Tiki Post Game Presser & Random Thoughts

[Eli The Future]

Eli, I'm not clueless, and I'll bet I've watched a lot more football than you have. Let's clarify a few things. I never mentioned Jason Campbell, and my attitude on him is "let's wait and see what he's got". I also never said that the Giants didn't have a future, just that you are reading way too much into this one win. Also, since you appear to be more clueless than you accused me of being, I should point out that in this day and age a pro-football team can be built in more than one way. Through the draft, or through a free agency/draft combination, yet since you're such an expert you already knew that. I'm sure you're also aware that free agency presents immense problems with keeping a team intact for extended periods of time, wether it be the Giants or the Redskins (witness Antonio Pierce). I happen to believe that both teams will do a reasonable job under their respective head coaches in keeping a core intact. A young Manning does make the job easier for you, but I've seen Gibbs coached teams with average QB's winning Superbowls while the likes of Marino and Kelley never reached that milestone (not that it was necessarily their fault). But with your years of experience you already knew that too. Actually I was surprised and impressed with the Giants yesterday, as much as I was dissappointed with my own team's effort. Unlike you, however, it was not the fall of one franchise into the abyss and the ascendancy like a Phoenix of another in my opinion. Just one team doing everything right catching the other doing everything wrong. I'll remember you said 7-9, and I'll be here at the end of the year to see the result of that prediction if you want to check back, however it turns out. By the way, I won't end my post with an insulting comment, but if that's you're style, have at it.

I am not basing anything off 1 game. As for the cap, when we start throwing out tens of millions for either over the hill or overrated players which you guys have been doing ever since Snyder took the reigns in DC, then we'll have to worry about the cap. As for now, the Giants offense, which still leads the NFL in scoring, has every single starter under contract for 3 more seasons AFTER this one with the exception of the very replaceable Shaun O'Hara, our center. But being the expert that you are I'm sure you knew that. The defense, which is now giving up fewer points per game then Washington this year, with a fierce pass rush that results in turnovers (the 2 are directly connected, people here wonder why you dont get turnovers, people who can put pressure up front get turnovers, teams who don't don't) is built largely with young players on their first contract, or veterans who are locked up for 2+ years. The only free agents we have this offseason who take any kind of priority are Nick Griesen (who is only starting cause Emmons is out) and Will Allen, who will be allowed to walk and be easily replace by a healthy Will Peterson next year, who is simply a better player

This is a team with youth, that has all of its key players under contract for a long time, and a QB who has made just 14 starts and is still on pace for a 30 touchdown, 11 interception season. As with all young QB's, he'll only get better with experience, but I'm sure you knew that too.

[Brown_Hornet]

Sol that sig is not becoming. :mad:

While I was watching the game yesterday I thought about all you guys at the stadium... they actually showed two 'Skins fans on TV in the 4th quarter. Man that had to be painful. :doh:

Back on topic... I kind of mis-spoke, I wasn't happy necessarily to see AP go, but I was kind of happy that someone who had ridden the bench for 3 years, done what the coaching staff asked (consistently, without question), stepped in and played well.... I was happy that he got a piece of the NFL pie.

But after this week... not happy for him anymore... I dunno I guess I expected a lot more out of him, I thought he was a stand up guy.

.....

Oh god, quit your whining. Pierce is a class guy, problem is, he's no longer a Redskin. That's all that's bothering you.

Well, that and the fact that he kicked the Redskins arses all over the field on Sunday.

[zoony]

I am not basing anything off 1 game. As for the cap, when we start throwing out tens of millions for either over the hill or overrated players which you guys have been doing ever since Snyder took the reigns in DC, then we'll have to worry about the cap. As for now, the Giants offense, which still leads the NFL in scoring, has every single starter under contract for 3 more seasons AFTER this one with the exception of the very replaceable Shaun O'Hara, our center. But being the expert that you are I'm sure you knew that. The defense, which is now giving up fewer points per game then Washington this year, with a fierce pass rush that results in turnovers (the 2 are directly connected, people here wonder why you dont get turnovers, people who can put pressure up front get turnovers, teams who don't don't) is built largely with young players on their first contract, or veterans who are locked up for 2+ years. The only free agents we have this offseason who take any kind of priority are Nick Griesen (who is only starting cause Emmons is out) and Will Allen, who will be allowed to walk and be easily replace by a healthy Will Peterson next year, who is simply a better player

This is a team with youth, that has all of its key players under contract for a long time, and a QB who has made just 14 starts and is still on pace for a 30 touchdown, 11 interception season. As with all young QB's, he'll only get better with experience, but I'm sure you knew that too.

