This doesn't sound like a team that's addressed its offensive line very well...

[bubba9497]

To be fair, you got to the playoffs and won because of your defense.

A more accurate statement would be you won a playoff game in spite of Brunell.

that is funny, It was the defense that hit 2 perfect bombs to Santana Moss in week 2 to beat the cowboys, it was the defense that threw 4 TD passes to beat the cowboys in week 14

3000 yards passing 23 TD 10 Int.

and for all everyone huffing and puffing about TB, yep the defense was the main reason for the win. After the the Skins got the lead, Gibbs went super conservative. Brunell threw a total of 15 passes... 15 most teams throw that many in a single quarter, took Portis out for half the game becasue of his shoulders. The defense was so dominant, why risk injuring his players further.

yeah Brunell was a real liability :doh:

[tr1]

Bubba, please stop throwing facts at these guys...they hate it when you bring up that we had a winning season and they had a losing season.

I think you don't care about their feelings.

You big troll, you.

[HeHateMe]

All that mismanagement of draft picks and we still beat you twice last year. Go figure.

And how about the 8 years before that?

[HeHateMe]

Who has the better overall record over the last ten years? :laugh:

Werent you the one who brought up head to head though?

[HeHateMe]

that is funny, It was the defense that hit 2 perfect bombs to Santana Moss in week 2 to beat the cowboys, it was the defense that threw 4 TD passes to beat the cowboys in week 14

3000 yards passing 23 TD 10 Int.

and for all everyone huffing and puffing about TB, yep the defense was the main reason for the win. After the the Skins got the lead, Gibbs went super conservative. Brunell threw a total of 15 passes... 15 most teams throw that many in a single quarter, took Portis out for half the game becasue of his shoulders. The defense was so dominant, why risk injuring his players further.

yeah Brunell was a real liability :doh:

How was he down the stretch at the end of the season?

3000+ yards passing and 23 TD?

Right about what Bledsoe did, yet Brunell is way better than Bledsoe.

[kingfish50]

Funny how u tried to spin it positive for you, but everyone else see's it as

Giving up a high pick for an old QB that would have came to you anyway.

Giving up a Champ Bailey and a pick for Portis.

Giving up 2 picks for Lloyd

Giving up picks and jumping up to get McIntosh in the second round. Hopefully he starts this year or next year, if not would that be qualified as a bust.

Giving up picks to move up to get Campbell who has yet to show anything.

Giving up low round picks for Bowen, Thrash and others

Drafting Ramsey and he is gone

Giving up a first round for Brad Johnson

There you go again #284ever! You don't know what your talking about. Bowen was a FA signing. We did not draft him. Thrash was a FA sigining and we did not draft him.

Anymore knowledge you want to throw at us?

[HeHateMe]

Bubba, please stop throwing facts at these guys...they hate it when you bring up that we had a winning season and they had a losing season.

I think you don't care about their feelings.

You big troll, you.

tr1 teaching us all new things each day.

9-7 is now a "losing" season.

Thanks again tr1. :thumbsup:

[kingfish50]

tr1 teaching us all new things each day.

9-7 is now a "losing" season.

Thanks again tr1. :thumbsup:

9-7 didn't seem to get you in the playoffs last year, so I'd say it was a losing season. If your satisfied with that every year, then hears to many more 9-7 years to come. Hail!

[ArmchairRedskin]

And how about the 8 years before that?

How about a few years before that? Is any of this relevant to the claims that we forgo the draft in favor of the FA and somehow mismanaged the team in the process?

Most of the examples given were from the Gibbs II era. He turned a 5-11 team that consisted of a bunch of me-first type underachievers and transformed the Redskins into a team that you have to contend with.

Until draft picks become more important than on the field production, I don't really think you have a leg to stand on if you're claiming we wasted or mismanaged draft picks. The game is still about wins and losses. It doesn't matter how you go about obtaining the players to help you in that regard. Not unless it somehow prohibits your team in future years. So far, the Redskins have avoided the ever looming cap hell.

[HeHateMe]

As for Dirk, yes, it was your defense AND your running game.

But more your defense.

There has been money and picks invested; but, with regards to the money invested, I'm content with it right now.

Adams is worth his money. I dont think that was any clearer than last season when his injury had catastrophic effects. As you correctly and wisely predicted at the time.

Rivera, although having an average year last season, was hampered all year by that back injury. He's looked great this offseason and lets give him that chance to earn his keep.

