How Important is the "System"

[Chiefinonhaze]

I am a JC supporter/fan. I always bring up the fact that he has had so many systems in his career, and that it has stunted his growth. But the more I think about it, how different can "systems" really be?

I came to the conclusion that football is football. There are 9 or ten different routes. The QB should know these routes by the time he gets into the NFL.

The footwork does differ from system to system, but how long can it take to learn footwork? A Whole Season? Isn't it similar to learning a dance routine? Why does it take Campbell so long to learn the footwork and dropbacks?

I don't see any obstacles in learning a new system besides the termanology and footwork. The protections do vary, but when you are blitzed, you should know to get rid of it to the side from which you are being blited.

I am starting to have doubts in the whole system cliche. Maybe it isn't that hard to learn a system?

I think the problem is getting 11 players at once to learn the termanology, footwork, depth of routes, etc. That is probably why we couldn't get anything going in the passing game. At least we know there won't be any excuses in year two. :eaglesuck

[PROSCOUT]

You'll find out how important the SECOND year in a system is shortly.

[Symbol]

Different systems are tough to over come in one season. Though I played defense my entire playing days, my only real example of switching systems was when I moved from Georgia to California. I went from a blitz happy, attack the QB at all costs and if the guy with the ball gets in your way, hit him first, 4-3 system as a speed tackle to a conservative, zone 3-4 system where I had to take blocks instead of try and make my way past the blocks.

It's more of habit than anything else. For a QB, coming into a new system, you have to learn a new playbook. The routes maybe similar, but the habit and timing that you have to deal with is different. For a true west coast system, you go with a 3-5 step drop, make quick reads before and immediately after the snap and within 2 seconds you have to know where the ball is going (this after the snap of course.) In a 5-7 step drop you have to wait for the routes and play to develop more, which is why in these systems a good running game is so important. You're not making the quick decision of this is where it's going and I know my receiver is going to be here when the ball gets there. Instead you're waiting that extra half second and seeing which receiver has become open and then you throw it.

JC in this his second season in Jim Zorn's west coast system should have a much better understanding of the timing and what his receivers can do in their routes. The improvement should be obvious, but not necessarily pro bowl caliber.

[illone]

The system is important but only if you have the right pieces to run the system you want to employ.

That said Campbell is in the wrong system. He is more fit to a Gibbs or Coughlin type system where the ball is run alot and the passing game relies on play-action and big drop backs. Think David Garrard in Jax, or Eli Manning in NYG. That is what Campbell needs to be asked to do.

[jrfriedm]

The only system that Campbell is right for is the one where he is only asked to hand the ball off and NEVER EVER throw the ball

[SkinsFTW]

The system is important but only if you have the right pieces to run the system you want to employ.

Good thing we keep going 180 on what system the team wants to run every couple years. If Campbell sticks around here long enough we might just be in the right system for him. Next year we will go after New Englands new OC and try out their offense.

[Oldfan]

I think your thread title is misleading. Your OP seems to ask, "How difficult is it to learn a new offensive system?"

And, since the running game is simple enough to teach, we can refine the question to "How difficult is it to learn a new passing scheme?"

And, refining the question still further, what we really want to know is "How difficult is it to learn a new passing game so that it can be executed precisely with the defense employing various strategies to stop it?"

There are five eligible receivers who might end up anywhere on the field at different times, so the number of possible pass plays is infinite.

Bill Walsh added a degree of difficulty for receivers by asking them to read the defense and alter their routes accordingly. The QB is required to know what each of those receivers will do after reading the defense.

Using your analogy, I would imagine learning 100 WCO plays to be something like having 11 dancers learning 100 routines while 11 other dancers try to stop them.

[MattFancy]

In any system JC would still have to be able to read defenses and pick up blitzes and coverages, something that he still struggles with. I'm not really sure how much the plays differ from system to system, but your job as QB is to find the open receiver no matter what system you're in.

