TheSteve Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 Originally posted by Skins26 I hear that. Just bringing up that though I remember some awesome quotes other guys said about Ramsey. I remember the Giants D Cordinator saying what scared him about Ramsey is that when the game was on the line he made a play to win it. I remember Brian Baldinger screaming "THIS KID IS AWESOME" after he made a great 2PC play in that Giants game. I remember his first start where after his first 4 passes 3 were INT's and he came back to throw for 300 and some yards and several TD's, I remember the Saints defenders saying he was like a ghost, b/c they kept pounding him but he kept getting better and better. I remember on a Redskins pregame show an Eagles fan saying that he would rather have Ramsey than McNabb b/c of the heart and toughness Ramsey showed. I remember Shawn Springs and other Seahawks DB's saying that he thew it so hard they had no chance to make a play on the ball no matter how tight the coverage was. Ramsey kicks ass. I remember everyone around the league saying if Ramsey had the protection he could be a star. Now Gibbs brings in a washed up Mark Brunell and because he's stick with his guy Ramsey has all of a sudden lost that potential and that ability that had the same people who are hating on him now claiming that he could be our future. I'm not one to give up so easily, he is our future, and if we let him go and repeat another Trent Green scenario we will regret it far longer. Ramsey has the ability to be better than Trent Green, and that is scary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins26 Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 Originally posted by steveskins I remember everyone around the league saying if Ramsey had the protection he could be a star. Now Gibbs brings in a washed up Mark Brunell and because he's stick with his guy Ramsey has all of a sudden lost that potential and that ability that had the same people who are hating on him now claiming that he could be our future. I'm not one to give up so easily, he is our future, and if we let him go and repeat another Trent Green scenario we will regret it far longer. Ramsey has the ability to be better than Trent Green, and that is scary. If we let Ramsey go I am going to be pissed beyond belief. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Posse91 Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 Yea I forgot, he hasn't showed us any evidence of his great skills in a long time. After we were 3-2 last year where did Ramsey go?. Held on to the ball way too long, fumbled it too much. Of course Ramsey looks good in our eyes now. Look at what we're dealing with right now. Id take Rick mirer over brunell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins26 Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 Originally posted by The_Posse91 Yea I forgot, he hasn't showed us any evidence of his great skills in a long time. After we were 3-2 last year where did Ramsey go?. Held on to the ball way too long, fumbled it too much. Of course Ramsey looks good in our eyes now. Look at what we're dealing with right now. Id take Rick mirer over brunell. Ramsey didnt go anywhere, he was playing with a sprained knee, spraining finger on his throwing hand, broken foot, probably a concussion or two, he had something with his elbow, and im sure there was more. Plus the flaws of the system just really came out. He still had some very solid games though. Seattle game he tore it up. But the injuries mounted and he just couldnt go on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Posse91 Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 Originally posted by Skins26 Ramsey didnt go anywhere, he was playing with a sprained knee, spraining finger on his throwing hand, broken foot, probably a concussion or two, he had something with his elbow, and im sure there was more. Plus the flaws of the system just really came out. He still had some very solid games though. Seattle game he tore it up. But the injuries mounted and he just couldnt go on. Favre proved today you can play through all that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mad4comp Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 Originally posted by The_Posse91 Favre proved today you can play through all that. oh so Favre had a broken foot today ?? hmm i wonder why no one mentioned it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Posse91 Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 You know what Im gettin at, he had that concussion not to long ago, the busted throwin hand plus the emotional strains of what has recently transpired in his life. If you ask me thats more then what Ramsey had to deal with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mad4comp Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 Originally posted by The_Posse91 You know what Im gettin at, he had that concussion not to long ago, the busted throwin hand plus the emotional strains of what has recently transpired in his life. If you ask me thats more then what Ramsey had to deal with. Put Favre in Spurrier's system..i bet he would last just as long as Ramsey did. GB has one heck of a O line, by no means are they to be taken lightly, but last year Ramsey got sacked a bizillion times and still lit it up for the first 4 games or so, and he tried his best to finish out the season too, but a broken foot can only be walked on for so long. Dont compare Favre to Ramsey, they did not play in the same system, so only when Favre has played in SOS's system and passed like a HOF QB can you make the statement that hes better than Ramsey injured. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rypien11 Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 Favre proved today you can play through all that. Farve has never in his career endured the beating PR took last year. I have not seen many QB's take the hits that PR did last year. I think there towards the end before he went out injured the defensive players felt bad for him in a way and let up several times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RySkins Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 Favre threw 3 picks and nearly won us this game! How does his game today support Ramsey not being any good? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbooma Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 Originally posted by flexxskins Excellent point. Im looking at that play right now on TIVO and he definately steps back to avoid being hit and thus sends another floater. actually the reason that pass is bad is because Brunell is moving the entire time, when ramsey made some of those throws you are talking about he was in the pocket, so your arguement doesn't hold much water, it is much easier to throw in the pocket under a heavy rush then running away from it from the start Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inmate running the asylum Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 Originally posted by bubba9497 I have yet to read a single post by any Brunell basher give a detail explanation of how everything is Brunell's fault. No detail of the play, and what he did wrong, or how he caused the others to fail. It is just easy to point a finger and say it is all Brunell, or Brunell got a weak arm... yadda yadda yadda... but no real substance. I have to agree with Ghost and Bulldog and many others on this board, that Brunell has to be benched. Anyone need details on Brunell's problems? :laugh: What more does one need to know, except that he is just about the worst rated QB in the NFL in most passing categories. He's no better than Ryan Leaf who was also at the bottom in most passing categories. Thats substance enough. :laugh: Does Brunell do anything well now? Yeah, he rolls to his left and throws the ball away into the stands. He does that well. "The game plan was to knock him down," Packers free safety Darren Sharper said of Brunell. "He doesn't want to get hit. We had to get in his face and not let him set his feet." That would explain Brunell's willingness to get rid of the ball so quickly — and his tendency to miss throws when faced with the slightest pressure. His longest pass to a wideout yesterday was 17 yards, and he averaged an atrocious 4.95 yards per attempt.:puke: The Packers were hurting in the secondary, too. Sharper was out with a sprained knee, and cornerback Al Harris didn't practice all week because of the same injury. Late in the game, Green Bay got so short-handed that third-string safety Curtis Fuller was pressed into service (and promptly committed a defensive holding penalty that set up the Redskins' second score). But Brunell was unable to take advantage of the situation. And if he couldn't throw on the banged-up Packers, well, who can he throw on? And the Redskins, I'll just remind you, had two weeks to prepare for the Packers. None of it matters, though, if your quarterback can't hit a wide-open Taylor Jacobs at 20 paces. (And if he follows that up by nearly pegging the ball over Jacobs' head on a flat pass on third-and-1, resulting in loss and a punt.) "I understand frustration sometimes sets in," Gibbs said, "and that's just something we have to deal with. ... We need to get everything else on offense working together ... all of us, including myself. I think he can make plays that will win games for us." Strange thing to say about a quarterback the Redskins shelled out millions for, don't you think? If everything is just right around him, he can be successful. The name of the game in the NFL is quarterbacking, and we still don't know if Ramsey is the future answer or not while he is sitting on the bench. Last year Ramsey was ahead of most of the young QB's drafted in his class, but they have moved ahead of him now. Leftwich is 5-3; Carr is 4-3; Harrington is 4-3, Brees is 5-3 and even the rookie Roethlisbeger is 6-1 as starters. If Ramsey is not the answer, we need to find out as soon as possible, so we can begin looking for another QB. :mad: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselPwr44 Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 Bubba,jbooma and the dogged Brunell defenders, A famous man once said: "Don't be afraid to believe what you see"...Apply this advice to Brunell. Now please tell me what you see. But before you do, take off your burgundy and gold glasses. Now in all honesty, just what have you seen over the last 7 games that still makes you want to back Brunell? This should be interesting........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsfan1966 Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 Originally posted by bubba9497 the problem is ghost, is you gio way out of your way to find anything to bash Brunell with, but refuse to accept anything positive in his favor/ or positive about him. Your posts are neither objective, or informative... just the typical bash bash bash variety. I have yet to read a single post by any Brunell basher give a detail explanation of how everything is Brunell's fault. No detail of the play, and what he did wrong, or how he caused the others to fail. It is just easy to point a finger and say it is all Brunell, or Brunell got a weak arm... yadda yadda yadda... but no real substance. you have an obsession that is boarding on the extreme. (no pun inteneded). as they say "opinions are like ass-holes" "everyone has one, and most of them stink." :bow: I have read most of ghosts Brunell rants and for the most part agree with him. Nobody says that all of the problem with the offense are solely Brunells fault; but Brunell contributes to every problem on offense and is solely responsible for some of the problems. Details: The O-line: Since there wasnt much attention paid to the O-line in the off season it remain basicly the same line as last year, mediocre. The loss of Janson means that Brunell doesnt get great proteion on his blind side. Brunell makes this worse by taking very deep drops, 7-10 steps. This lets LE's and strong side blitzers take a more direct line to him. The loss of Janson exacerbates this because his replacement is not as agile and has a hard time taking the end outside when the qb is so far back. Brunells tendency to roll out also causes problems for the line, they are not the quickest bunch. The passing game: This receivers are the same as last year, yet our yards per pass is woeful in comparison. There seem to be more dropped balls, which is attributable to Brunell in two ways. Laugh if you will, but Brunell being a lefty is part of the problem, the ball spins the wrong way, over time the dropped balls will diminish (as we have already seen) The other problem in the passing game has to do with velocity and armstrength. Brunell