Wow... impossible to argue with all of that.

Sounds like you've got the Lombardi Trophy wrapped up for the next 10 years. Congratulations!

....

[RedRaiders]

we'll find out if the Giants are that good and the Redskins that bad.

We'll find out? We already found out. Giants proved that they are a great team yesterday.

[Eli The Future]

as for "the little eli", you're the epitome of a sore winner. grow up.

You guys told me and all other Giant fans all week to be sure to show our faces after the game. But since you were thoroughly abused, you changed your mind? By mid week my stay on this board will be gone until the next time, but until then I'm gonna enjoy the win after all the smack redskins fans threw our way all week. I did not come on this board with an intention to smack, period. But after getting crap thrown at me, both in private messages and on the board, I'm simply firing back. And I don't think I've said anything thats out of line all week.

[RedRaiders]

Last week reading thru the boards all I saw was how thr Redskins ahd the #2 Offense and a great statistical defense. Giants were going to get killed, Giants have the #31 ranked defense. etc. Well, now it's the day after the massacre and can we all agree now that the Giants have great play makers on both sides of the ball?

It was a joke the things that were said about Eli and our Defense and although Eli didn't have the greatest game, he still played your defense like a drum with the Hard Counts and Audibles. Not bad for a second year QB.

How many teams have a Top 10 QB, Top 10 Receiver, Top 5 RB, Top 3 TE?

[PiLfan]

And I don't think I've said anything thats out of line all week.

you've been a jacka$$, plain and simple.

the guy has only a couple of posts on these boards...so he's not one who's been jawing with you before...and he made some thoughtful, non-trash talking comments about how he hopes Gibbs will get the team to rebound and looks forward to the next time we meet in December, as a different team than the one you saw yesterday.

it was classy.

yet you responded with crap and insults.

your team won, they outperformed us in every possible phase of the game, and any sensible fan on here who isn't theorizing a stupid, league-wide conspiracy theory on par with the staging of the moon-landing will admit that.

i was ready to give the giants their full due...but trolls like yourself are too interested in your little agendas, so what's the point?

[tr1]

We'll find out? We already found out. Giants proved that they are a great team yesterday.

Hold your horses, bucko. 'Great' applies to teams that win playoffs...this team hasn't won snot.

And let's see how they do in our stadium.

[Jumbo]

Eli, I'm not clueless, and I'll bet I've watched a lot more football than you have. Let's clarify a few things. I never mentioned Jason Campbell, and my attitude on him is "let's wait and see what he's got". I also never said that the Giants didn't have a future, just that you are reading way too much into this one win. Also, since you appear to be more clueless than you accused me of being, I should point out that in this day and age a pro-football team can be built in more than one way. Through the draft, or through a free agency/draft combination, yet since you're such an expert you already knew that. I'm sure you're also aware that free agency presents immense problems with keeping a team intact for extended periods of time, wether it be the Giants or the Redskins (witness Antonio Pierce). I happen to believe that both teams will do a reasonable job under their respective head coaches in keeping a core intact. A young Manning does make the job easier for you, but I've seen Gibbs coached teams with average QB's winning Superbowls while the likes of Marino and Kelley never reached that milestone (not that it was necessarily their fault). But with your years of experience you already knew that too. Actually I was surprised and impressed with the Giants yesterday, as much as I was dissappointed with my own team's effort. Unlike you, however, it was not the fall of one franchise into the abyss and the ascendancy like a Phoenix of another in my opinion. Just one team doing everything right catching the other doing everything wrong. I'll remember you said 7-9, and I'll be here at the end of the year to see the result of that prediction if you want to check back, however it turns out. By the way, I won't end my post with an insulting comment, but if that's you're style, have at it.

