Waldo da Magnificent Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20050323/ap_on_re_us/brain_damaged_woman By ELIOTT C. McLAUGHLIN, Associated Press Writer ATLANTA - A federal appeals court refused early Wednesday to order the reinsertion of Terri Schiavo's feeding tube, denying an emergency request by the severely brain-damaged woman's parents. The three-judge panel ruled 2-1 to deny the request, a day after a federal judge in Florida also refused a similar appeal. Schiavo's parents, Bob and Mary Schindler, vowed yet another appeal Wednesday. "The Schindlers will be filing an appropriate appeal to save their daughter's life," said Rex Sparklin, an attorney with the law firm representing the parents. The Schindlers said Tuesday that their daughter was "fading quickly" and might die at any moment. The feeding tube was disconnected on Friday, and doctors have said that Terri Schiavo, 41, could survive one to two weeks without water and nutrients. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Punani2 Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 I feel bad for her parents. Just watching their daughter die like that. I don't understand why the ex husband is so set on ending her life. What does he have to gain? He's moved on with his life so just finalize the divorce and let her parents have custody of their daughter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkLadyRaven Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Originally posted by Johnny Punani I feel bad for her parents. Just watching their daughter die like that. I don't understand why the ex husband is so set on ending her life. What does he have to gain? He's moved on with his life so just finalize the divorce and let her parents have custody of their daughter. Its techinically Illegal to divorce someone who is incapacitated in the state of Flordia from what I heard. I am not sure if its true. There is still one shot the family has: Either George or Jeb Bush using Police Powers. There are two people in the United States who can save Terri Schiavo's life right now. The president of the United States and the governor of Florida have the authority to use the police services at their disposal to take Terri into protective custody, restore her food and hydration, and arrest anyone who would interfere," said Dr. Paul Schenck, executive director of the National Pro-Life Action Center on Capitol Hill. "For the sake of Terri's life, we cannot afford to wait while the courts dither over jurisdiction." http://www.earnedmedia.org/cfts0323.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColdnGrey Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Originally posted by Johnny Punani I don't understand why the ex husband is so set on ending her life. What does he have to gain? He's moved on with his life so just finalize the divorce and let her parents have custody of their daughter. Just because he moved on with his life, after 15 years, does not mean that he's still not duty bound to follow his wife's wishes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimboDaMan Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Originally posted by Johnny Punani I feel bad for her parents. Just watching their daughter die like that. I don't understand why the ex husband is so set on ending her life. What does he have to gain? He's moved on with his life so just finalize the divorce and let her parents have custody of their daughter. My wife felt the same way, and I can understand why. But I asked her what if she really did tell him she wouldn't want this? Isn't he then obligated to show his respect to Terri by carrying out her wishes, no matter how hard? Because it would be so much easier for him to do as you said, just hand her over to the people willing to care for her. There seems to be absolutely nothing in it for him, except maybe honoring her in the only way left. I agree with you, I feel awful for the parents. The desperation they must feel is unimaginable. But they seem completely deluded as to the situation with Terri. Their daughter is gone. While I'm sure what remains behind is a comfort for them to hold, that's not reason enough to allow this to go on indefinitely. 15 years is enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thiebear Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Originally posted by ColdnGrey Just because he moved on with his life, after 15 years, does not mean that he's still not duty bound to follow his wife's wishes. His kids are like 12, I wouldn't say he waited 15 years ... In a Murder case they would have thrown his testimony out... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@DCGoldPants Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 I don't know what to say anymore. But court after court is siding against the parents for some reason. I don't know...... but I heard on hardball last night, that their lawyer said that if she died, she'll go to Hell....and that's why they need to stop this. Who says that their child who's been in this state for 15 years, is going to Hell? How sick is that? Regardless, they keep losing....and its not some giant conspiracy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Gichin13 Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Originally posted by Bufford I don't know what to say anymore. But court after court is siding against the parents for some reason. I don't know...... but I heard on hardball last night, that their lawyer said that if she died, she'll go to Hell....and that's why they need to stop this. Who says that their child who's been in this state for 15 years, is going to Hell? How sick is that? Regardless, they keep losing....and its not some giant conspiracy. The parents lawyer actually argued to the federal trial court that she was in risk of "eternal damnation" unless they put the tube back in. This cogent legal argument did not appear to hold much weight with the federal district court judge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sith lord Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 This is no different than torcher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearrock Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Originally posted by Thiebear In a Murder case they would have thrown his testimony out... Why do you say that? To me it seems the testimony about what Terry told him would fall under unavailable declarant exception to hearsay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief skin Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 The parents lawyer is a jackass Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbear Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Just saw this and thought it might prove interesting to some on here. It's the chat from the Wasintonpost today with her court appointed special guardian. It haas some interesting stuff about some of the misinformation out there currently. http://discuss.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/zforum/05/nation_wolfson032305.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@DCGoldPants Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 also, read the transcript from Hardball last night. A lawyer to the parents said that if she dies, she will be punished by god. Geez...... I doubt even the people who think the courts are wrong would agree with this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dah-Dee Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 CNN and others now reporting the parents have requested a rehearing by the full 11th Circuit instead of going straight to the U.S. Supreme Court. