You guys wanted this, now you got it!!

[Moorecards]

THIS is how you quote someone. :laugh:

But yeah....an electric current ran through my body as the 49ers signed Smith....OUR GUY!

I think he was overpaid with a six-year, $45 million contract that included $20 million in guarantees.

107 starts 43.5 sacks, 466 tackles (314 solo) no more than 8 sacks in any year including 2 last year

[fpickering]

Its pretty obvious that I do have a life.

I read enough to figure out that for this organization, damn if they do, damn if they dont.

Congratulations for having a life.

Unfortunately, that has nothing to do with that fact that you posted a question that has been answered multiple times by the OP and myself. It has been the central theme of our posts for 6 pages. Had you read any one of these posts then you would know that your damn if they do, damn if they don't theme is not applicable.

[fpickering]

Wiflord stinks. He can't muscle his way into the lineup on a team that can't spell WR.

I have to disagree with you here. He definitely does not stink. Jacksonville had 6 WRs with with 24 catches or more and Wilford led the team with 45. I feel that his better years are ahead of him. At a minimum he is a solid NFL WR. As I stated earlier in the thread, I would have liked for us to at least bring him in for a visit and see what kind of contract he was looking for.

we have the luxury this year of being able to wait til round two, or even three, watch the prices move, watch the teams jockey. We simply do not have CRITICAL areas of need that absolutely MUST be addressed right this minute. We're in a fine position right now.

I would say that an upgrade at DE is pretty critical. All indicators point to us drafting one which is a sound strategy ... however, there is little or no room for error come draft time, IMO since we also need to add depth at CB, OT, OG, WR, OLB and S.

But as written above by APBT, the team is damned if they do, and damned if they don't.

I don't believe that the comments within this thread warrant the assertion above. It is much too oversimplistic. Basically the viewpoint from where I am sitting is that we should not give away draft picks like they grew on trees... (especially for for players who did not fit within our system, were not able to even get on the field or for a player who was rumored to be cut).

We also believe that we should not fully rely on the draft to fill the voids on our team as that is a risky proposition.

The answer lies somewhere in between. Keep your picks and use the draft for depth, a couple starters and possibly a star. Then complement that with a top tier free agent or two.

[fpickering]

Even you admit Wilford is a #2 WR at best. However, for the umpteenth time, we need a #1 WR for the WCO. Moss fits the number 2 role perfectly in a west coast offense, and Zorn has said that is where Moss will be used, and ARE will be in the slot because he fits that mold very well. Zorn needs a legit target at the #1 WR slot, and you yourself have said Wilford isn't that guy. Santana Moss is not tall enough to be the #1 WR in the WCO.

...perhaps you need to read about before assuming a 5'10" receiver can play in the WR1 role, or that a 29 year old who can't get adequate starting time on a team filled with crappy WRs, can play the #2 spot, which relies on cuts, beating the defender, and speed.

Seattle's #1 WR statistically from last season was Bobby Engram who is 5'10'' 192 lbs. Moss is 5'10" 200.

[APBT]

Congratulations for having a life.

Thank you very much. You should try the Kool-aid.

Unfortunately, that has nothing to do with that fact that you posted a question that has been answered multiple times by the OP and myself.

I guess I should be ashamed of myself, not knowing that you speak for the whole damn board. Maybe I should be ashamed for responding to this BS the way I am about to **Sniff**

It has been the central theme of our posts for 6 pages. Had you read any one of these posts then you would know that your damn if they do, damn if they don't theme is not applicable.

The central 'theme' of all your responses are BS babble at best.

Lets see; You want the team to spend money, when we just got of salary CAP hell; check. You want the team to spend money, when we already have a playoff calibre team in place; check. You want the team to spend money on free agents, when we need the money to pay our draft picks; check. You want the team to spend money, even though that experiment hasn't worked in 1999, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, nor did it work in 2007; check.

Its funny how you seem to like this vicious pattern that has now morphed into a virus. A virus that has made us the laughing stock of the whole damn NFL. It seems to me, that you want us to continue down this beaten path, so that, either you have something to babble about at work or you like the way we have failed in the past and it kills you that we seem to be steering this ship in the right direction, because you are simply a coWBoy fan.