Very well written and well reasoned my friend. And very fair to both parties, giving the ignats the praise they merit, and the Redskins the criticism they earned while noting how silly it is making sweeping proclamations this early in the season about any team in this division. All the positive qualities of your arguments and behavior will likely be wasted on a poster like Young Eli of course, but other will appreciate them. At this point in time nobody in this division can be intelligently written off or coronated.

[RedRaiders]

Hold your horses, bucko. 'Great' applies to teams that win playoffs...this team hasn't won snot.

And let's see how they do in our stadium.

I never said they were a division winner yet, but yesterday proved to me what I already knew. The Giants are for real. I mean wouldn't you agree that before the game everyone considered Washington to be a very good team? The Giants absolutely destroyed a good team. And there still improving.

[OldSchoolGibbs]

Eli, as far as I'm concerned you can spend all week here. If your feelings are getting hurt, well then, maybe board surfing is not for you. I like hearing from other fans and what they've got to say. My initial post to you was made because you were arrogant on our board, and to point out that all may not be as rosy as you were telling it to be. You implied that AP's leaving was akin to escaping a sinking ship. The difference (with the exception of yesterday to be sure) in this Redskins team from Coach Gibbs coming back last year to now has been apparent, and positive.

Anyway, you make it sound like your noble purpose here has been taken advantage of by ruthless Redskin fans, and all your smack is in self-defense. I doubt this is the case, but I'll admit to not reading every blow-by-blow verbal tussle you've engaged in here.

Your points about current Giants contract status is well taken, but hardly the be all - end all you make it out to be. I'm no NFL cap expert, and certainly not on the Giants, but I do know that in an environment of standing contracts that escalate upwards from one year to the next, what appears to be rosy now may not be so in a year or two. Injuries, players unhappy about their "fair market value" being met (or in Terrell Owens case, the ability to put food on the table), and ownerships evaluation of current players down the road can all come into play. I'm not saying that the Giants won't be able to keep their players around, or that catastrophe awaits, but we'll see what happens. Regardless, until this current Giants team win something, it's all speculation and potential. There have been many good teams that have not won it all, and the Giants have not made the jump to great yet. Your point about Washington overpaying under Snyder is moot because that was before the current coaching staff was in place. Under Gibbs it is already different. Both the Redskins and the G-men have a long way to go, and I don't see Superbowl for either just yet. I do have a track record I can look at under Joe Gibbs that = 4 appearances in the big one. Tom Coughlin is a good coach, but one that hasn't won anything yet. Seeing is believing.

If you care to continue now, or later, we can, just remember that you're here on our board, and if I ever come to yours I'll remember that I'm the guest. Whatever, you know where to find me.

[redskins55]

Ya know everyone talks about AP and Hasselback knowing things about the Redskins, but people forget that Brunell knows quite a bit about Coughlin's offense from the Jacksonville Days.

All that stuff about the giants knowing the plays is overratted! Antonio Pierce and company benefited from the worst display of Redskins football ever seen in the modern era.

They wont benefit from it come December....

[redskins55]

Eli Manning does not look like a world beater...sorry.

The Giants are like all the other teams in the NFC East...look good one week, look horrible the next.

:applause: :applause:

Old Eli looked confused and almost gave up a fumble on the sack early in the game.

I agree, they'd better buckle their chin straps next week after the 49ers beat Tampa.

Also, the giants have the easiest schedule of all the NFC East teams. 9 home games, 7 away and most of the tough opponents at home. Here's a look at the Girlie Men's remaining schedule.

at 49ers

VIKINGS

EAGLES

at Seahawks

COWBOYS

at Eagles

CHIEFS

at Redskins

at Raiders

[bubba9497]

didn't Tiki screw up?

I mean if it is true they found a way to exploit the skins defense.... why go on a national radio show and tip the Skins off so they can make adjustments for the next game

If it was a one game every so often team, that's OK, but a divisional rival you play twice a year. who knows how long you can use something like that if you stay quiet.

