Zen-like Todd Posted October 29, 2006 Share Posted October 29, 2006 Jansen has been a lousy right tackle since 2002.I think he should be forced to take a massive paycut this offseason or face a June 1st cut. Then even if he does renegotiate his contract, he's still assured of nothing for next year. He should be made to compete for the starting job with legit competition not some college FA longshot. Jansen has been allowed to coast on his rep from Michigan and his very strong first 3 years in the league way too long by the media and some fans. Jansen signed a 6 year 24 million dollar contract a few years ago when he could have run out and gotten a bigger better deal somewhere else. In terms of paycuts, he's not high on my list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redskin Rush Posted October 29, 2006 Share Posted October 29, 2006 Maybe we should break his thumbs... :laugh: I thought that had always been the consensus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiggoReincarnated Posted October 29, 2006 Share Posted October 29, 2006 Not putting all the blame on the offense either, the defense is horrid and they have no excuse, same defense for 3 straight years. That's exactly the problem. Being stubborn and not adjusting/adapting your defensive scheme means you get eaten alive in this league within a few years, unless your players are superior enough to compensate. Remember Buddy Ryan and the "46" defense? Initially nobody could stop it, then Gibbs and other teams figured out how to beat it and its effectiveness diminished greatly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XxSpearheadxX Posted October 29, 2006 Share Posted October 29, 2006 That's exactly the problem. Being stubborn and not adjusting/adapting your defensive scheme means you get eaten alive in this league within a few years, unless your players are superior enough to compensate.Remember Buddy Ryan and the "46" defense? Initially nobody could stop it, then Gibbs and other teams figured out how to beat it and its effectiveness diminished greatly. I really don't think it has to do with being "stubborn" I think it has to do with Gibbs and Cerrato letting GW's players walk for 3 years, and finally it has caught up to them. Jansen signed a 6 year 24 million dollar contract a few years ago when he could have run out and gotten a bigger better deal somewhere else. In terms of paycuts, he's not high on my list. Not to mention Jansen was Sporting News All-Pro RT last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3CardMonte Posted October 29, 2006 Share Posted October 29, 2006 Funny thing is all these linemen look better when we play REDSKINS FOOTBALL and pound the crap out of a defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XxSpearheadxX Posted October 29, 2006 Share Posted October 29, 2006 Funny thing is all these linemen look better when we play REDSKINS FOOTBALL and pound the crap out of a defense. Tough to do against a 9 man front. Welcome to the NFL. If Brunell can't prove he can throw against a seam in the Cover 2, we are screwed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiggoReincarnated Posted October 29, 2006 Share Posted October 29, 2006 Funny thing is all these linemen look better when we play REDSKINS FOOTBALL and pound the crap out of a defense. Amen. Its like going to a party and changing your whole demeanor to hook up with a chick. Any positive results (ie getting laid) will be short-term and fleeting. Our personality has been that of a power running football team. Its what won us Super Bowls...committing to the run and establishing play-action passes. Why we are trying to go the route of finesse, I do not know. Gibbs adapted his philosophy to the power running game after coming here from San Diego...and we saw it during the 5 game win streak and against Jacksonville this year. Why are we straying from what works for us? If any of you watched the Giants on Monday night against the Cowboys, they are playing the power running game the way we need to be doing it. They punished the Dallas defense mercilessly. Tiki Barber had over 20 carries and over 100 yards by the end of the 3rd quarter. Think its an accident that they are in 1st place in the NFC East? I don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spidernat Posted October 29, 2006 Share Posted October 29, 2006 Amen.Its like going to a party and changing your whole demeanor to hook up with a chick. Any positive results (ie getting laid) will be short-term and fleeting. Our personality has been that of a power running football team. Its what won us Super Bowls...committing to the run and establishing play-action passes. Why we are trying to go the route of finesse, I do not know. Gibbs adapted his philosophy to the power running game after coming here from San Diego...and we saw it during the 5 game win streak and against Jacksonville this year. Why are we straying from what works for us? If any of you watched the Giants on Monday night against the Cowboys, they are playing the power running game the way we need to be doing it. They punished the Dallas defense mercilessly. Tiki Barber had over 20 carries and over 100 yards by the end of the 3rd quarter. Think its an accident that they are in 1st place in the NFC East? I don't. I find some of it curious also considering that Saunders is a Coryell disciple. So in essence, Gibbs seemed to somewhat revert back to what he abandoned when he first came to Washington in 1981. Having said that, I have noticed a trend, specially from the OT's, of failing to overpower their opponents at the line of scrimmage. They talk about smash-mouth football but you have to do more than just talk. You have to step out on the field and execute it. Talk is cheap. Actions are priceless. Loved the analogy of going to a party and changing your demeanor for short term success! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REEGSKINS Posted October 29, 2006 Share Posted October 29, 2006 couldn't handle freeney??? where'd you get that idea? freeney didn't have any sacks, not even a tackle in that game. the only defensive stat he had was a deflection. stats dont mean everything. if you watched the game you would have seen freeney was disrupting everything. he was one one the reasons you saw all the 2 yard dump offs on third and long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiggoReincarnated Posted October 29, 2006 Share Posted October 29, 2006 our tackles are finewe need to play to their strengths, and that's run blocking, not keeping them on an island in pass protection the whole game when you got an elite speed rusher like Freeney, you give Samuels some TE or RB help Freeney makes all-pro LTs look silly on a weekly basis if you want something to worry about, worry about our protection schemes that have even Portis saying he wants to stay in more and block Samuels should be able to handle Freeney without help. That's what we need an all pro LT to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadowplay Posted October 29, 2006 Share Posted October 29, 2006 couldn't handle freeney??? where'd you get that idea? freeney didn't have any sacks, not even a tackle in that game. the only defensive stat he had was a deflection. Sorry, but having tivo'd the game and watched Jansen, Freeney blew by him on at least a half dozen plays. I think that's one reason why you kept seeing these 3rd and 8 plays getting thrown to players in the flat for three yards. Jansen hasn't been good this year. It's tough to take too because he's probably my favorite player. His problems started in the preseason, there were reports of him getting frustrated and starting fights in training camp, and they've just continued. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuji869 Posted October 29, 2006 Share Posted October 29, 2006 That is kind of scary because this is only Jansens 8th season. O Lineman usually last for a long time, Jacoby, Grimm and Bostic all lasted for over 10 seasons and were 3 of the 6 Redskin Players that were on all three Super Bowl Championship Teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbuzz1962 Posted October 29, 2006 Share Posted October 29, 2006 The problem we have with both of our tackles is that we cannot count on them when we need them the most. When we have big game against a team with a good pass rush, we get hammered. I understand that we aren't going to beat everyone up front everytime. The problem I have is that we always get beat when it counts the most. This offensive line has not done a very good job this year, or last year. Last year was injuries, this year it is???? There is no real explanation other than there front four beating our front four. We have the same problem on defense. No pass rush. When you can't get pressure on the quarterback, the team is going to get away with murder. As they have with us. Unless Gibbs fixes these problems this team will not have a snowballs chance in hell to be sucessfull. I don't care what big name offensive receivers and runners we pick up, it doesn't do a damn bit of good if your line sucks. I don't like using that work to describe our team, but if fits, so I will use it for now. If this team doesn't have better line play after the bye week, we can look forward to the same old bs from this team. A bunch of finger pointing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uno Mas Posted October 29, 2006 Share Posted October 29, 2006 Absolutely. He was getting dominated the other game. Freeney dominates everybody. And still didnt get a sack against us, except for the one that got called back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uno Mas Posted October 29, 2006 Share Posted October 29, 2006 Sorry, but having tivo'd the game and watched Jansen, Freeney blew by him on at least a half dozen plays. I think that's one reason why you kept seeing these 3rd and 8 plays getting thrown to players in the flat for three yards. Jansen hasn't been good this year. It's tough to take too because he's probably my favorite player. His problems started in the preseason, there were reports of him getting frustrated and starting fights in training camp, and they've just continued. HUH? I thought Freeney was matched up with Samuels all game!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCsportsfan53 Posted October 29, 2006 Share Posted October 29, 2006 please dont say that, we gave him a 7 year 50 million dollar extension only...a season or two ago...lets all pray that Samuels can stay a pro bowl player for at least three of those seven years. He didn't deserve the Pro Bowl last year. The other guys who are paid what he's paid don't get abused by every speed rusher they see. Given that Jansen's never been a great pass pro guy and his play has slipped significantly, it's absolutely imperative that you be able to count on your 50 million dollar LT to hold up on an island. Against any kind of speed rush, he just can't. Our offensive line needs a serious look. Out tackles have not played up to their expectations, their contracts or performances early in their careers. But we may be stuck with them because of the contracts. I say trade em both and stockpile draft picks. We have too many needs right now to think of next year in such a shortsighted way again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mania