I think I understand you now, so there is no need to respond.

[#21Taylor4Ever]

I think he was overpaid with a six-year, $45 million contract that included $20 million in guarantees.

107 starts 43.5 sacks, 466 tackles (314 solo) no more than 8 sacks in any year including 2 last year

I agree that the money may be a bit high, but Phillip Daniels?

171 starts, 59 sacks, 466 tackles (359 solo) no more then 9 sacks in any year including 2.5 last year. Did I mention he's 35?

Im just saying man...we need a rush opposite Carter, and Wilson's just not ready.

[fpickering]

Thank you very much. You should try the Kool-aid.

No thanks, I don't drink the Kool-aid.

I guess I should be ashamed of myself, not knowing that you speak for the whole damn board. Maybe I should be ashamed for responding to this BS the way I am about to **Sniff**

I never stated that I speak for the whole board nor did I ever come close to suggesting that I did.... but you knew that already. Do you often resort to levying false claims against opponents in an attempt to win a debate?

The central 'theme' of all your responses are BS babble at best.

Lets see; You want the team to spend money, when we just got of salary CAP hell; check. You want the team to spend money, when we already have a playoff calibre team in place; check. You want the team to spend money on free agents, when we need the money to pay our draft picks; check. You want the team to spend money, even though that experiment hasn't worked in 1999, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, nor did it work in 2007; check.

Yes, I want the team to spend money wisely on one or two free agents to shore up some of the deficiencies, keep our draft picks and then use the draft as a supplement to free agency. This is the strategy employed by successful NFL franchises. I would hardly call it BS babble.

Also, I never suggested that we go on a free agency binge and trade away draft picks like we did in the past. There goes another false claim on your part.

[APBT]

The post below is responsible for your little CRUSADE. #21Taylor4Ever give you props and you run away with his thread. Now you are sitting in his thread arguing with everyone who doesn't understand or agrees with your warped logic.

Read my last reponse, I know you understand what I mean.

Ya see how easy it is? THIS guy right here read the thread, understood what direction I was headed, and agreed that we should sign SOME free agents to fill SOME of the voids.

[APBT]

No thanks, I don't drink the Kool-aid.

Once you drink it you will began to understand.

I never stated that I speak for the whole board nor did I ever come close to suggesting that I did.... but you knew that already. Do you often resort to levying false claims against opponents in an attempt to win a debate? .

The debate was won win Mr. Snyder didn't go out and do what you have been suggesting for 10 pages now. You act as if you speak for the whole board because of your Crusade with signing FA's. Everyone is not going to agree with you. Move on son.

Yes, I want the team to spend money wisely on one or two free agents to shore up some of the deficiencies, keep our draft picks and then use the draft as a supplement to free agency. This is the strategy employed by successful NFL franchises. I would hardly call it BS babble.

Teams use the draft first and then go after FA's. Teams haven't been throwing away draft picks like the Redskins have in the past. We are a team trying to steer in the right direction. Let Dan do what he hasn't been doing since he owned the team. The fun days of splash spending is over. Get over it, because thats the way it is.

Also, I never suggested that we go on a free agency binge and trade away draft picks like we did in the past. There goes another false claim on your part.

I never mentioned you said anything about trading draft picks, maybe you should look into taken so Critical Analysis classes?

[fpickering]

The post below is responsible for your little CRUSADE. #21Taylor4Ever give you props and you run away with his thread. Now you are sitting in his thread arguing with everyone who doesn't understand or agrees with your warped logic.

Read my last reponse, I know you understand what I mean.

I could be wrong but it sounds like you are suggesting that it was somehow wrong for me to share the opinion of the OP and defend my position throughout this thread.

To make matters worse, you attack positions that I never expressed and then label said positions as warped.

Given these factors, how could I understand where you are coming from?

[elkabong82]

Seattle's #1 WR statistically from last season was Bobby Engram who is 5'10'' 192 lbs. Moss is 5'10" 200.

Statistically doesn't mean he was in the WR1 slot in the WCO. Every article posted on this site thus far talking about the WCO says the WR1 needs to be big and physical. Under the Seahawks depth chart, Engram is listed on the left side of the QB, the WR2 position, and Hackett is listed on the right side, the WR1 position. Hackett was injured though, which is why Engram had better stats.

