QB Controversy

[Atlanta Skins Fan]

Originally posted by Smootylicious

Couple that with the fact that SS didn't apparently want Matthews in the first place and it seem like he'll be the first to go.

It seemed like he did want him prior to Ramsey being drafted, but not thereafter.

Spurrier's good friends and occasional golfing buddies with Matthews. I had a feeling that after the Ramsey draft he realized he'd have to make an unpleasant cut (among Matthews, Wuerffel and Sage), and he didn't see the point in setting up a situation designed to force him to fire someone, especially a friend.

[Thinking Skins]

An earlier poster compared Sage to Gus. Please don't go there, Gus sucked. I hope the fans don't turn on Ramsey like they did on Heath. I agree that Ramsey is screwing himself by not being there, but what if Heath didn't hold out and get the money, what would he have now? Put yourself in their shoes.

I'm talkign about the early stages of Gus's career, the pre head in the wall Gus, back when we could win games with him. That Gus was one who could always get in a game and give his all. Remember that year (was it 96?) when we drafted them both and Shuler just looked like a bum who didnt deserve to make the team. And then gus would come in each game and play against teh 2nd adn 3rd stringers and lead us to victory.

Now fast forward to last year. We were in teh same scenario. I dont think George was gone yet, but I know that teh battle was between Husak and Sage. Sage showed then that even though he was a rookie who had no NFL experience, that he was giving his all and trying to make the team. We didnt win too many of those games but he did look good in a loosing effort. Thats why this year, I'm likening him to Gus. I hope he's not dumb enough to avoid the secondary reciever or lock on one guy the entire play(remember Gus's adiction to Henry Ellard?) and I really hope taht he doesnt go running into walls as a means of celebrating touchdowns. But I do see that same competitiveness in Sage taht I saw in Gus.

Note: teh only time that I've SEEN them are the pics you guys post on this site but you get my jist. I think that he has the determination to be a starting QB in this league. You couple that with him having better physical qualities than SM or DW and I just think that he's the best QB on the team right now. And I can see that leading to a pleasure/problem (competition/controversy) for the Redskins in the near future.

[codeorama]

That was the question I had. As of now, Matthews is the third man. The washington post even lists him as third.

I could be wrong, but Sage has more tools than the other 2, maybe Spurrier is trying to spend more time with him to help him along faster. That was my impression.

[GatorEye]

Originally posted by Skins56

GatorEye, you obviously haven't been to any of the practices at training camp. Sage has looked the best of all the qb's, and honestly, I think he will be our starter. To say that he has no real value is an idiotic statement, and you're truly showing bias towards the Florida qb's. Quite honestly, Matthews and Wuerfel looked pretty poor at the practices I witnessed. Sage is by far the more talented qb and most likely will be the starter by the time the season starts.

Fascinating post, however I've yet to read anywhere that Sage has looked the best of all the quarterbacks in camp up to this point so I'd have to say your judging of QB skills must be poor or biased.

If SOS thinks Sage is the best QB, I'll assume he must be because he would know better than any of us. However just because someone is big and strong doesn't make a QB. SOS's offense is based on a SYSTEM of calling the best play against the defense and calling an audible to change the play, then making the correct reads. All of this needs to happen in a few seconds. So my statements are based on the fact that we KNOW Danny and Shane can work in this system. Sage hasn't proven himself to be able to do this yet. If he can - I'm all for him. If my statement of saying he has no value is idiotic, your statement that he is by far the more talented QB is just as idiotic. What is your definition of talent? If he was so great why wasn't he starting last year? Surely he was better than the pathetic Banks.

Originally posted by Max

Is it just me, or does every poster on every board with "Gator" in their name totally blow off anyone other than Matthews and Wuerffel and proclaim the Gator QB's as Gods of quarterbacking?

If you even suggest that Sage or Ramsey or Joe Montana might be a little better than either one of them, you get your head ripped off.

Of course everyone has their favorites out there, but give me a break here.

I'm not sure I've ripped anyones heads off, however if you had been around the board earlier this summer, I would be hard pressed to find anyone saying we should even keep Danny on the roster. He has no arm, he has no talent, cut him now, blah, blah. Now people are saying he is the best QB in camp so far.

All I'm saying is that SOS has had a lot of QB's and Danny and Shane are two of the best at running his system so it would make sense to initially look at people that you know can execute it. That's the argument. Just because someone is talented doesn't mean they are going to fit in a system. While some may argue Jeff George's talent as a QB he certainly has the physical tools - but he wasn't the right QB for Marty's offense.

Bottom line is I just want the best fit for SOS's offense and I'm open to anyone who he thinks is the best for it. I'd just prefer to have Danny and Shane help teach it and execute it.

[OrangeSkin]

Steve is very vague in his descriptions of the offense, because he knows just about as much as we do in terms of the QBs. I'm sure he has some ideas worked out in his mind, but I think we can assume that all are pretty much equal. People have different views of the same events, but they all look equally mediocre thus far.

Having a conversation this heated before any of us have seen any three QBs in game action is rather pointless. I reserve judgement until the final preseason game, but I'll be honest, right now I'm rooting for Sage. I love the kid.

Sage has shown that he has raw talent. Size, strength, mobility, and at least a decent arm. All he needs is some coaching from the ball coach. Matthews and Danny have shown none of the above thusfar in their NFL careers, and we have no reason to believe they'll start now.

Even though they're in the Fun 'N Gun, the system which they flourished in, they still have to deal with those pesky NFL defensive backs, and not Joe Gugliotti from Luigi's Baking School.

