ljs Posted January 8, 2009 Share Posted January 8, 2009 How much responsibility does a bar/tavern or other business have if you get assaulted/killed on their property? I find this particular situation interesting, especially since the prosecutors never filed charges on the 'suspect" since the "victim" started the fight. http://www.krem.com/topstories/stories/krem2-010709-screaming-yak-lawsuit.359d353.html SPOKANE -- A North Spokane bar faces a wrongful death lawsuit over a fistfight that killed a man in January 2007. The family of Gregory Smelcer is suing the owners of the "Screaming Yak" on West Francis and the man who threw the punch. The lawsuit accuses the bar of negligence for not having security personnel on hand to break up the fight. Smelcer was punched in the face inside the bar, then fell backwards and hit his head on the floor. He died the next day. Spokane County prosecutors never filed charges against the man who punched Smelcer, Morris Crane, saying Smelcer was the instigator. The lawsuit seeks an undisclosed amount of money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Predicto Posted January 8, 2009 Share Posted January 8, 2009 I think it highly unlikely that this lawsuit will succeed. However, as of yet I do not have many facts to work with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InsaneBoost Posted January 8, 2009 Share Posted January 8, 2009 Spokane go figure. I doubt they'll win anything from the bar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dictator Posted January 8, 2009 Share Posted January 8, 2009 so guy was punched...fell back on the floor and hit his head. lets say there were 100 security guards..could they have stopped one punch from happening? maybe if there was a scuffle prior to that. who knows. Nothing like trying to profiteer of off death. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ljs Posted January 8, 2009 Author Share Posted January 8, 2009 I think it highly unlikely that this lawsuit will succeed. However, as of yet I do not have many facts to work with. If you click the link, there is a link on the acutal web site with the lawsuit details. Thanks for posting, as I was hoping you might have some good input. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ljs Posted January 8, 2009 Author Share Posted January 8, 2009 Spokane go figure.I doubt they'll win anything from the bar. haha, considering we made national news for our shooting of a snow plow driver.... Home of a serial killer, last year a state rep( married/republican) was caught having a homosexual scandal w/ some dude at the infamous Davenport hotel (for $1000). Nothing in this area ever surprises me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midnight Judges Posted January 8, 2009 Share Posted January 8, 2009 it's not quite good enough to make the Darwin awards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Predicto Posted January 8, 2009 Share Posted January 8, 2009 Upset and mourning family members often look for other people to blame for the death of their loved one. It is difficult for them to accept that he may have brought it on himself. Human nature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GibbsFactor Posted January 8, 2009 Share Posted January 8, 2009 I believe something similar happened last year in a LaPlata MD bar, Good Times. I believe the bar was sued. Not sure about the particulars but it's up for sale now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TGI Jef Posted January 8, 2009 Share Posted January 8, 2009 as a general liability underwriter, i will say that - at least from an insurance standpoint - the bar could easily be found 100% liable in this case due to the fact that i have seen several lawsuits succeed against other bars in similar situations. do i agree with that ruling? not really. but depending on the legal climate there (it varies a great deal from county to county), this bar might be in a ton of trouble. and, depending on their insurance coverage, so might their insurance company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigMike619 Posted January 8, 2009 Share Posted January 8, 2009 I saw once on Montel where a guy punched a dude who was trying to get on the bus and he fell off and hit his head and died. the guy went to prison over that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeInJc aka M.I.A. Posted January 8, 2009 Share Posted January 8, 2009 If there was a scuffle or prior indications of the offender showing his intention to hit the guy, then yes the bar can be liable for a number of reasons. Say the bar served either individual to much alcohol, that could have contributed to the fight. Bars have a responsibility to cut people off and once they are cut off they are supposed to leave the premise. Security is supposed to be provided and when a situation arises they are supposed to get involved, get the offenders off the premise and after that they are in the clear. A lot of the bouncers at the bar I work at just say "take it outside" if anyone wants to fight, because if you do fight inside the bar they will take you outside REALLY quick. I used to bounce in Adams Morgan and Ole Towne and that's exactly what I would do, get the individuals involved out of the bar and after that I would turn my back and walk back inside. When someone is in an establishment, whether it be a business or house, they are a liability. Now, I doubt the bar will get hit with the wrongful death, but something to a lesser degree will be handed out. That is unless there were no signs of the confrontation about to happen and the dude just walked up and punched the guy real quick and ran off, but that almost NEVER happens. If it was as random as described in my previous sentence then the bar better have some security footage to prove it. EDIT: Spokane County prosecutors never filed charges against the man who punched Smelcer, Morris Crane, saying Smelcer was the instigator. And there you have it. There were indications of a fight about to happen and that guy who started saying **** should have been thrown out of the bar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevenaa Posted January 8, 2009 Share Posted January 8, 2009 I saw once on Montel where a guy punched a dude who was trying to get on the bus and he fell off and hit his head and died. the guy went to prison over that. The guy who did the punching is responsible. You can't take action absent responsibility. Suing the bar is yet another frivolous waste of time and money. It's unfortunate there's not a way to successfully prevent these types of lawsuits. I just don't see how you can manage it without the possibility of reasonable suits being denied. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
halter91 Posted January 8, 2009 Share Posted January 8, 2009 Depends if the bar over served either one of the guys in the fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jnhay Posted January 8, 2009 Share Posted January 8, 2009 They're suing the puncher too according to the article. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander PK Posted January 8, 2009 Share Posted January 8, 2009 and personal, individual common sense and responsibility takes another left to the head. :doh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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