UnKle RUku$ Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 After both devastating losses to Giants and Packers, I have seen things that I thought I would never see in all of my days of being a Washington Redskin! This team in Gibbs' new Era lacks what good and all elite football teams have...HEART...This team lacks heart in the playmaker positions and the coaching staff. I will try make my points short and sweet. But, These men lack what essentially takes an average team or a good team to elite status. You can not teach heart, coach heart, or inject heart! This is something that has to be built with the person! The problem I have with this team and HEART is, there is no reason for Santana Moss to take himself out of a football game when we are losing by 3 because he fumbled and dropped a couple of passes because he felt like the team would be better of with out him on the field. How and why do players on our team have these privledges?!?! Now, this shows another part of heart where it should never, ever rear it's ugly face: The coaching staff! Somebody should have told Moss immediately to get his ASS out there and make a play! Stop whining like a "cat" for lack of a better word and get out there and keep fighting. This was a VERY cowardly move! Where was Gibbs when Santana made this decision? Where was the wide recievers coach? Al Saunders? Jason Campbell? These are grown damn MEN, I dont care about the dropped balls, no receiver can say that they never dropped a ball and caught every pass thrown to them. NO HEART!!! I wish I could ask Gibbs face to face " Who is giving these players privledges to leave the field without being told to leave the field? Does any of Gregg Williams defensive players leave the field when they are tired or need a blow??? Hell NO, becasue they know if they come off that field they might not get back in! Williams has heart, The defense as a whole has heart! It's funny what a Middle Linebacker with Heart can do for your defense! Clinton Portis, I really think the world of this running back. But in the most costly of times he continues oto fumble the football. Where was Ladell Betts yesterday? What did he get like 5 carries yesterday? What happened to the interchangable backs that we were told we had? But the part about the fumble that really upsets me is they make these crucial mistakes and walk to the sidelines with a so-what mentality or and attitude of " Ok I missed up, so what now". HEART could you see Riggins or Byner with this style of attitude after a fumble on your own 12 yard line? Or could you see Gary Clark or Art Monk hang there head after a fumble is recovered and returned for the winning touchdown? NO! They are going to say keep going to me I can make a play! Not take themselves out of the game for the better meant of the team! THAT IS A COACHING CALL!!! NOT A PLAYER!!! I remember writing once last year about Leaders! We have no leaders! This issue still remains true to this day! There is no one on this team that will take charge and be a leader of the Team! Jason should have told Santana straight up " Im not going to stop going to you because you give us the best chance to score". We have got to weed out these players with no heart because they are tearing this franchise apart. I honestly hope Santana Moss is sick, not because of the dropped passes, but the cowardly ass move he showed us during a game that will come back to haunt us late when the packers and us are trying to get into the playoffs! I'm done, the 24-hour rule is in effect for me so I still have about 2 more hours to RANT! Before I move on to the Cards! This is another game that hurts, we should be 5-0 and 1st in the division! HEART!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saqs Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 Hard to disagree with the points you make. No player on any team should have the right to "bench themselves". If you have any sense of pride, granted you are healthy, you should want to get back out there and make up for your mistakes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UnKle RUku$ Posted October 15, 2007 Author Share Posted October 15, 2007 Please reply, let me know how you feel. This team needs to be held accountable for these type of issues! I just want to hear from you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veretax Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 I think it was said that Moss was hurting more than just his pride at that point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhouse Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 Well said. :applause: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gart Monk Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 This team has no Heart and no Soul! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UnKle RUku$ Posted October 15, 2007 Author Share Posted October 15, 2007 I can not cheer for a Cowardly move. He should've probably kept that information to himself and the team! You never give up! NEVER! Im not going to let that down for awhile. We are REDSKINS dammit, we fight til the end! REDSKINS! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vi Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 I don't know. Santana knows himself better than anyone, and if he realized he was going to be a liability than I think he was right to do what he did. I'm sure it's not something he WANTED to do (you don't get to this level in the game without being a competitive person), but he swallowed his pride and did what he felt was best for the team. Right or not, I think that took more guts to sit himself than just staying in a game for the sake of your ego. As for Portis, I think that was a coaching breakdown. If your #1 RB is struggling, why not spell him with your very capable #2 or FB for a drive or so? With the O line breaking down the way it was there is no way any RB could stay remotely fresh. I do think this team had heart, but it's concentrated in our young QB and our fierce D right now. Both played good games and refused to give up on the game no matter what happened. Sure, we have some things we need to work on, but I think we have a good team that really wants to win. It'll come together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UnKle RUku$ Posted October 15, 2007 Author Share Posted October 15, 2007 NO doubt, you make good points in your defense but still we are talking about Heart! It starts with the coaching staff! Trust me, Im not bashing any one person or the REDSKINS I love my team! This is why I can criticize. But anyway, Why are these players given the privledge to make these decisions?!?!? This is where it starts and finishes! You CAN NOT take yourself out of a game when you are the number 1 reciever...PERIOD!!! YOU CAN NOT!!! My issue is not with the Defense or Campbell, more with the playmakers on offense! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreek1973 Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 it is been said in many threads. Not as directly as you have but it has been said. I think fans like us, that have been around in Gibbs I can't believe many things about this team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UnKle RUku$ Posted October 15, 2007 Author Share Posted October 15, 2007 I can't believe he allows it to be honest! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vi Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 NO doubt, you make good points in your defense but still we are talking about Heart! It starts with the coaching staff! Trust me, Im not bashing any one person or the REDSKINS I love my team! This is why I can criticize. But anyway, Why are these players given the privledge to make these decisions?!?!? This is where it starts and finishes! You CAN NOT take yourself out of a game when you are the number 1 reciever...PERIOD!!! YOU CAN NOT!!!My issue is not with the Defense or Campbell, more with the playmakers on offense! Oh, I know you love the team. Your post is fair and well-deserved. I just have a slightly different opinion about it than you, is all. I feel you, but I'm still on the other side of the fence about Santana. There was no advantage for Santana for him to sit himself out, but he felt it would be better for the team if he took himself out of the game. He even took responsibility for the loss afterwards! I don't think that's heartless. I think his confidence is WAY low right now, and I agree that the coaching staff should have probably kept him in to maybe help boost that confidence a little. Still, he's a grown man who made a hard decision, and I respect that. I think how Santana plays these next few weeks will tell us a lot about him. He's been beat down these last few weeks, and hit an all-time low this week. How he rebounds from that says a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylor 36 Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 If Santana was taking himself out to help the team, he should have left much earlier. Leaving after the fumble shows me he left because his ego was bruised more than anything else. I am not saying we should bench him or get rid of him, but Moss did cost us that game. I hope he works hard to make that up to all of his teammates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loyal2Washington Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 I don't know. Santana knows himself better than anyone, and if he realized he was going to be a liability than I think he was right to do what he did. I'm sure it's not something he WANTED to do (you don't get to this level in the game without being a competitive person), but he swallowed his pride and did what he felt was best for the team. Right or not, I think that took more guts to sit himself than just staying in a game for the sake of your ego. I remember a certain playoff game, I think 96-97, were T.O. dropped numerous balls and even a TD but he keep himself in and ended up winning the game on what turned out to be the toughest catch of the game, why? Because he was there best WR and they keep going to him regardless of the drops. I can't believe you made me have to make a point about a time when T.O. was a better teammate then Santana. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cakmoney61 Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 I agree with you. The coaches or players should have dragged Moss' behind back out on that field! Moss is not a coward however. He simply loss confidence in his abilities...and so did the coaches and players. It truly is an indictment on the team that he didn't come back into the game. Moss should have had a minimum of 20 feet in his rear end kicking his tail back onto the field. Instead the players and coaches not doing anything was equivalent to kicking him while he was already down (on himself). It bothers me more that no one exhorted him or expressed their need for him to get back out there and fight. That really is a heart issue that involves the entire team. This would never have happened during the Gibbs I era. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonkeyTeeth Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 I thought there was plenty of heart on display yesterday, just not a lot left in the tank on offense after the OL was 'body-bagged' for the most part. There's nothing systemtically bad about the team that I saw in yesterday's loss. Individual execution was repeatedly sloppy, and by the end of the game we were close to being physically unable to execute much of an offense. That's it. We lost. It hurts, but the season is far from over and there's nobody that needs to be 'weeded out' at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UnKle RUku$ Posted October 15, 2007 Author Share Posted October 15, 2007 Oh, I know you love the team. Your post is fair and well-deserved. I just have a slightly different opinion about it than you, is all.I feel you, but I'm still on the other side of the fence about Santana. There was no advantage for Santana for him to sit himself out, but he felt it would be better for the team if he took himself out of the game. He even took responsibility for the loss afterwards! I don't think that's heartless. I think his confidence is WAY low right now, and I agree that the coaching staff should have probably kept him in to maybe help boost that confidence a little. Still, he's a grown man who made a hard decision, and I respect that. I think how Santana plays these next few weeks will tell us a lot about him. He's been beat down these last few weeks, and hit an all-time low this week. How he rebounds from that says a lot. :applause: You are exactly right. I love Santana but for him to pull himeself is WRONG. It shows a bad example, and view of our team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UnKle RUku$ Posted October 15, 2007 Author Share Posted October 15, 2007 I agree with you. The coaches or players should have dragged Moss' behind back out on that field! Moss is not a coward however. He simply loss confidence in his abilities...and so did the coaches and players. It truly is an indictment on the team that he didn't come back into the game. Moss should have had a minimum of 20 feet in his rear end kicking his tail back onto the field. Instead the players and coaches not doing anything was equivalent to kicking him while he was already down (on himself). It bothers me more that no one exhorted him or expressed their need for him to get back out there and fight. That really is a heart issue that involves the entire team. This would never have happened during the Gibbs I era. Im sorry and apologize to MOSS, you are not a Coward. However, that was a cowardly act that has to be recognized! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vi Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 I remember a certain playoff game, I think 96-97, were T.O. dropped numerous balls and even a TD but he keep himself in and ended up winning the game on what turned out to be the toughest catch of the game, why? Because he was there best WR and they keep going to him regardless of the drops. I can't believe you made me have to make a point about a time when T.O. was a better teammate then Santana. Yeah, I can't believe I made you do that either. :laugh: Let's never make it happen again. But generally speaking, you kinda missunderstood my point. Personally? I think Moss should have stayed in. What I was disputing was calling what he did "heartless." Right or wrong, I think making a call like that would be a really hard thing to do. Santana has never done anything to make us think that he does not want to be in and play his hardest every game, and for him to take himself out must have been hard. Right or wrong, I think Santana was trying to do what was right. I don't think that about TO. I think TO wanted to make TO feel better. I doubt it had much of anything to do with his teammates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
csnow03 Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 I understand the frustration about Moss. However, he stated the reason he was not on the field was his hamstring cramped up on the long pass he dropped. He took himself out because he was injured not because he was afraid of the ball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loyal2Washington Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 I also remember a 1991 game against the Giants, in the Meadowlands, against a team that beat us six times in a row. Gary Clark DROPPED two sure TD's and the Giants led 13-0 at half. The second half Clark scores two TD's and we go on to win 14-13. Well at least we have the good ole days when players wanted the ball and to be on the field to make plays regardless of what happened the last play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UnKle RUku$ Posted October 15, 2007 Author Share Posted October 15, 2007 I thought there was plenty of heart on display yesterday, just not a lot left in the tank on offense after the OL was 'body-bagged' for the most part.There's nothing systemtically bad about the team that I saw in yesterday's loss. Individual execution was repeatedly sloppy, and by the end of the game we were close to being physically unable to execute much of an offense. That's it. We lost. It hurts, but the season is far from over and there's nobody that needs to be 'weeded out' at this point. Hey, we are in a 24 hour rule, HOwever you make great points about sloppy-ness and poor execution. There were defensive mistakes as well though, I think Taylor could've made a record 5 picks yesterday. But the season is not over, but when jocking for home field or playoff births this could hold true later! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loyal2Washington Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 Yeah, I can't believe I made you do that either. :laugh: Let's never make it happen again. I don't think that about TO. I think TO wanted to make TO feel better. I doubt it had much of anything to do with his teammates. :laugh: Deal but Steve Young is on record as saying that play turned Terrell Owens into T.O. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UnKle RUku$ Posted October 15, 2007 Author Share Posted October 15, 2007 I understand the frustration about Moss. However, he stated the reason he was not on the field was his hamstring cramped up on the long pass he dropped. He took himself out because he was injured not because he was afraid of the ball. Thats not what I heard... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cakmoney61 Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 Yeah, I can't believe I made you do that either. :laugh: Let's never make it happen again.But generally speaking, you kinda missunderstood my point. Personally? I think Moss should have stayed in. What I was disputing was calling what he did "heartless." Right or wrong, I think making a call like that would be a really hard thing to do. Santana has never done anything to make us think that he does not want to be in and play his hardest every game, and for him to take himself out must have been hard. Right or wrong, I think Santana was trying to do what was right. I don't think that about TO. I think TO wanted to make TO feel better. I doubt it had much of anything to do with his teammates. That's the thing about sports. The best "think" they are the best. It seems selfish to keep playing when you are playing horribly, but it really isn't. TO has the ultimate confidence in his abilities even though I'm sure he has to fight off doubt when he's dropping passes left and right. Santana should have done the same and his coaches and teammates should have helped him. They didn't!!! The ultimate defeat is not physical defeat; it's the mental defeat that takes place in the head. Santana went into a fetal position and no one came to help him get out of the hole he crawled into. Quitting is not an option! Moss is a professional! He should have forced the coaches to take him out if they didn't want him in the game. Although understandable, he cannot take himself out! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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