WT - Patten welcomes stiff competition

[Mass_SkinsFan]

I don't see how one can be the fan of a team and hate/root against players on your team...how well/bad some of those players play have some factor in the success of your team.

It's actually not that hard. Especially with WR's. You simply root for that player to get hurt and for other players to play well.

While I couldn't stand Jeff George..and particularly loathed Deion Sanders...they were on the team, and started...to wish them poor play is to some degree wishing your team some modicum of failure.

Don't worry. It isn't poor play that I wish on these people. It's career ending injury.

Mass you make this a tad too personal...and your personal hatred clearly clouds sound reasoning and judgement. How about we let the coaches of the team you root for determine who is a skin and who isn't..and who is good enough to do what, and how much playing time they get. It's very possible you're right..and Patten will be out of here..but if he gets and opportunity and contributes in a way that helps this teams' success, ie playoffs/superbowl, how can you be against the good of the team as a whole.

Everything is personal. If I invest my time, energy and interest into something, I expect to get a return on that investment. I haven't gotten one since the 1991-1992 season. I don't trust the coaching staff any further than I can throw FedEx field off it's foundation. They haven't proven an ability to do anything in their return thus far.

[Mass_SkinsFan]

patience young grasshopper.

Patience is something I have none of and have less than no interest in acquiring any of.

you're right, elway and manning came in a showed they could start right away and lead their teams. but with all the QBs that have ever been drafted in the first round, how many of them started right away, or even in their second year? not many.

I was more refering to the way that Manning and Elway shot their way off the teams that drafted them. It was in response to a comment about Campbell not being able to pick which team drafted him. Personally, I don't believe in drafting ANY player that you don't believe can come in and have an IMMEDIATE impact on the team. It's a waste so far as I am concerned.

just give JC some time, stop throwing tantrums like a little spoiled brat, and trust the staff we have.

I have given JC some time. He got all of last season and this offseason. If a first rounder can't come in and win the job in that time, he's a bust so far as I am concerned. Oh, and where I'm from trust is EARNED and this offensive coaching staff has done nothing to earn any trust from me.

[Mass_SkinsFan]

I'm sorry, maybe I'm a bit slow, but could you explain exactly what about the system the NFL uses is irking you. I'm getting the vibe that you're talking about the quasi-communistic system of parity, but could you confirm that and clearly state exactly what angers you so?

You hit it almost right on the head there. It's the TOTALLY Communistic system that the NFL uses these days. The total lack of interest in Greatness of teams that has been replaced by the acceptance and elevation of mediocrity to an artform in the NFL. It's the whole salary cap system. The whole idea that a "Strong League - Weak Team" system is so much better than a "Strong Team - Weak League" system, which is what I would really prefer to see.

[DCsportsfan53]

"Any receiver wants the ball. He wants to be the man. But putting your personal goals secondary to the team makes you a championship caliber team. If D.P. gets a lot of balls, I'll embrace it. If D.P. is clearing out underneath or cheering on the sidelines, I'll embrace that, too. When I signed that contract, I agreed to do what they tell me to do."

That's why Patten isn't going to be cut. Despite the fact that his cap number is high for a 4th stringer, you have to add his value as a leader, a locker room prescence, an influence on the younger guys and his championship experience to the equation and when you do his price isn't bad at all. He's the kind of guy that exemplifies a Joe Gibbs team and what makes them what they are.

[JimmiJo]

It's actually not that hard. Especially with WR's. You simply root for that player to get hurt and for other players to play well.

Don't worry. It isn't poor play that I wish on these people. It's career ending injury.

Everything is personal. If I invest my time, energy and interest into something, I expect to get a return on that investment. I haven't gotten one since the 1991-1992 season. I don't trust the coaching staff any further than I can throw FedEx field off it's foundation. They haven't proven an ability to do anything in their return thus far.

I'm convinced now that you are just baiting people on this board - as your comments are beyond proposterous. You know exactly what you are saying and the potential upset that results.

Beyond this - your comments are without class.

My sincere hope is that one of the mods will grant you some time off.

[Mass_SkinsFan]

You're a smart guy...no doubt about that. Why don't you explain to me why you still follow a team and a league that fly in the face of what your personal beliefs are (and have been doing so for over a decade)?

Actually if I was as smart as you seem to indicate that's probably exactly what I would have done a long time ago. Unfortunately it appears that my stubbornness and stupidity (or is that masochism) keep me coming back for some reason. Every Sunday all fall my blood pressure must go up 30 points watching, listening or reading the game log online. Even when the Redskins WIN, I'm generally not real happy.

