1995, and inform them of this new development. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riggo#44 Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 "Just don't shut us out,” Glass**** said. “That's all we are saying." :laugh: Ok that was juvenile...but still funny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elkabong82 Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 Wait an owner is paying for the construction of a new stadium with price hikes, PSLs, and naming rights?Someone notify the newspaper industry of 1995, and inform them of this new development. Dude chill out, I'm just passing along information, there is no need to act like a smart ass. Besides, the price hikes for an already fickle fan-base do lend some credence to what tr1 was saying about Jones having potential financial woes. If you'd actually bother to read the article in the link, there is more in there too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigDFan5 Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 Well maybe you can't hope that another player on your team dies, so that your team can rally around that and ride their corpse to make the playoffs. too far Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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