There comes a time when you need a certain amount of physical tools, no matter what system you are playing in. Sage has these, the Gator QBs do not. Bottom line.

[codeorama]

Seems like as of today, Tuesday, Shane is moving up the depth chart. The post listed Shane as rapidly improving and Sage heading south, with Danny staying the same. Seems like the obvious may come about after all. Shane has the most experience and it will probably come out during the preseason.

[fansince62]

will QB by committee work in the NFL? no one has asked that question yet from the practical point of whether the offensive line and receivers can adjust to frequent changes. haven't cadence, timing, etc., always been issues that have worked against frequent QB changes? hasn't this always been considered destablizing for a team?

[amsterdamgator]

THE DB's UF faced and toasted were noe other than Champ bailey and Fred Smoot ...chumps huh?

yeah FSU produces sorry db's too.

A SOS team never put big numbers vs. a good secondary.

LOL

[Luca Brasi]

Originally posted by GatorEye

Fascinating post, however I've yet to read anywhere that Sage has looked the best of all the quarterbacks in camp up to this point so I'd have to say your judging of QB skills must be poor or biased.

If SOS thinks Sage is the best QB, I'll assume he must be because he would know better than any of us. However just because someone is big and strong doesn't make a QB. SOS's offense is based on a SYSTEM of calling the best play against the defense and calling an audible to change the play, then making the correct reads. All of this needs to happen in a few seconds. So my statements are based on the fact that we KNOW Danny and Shane can work in this system. Sage hasn't proven himself to be able to do this yet. If he can - I'm all for him. If my statement of saying he has no value is idiotic, your statement that he is by far the more talented QB is just as idiotic. What is your definition of talent? If he was so great why wasn't he starting last year? Surely he was better than the pathetic Banks.

1. You've yet to read anywhere that Sage has looked the best?

Have you read anything? Do you watch the camp reports every evening? Have you read any articles in the Post? Have you read any of the posts on this board, from people who have actually seen all three qb's in action, no more than a week ago?

2. If Sage is so good, why didn't he start last year? For the same reason Ramsey isn't going to start this year. HE WAS A ROOKIE. He wasn't better than Banks last year, just as Ramsey wouldn't be better than any of the 3 qb's we have here now.

I agree that this system is all about making decisions about what the defense shows you. And I'm sure Danny and Shane have the slight edge right now in regards to that. My point is, to say that Sage is a waste of time is not a statement that you would make, had you seen the same practices that I witnessed. Sage clearly has the better arm and mobility. Will he be better that Shane or Danny in the system? Who knows. It's far too early to tell.

[One Dollar]

Don't you actually have to HAVE a legitimate QB to have a controversy?

[GatorEye]

Originally posted by Skins56

1. You've yet to read anywhere that Sage has looked the best?

Have you read anything? Do you watch the camp reports every evening? Have you read any articles in the Post? Have you read any of the posts on this board, from people who have actually seen all three qb's in action, no more than a week ago?

2. If Sage is so good, why didn't he start last year? For the same reason Ramsey isn't going to start this year. HE WAS A ROOKIE. He wasn't better than Banks last year, just as Ramsey wouldn't be better than any of the 3 qb's we have here now.

I agree that this system is all about making decisions about what the defense shows you. And I'm sure Danny and Shane have the slight edge right now in regards to that. My point is, to say that Sage is a waste of time is not a statement that you would make, had you seen the same practices that I witnessed. Sage clearly has the better arm and mobility. Will he be better that Shane or Danny in the system? Who knows. It's far too early to tell.

OK, let me start again in the spirit of solidarity. Perhaps saying he is waste would be an overstatement. Again - I'm all for who is the best QB for us. I've been reading the board and the Post extensively and the Post currently ranks Shane first, Danny second, and Sage third. Most of what I've read on the board says Danny has been the best with Shane probably last. My statements also are from knowledge that these guys play better come game time than they do in practice (at least they did at UF). Game situations are always different.

For as bad as Banks was he SHOULD have started and my thinking is that even if he was a rookie Marty should have given him more PT with as bad as Banks was especially if he thought he had enough talent to be the QB of the future.

Anyway - you are correct. It's far too early to tell anything. In the next month Sage could be the greatest thing since sliced bread...or Shane could stink up the practice field and throw for 300+ yards in the next to last preseason game. Who knows.

I think we can both agree we just want what is best for the Skins.

[GatorEye]

To follow up, here's a quote from today's Sportsline article:

Rosenfels threw well on the first day of training camp last week, but it's been downhill from there. After a slow start, the quarterback battle has begun to define itself clearly: Matthews is emerging as the clear leader and the only one who looks ready to be an NFL starter, while Wuerffel has been consistent but not spectacular.

As for Rosenfels, he had another tough day Tuesday. His lobbed interception over the middle, intended for Jacquez Green but picked off by Mark Washington, might have been his worst throw of camp.

While others might not be tearing up camp, it doesn't sound like he is either.

[Darth Tater]

Wow!

This thread almost reads like a flame war just prior to a division game! Except, I saw only one post by someone who is obviously NOT a Redskin fan. What's up?

[OrangeSkin]

I'm not going to make excuses for Sage if he sucks and sucks badly, but he's still learning the system right now, and he's demonstrated superior physical skills.

When Matthews and Weurffel, five and six year vets respectively who are playing in their college system, can't establish themselves as clear leaders over a second year fourth rounder who's yet to fully grasp the system, then that's pitiful.

Either Sage is playing superbly (which the gator fans on here go to great lengths to disprove), or Matthews and Wuerffel just plain suck. I'm leaning towards the latter.