The case for Bryan Bulaga (Trading Down, and the ZBS)

[angel2]

Dude, you are seriously fixated on arm length! It's one tangible. One. If that's all that mattered, then that's all you'd have to look for and drafting would be easy.

I like Bulaga for a number of reasons.

• Runs similar OL system in college to what the Redskins will run
  
• Iowa has a history of turning out quality, NFL-ready linemen
  
• Shows a great deal of intelligence and confidence in interviews
  
• Moves in space/pulls & traps better than Okung
  
• Played well against top competition in college
  

And if the Lions take Trent Williams over Okung, then expect new GM Martin Mayhew to pull off his mask on national TV and reveal that he is really Matt Millen. Won't happen.

Hey, I am just saying what the experts predict at this time in space:

2010 Mock Draft

Round: 1 | 2 | 3

Pick Team Player Pos. School

1 (1) Rams Sam Bradford* QB Oklahoma

While Ndamukong Suh is the player many have been pencilling in for the Rams since Bradford's injury, it looks like Bradford's shoulder is going to check out fine and if it does you can be sure the Rams are going to get their young QB to re-build around.

2 (2) Lions Trent Williams T Oklahoma

While many believe the Lions will pick Russell Okung, we believe that based on film, Williams is the better player. If the concerns about his weight are not a deal breaker, then the Lions may surprise some by picking Williams ahead of Okung.

[E-Dog Night]

NM, you obviously edited that. What site is that from? (Link please.) It's only one site, so if you are claiming that this is what the "experts" are saying, I'll need confirmation from more than just one site.

[HoggLife]

This would be great, but the value doesn't add up. This chart shows the value of draft picks in relation to trade value. Let's say the Redskins traded with Cleveland at #7. That means that Cleveland would "owe" the Redskins 300 points. Cleveland's 2nd round pick (#38 overall) is worth 520 points, so unless they were incredibly desperate or stupid, they would not agree to that trade.

Their third round pick (#71 overall) is worth 235 points, so you add that pick plus a #4 next year, which should be worth about 60-80 points, and you have an even trade.

I agree with you that the draft chart points dont add up. BUT from what I have mostly seen the draft chart usually is used more AFTER the top 5 picks. If someone is really love with a player and moves up into the top 5 then they are usually willing to give up a little more. If Cleveland is really in love with Clausen or Sue/McCoy drop to #4 and they really want one of those guys them giving us a 2nd rounder to move up isnt all that crazy to believe that they would pay. Maybe we throw in a late round pick or a 4th rounder next year but I think the scenario I said is possible. I do think it is more likely to happen if Sue or McCoy drops to us though. And this is only talk about what we would like to happen and in no way is what I think will happen. I think Shanny and Bruce have a solid plan and they in no way will tip their hand so we are just gonna have to wait it out and see. I am confident that they have a long term goal for the team and will do what is best for us even if that means drafting Berry. It is pretty exciting to actually have people running the team that can be so sneaky and unpredictable.

[angel2]

Dude, you are seriously fixated on arm length! It's one tangible. One. If that's all that mattered, then that's all you'd have to look for and drafting would be easy.

I like Bulaga for a number of reasons.

• Runs similar OL system in college to what the Redskins will run
  
• Iowa has a history of turning out quality, NFL-ready linemen
  
• Shows a great deal of intelligence and confidence in interviews
  
• Moves in space/pulls & traps better than Okung
  
• Played well against top competition in college
  

And if the Lions take Trent Williams over Okung, then expect new GM Martin Mayhew to pull off his mask on national TV and reveal that he is really Matt Millen. Won't happen.

Aside from your negativity, you have a crush on Bulaga, fine. But, he still has short arms. That's what the Mike Mayock said, not me. I am saying I prefer a LT with longer arms. That's not a fixation on my part. It's truth, Okung has longer arms to knock DE off their stride in case Okung gets beaten. He could reach out and disrupt the DE. And he is QUICK.

Bulaga has short arms! lol:saber:

[angel2]

Of all of the OTs that could go in the first two rounds half have a wingspan of 34" or less (Bryan Bulaga, Anthony Davis, Rodger Saffold, Jared Veldheer, and John Jerry). If having the difference between 33" and 34" was as big as you seem to think it is none of these guys would be graded out so highly.

Is 33" good? No. Does it tell the whole story? Of course not.

But it could make a difference in reaching out to push that DE out and away from the QB.

[E-Dog Night]

Aside from your negativity, you have a crush on Bulaga, fine. But, he still has short arms. That's what the Mike Mayock, not me. I am saying I prefer a LT with longer arms. That's not a fixation on my part. It's truth, Okung has longer arms to knock DE off their stride in case Okung gets beaten. He could reach out and disrupt the DE. And he is QUICK.

Bulaga has short arms! lol:saber:

Please show me where I've been negative. Be specific. I'm feel I'm stating my case and using facts wherever possible to back my opinions up, so I'd like you to point out where that hasn't been the case. That really seems out of left field.