cant get much zip on the ball, this causes the ball to arrive late or behind players, it also mean that Brunell tend to throw high. While this allows Gardener to make some arobatic catches it also results in dropped balls and incompletions. It take Coles out of the game almost completely because he is a great route running timing receiver, by the time Brunell is ready to throw to him, he is already out of range. Since the ball gets there late Coles doesnt get YAC he would if he was catching the ball in stride. The running game: Off season we picked up Portis and very big improvement from last year yet Portis struggles, he has complained about the other team knowing what we were going to do and in a sense ....they do. The O-line telegraphs run. Because Brunell take such deep drops, if the OT's stay up near the line its a run...almost every time. The lack of a deep threat means that we see the linebackers up playing the line on almost every down, it also lets a saftey come up to play short crossing routes or the run. Brunell isnt the sole problem on offense, but he contributes to almost every problem on offense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fansince62 Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 weak answer Jbooma...the article refers to numerous sources who have leveled the same observation......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inmate running the asylum Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 Jbooma and Bubba in the same bed with each other? Now's there's one for the ages. :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubba9497 Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 Originally posted by inmate running the asylum Jbooma and Bubba in the same bed with each other? Now's there's one for the ages. :laugh: :paranoid: scary ain't it... must have been something about it being halloween :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDSKNfaithfull Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 Originally posted by flexxskins Excellent point. Im looking at that play right now on TIVO and he definately steps back to avoid being hit and thus sends another floater. Brunell didn't even see Cooley:doh: He is old and can not see the field:doh: :doh: Post game on Comcast interviewed Cooley and Cooley said he walked up to mark and said "Sorry man I tried to get to it" HE THEN SAID THE MOST SHOCKING THING he said BRunell told him he did not see him he was just throwing it away:doh: :doh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nneece Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 Originally posted by jbooma Typical Ghost, I see you didn't add the part of the article where Brett went to bat for Brunell. Here's the Brett part: "After the game, the first Redskins player Favre went to was Brunell. Favre had heard his friend being booed and the chanting for Ramsey. "His career," Favre said of Brunell, "has been a lot different from mine in some ways. He's trying to help Joe Gibbs start over here, to get them back to where they were. And it's a tough position to be in. I feel for him. I heard the boos. I just wanted to tell him to hang in there. He's a strong person. I have a lot of respect for him and I just wanted him to know that."" Not exactly a ringing endorsement of Brett saying Brunell has great skills and the booing is not justified. More, he is my friend and I have respect for him so I don't want to see him in this position. I don't see how anyone can defend Brunell's play at this point. You would have to be delusional. And that goes for Gibb's too. I give him kudos for sticking by his man, but enough is enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jempet Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 It was embarrassing watching our offense yesterday. Although I thought we maybe won the game when Portis scored, and the refs working for Kerry called a fake penalty, we never should have been in the posistion of trying to score twice in a short amount of time. Brunell was horrible. Look, I'm oldschool, and I love Gibbs, but it was so obvious that Brunell couldn't get the ball to the wide open recievers. Not just once either, but several times. Than near the end of the first half, Brunell was responsible for getting the team to the line, or calling a timeout. Instead, he screws around for 15 seconds, than calls timeout. We are 2-5, and have no shot at playoffs. It's time to put the kid in and see what he can do. Otherwise, I see no point wasting the rest of my Sundays this year watching such dissapointment. Plenty of teams in this league are mediocre, but much more fun to watch than our offense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins26 Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 Originally posted by The_Posse91 You know what Im gettin at, he had that concussion not to long ago, the busted throwin hand plus the emotional strains of what has recently transpired in his life. If you ask me thats more then what Ramsey had to deal with. Sorry i'm so late responding but I just went to bed last night. And as far as saying Favre proved you can play through that. First of all, he didnt have a broken foot and also wasnt battling the Spurrier system and he isnt a first year starter which means he can get by easier with just his experience. And secondly, Favre threw 3 INT's today. He had some nice throws, but dont act like this was a performance for the ages. The dude threw 3 INT's, should have been 4 if Todd Franz hadnt of knocked it out of Spring's hands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins26 Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 Originally posted by jbooma actually the reason that pass is bad is because Brunell is moving the entire time, when ramsey made some of those throws you are talking about he was in the pocket, so your arguement doesn't hold much water, it is much easier to throw in the pocket under a heavy rush then running away from it from the start This isnt true. It was a playaction and straight drop back. He hit his final step and was still, in position to plant and throw, but he chose to fall back and throw to avoid a hit. This was not a rollout or bootleg. He was standing still in the pocket and had time to plant and throw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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