Gurode's versatility alone is worth the small contract he signed.

Johnson is improving every year.

Rogers, I will agree, was a tremendous disappointment.

Peterman has struggled since his knee injury but the jury is still out. Although it doesnt look promising.

[HeHateMe]

9-7 didn't seem to get you in the playoffs last year, so I'd say it was a losing season. If your satisfied with that every year, then hears to many more 9-7 years to come. Hail!

Only a Super Bowl championship truly satisfies me.

But strictly by the books, 9-7 is considered a winning season.

To each his own as to what they consider a winning season though.

[ArmchairRedskin]

Werent you the one who brought up head to head though?

Yeah, if you followed the posts being made you would have seen that I wasn't the one that switched from head to head to overall.

[HeHateMe]

How about a few years before that? Is any of this relevant to the claims that we forgo the draft in favor of the FA and somehow mismanaged the team in the process?

Most of the examples given were from the Gibbs II era. He turned a 5-11 team that consisted of a bunch of me-first type underachievers and transformed the Redskins into a team that you have to contend with.

Until draft picks become more important than on the field production, I don't really think you have a leg to stand on if you're claiming we wasted or mismanaged draft picks. The game is still about wins and losses. It doesn't matter how you go about obtaining the players to help you in that regard. Not unless it somehow prohibits your team in future years. So far, the Redskins have avoided the ever looming cap hell.

First, you brought up the past, not me.

Second, I believe in the Gibbs/Parcells return era, its 2-2. So spare me the yet to contend with stuff. I believe we contended with you quite well in 3 of the 4 games thus far.

Third, show me where I was the one saying anything about mismanagement of picks.

[HeHateMe]

Yeah, if you followed the posts being made you would have seen that I wasn't the one that switched from head to head to overall.

But you brought up the past between Dallas and Washington.

Which hardly has anything to do with this thread.

[ArmchairRedskin]

First, you brought up the past, not me.

I was repsonding to another poster.

Second, I believe in the Gibbs/Parcells return era, its 2-2. So spare me the yet to contend with stuff. I believe we contended with you quite well in 3 of the 4 games thus far.

That first year was Gibbs' first year back after a 12 Year Absense. He still had most of Spurrier's players and he had to work the kinks out. Considering all that, you sure didn't blow us out. Save a flea flicker and some atrocious PI calls in that first game, and a late 4th quarter mistake by a rookie in the second, we did pretty well against a team that Parcells took to the playoffs just the year before.

Third, show me where I was the one saying anything about mismanagement of picks.

Well what's the whole point of bringing up how we use our draft picks then? If it isn't you trying to say we don't know how to manage them, then what exactly are you trying to say?

[ArmchairRedskin]

But you brought up the past between Dallas and Washington.

Which hardly has anything to do with this thread.

Sure it does.

By Cowboys logic in this thread using draft picks to aquire FA's or move up in the draft is not as good as relying mostly on draft picks to build a team. Isn't that basically the premise?

What it all comes down to is not how players are aquired, but how the players that you aquire contribute to the success of the team. In that regard I compared a team that uses mostly draft picks with few choice FA's to a team that uses mostly FA with a few choice draft picks.

[Birdlives]

How was he down the stretch at the end of the season?

3000+ yards passing and 23 TD?

Right about what Bledsoe did, yet Brunell is way better than Bledsoe.

Well, if you factor in turnovers, then yes, Brunell is way better than Bledsoe.

10 ints to Bledsoe's 17

4 fumbles to Bledsoe's 9

overall Bledsoe had 12 more turnovers

Yeah, I'd say thats better.

[HeHateMe]

Sure it does.

By Cowboys logic in this thread using draft picks to aquire FA's or move up in the draft is not as good as relying mostly on draft picks to build a team. Isn't that basically the premise?

What it all comes down to is not how players are aquired, but how the players that you aquire contribute to the success of the team. In that regard I compared a team that uses mostly draft picks with few choice FA's to a team that uses mostly FA with a few choice draft picks.

If Dallas is the bar for success, then yes, youre right it is relevant.

So if thats the case, I'm flattered your standards are set so high.

BTW, thats not my logic, but run with that generalization. Its what you do best.

[DWinzit]

Funny how u tried to spin it positive for you, but everyone else see's it as

Everyone else?