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingtiger1013 Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 This is a sad situation for both sides. I am sickened at the thought of the parents not being able to even rub an ice cube on her lips for fear of arrest. Just to watch her die like that. As a husband and father of 4, I can see both sides, however should I ever be put in the same situation, I would defer to my wife's parents. I couldn't live with myself if I were to put them through this same torture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingtiger1013 Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Originally posted by Bufford also, read the transcript from Hardball last night. A lawyer to the parents said that if she dies, she will be punished by god. Geez...... I doubt even the people who think the courts are wrong would agree with this. I believe this has to do with a new angle they tried which dealt with her religious beliefs being violated. I don't think it was their first legal argument. Just shows how desperate they are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thiebear Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Gbear: That was a good read. I like how the doctor reviewed all previous reviews but didnt actually DO anything because Michaels lawyer wouldnt allow it. To include seeing IF she could swallow watter or thickened liquid. So even though he was appointed an adhoc guardian he had absolutely no authority. Did no real testing and came out with a review that everyone is supposed to just agree with???? or did i just read that entire thing wrongly? From Gbears post: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A57781-2005Mar22.html Bethesda, Md.: Over the past few days ,many people on television and on the radio have contended that she could be rehabilitated, but hasn't been given the chance. In your medical opinion, is that true, or is she beyond that point? Dr. Jay Wolfson: I offer no medical opinion - only a carefully thought through review of the actual medical facts and legal documents, according to the rules of evidence and the rules of civil procedure and the guardianship law of Florida. _______________________ Canton, Ohio: Why did you insist on agreement before a swallow test was done? why not ask for a definitive test so that the truth would be known? were you a mediator or a fact finder? Dr. Jay Wolfson: I had no legal power in any event. And the courts were not obliged to follow any of my recommendations. _______________________ Upper Marlboro, Md.: Dr. Wolfson, Can you state which party disagreed? Dr. Jay Wolfson: Mr. Felow, Michael's attorney, properly disagreed, because he was in the midst of a constitutional challenge to the law that appointed me -- if he had bought into my suggestion, then he would be lending credence to the very law he was challenging -- and that would have diluted his challenge. he was legally correct. _______________________ Canton, Ohio: Did you try to give Terri thickened liquids? Did you interview any of the doctors or nurses who said they gave Terri jello or other foods? They said she ate it and enjoyed it. Dr. Jay Wolfson: there is no credible evidence to support any of those contentions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Originally posted by Bufford also, read the transcript from Hardball last night. A lawyer to the parents said that if she dies, she will be punished by god. Geez...... I doubt even the people who think the courts are wrong would agree with this. My guess is if she asked her husband not to use heroic measures, and her husband carried out her wishes, she's technically committing suicide. Thus, no heaven for her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funkyalligator Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Just let the woman die in peace...every single judge has ruled in Michael Schiavo's favor and it seems that only those who use religion and not science as their basis believe that she should be kept alive....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thiebear Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Originally posted by Funkyalligator Just let the woman die in peace...every single judge has ruled in Michael Schiavo's favor and it seems that only those who use religion and not science as their basis believe that she should be kept alive....... buzzzz wrong .. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimboDaMan Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Originally posted by flyingtiger1013 This is a sad situation for both sides. I am sickened at the thought of the parents not being able to even rub an ice cube on her lips for fear of arrest. Just to watch her die like that. As a husband and father of 4, I can see both sides, however should I ever be put in the same situation, I would defer to my wife's parents. I couldn't live with myself if I were to put them through this same torture. But therein lies the terrible dilemma. Since Terri had verbally made statements that she would not want this (so determined by the special guardian, among others), could you violate your beloved's wishes simply to comfort her parents? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingtiger1013 Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Originally posted by JimboDaMan But therein lies the terrible dilemma. Since Terri had verbally made statements that she would not want this (so determined by the special guardian, among others), could you violate your beloved's wishes simply to comfort her parents? Well, as I understand it, the people that want her death argue that she has no feeling and no cognitive thought. So even if she is allowed to live, she is in no pain and has no conscience. However, the parents will live with this for the rest of their lives and that to me is a form of torture. To answer your question, in this exact case, I could. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@DCGoldPants Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 a few things. #1. Mentioned recently on one of these shows, she wasn't a church goer.....not to say she wasn't religious. But I think she's been painted as a every sunday type of lady #2. I can't see how this is considered suicide in any way. If this happened to her and nobody was with her until the next day, she would of died. If she's let alone right now, she dies not because anything is being done to her....but because nothing is being done to her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Originally posted by Bufford #2. I can't see how this is considered suicide in any way. If this happened to her and nobody was with her until the next day, she would of died. If she's let alone right now, she dies not because anything is being done to her....but because nothing is being done to her. I'm was just trying to figure out why the parents would think she was going to hell. If you've got a better explaination I'm all ears. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimboDaMan Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Originally posted by flyingtiger1013 Well, as I understand it, the people that want her death argue that she has no feeling and no cognitive thought. So even if she is allowed to live, she is in no pain and has no conscience. However, the parents will live with this for the rest of their lives and that to me is a form of torture. To answer your question, in this exact case, I could. Fair enough. Its certainly a difficult question to wrestle with. Under those circumstances, if you consider what's in that hospice to be simply a container that Terri has already left, I guess these painful images we see on TV involve no loss of dignity. Might as well derive all the comfort you can. But consider also the reverse situation: that there may be a faint flicker of awareness remaining. One alternative hypothesis presented by the appointed guardian is that "Theresa's exclusive awareness for 13 years, to the extent she may be aware of anything, is the equivalent of fear and perpetual horror. She is unable to hear, see, speak or interact, and unable to die". A terrible, haunting thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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