adamyesme1111 Posted June 4, 2008 Share Posted June 4, 2008 I am 15 years old freshman in higshchool (please don't bring up the age on my account anymore :laugh:) . Due to complications I haven't went to school yet but I am planning on going next year. Because I work out at home and most often alone, I have been using a Smith Machine to bench press. I bench probably like 205 now with the 25 pound bar on the Smith Machine, but lately I have been reading mixed feelings online about it. Some people say Smith Machine is great. Some people say that it is a total waste of time. I know that since in highschool they use free weights I probably won't be able to bench as much when I go there. In terms of my muscles and strength, did I miss out on anything because I have been using the Smith Machine instead of free weights? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonard Washington Posted June 4, 2008 Share Posted June 4, 2008 if you're working out alone the smith machine is safer. you can also do a wider variety of exercises safely and quickly. personally i prefer free weights and you could easily use both at home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WVUforREDSKINS Posted June 4, 2008 Share Posted June 4, 2008 you 15 and benching 205? You are an animal! I have never used the smith so IDK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adamyesme1111 Posted June 4, 2008 Author Share Posted June 4, 2008 you 15 and benching 205?You are an animal! I have never used the smith so IDK I've been lifting weights for a couple years now lol. And apparently 205 for the Smith Machine would be less for free weights. I just hope the past 2 years weren't in vain because I've been using a Smith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GibbsFactor Posted June 4, 2008 Share Posted June 4, 2008 You haven't lost anything. You are good to go. Smith machines are easier then free weights. Free weights are great because you can add size with them and it works your stabilizers. Smith machine is better for safety and it helps iso your target muscles better. You probably have pretty good muscle endurance, switching to free weights will add the strength. I'd say that 205 on a Smith is about 165 free weights. Still pretty good for 15. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DariusCyrus Posted June 4, 2008 Share Posted June 4, 2008 since you're restricted to a fixed path (up & down) on machines you don't get to train those smaller muscles called the "stabilizing muscles". Whereas on free weights, its not just up and down, you're not restricted. this is why if you've been training a long time on a smith machine and try to do free weights, at first, your arms start to swing left/right and front/back.. so you have to concentrate on that. From experience, if your max bench on the smith machine is 205lbs, then on free weights it would be like ~180lb now if you're doing Squats on a Smith Machine, when you transition to free weights, the problem you'll have would be with "balance". its not a problem though... if you're trying to train for sports, i'd say go with free weights. If you're going for just a "beach" look, then do machine. Bench press, squats, dead lifts, power cleans... --> workout for the champions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reic Posted June 4, 2008 Share Posted June 4, 2008 I enjoy free weights myself, but have used a smith machine here at ODU for a few exercises. It will be more difficult for you to bench freeweights because you lose the fluid smooth motion of a smith machine, and the freeweights reply completly on you. You will be fine in the transition, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Williams Posted June 4, 2008 Share Posted June 4, 2008 I really really REALLY don't approve the smith machine......I find VERY few people in my industry that do either...... I haven't done any indepth study about it because so many I respect in the field have been against it.....I'll assume it is the unnatural motion coupled with the fact that all the weight is compressing your discs with no chance of flexion. use a standard rack that can catch you.....as for 205 @ 15......nice....I reached that @ 17......then again....I'm probably ALOT smaller than u :laugh: if you are lifting for any specific sport ie:football Squats, Incline bench, Power CLean and DEadlifts need to be your bread and butter..... just make sure never to lift when sore, the gains you make are OUTSIDE the gym NOT in it. tip #2- Try not to do heavy deads on the same day as squats......your central nervous system doesn't like that on a consistent basis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adamyesme1111 Posted June 4, 2008 Author Share Posted June 4, 2008 About the stabilizers. Are they not muscles that can't be just adressed separately? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Williams Posted June 4, 2008 Share Posted June 4, 2008 About the stabilizers. Are they not muscles that can't be just adressed separately? They can but it won't be nearly as effective if throw into a sport specific movement.... example: D-lineman workout A: Bench, squat, Deadlift workout B: tricep ext Bicep curl forearm curl leg press lunges/hammy curls back extensions ------ I will always lean toward the power movements if power or strength is the goal. If ya wanna get bigger or gain endurance that's another topic..