As an offensive lineman, especially OT, it helps to have long arms to keep pass rushers at bay. No one disputes this. But this is hardly the only thing of importance. You can pass protect with a variety of wingspans. And, there's also that running part of the offense, where leverage, technique and strength are far more important than long arms.

So yeah, Mike Mayock says Okung's arms are longer than Bulaga's...we get it, already. 36 is longer than 33 1/4. It's becoming myopic. Let's move on, shall we?

[angel2]

Dude, you are seriously fixated on arm length! It's one tangible. One. If that's all that mattered, then that's all you'd have to look for and drafting would be easy.

I like Bulaga for a number of reasons.

• Runs similar OL system in college to what the Redskins will run
  
• Iowa has a history of turning out quality, NFL-ready linemen
  
• Shows a great deal of intelligence and confidence in interviews
  
• Moves in space/pulls & traps better than Okung
  
• Played well against top competition in college
  

And if the Lions take Trent Williams over Okung, then expect new GM Martin Mayhew to pull off his mask on national TV and reveal that he is really Matt Millen. Won't happen.

Where did you get the idea I have a fixation with arm length. I just stated what Mike Mayock said.

Yes, I would draft the best LT I could with the #4 pick. You may not see what difference an inch or two might make in a game when a LB or DE has beaten you. But that longer armed LT could lurch out and with that extra arms length disrupt the DE or LB.

[angel2]

Please show me where I've been negative. Be specific. I'm feel I'm stating my case and using facts wherever possible to back my opinions up, so I'd like you to point out where that hasn't been the case. That really seems out of left field.

As an offensive lineman, especially OT, it helps to have long arms to keep pass rushers at bay. No one disputes this. But this is hardly the only thing of importance. You can pass protect with a variety of wingspans. And, there's also that running part of the offense, where leverage, technique and strength are far more important than long arms.

So yeah, Mike Mayock says Okung's arms are longer than Bulaga's...we get it, already. 36 is longer than 33 1/4. It's becoming myopic. Let's move on, shall we?

Your connotation of "Dude". I know its a figure of speech but in its context its as if you want to say, "yo,stupid".

But, yes let's move on to previous post to you.

I would stay at #4 and draft either Okung or Williams.

[E-Dog Night]

Where did you get the idea I have a fixation with arm length. I just stated what Mike Mayock said.

Yes, I would draft the best LT I could with the #4 pick. You may not see what difference an inch or two might make in a game when a LB or DE has beaten you. But that longer armed LT could lurch out and with that extra arms length disrupt the DE or LB.

So...what you're saying is, Mike Mayock said that Bulaga's arms are shorter than the ideal. And that arm length plays some part in the projected effectiveness of college linemen coming into the NFL.

Huh. I hadn't picked up on that yet in the 12 posts where you stated that previously. :beatdeadhorse:

[HoggLife]

It is understood that you both have different views. There is nothing wrong with that. You both said "Lets move on". So lets do that. And sometimes people read stuff different in what you write and how you mean for it to be read. You both are passionate for the Redskins and at least both of you are hoping to address the O-Line in the draft.

[Ryko]

It is understood that you both have different views. There is nothing wrong with that. You both said "Lets move on". So lets do that. And sometimes people read stuff different in what you write and how you mean for it to be read. You both are passionate for the Redskins and at least both of you are hoping to address the O-Line in the draft.

I agree, all that matters is that we get SOMEONE who can man the left tackle spot, hopefully for years to come as Chris Samuels did when we draft him. Whether it be Okung, Bulaga, Williams, or someone like Saffold or Ducasse later on it does not matter, as long as Shanahan believes this person can anchor the left tackle spot.

And hopefully that involves a trade down to get more picks or whatever it takes for shanahan to be satisfied. In my eyes, I would like them to trade back out of any picks that they can because they need QUANTITY of new players, but I trust that Shanahan knows what hes doing and as long as he gets "his" guy (OR GUYS!) for the O-Line then I will be more than satisfied

[HoggLife]

I agree with you Ryko. This is the best season to trade down considering there are like 50 guys that are predicted to be 1st round grade talent. So the more picks we can get the better. If we could get two of the top 8 Tackles and the 2nd best OG then our line will be pretty solid.

[angel2]

So...what you're saying is, Mike Mayock said that Bulaga's arms are shorter than the ideal. And that arm length plays some part in the projected effectiveness of college linemen coming into the NFL.

Huh. I hadn't picked up on that yet in the 12 posts where you stated that previously. :beatdeadhorse:

Ah, many post ago I stated why I would not fancy to the idea of trading down to select (if he's still there) Bulaga.

The next time Mike Mayock does a Q&A online, I will ask him of his expert opinion why its important to be cautious of drafting a shorter arm Offensive Tackle.

E-Dog, I like the first round, number four pick just the way it is. Why, because I would get the LT I would want. A guy that is ideal to play the position.

[Going Commando]

IMO, trading down is not an option for the Skins. We need a LT who is regarded as the best LT. Trouble with Bulaga is his short arms. Not good to have a short arm LT.