Posted October 29, 2006 Share Posted October 29, 2006 I point you to this quote by Bill Parcells: “This is Jansen getting pushed back' date='” he says. “He doesn’t look like the player he was a couple of years ago.” [url']http://www.nytimes.com/2006/10/29/sports/playmagazine/1029play_parcells.html?pagewanted=2&_r=2&ei=5094&en=00292a0d8a8a5745&hp&ex=1162008000&partner=homepage[/url] We've all seen him struggle this season and to tell the truth, he hasn't looked all that good in the past two seasons. Should we be concerned at offensive tackle come draft time and FA? Parcells is right, he isn't the player he was a couple of years ago, because 2 years ago he was out the entire season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redskin81 Posted October 29, 2006 Share Posted October 29, 2006 only 15 sacks, but how many pressures, hurries, hits? I don't think sacks are a telling stat of that, as we have seen Brunell become hurried, pressured, and hit after throwiing oftentimes, definitely more than 11 times. I think Samuels can be alright, he kept sucking last weekend though. Jansen, Im not too sure anymore, the telling signs were when he was apparently getting rocked in training camp. I saw rookie Montgomery rock him on one play, I was weary since then. A ton of hurries and throw aways. Blame Brunell all you want but this O line has underachieved in a huge way. Im not exactly impressed with the run blocking either. I made a point in another thread in a sacrastic manner about benching some of the o line to see about "the future" behind them on the bench. I know we cant do that but we have a ton of cash tied up in a line thats not getting it done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronnix Posted October 30, 2006 Share Posted October 30, 2006 i dont think jensen is as hungry a player as the first few years in the league. he looks complecent, out of shape to me. chris has trouble with speed rushers period. we cant put a tight end on each tackle. this has been the big problem in pass blocking all season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roanoker Posted October 30, 2006 Share Posted October 30, 2006 Don't know if it is just Jansen. the oline seems to do better on run blocking than on pass rush. :2cents: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PleaseGoForTheWin Posted October 30, 2006 Share Posted October 30, 2006 He has been good up until this year--he played very well at times last year--so I'm hoping that he's still adjusting to the new O. He's only what, 30, so he's not quite over the hill. Still a starter, despite his recent troubles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XxSpearheadxX Posted October 30, 2006 Share Posted October 30, 2006 A ton of hurries and throw aways. Blame Brunell all you want but this O line has underachieved in a huge way. Im not exactly impressed with the run blocking either. I made a point in another thread in a sacrastic manner about benching some of the o line to see about "the future" behind them on the bench. I know we cant do that but we have a ton of cash tied up in a line thats not getting it done. No more hurries and throwaways cause by the o-line than any top 10 team. You can't blame sacks, hurries, and knockdowns that are Brunell's fault ont he O-line. When a blitzer gets in the backfield and no blitzpickup was called for, it is Brunells fault. Not the O-Line. I really don't think you have watched the games closely enough to feel the way you have, because everyone that has really reviewed the games play by play doesn't see the O-line playing that badly - in pass pro. The run blocking against Indy was horrendous though, I'll give you that. It was real bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iceman330 Posted October 30, 2006 Share Posted October 30, 2006 I point you to this quote by Bill Parcells: “This is Jansen getting pushed back' date='” he says. “He doesn’t look like the player he was a couple of years ago.” [url']http://www.nytimes.com/2006/10/29/sports/playmagazine/1029play_parcells.html?pagewanted=2&_r=2&ei=5094&en=00292a0d8a8a5745&hp&ex=1162008000&partner=homepage[/url] We've all seen him struggle this season and to tell the truth, he hasn't looked all that good in the past two seasons. Should we be concerned at offensive tackle come draft time and FA? God I hope we get rid of his sorry ass Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redskin81 Posted October 30, 2006 Share Posted October 30, 2006 No more hurries and throwaways cause by the o-line than any top 10 team.You can't blame sacks, hurries, and knockdowns that are Brunell's fault ont he O-line. When a blitzer gets in the backfield and no blitzpickup was called for, it is Brunells fault. Not the O-Line. I really don't think you have watched the games closely enough to feel the way you have, because everyone that has really reviewed the games play by play doesn't see the O-line playing that badly - in pass pro. The run blocking against Indy was horrendous though, I'll give you that. It was real bad. I watch every game extremely closely and sometimes twice. I dont know what line your watching but samuels and jansen are constantly being blow off the ball. Watch the colts and the giants games again. They played ok vs the vikes. And the cowboys game was a slopfest from both teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barry wilburn Posted October 30, 2006 Share Posted October 30, 2006 Whether he is done or not, Jansen is the type of guy that this staff will stick with until he can't walk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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