The fact of the matter is, the NFL is made up of football coaches and players who are only trying to win within the scope of the rules laid out by the NFL. To hold so much hatred or anger toward any one of them seems silly to me. If everything bothers you so much, be a baseball fan.

Unfortunately, I see the acceptance (and now extension) of those rules as the very core of the problem in the sport of football. I take every sport and team that I follow very personally. I've discussed my hatred for losing in the past.

I have been a baseball fan my entire life. I used to follow the Red Sox every pitch of every game, every year. Since the end of 2004 everything has seemed relatively boring with the team though.

If you ask me, I don't think you have too much objection to the system or the players, but you like to make splashes on Extremeskins. Otherwise, why would someone who feels the way you say you do spend any time at all on a message board for an NFL team?

No, actually I've been trying to avoid making splashes like this here at ES. It hasn't worked terribly well, but I've been trying to avoid turning every thread into the sort of disaster zone that this one has turned into. For which I sincerely appologize to the thread's creator and the moderators. Unfortunately, I have very long-held and totally unchangable opinions and view on players, the league and many other topics and when I get started on them, my fingers tend to type faster than my brain can edit the comments. I love the Redskins. I have since I was a kid. That's the only reason I'm here.

[TK]

I love the Redskins. I have since I was a kid. That's the only reason I'm here.

Really?

Don't worry. It isn't poor play that I wish on these people. It's career ending injury.

[Mass_SkinsFan]

I'm convinced now that you are just baiting people on this board - as your comments are beyond proposterous. You know exactly what you are saying and the potential upset that results.

Be convinced of whatever you want. I'm just telling you the truth as I see and believe it. Yes, I know that people will disagree with and seriously dislike the way I see sports and life. That's their problem, not mine, so far as I am concerned. There is an ignore feature that every poster here can use to ensure they never have to read another post of mine. I encourage people to use it if they don't like my comments. You're definitely not going to hurt my feelings by doing so.

Beyond this - your comments are without class.

Class is for winners, not losers, and right now the Redskins are losers. Anyone who "loses with class" has obviously never won anything of importance because if they had they'd know that Winning isn't Everything... It's the ONLY thing.

My sincere hope is that one of the mods will grant you some time off.

They probably will, and I'm more than ready to accept it. It's happened before and I'm pretty sure (if I'm still around) that it will happen again either now or in the future. That's largely because I don't believe in being PC or editing my comments for social acceptability.

[Mass_SkinsFan]

Really?

Yes, TK, REALLY. It just isn't that sort of fru-fru, unconditional, hippie style love that some of the other people here buy into. It's not that... I'll love you no matter what you do and always be your friend no matter how screwed up you are sort of love. It's much more the sort of love that father's used to have for their sons.... That sort of "I love you but not what you do and I'm gonna whup your *** when I find out that you screwed up" love.

[TK]

Yes, TK, REALLY. It just isn't that sort of fru-fru, unconditional, hippie style love that some of the other people here buy into. It's not that... I'll love you no matter what you do and always be your friend no matter how screwed up you are sort of love. It's much more the sort of love that father's used to have for their sons.... That sort of "I love you but not what you do and I'm gonna whup your *** when I find out that you screwed up" love.

So you wish career ending injuries on our players.

Mass, you have issues. Serious issues. You need to seek help for those issues & this ain't the place for it. You need some couch time & quite possibly some sedation time as well.

Or you can just drop this charade of being a Skins fan that you've been hiding behind since you registered here. Trolling while professing to be a Skins fan went out of style years ago.

[Mass_SkinsFan]

So you wish career ending injuries on our players.

No. I wish career ending injuries on players who I don't believe should be on our team and our opponents.

Mass, you have issues. Serious issues. You need to seek help for those issues & this ain't the place for it. You need some couch time & quite possibly some sedation time as well.

Definitely. I've never said anything to the contrary. I have serious issues and have had them my entire life. The mental health professionals just shook their heads when I was 11 and told my parents "Until he sees a need to change and decides he wants to, there's absolutely nothing we can do." Suffice it to say I still don't see any need to change.

Or you can just drop this charade of being a Skins fan that you've been hiding behind since you registered here. Trolling while professing to be a Skins fan went out of style years ago.

