armada58 Posted December 3, 2007 Share Posted December 3, 2007 Run left with Priest Holmes behind Tony Richardson and Willie Roaf?...I'm not sure Saunders had many days when his running game hadn't gained 8 yards on any carries whatsoever before he got here... Considering the runnin game was 100% ineffective, I would say he would have dialed up something for Tony Gonzalez. Fast forward to yesterday, I would imagine he would have worked in something for Cooley. With Gibbs making the final strategic decision, we ran it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadowplay Posted December 3, 2007 Share Posted December 3, 2007 If anything, people's thoughts are generally tempered BECAUSE the person they are slamming is one Joe Jackson Gibbs - the guy who brought three Super Bowl Trophies to the Washington Redskins. Some people just want to keep patting Joe on the head and say "it's alright, you'll get this thing turned around", but what if he doesn't? For certain, he has NOT earned any justification of a contract extension (as I've seen rumored that it's already a done deal). I've said it before and I'll keep on saying it - Joe Gibbs could have came in here and cleaned house and put Dan Snyder in his place and created a structure within the organization that has worked in the past here and around the league. Instead he chose to buy into Dan's big spending ways and neglect the draft....all the while completely bloating his coaching staff. The onus of this team's faults lies on the Head Coach and President of the Washington Redskins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peytskins47 Posted December 3, 2007 Share Posted December 3, 2007 I just want to win. Gibbs was supposed to bring me wins. He has failed to deliver. When it was announced that Gibbs was coming back I also thought the same. After the first Tampa Bay game I thought we were going back to the glory days. It is two totally different situations. I am not saying that Gibbs is the best coach ever, but Norv, Steve, Marty etc. could not do any better. If anything Gibbs has shored up a lot of things-at least it seems like the players want to play for him. I would just like someone to take us to the next level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimmySmith Posted December 3, 2007 Share Posted December 3, 2007 3rd & 8. 8 yards from ending the game. 8 simple yards away. On a day when the running game hadn't gained 8 yards on any carries what so ever...This play is why Gibbs must go. Once again he tried "not to lose the game" rather than win it. It never occurred to him that the defense had played for 20 minutes in the 2nd half and was done. There is no more fire there and not much insight into the game anymore. He is not a struggling 40 year old with something to prove, he is a rich 60something who has naturally lost his killer instinct. Players (and many fans here) talk of him in the same voice they would talk of their grandfather. They love him. You think any Patriots "love" Bellichek? You think Bellichek gives the other team the ball with a chance to win without taking a shot? Gibbs lovers here are doing more harm than good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted December 3, 2007 Author Share Posted December 3, 2007 If anything, people's thoughts are generally tempered BECAUSE the person they are slamming is one Joe Jackson Gibbs - the guy who brought three Super Bowl Trophies to the Washington Redskins. Some people just want to keep patting Joe on the head and say "it's alright, you'll get this thing turned around", but what if he doesn't? For certain, he has NOT earned any justification of a contract extension (as I've seen rumored that it's already a done deal). I've said it before and I'll keep on saying it - Joe Gibbs could have came in here and cleaned house and put Dan Snyder in his place and created a structure within the organization that has worked in the past here and around the league. Instead he chose to buy into Dan's big spending ways and neglect the draft....all the while completely bloating his coaching staff. The onus of this team's faults lies on the Head Coach and President of the Washington Redskins. There are still some fans who refuse to believe that Joe Gibbs has made mistakes, but my sense is that the pedulum is swinging the other direction now. I don't consider your criticism of him as unfair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewCliche21 Posted December 3, 2007 Share Posted December 3, 2007 I hope you know that half of the people who read this thread did it just to find out what "equanimity" means. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted December 3, 2007 Author Share Posted December 3, 2007 I hope you know that half of the people who read this thread did it just to find out what "equanimity" means. If the Buffalo game is an indicator, half of our fanbase hasn't figured out whether they're supposed to make noise when the offense or the defense is on the field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG Posted December 3, 2007 Share Posted December 3, 2007 Sorry, but no team in the NFL has assistants who have veto power over the head coach. A head coach doesn't "discuss" such decisions, he just makes them.Now, you can question his ability to make those decisions, but that doesn't have much to do with the way the team is organized. Jason So if a coach sends the punt team out on 1st and goal, you don't think the staff would cause a bit of an uproar over the headsets? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skins4eva Posted December 3, 2007 Share Posted December 3, 2007 As one of his earliest critics in this forum, I understand your position on Joe Gibbs very well. I don't think it's unfair at all. Joe Gibbs deserves the dignity of going out on his own terms--he probably deserves to decide whether he'd like to come back next season--but, from what we've seen on the field, he should retire. And there will be no shame at all in that. There's no shame when you've tried your hardest and done all you can do. I don't think anyone has ever questioned his dedication or commitment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Campbell's_da_man Posted December 3, 2007 Share Posted December 3, 2007 You need to read more carefully. I didn't say that the criticism of Joe Gibbs started this week. I implied that the unfair criticism of Joe Gibbs was heavy this week.I'm in favor of fair criticism of the man. It's the "bashing" that I regard as juvenile. Why would you suggest that Gibbs criticism is unfair? And yes, it was a lot heavier this week, but you better get used to it, because it's gonna get a lot worse. The fan-base was very patient up to this point, but they are growing very tired of supporting a sure loser. When the team keeps repeating the same mistakes over and over again, that's a sure sign that the once great coach has lost his winning edge, and you, my friend, are now part of the minority. The fans pay an awful lot of money to support their team and they want a winner. It's not like they can pick up the phone and let him know how they feel, so bashing him at the game may be the only way they know how to let him know their true feelings. Like it or not, Joe Gibbs is well on his way to wearing out his welcome here. I still love the man and what he was able to acomplish in the past, but the numbers in his win-loss record don't lie. He gave it a heck of a try, but it's time to say goodbye at seasons end. I think he probably knows this himself now too, but if he doesn't and tries to finish out his contract, it could get much uglier I'm afraid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted December 3, 2007 Author Share Posted December 3, 2007 Joe Gibbs deserves the dignity of going out on his own terms--he probably deserves to decide whether he'd like to come back next season--but, from what we've seen on the field, he should retire. And there will be no shame at all in that. There's no shame when you've tried your hardest and done all you can do. I don't think anyone has ever questioned his dedication or commitment. We see it the pretty much the same way. I don't want to see Joe making the crucial calls on the sidelines next season, but I wouldn't be among the screamers if he kicked himself upstairs for his final contract year (unless he starts dealing our draft picks away again). As long as we've come this far, I'd give Gregg Williams a one-year trial as head coach and Al Saunders his head with the offense. I'd like to find out what Al can do on his own now that he knows the personnel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TotalRecall Posted December 3, 2007 Share Posted December 3, 2007 How about the truth!!! You wouldn't give Norv Turner or any other head coach this much slack! Gibbs, Cerrato, and Williams need to go. We need a legitimate GM to pick the coaches and players. How about some "steadiness of mind" instead of hypocrisy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted December 3, 2007 Author Share Posted December 3, 2007 Why would you suggest that Gibbs criticism is unfair? Would you quote me please? Where did I say that it is unfair to criticize Joe Gibbs or that ALL criticism of Joe Gibbs is unfair? I think you know very well what I'm saying. The other posters seem to understand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skins4eva Posted December 3, 2007 Share Posted December 3, 2007 How about the truth!!! You wouldn't give Norv Turner or any other head coach this much slack! Gibbs, Cerrato, and Williams need to go. We need a legitimate GM to pick the coaches and players. How about some "steadiness of mind" instead of hypocrisy! The only person with any power to make any decision is Snyder. What will he do? This is certainly the biggest crossroads for him. Has he been learning from his mistakes? Bringing back Gibbs had