The Gibbs Redskins take into consideration all available in FA and drafts, then target players who fit their system. If there was no available FA or high round draft choice that fit a need, the Skins locate the player on another team and make the trade. Sometimes these trades included high picks or players. When the Portis trade went down I almost puked. My favorite player on the Skins was Champ. Once I understood he didn't fit the GW scheme, I understood. He was replaced by Springs.

The Redskin draft picks traded you mention in your rant all seem to have paid off with starts, insurance and playing time by acquired players. Mismanagement doesn't happen in the Gibbs Redskins. It never used to happen in Parcell run teams either.

Nice job with the positive spin Dirk

[bigernmccracken]

Isn't this thread about O-line draft picks? We did draft 3 of our 5 starting linemen, each of which is better than anyone on the Cowboys line.

Problems- if Flo and Marco don't bounce back the way you want, you could have a line in which every player is a below average NFL lineman.

I mean, freaking Kosier? 7th pick, traded just last year for a 7th and a one year deal. Don't even try to lie- every Puke fan thought this guy was Larry's backup until you found out how much you paid him. Best available? Sad. Just Sad. Larry was overated? Yea, I guess, but Kosier isn't rated.

:eaglesuck

[ArmchairRedskin]

Brunell is also more accurate.

A bigger percentage of Bledsoe's incompletions were the result of a poor pass while he had a lower percentage of drops than Brunell.

Bledsoe

poor throws 39.7%

passes dropped 10.1%

http://snap.stats.com/stats/nflinfo/playerstats.asp?id=2359&Submit=Go

Brunell

poor throws 33.9%

passes dropped 15.1%

http://snap.stats.com/stats/nflinfo/playerstats.asp?id=2485&Submit=Go

[HeHateMe]

That first year was Gibbs' first year back after a 12 Year Absense. He still had most of Spurrier's players and he had to work the kinks out. Considering all that, you sure didn't blow us out. Save a flea flicker and some atrocious PI calls in that first game, and a late 4th quarter mistake by a rookie in the second, we did pretty well against a team that Parcells took to the playoffs just the year before.

Here we go with the excuses.

I'm not going to even address that. ACR, youre better than that; at least I thought you were.

As for those "teams"?

Well, that 2004 team was still Campo's roster of basically crap. It was a washed up Testaverde instead of a dreadful Quincy Carter. Not too many significant differences from the 2003 to 2004 Cowboys. So yes, Parcells was in his 2nd year, but the team he had was hardly anything he was happy with.

And that rookie mistake? Well, it was a 7th round rookie WR scored that winning TD.

So spare me that. Its 2-2 in 2 years. Period.

And each game has been competitive except for one where the Dallas players never even got off the bus.

[HeHateMe]

Brunell is also more accurate.

A bigger percentage of Bledsoe's incompletions were the result of a poor pass while he had a lower percentage of drops than Brunell.

Bledsoe

poor throws 39.7%

passes dropped 10.1%

http://snap.stats.com/stats/nflinfo/playerstats.asp?id=2359&Submit=Go

Brunell

poor throws 33.9%

passes dropped 15.1%

http://snap.stats.com/stats/nflinfo/playerstats.asp?id=2485&Submit=Go

Care to make a friendly sig wager comparing thier stats this season?

Yards, TDs, completion %?

[ArmchairRedskin]

If Dallas is the bar for success, then yes, youre right it is relevant.

So if thats the case, I'm flattered your standards are set so high.

BTW, thats not my logic, but run with that generalization. Its what you do best.

Haha, like you didn't list players that we traded draft picks for. :laugh:

Your team isn't any sort of standard, it's just a team that's relevant to the discussion.

You sure are misguided.

[ArmchairRedskin]

Here we go with the excuses.

I'm not going to even address that. ACR, youre better than that; at least I thought you were.

As for those "teams"?

Well, that 2004 team was still Campo's roster of basically crap. It was a washed up Testaverde instead of a dreadful Quincy Carter. Not too many significant differences from the 2003 to 2004 Cowboys. So yes, Parcells was in his 2nd year, but the team he had was hardly anything he was happy with.

And that rookie mistake? Well, it was a 7th round rookie WR scored that winning TD.

So spare me that. Its 2-2 in 2 years. Period.

And each game has been competitive except for one where the Dallas players never even got off the bus.

Dallas players did get off the bus. They were just hit by a burgundy and gold mack truck as soon as they did.

No shame in losing to a better opponent.