That "charade" is nothing of the sort. Obviously you believe differently. That's fine. You also have the ability to remove me from this site, if you feel I should not be here. It's your guys site, not mine. I understand that. Please do me a small favor though. If you REALLY believe that I am not a Redskins fan, officially ask me to leave permanently and I'll be gone.

[Dirk Diggler]

That "charade" is nothing of the sort. Obviously you believe differently. That's fine. You also have the ability to remove me from this site, if you feel I should not be here. It's your guys site, not mine. I understand that. Please do me a small favor though. If you REALLY believe that I am not a Redskins fan, officially ask me to leave permanently and I'll be gone.

Like a lot of things in life, posting here is a priviledge. You don't deserve the priviledge in my book because you are despicable in every sense of the word. I hope the mods take you up on your offer and show you the door pemanently.

[RedskinInExile]

No. I wish career ending injuries on players who I don't believe should be on our team and our opponents.

Jesus Christ on a crutch. Wishing a career ending injury on ANYONE is ****ed up, especially our own damn players. These are people you're talking about. Apart, of course, from losing millions and thoroughly ruining their lives, these injuries put players in incredible pain, surguries and years of physical rehab. Its a game, people. One that we can really get into, but in the end, a game nontheless. Get your priorities straight.

And with the Campbell thing, be angry with the coaches, not him. It was their decision to sit him, not Campbell's. It makes no sense to wish ill of a player for things over which he has no control.

[DiscoBob]

Mass - I say this with lots of respect -

Every one needs to see a shink every once in a while, and buddy - now is the time....

[Pete]

That "charade" is nothing of the sort. Obviously you believe differently. That's fine. You also have the ability to remove me from this site, if you feel I should not be here. It's your guys site, not mine. I understand that. Please do me a small favor though. If you REALLY believe that I am not a Redskins fan, officially ask me to leave permanently and I'll be gone.

Mass, even if you were a fan of another team poseing, you wouldn't be asked, or removed from the site.

I have encountered fans over time on the boards that have the same manner of supporting the team as you. Being it's the far extreme from what might be called the average fan, many find it hard to believe your actually a fan, and will always go at you.

I most circles of any type of sports fans, wishing injury on any player is, and has always been thought of as a classless statment. While your entitled to your opinion, one so vastly unpopular as wishing harm to a player might be better of unspoken.

[Mass_SkinsFan]

I have encountered fans over time on the boards that have the same manner of supporting the team as you. Being it's the far extreme from what might be called the average fan, many find it hard to believe your actually a fan, and will always go at you.

Yes, my views are the far extreme from the average fan. That doesn't mean that people like me AREN'T fans, though. I have no problem when people disagree with me. That's their right. I may believe that they're wrong, but they have the right to their own opinion. I also understand that my views are nowhere near the mainstream of sports fandom. What irks me is being told I'm not a real fan because I don't drink the Cool-Aid and chant "In Gibbs We Trust" no matter what the ownership, management and coaching staff do. Or because I root for one team and not the entire league. Or any of a dozen other unpopular viewpoints I hold.

In most circles of any type of sports fans, wishing injury on any player is, and has always been thought of as a classless statment. While your entitled to your opinion, one so vastly unpopular as wishing harm to a player might be better of unspoken.

As I've said previously, I'm not your average sports fan. I also tend to allow my fingers to get ahead of my brain when I type at times. Especially when discussing certain "hot-button" issues, like this one. Unfortunately if I edited out every unpopular and "classless" opinion that I hold, there'd be very little for me to discuss around here.

[RedskinInExile]

I most circles of any type of sports fans, wishing injury on any player is, and has always been thought of as a classless statment. While your entitled to your opinion, one so vastly unpopular as wishing harm to a player might be better of unspoken.

I don't know, Pete. It might be less "classless" and "unpopular" and more the rantings of a "sociopath."

[DieselPwr44]

Sorry. There are certain things that I hold a higher allegiance to than even the Washington Redskins. My personal philosophies of life and conscience are two of them. The system the NFL now imposes on the teams that want to win championships is against both my philosophy and conscience.

If this is the way you feel, why not turn the t.v. off on Sunday and Monday from Sept thru the first weekend in February?

You obviously hate the NFL and the Redskins. Why even follow the sport?

Baseball has no salary cap. Perfect fit for you.

Besides, you don't need to be wasting bandwith here when you abhor this sport.

[Mass_SkinsFan]

If this is the way you feel, why not turn the t.v. off on Sunday and Monday from Sept thru the first weekend in February?