His arms are almost the exact same length as Chris Samuels' and Jason Peters', and probably less than half an inch shorter than Joe Thomas'. They are 33.25 inches long. That's long enough.

[Going Commando]

Anything less than 34 inches is not good.

You've said this over and over but it isn't true. FWIW, 33 inches is actually considered the magical cutoff, but plenty of left tackles have succeeded with shorter arms than that. There were about 8 starting left tackles with arm length in the 33 inch range in 2008 which is a quarter of the league. A list of tackles who have been to the Pro-bowl recently with 33 inch arms:

-Joe Thomas

-Jason Peters

-Chris Samuels

-Chad Clifton

-David Diehl

-Matt Light

-Jordan Gross

Jeff Backus and Michael Roos have also been sucessful with arms in the 32 inch range which is below that cutoff. Sam Baker was a recent first round pick with 32.75 inch arms. Arm length is nice but it is by no means the end all be all. If Bryan Bulaga doesn't succeed in the NFL, it won't be because of his arm length.

As for the OP, I think Bryan Bulaga is a better OT prospect than Russell Okung straight up. If his thyroid condition isn't anything serious or recurring, I would consider taking him over Okung at 4 anyway. If we wanted to trade down, we could probably still get a superior OT prospect like Anthony Davis or Bruce Campbell in the teens. So its a good idea even if we move down to far to get Bulaga. There is almost nothing separating the top 4 or 5 offensive tackles from each other (Davis, Okung, Bulaga, Brown). And Campbell has truly unique athleticism to put himself in the discussion. Trent Williams is the only dud in the group as far as LTs are concerned.

[Orakpophobia]

Bulaga has short arms. Ok. But does he have

...

[Going Commando]

A "Technician" is a nice way of saying he's just an average "short armed" LT, whose slightly below norm who has the potential of bust written all over him, jmho.

No a technician is a nice way of saying he's good at the details of his position which is absolutely essential to success for an OT. It means he already understands his scheme, leverage, footwork, balance, hand technique, etc. It's definitely a compliment. Go watch Bulaga play dude.

[stoney26]

So how long are bulagas arms again?

[Going Commando]

Is 33" good? No. Does it tell the whole story? Of course not.

33 is fine. It's not a negative, I don't know where it got started that it's a negative but its not. I'll take a guy with 33 inch arms that's got quick and heavy hands EVERY SINGLE TIME over a guy with 36 inch arms with slow hands and a lame punch if that's all you were evaluating. That is essentially the difference between Bulaga and Okung--Watch Bulaga play and you see him occasionally level defenders with his punch alone. Ditto for Anthony Davis. Watch Okung and you'll never see it. For all those BP reps he put up at the combine Okung doesn't play with any where near the base or even upper body strength that Bulaga and Davis do.

[DGREENHULK]

How do you know Bulaga is going to be there in one of the later slots in the top 10? If Okung goes #2, Kansas City or Seattle could easily take Bulaga at #5 or 6 respectively. Bulaga is the 2nd best OT in the draft and I doubt he's around at #7, 8, or 9.

Agreed Bulaga IS the 2nd best tackle and by the scouting he maybe the best ZBS Tackle in this draft...so if Det does take Okung at 2 Nothing should change for us we still need a LT so Bugula at 4 could make sense. I think its a little high for him but KC at 5 would take him so 4 really isn't that much of a reach.

[E-Dog Night]

So how long are bulagas arms again?

I found a picture of him on the internet. This should help clear up any confusion. Wow, he really does have kinda short arms.

[angel2]

His arms are almost the exact same length as Chris Samuels' and Jason Peters', and probably less than half an inch shorter than Joe Thomas'. They are 33.25 inches long. That's long enough.

Hey don't pick on me, Steve.:cool: I can see why Mike Mayock made his comment and you can't. Just saying, give me the best draft pick at number four. If you getting upset with his arm length, so be it.

[angel2]

I found a picture of him on the internet. This should help clear up any confusion. Wow, he really does have kinda short arms.

That was funny as hell, eee.

[DGREENHULK]

You've said this over and over but it isn't true. FWIW, 33 inches is actually considered the magical cutoff, but plenty of left tackles have succeeded with shorter arms than that. There were about 8 starting left tackles with arm length in the 33 inch range in 2008 which is a quarter of the league. A list of tackles who have been to the Pro-bowl recently with 33 inch arms:

-Joe Thomas

-Jason Peters

-Chris Samuels

-Chad Clifton

-David Diehl

-Matt Light

-Jordan Gross

Jeff Backus and Michael Roos have also been sucessful with arms in the 32 inch range which is below that cutoff. Sam Baker was a recent first round pick with 32.75 inch arms. Arm length is nice but it is by no means the end all be all. If Bryan Bulaga doesn't succeed in the NFL, it won't be because of his arm length.

Great post!!! this should put to rest the "short arm" argument. fine research Mr. McQueen.

[Orakpophobia]

Bulagasaurus Rex!!