[APBT]

I could be wrong but it sounds like you are suggesting that it was somehow wrong for me to share the opinion of the OP and defend my position throughout this thread.

To make matters worse, you attack positions that I never expressed and then label said positions as warped.

Given these factors, how could I understand where you are coming from?

An opinion is OK, but 18+ pages of the same garbage opinons is driving me nuts.

Futhermore the OP has moved on and yet you are still at it. Move on man, arguing with me wont make matters better for you; trust me.

Whats funny though is you wait 2 days to mildly call me out, thus forcing me take off my belt.

Lets just agree to disagree and move on.

[fpickering]

The debate was won win Mr. Snyder didn't go out and do what you have been suggesting for 10 pages now. You act as if you speak for the whole board because of your Crusade with signing FA's. Everyone is not going to agree with you. Move on son.

Daniel Snyder has a less than stellar track record as owner. Given the state of our franchise over the last decade, I would be hesitant to say that he is always right. In any event, I am entitled to my opinion as you are yours.

Let me get this straight. Because I express an opinion and then substantiate it with supporting arguments, I somehow speak for the entire board? If that were the case then hundreds of ES posters also speak for the entire board.

Teams use the draft first and then go after FA's. Teams haven't been throwing away draft picks like the Redskins have in the past. We are a team trying to steer in the right direction. Let Dan do what he hasn't been doing since he owned the team. The fun days of splash spending is over. Get over it, because thats the way it is.

Free agency starts in early March. The draft is in late April. How can teams use the draft first and then go after free agents? I think that you have this backwards.

I feel as though I am talking to a brick wall. My position from the start of this thread was to sign 1 or 2 free agents and then supplement that with the draft. I never advocated splash spending.

I never mentioned you said anything about trading draft picks, maybe you should look into taken so Critical Analysis classes?

In one of your previous posts you referenced what we did in past years and tried to suggest that is what I wanted to happen now. Although you did not say anything about trading picks explicitly the fact is that what we did in those years was give away draft picks like they were candy, deemphasize the draft and focus on signing/trading for many high priced free agents.

I have been clear that I don't support this philosophy throughout this thread.

I think it best that we conclude our discussion because we are not getting anywhere.

[fpickering]

Statistically doesn't mean he was in the WR1 slot in the WCO. Every article posted on this site thus far talking about the WCO says the WR1 needs to be big and physical. Under the Seahawks depth chart, Engram is listed on the left side of the QB, the WR2 position, and Hackett is listed on the right side, the WR1 position. Hackett was injured though, which is why Engram had better stats.

OK, I think that I may have confused terminology within the WCO with a team's #1 WR, #2 , etc...

[elkabong82]

I feel as though I am talking to a brick wall. My position from the start of this thread was to sign 1 or 2 free agents and then supplement that with the draft. I never advocated splash spending.

.

I have also argued in favor of a balanced approach to free agency and the draft. The problem so many posters on here have had with the OP is that he was suggesting we won't get any decent free agents because we have been quiet the first couple days of free agency. I'm all for bringing in a free agent if they fill a need and we don't overpay for them, but had we gone after some of the guys that have already been signed, we absolutely would have overpaid for them, especially considering the teams that signed them did overpay. I stated earlier that out of the free agents already signed, none of them really seemed like a "must have" for this team. But that part is just one opinion versus another.

I don't recall seeing you advocate splash spending in this thread, but the OP in his first post seemed to advocate just that. I know he wasn't, that he was just worried we had missed out on a few good players like Justin Smith and Ernest Wilford, but I agree with the other posters, and have said so, that there is no reason to think we can't find any good free agents only a few days in, with good players still available. This thread has boiled down to people only thinking the OP wanted us to make big splashes in free agency, and I think it is quite obvious most people on the board don't want us doing that, which is why there has been so much backlash here. I think most, if not all, of us can agree that so long as we get a couple good free agents for a good price, and answer the rest of the problems in the draft, that this team will continue in the right direction. HTTR!

[fpickering]

An opinion is OK, but 18+ pages of the same garbage opinons is driving me nuts.

Futhermore the OP has moved on and yet you are still at it. Move on man, arguing with me wont make matters better for you; trust me.