I've tried in the past, and for some reason I just can't walk away from following the Redskins. It's kind of the opposite of the predicament that Sysaphis is forced to endure in Greek mythology. Sysaphis is forced to roll a stone a hill only to have it roll back past him to the bottom of the hill. Whereas I watch and root until I get so frustrated and disappointed that I blow up and vow to never watch or pay attention to the Redskins again. Within a week the anger has passed and I'm back to rooting for and paying attention to the 'Skins. I'm probably just too stubborn and stupid for my own good.

You obviously hate the NFL and the Redskins. Why even follow the sport?

Yes, I hate the NFL. I don't hate the Redskins though. I just hate losing, which is what the Redskins have been doing for the last decade and a half. Maybe I just have some misguided idea that maybe the Redskins can be the first team to find a way to bring Greatness back into the NFL. Maybe I'm just to ****ing stupid for my own good. Who knows.

Baseball has no salary cap. Perfect fit for you.

I used to follow the Red Sox religiously. Since the 2004 season, the same excitement isn't there. It's gonna be another 84 years before they win another World Series, so what's the point?

[Pete]

Yes, my views are the far extreme from the average fan. That doesn't mean that people like me AREN'T fans, though. I have no problem when people disagree with me. That's their right. I may believe that they're wrong, but they have the right to their own opinion. I also understand that my views are nowhere near the mainstream of sports fandom. What irks me is being told I'm not a real fan because I don't drink the Cool-Aid and chant "In Gibbs We Trust" no matter what the ownership, management and coaching staff do. Or because I root for one team and not the entire league. Or any of a dozen other unpopular viewpoints I hold.

I never said you weren't a fan, but that I know of others who are of the same type as yourself. It's unfortunate that people can't except others who differ from how they feel a team should be supported. With as you say, nowhere near mainstreem views, being doubted is unavoidable and causing a natural tension. Though, it shouldn't irk you. It's your chosen stance, and know as well as I do what comes with it.

As I've said previously, I'm not your average sports fan. I also tend to allow my fingers to get ahead of my brain when I type at times. Especially when discussing certain "hot-button" issues, like this one. Unfortunately if I edited out every unpopular and "classless" opinion that I hold, there'd be very little for me to discuss around here.

I agree that if you didn't post hot button issues, there indeed would be little to discuss. Heated debate isn't a bad thing, and that's what a message board is all about. Point and counter point so to speak. Your not the first to post a comment about wanting to see a player injured, and the results were the same for those people. So again, your not alone in your stance, but must expect to catch heat when so far outside the lines.

[JimmiJo]

Whereas I watch and root until I get so frustrated and disappointed that I blow up and vow to never watch or pay attention to the Redskins again. Within a week the anger has passed and I'm back to rooting for and paying attention to the 'Skins.

And this happens when - at 11:30 remaining in the first quarter?

Yes, I can choose to ignore you as you said, or I can chose to share with you that I find your comments so far afield that they strain reason.

Class is for winners? Winners don't wish injury on folks. Instead they desire their competition to be at their very best so that they have a real challenge and a more satisfying win when earned.

Life is unfair I know - but without the losing there would be no winning.

Last season was so satisfying because we turned the corner and began to win again, after a lot of losing. How satisfied would we had been after last season if we went to the playoffs every year?

The game is great because at its core it is just like life. Sometimes you win and sometimes you lose. But what they say is true - at the end of the day what matters is how you played the game.

[Isifhan]

Meh, Mass Skins will continue with his schtick as long as people keep buying into the bait he's laying. I'm getting a good laugh out of it actually, it's so preposterous how can anything that he's stated be taken seriously.

[JimmiJo]

Meh, Mass Skins will continue with his schtick as long as people keep buying into the bait he's laying. I'm getting a good laugh out of it actually, it's so preposterous how can anything that he's stated be taken seriously.

Really? I don't find it much too funny at all.

[Gizzle]

Mass, would the following statement be correct than?

You really couldn't care less if the redskins won the superbowl if they don't do it in a explosive fashion?

You seem to be looking for something to pick you up and carry you onto cloud 9. It's a sports team. I would think you'd want to see them do well even if its not scoring 50 pts a game.

And to call the Redskins losers now seems a bit harsh. All teams go through periods of time where they are not performing at their peak. To me it seems as though we are coming out of the valley and heading towards the peak. That, I would think, would make most fans happy. But as you said yourself, your not most fans.

[Bonef1de]

this is a Pittman-like thread.

Without the funny parts.