the potential to end either very well, or very badly. There was really no in between. How does Snyder, seeing what Gibbs has done on the field, remain confident that Gibbs can win a SB in this incarnation? He can't. How does Snyder then extricate himself from this situation while showing Gibbs the respect he deserves? Not easily. Finally, where does Snyder take this team from here? There are incredibly important decisions to be made regarding the future of this franchise--and the stability we've enjoyed since Gibbs's return is probably at an end. My one comfort is the hope that our darkest days as a franchise are behind us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bulldog Posted December 3, 2007 Share Posted December 3, 2007 The point remains that the defense despite its flaws in getting immediate pressure didn't give up a touchdown on Sunday and the winning points actually turned out to be the SAFETY that the offense allowed in the first half................. without that safety the Redskins still win the game 16-15 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alwaysaskin Posted December 3, 2007 Share Posted December 3, 2007 How about the truth!!! You wouldn't give Norv Turner or any other head coach this much slack! Gibbs, Cerrato, and Williams need to go. We need a legitimate GM to pick the coaches and players. How about some "steadiness of mind" instead of hypocrisy! And yet Norv got seven years! We had seven years of Norv and two of Spurrier, you expect that mess undone in three years after this team has been hit so hard by injuries that it is absolutely ridiculous. Our O-Line is a Sieve and a Gibbs team without an O-Line is a bad team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skins4eva Posted December 3, 2007 Share Posted December 3, 2007 The point remains that the defense despite its flaws in getting immediate pressure didn't give up a touchdown on Sunday and the winning points actually turned out to be the SAFETY that the offense allowed in the first half.................without that safety the Redskins still win the game 16-15 Leaving out last season, I've never blamed the defense for a loss. With an offense that consistently fails to put up 21 points a game, it's hard to blame the defense for anything--they have no margin of error. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted December 3, 2007 Author Share Posted December 3, 2007 How about the truth!!! You wouldn't give Norv Turner or any other head coach this much slack! Gibbs, Cerrato, and Williams need to go. We need a legitimate GM to pick the coaches and players. How about some "steadiness of mind" instead of hypocrisy! You don't know me very well. In a bash Norv Turner thread that has been bumped several times recently, I am the lone defender arguing for fairness to the man. I have been critical of Joe Gibbs since becoming a member of this board, but I have always been careful to be fair about it. The man has earned it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmfam7 Posted December 3, 2007 Share Posted December 3, 2007 Sure Gibbs has made mistakes, after all he's human isn't he. How many of you on here have never screwed up on your jobs, probably not a single one of you.If you think you can do a better job at rebuilding this team call Snyder I'm sure he would love to hear from you. I would love to see some of you deal with the pressure this man has had to endure since he came back. He owes you wins what have you done for him besides praise him when he wins and kick the crap out of him when he loses. It is easy to be critical of someone when you are sitting by the wayside and not fighting in the trenches with them. I"m sorry my friend he doesn't owe you squat. Great post by the way oldskinsfan, certainly puts some things in perspective, maybe he will be judged less harshly on here though I doubt it. Unfortunately its this what have you done for me lately attitude that is not only pulling this fan base apart but also this country but thats another story. on a final note show some respect for your elders.:2cents: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmfam7 Posted December 3, 2007 Share Posted December 3, 2007 Oh and by the way Saunders offense wasn't here when Gibbs coached us to the playoffs his second season here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TotalRecall Posted December 3, 2007 Share Posted December 3, 2007 The point remains that the defense despite its flaws in getting immediate pressure didn't give up a touchdown on Sunday and the winning points actually turned out to be the SAFETY that the offense allowed in the first half.................without that safety the Redskins still win the game 16-15 Dude, the Bills had a rookie QB and a 3rd string RB starting against this piss poor D. Just watch them give up TDs the remainder of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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