Whats funny though is you wait 2 days to mildly call me out, thus forcing me take off my belt.

Lets just agree to disagree and move on.

I know I wanted to move on but I had to respond one last time in light of these developments.

Remember, we established early on that we have lives so we can't log on everyday which explains the reason for the 2 day delay.

Just to point out, you are still here too so maybe you should take your own advice and move on as well.

Lastly, the only thing that happened when you took off your belt was that your pants fell down.

[fpickering]

I have also argued in favor of a balanced approach to free agency and the draft.

...I think most, if not all, of us can agree that so long as we get a couple good free agents for a good price, and answer the rest of the problems in the draft, that this team will continue in the right direction. HTTR!

I agree completely. Hopefully, we will stay on this track for years to come so we have the right mix of solid depth, starters and star players.

[elkabong82]

OK, I think that I may have confused terminology within the WCO with a team's #1 WR, #2 , etc...

It's cool. A lot of people on here, and in free agent WR X threads, have confused the roles also. In all honesty, until I read the articles on the WCO posted on the board, I didn't know the exact roles either. I knew the WCO emphasized the pass more, and that clears up space for the RB. I also knew that the system did require a big, physical WR. I didn't know what the various roles of the WRs in the WCO were, nor did I know just how important having a big guy at the WR1 spot is in the WCO. I wasn't a big supporter at first of getting another WR, I thought developing Mix and using Caldwell could work, but after reading those articles I realized we needed somebody else, one with potential who fits the physical requirements, or one who is close to the requirements but has WCO experience. In all honesty, considering this I'd be happy with either Hackett or Bryant Johnson if we are going for a free agent WR. I've said before that with Moss, ARE, and Cooley also catching passes that we don't need a bonafide superstar at the position, just someone capable with potential and/or experience.

[Moorecards]

I agree that the money may be a bit high, but Phillip Daniels?

171 starts, 59 sacks, 466 tackles (359 solo) no more then 9 sacks in any year including 2.5 last year. Did I mention he's 35?

Im just saying man...we need a rush opposite Carter, and Wilson's just not ready.

I agree we can use help on the d-line, more at DT I think (as Wilson/Washington/Daniels did get 11.5 sacks opposite Carter) BUT not over pay for someone like Smith. That is what the Skins been doing and look where it got us. I rather do nothing in FA than overpay these guys this year and wait for the draft and see what happens after June 1st.

[RedDevil]

Redskins seem to be waiting to make the smart move... I am happy so far.

[Campbell's_da_man]

So far, so good, no ridiculous moves to mortgage the future. This is the time when exercising patience starts to pay off and inflated values start coming back down to earth. The skins plan is to build some solid depth in free agency if they can, and maybe fill some holes.

[Stophovr6]

It's exactly what I wanted. Glad I got it.

[master4caster]

Nobody -- that we had a real chance to get -- has been signed by other teams for a price we wanted to pay.

I don't want Chad Johnson if it costs the Redskins two first round draft choices. I don't want Lance Briggs or Asante Samuel if the cap hit keeps us from rebuilding the lines, or resigning our own free agents. I don't want still-unproven D.J. Hackett at a Brandon Lloyd contract. I don't want Javon Walker if . . ., well I just don't want Walker. We never had a shot at Randy Moss.

I'm still skeptical of the Vinny-Danny team, but after eight years even they must have learned that free agents are just as risky as draft picks and new players need a season to be fully productive [example: Andre Carter, Antwaan Randle El]. A good player can hamstring a roster if he's not a good deal.

As far as I can see, the Redskins haven't lost anyone of value, yet.

[bbuzz1962]

Free agency moves can ruin your salary cap if you sign duds. Does the two words Adam Archuletta ring a bell? A huge bust. It's time to be smart and choose who you sign wisely. We are doing exactly what we should be doing. Only sign younger, more athletic, players who may actually help the team.

[SkinzHog]

Some of the greatest pickups for a good price at your local flea market are an hour before they shut down.

The longer these FA are the market the less the cost.

I am loving the new look.

Did all of these FA play on a SB team last year? Obviously they are not quick-fixes or guarantees.

Some trades looming i think:gaintsuck

Bring on Draft Day