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PokerPacker Posted June 4, 2008 Share Posted June 4, 2008 what do you guys think about pushups as a workout? effective? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Williams Posted June 4, 2008 Share Posted June 4, 2008 what do you guys think about pushups as a workout? effective? Make sure you are balancing out your back lifts with your chest......if not you will not be able to maximize your potential and worse you will cause posture issues..... Push ups ( unweighted ) are simply an endurance workout...... you get better at what you work at......don't expect size, strength or power gains........ You will be able to do substantially more after about 8-10 weeks of continuous training but that is neural adaptation. If you are weightless I suggest shoulder wide pull ups, back extenstions, shoulder width push ups, crunches/ leg raises while hanging, & lunges. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PokerPacker Posted June 4, 2008 Share Posted June 4, 2008 Make sure you are balancing out your back lifts with your chest......if not you will not be able to maximize your potential and worse you will cause posture issues.....Push ups ( unweighted ) are simply an endurance workout...... you get better at what you work at......don't expect size, strength or power gains........ You will be able to do substantially more after about 8-10 weeks of continuous training but that is neural adaptation. If you are weightless I suggest shoulder wide pull ups, back extenstions, shoulder width push ups, crunches/ leg raises while hanging, & lunges. so if i'm looking to gain size (i'm only 125 pounds!!!), what would you suggest for a home workout? I'm usually doing it late at night (or early morning technically) at which point i don't have access to much. If there's nothing for gaining size without machinery, then do you have anything you'd suggest that a bowflex can work for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Williams Posted June 4, 2008 Share Posted June 4, 2008 so if i'm looking to gain size (i'm only 125 pounds!!!), what would you suggest for a home workout? I'm usually doing it late at night (or early morning technically) at which point i don't have access to much. If there's nothing for gaining size without machinery, then do you have anything you'd suggest that a bowflex can work for? size or ( sarcoplasmic hypertrophy ) is best gained for the majority in the 8-12 rep range.... therefore lifts such as a sit up up or push up don't qualify since you could probably do hundreds non-stop if motivated to do so. A boxflex can only take you so far because of the lack of attention to stabilizers..... IMO, it will help after about the 10 week mark if used properly......as for your size.... honestly, genetics are clearly against you @125 so I doubt a beast-like build much less an average one is attainable through NORMAL eating and lifting..... I'd say give it a shot and if after a year or so you don't see enough results to motovate you to continue you should look into some more refined athletics such as golf, bowling, and tennis. Heck.....I am built similarly therefore my football career ended FAST once I reached the college level.......After talking to one of my professors here at ASU he said I would be a gifted endurance runner if I tried ( my resting heart beat is less than 50 ) Since I hate running I don't see this happening until I'm at least 30+ but whatever.... for now, I lift 4 times a week and run usually 2 times a week.....I lift ALMOST as hard as if I still play.....mostly to stay in shape for random pickup games....lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PokerPacker Posted June 4, 2008 Share Posted June 4, 2008 I'd say give it a shot and if after a year or so you don't see enough results to motovate you to continue you should look into some more refined athletics such as golf, bowling, and tennis. Heck.....I am built similarly therefore my football career ended FAST once I reached the college level.......After talking to one of my professors here at ASU he said I would be a gifted endurance runner if I tried ( my resting heart beat is less than 50 ) Since I hate running I don't see this happening until I'm at least 30+ but whatever.... i'll stick with keep up with hockey regardless of my size, i just think it would be nice to look a little less... small. As I understand it, its good to get protein intake after a workout. should something around the range of like, 60 grams of protein be effective for an after-workout snack? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No_Pressure Posted June 4, 2008 Share Posted June 4, 2008 Free weights is way, way better for strength training but if you are working out by yourself I wouldn't recommend doing them at all. In order to get the correct amount of work out of your muscles, you would have to be pushing yourself to the point of failure, and at that point you need a spotter or you're going to kill yourself. If the exercises are for football or any sport for that matter, I would not put as much emphasis on the bench press while you're using the machine. If you are looking to buy any free weights get a bar so you can do power cleans, other than that I would say to keep this in mind: the bench press for football and a lot of sports is overrated. I've seen so many people over the years that think it is the be all and end all- that if they spend an hour doing the