[ttr77]

I think certain systems can take time to learn, but it's up to the coaches to make sure the team is comfortable enough to run it fully, or shorten the play list.

Also, the coach needs to be able to adapt his system to match the players on the roster.

[SkinsFTW]

but your job as QB is to find the open receiver no matter what system you're in.

Actually a lot of systems aren't like that at all. The QB is expected to throw to the receiver before he is open or breaks away, or the QB throws the ball to a spot, not an open receiver.

[terrifNick21]

The system is important but only if you have the right pieces to run the system you want to employ.

100% on point.

[Laxpunk2006]

The routes may be the "same" but the plays are completely different. The QB has to know every play. He needs to know how the route of one WR effects another. He needs to know the depth of each route. There was a good article PFT linked to a few days ago regarding Tory Holt's speed and the "go" route. It explained that while a go route is basically running in a straight line there are different ways to run it for different depths and coverages.

Many routes are made to be altered as coverage changes, for this reason the QB also has to know every adjustment any WR/TE/RB will be making. He has to know all of the blocking schemes so he can understand where the blitzer may be getting through and where he can step up/roll out.

While a QB might possibly be able to learn everything the first season (I really doubt it) there is going to be hesitation in the thought process. More time in the system allows these decisions to be made quicker and quicker which can be very important for the timing of the play. In my opinion the system is extremely important and can take many years to master.

[Annonymous Source]

Good thing we keep going 180 on what system the team wants to run every couple years. If Campbell sticks around here long enough we might just be in the right system for him. Next year we will go after New Englands new OC and try out their offense.

The FO wants for Campbell to be proficent in every system in the Leauge so that when he leaves if Free Agency this year he will be able to fit into any team that needs a starter.

[TD_washingtonredskins]

I think it's more the philosophy than the mechanics.

For example, it takes practice to teach yourself to look deep first. Some systems prefer that you look downfield and work back. Some systems prefer that you work right to left.

I think making the reads while remembering what you're trying to accomplish is the tough part if you're changing systems year in and year out.

[ttr77]

For example, it takes practice to teach yourself to look deep first. Some systems prefer that you look downfield and work back. Some systems prefer that you work right to left.

I think Zorn's system is designed to look into the flat first...if the TE/RB/FB are covered, only THEN should you look downfield to a WR. And this is even more important on 3rd and long.

[TD_washingtonredskins]

I think Zorn's system is designed to look into the flat first...if the TE/RB/FB are covered, only THEN should you look downfield to a WR. And this is even more important on 3rd and long.

:hysterical:

Hopefully that improves in year 2. I really do believe that the philosophy of the system needs to be obvious and second-nature for a QB before he can flourish.

[dreamboater]

I think your thread title is misleading. Your OP seems to ask, "How difficult is it to learn a new offensive system?"

And, since the running game is simple enough to teach, we can refine the question to "How difficult is it to learn a new passing scheme?"

And, refining the question still further, what we really want to know is "How difficult is it to learn a new passing game so that it can be executed precisely with the defense employing various strategies to stop it?"

There are five eligible receivers who might end up anywhere on the field at different times, so the number of possible pass plays is infinite.

Bill Walsh added a degree of difficulty for receivers by asking them to read the defense and alter their routes accordingly. The QB is required to know what each of those receivers will do after reading the defense.

Using your analogy, I would imagine learning 100 WCO plays to be something like having 11 dancers learning 100 routines while 11 other dancers try to stop them.

That is a very good reason Colt looked sharp in preseason. Although I am not a genious with the Run and Shoot but adapting to WR changed routes is what he was asked to do at Hawaii. Yeah I had to bring up that name. But in honesty, he is not as talented as JC, but with Colt you see much better instincts and quickness which is what the WCO thrives off of.

[artmonkforHOF]

well to Danny boy, apparently not very much since he cant seem to keep an OC or DC here for more than 3 years.