bench press in the gym they're set. It is an important exercise but it really isn't that important. While I was playing the exercises that I really think gave me the most benefit were power cleans, dips/pullups on the dip/pullup bars, and believe it or not, some of those calf exercises where you're standing on a block with some weights. I always had a lot of variety in the weight lifting routines I did, but those are the ones that I noticed had an impact for me at least. But everything "coach williams" :laugh: is saying is pretty much on point. It depends on what you're going for, you build what you do around that. I was going more for overall strength and endurance at my position so I did a lot of exercises that incorporated endurance stuff, high rep stuff, etc. while I always saw a lot of the linemen sticking strictly to the strength stuff. Its like they would basically squat, bench, maybe deadlift, etc and that was the whole workout. I think being a better athlete means incorporating more than just sheer raw strength but whatever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Williams Posted June 4, 2008 Share Posted June 4, 2008 I'll touch on the protein and then I'll go to bed.... ----- the post workout meal is a very important concept. It should have a nice balance of fats, proteins and carbs to make up for the deficit created when exercising. Most theorize that the best time to eat this meal is ASAP because the window can close in as little as 10 minutes for this period of hyperabsorbtion. It is a myth to say that if you don't eat immediately after your workout is wasted. While logic says it may hurt it isn't as severe as most say it is. When it comes down to the AMOUNT of protein needed, this is where everyone from the old skool logic gets all butt-hurt.... it's NOT about the # of grams of protein as it is the balance of AA's ( amino acids ) If you aren't weird like me and try to eat something to get this *balance* perfect use the nsca standard for protein intake and eat a larger portion POST workout. THe nsca scale goes like so: 0.591 Normal peeps 0.691 standard working out people 0.791 non-competing athletes 0.891 competing athletes ~ 1.291 pro athletes basically those #'s represent the # of grams needed pre KILO of body weight in accordance with your trained event. therefore, a man who is 125 lbs training to look good for the ladies and play a lil hockey on the side probably falls under the 0.791gpk So....125 lbs= 56 kilos * .791= ~44.5 grams of protein per day.... --- Now comparing this relatively new data to your initial thought of 60 grams POST workout makes the idea somewhat overkill...... A whole different topic is actually ( how much protein can the average person absorb over a 3 hour period ? ) or ( how much protein does it take to have expensive pee ? ) I would suggest you focus more on unsaturated fats, complex carbs and about 15-20 grams of HIGH quality protein such as fish ( Alaskan salmon ONLY if you pick salmon ) or turkey....... As for the shakes comment.......not a person in this forum can convince me a scientifically created formula of AA's is better than the natural blend in organic meats. ditch the shakes .........most are filled with so much artificial sugars with unknown side effects they aren't worth it in the long run anyways.... G'nite..... ps- I'm sure I'll have plenty of opposition in the morning but they won't be arguing with me, only the j.a.m.a. database I read nearly as much as the Bible :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PokerPacker Posted June 4, 2008 Share Posted June 4, 2008 I'll touch on the protein and then I'll go to bed.... yeah, i'm still up too... i'll be going to bed now too. So....125 lbs= 56 kilos * .791= ~44.5 grams of protein per day.... --- Now comparing this relatively new data to your initial thought of 60 grams POST workout makes the idea somewhat overkill...... A whole different topic is actually ( how much protein can the average person absorb over a 3 hour period ? ) or ( how much protein does it take to have expensive pee ? ) I would suggest you focus more on unsaturated fats, complex carbs and about 15-20 grams of HIGH quality protein such as fish ( Alaskan salmon ONLY if you pick salmon ) or turkey....... As for the shakes comment.......not a person in this forum can convince me a scientifically created formula of AA's is better than the natural blend in organic meats. unfortunately, being a vegatarian, my options are limited. I came up with the number of 60 pretty much just because I figured mozzerella sticks would make a good post-workout snack, and amount of protein contained in the number I ate comes out to about 60 grams. I guess I could cut down on it a bit which would give me a longer time between restocking (but they taste so good). is that a natural enough of a source to give me the Amino Acids I need (at least a decent amount)? (don't worry, i'm not expecting a response for a few hours since we'll both be getting a good... mornings... rest.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#98QBKiller Posted June 4, 2008 Share Posted June 4, 2008 I always use the smith machine for bench since I workout alone at the gym. It's safer and you can work your chest to failure without worrying about dropping the bar on yourself. I'd recommend it if you're lifting alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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