I feel the Giants will come back to earth soon. after playing 5 of 7 games at home.... their remaining schedule has 5 road games, and after the 49ers (who beat the Bucs) their schedule becomes more difficult as well.

[bubba9497]

You guys told me and all other Giant fans all week to be sure to show our faces after the game. But since you were thoroughly abused, you changed your mind? By mid week my stay on this board will be gone until the next time, but until then I'm gonna enjoy the win after all the smack redskins fans threw our way all week. I did not come on this board with an intention to smack, period. But after getting crap thrown at me, both in private messages and on the board, I'm simply firing back. And I don't think I've said anything thats out of line all week.

:cry: poor baby

not like you came here uninvited to begin with talking smack?

save the "poor me" routine.

We have several good posters who are fans from other teams we respect because they show respect.

[zoony]

you can use something like that if you stay quiet.

I feel the Giants will come back to earth soon. after playing 5 of 7 games at home.... their remaining schedule has 5 road games, and after the 49ers (who beat the Bucs) their schedule becomes more difficult as well.

It is absolutely criminal, in my mind, that the Giants and Cowboys get the Chiefs and the Broncos at home.

The two NFL teams with the most lopsided home field advantage. Two teams that are COMPLETELY different on the road than they are at home.

That is bullsh!t.

.......

[Eli The Future]

Eli, as far as I'm concerned you can spend all week here. If your feelings are getting hurt, well then, maybe board surfing is not for you. I like hearing from other fans and what they've got to say. My initial post to you was made because you were arrogant on our board, and to point out that all may not be as rosy as you were telling it to be. You implied that AP's leaving was akin to escaping a sinking ship. The difference (with the exception of yesterday to be sure) in this Redskins team from Coach Gibbs coming back last year to now has been apparent, and positive.

Anyway, you make it sound like your noble purpose here has been taken advantage of by ruthless Redskin fans, and all your smack is in self-defense. I doubt this is the case, but I'll admit to not reading every blow-by-blow verbal tussle you've engaged in here.

Your points about current Giants contract status is well taken, but hardly the be all - end all you make it out to be. I'm no NFL cap expert, and certainly not on the Giants, but I do know that in an environment of standing contracts that escalate upwards from one year to the next, what appears to be rosy now may not be so in a year or two. Injuries, players unhappy about their "fair market value" being met (or in Terrell Owens case, the ability to put food on the table), and ownerships evaluation of current players down the road can all come into play. I'm not saying that the Giants won't be able to keep their players around, or that catastrophe awaits, but we'll see what happens. Regardless, until this current Giants team win something, it's all speculation and potential. There have been many good teams that have not won it all, and the Giants have not made the jump to great yet. Your point about Washington overpaying under Snyder is moot because that was before the current coaching staff was in place. Under Gibbs it is already different. Both the Redskins and the G-men have a long way to go, and I don't see Superbowl for either just yet. I do have a track record I can look at under Joe Gibbs that = 4 appearances in the big one. Tom Coughlin is a good coach, but one that hasn't won anything yet. Seeing is believing.

If you care to continue now, or later, we can, just remember that you're here on our board, and if I ever come to yours I'll remember that I'm the guest. Whatever, you know where to find me.

Well thought out post. I am not sitting here and guarenteeing anything, but I love the position my team has put itself in with regards to the rest of the divison, having a younger core and a franchise QB in the making, and aside from the Eagles, the best cap situation long term (the Eagles perennially sit on 8-10 million in cap room anyway)

I was just taken aback by the level of confidence Skins fans had heading into the game, but thats what makes it fun. Im happy to see a division where we can have weeks like we had the week leading up to last weeks game, instead of weeks of the recent past with fans arguing wether or not the Danny Kanell led Giants could beat the Gus Frerrote led Redskins in a game that would end in a 7-7 tie. The division has come a long way and rivalrys only take it to another level. It would be boring if i just came here and congratulated you on a 4-3 start, and accepted congratulations on a win yesterday

[Eli The Future]

It is absolutely criminal, in my mind, that the Giants and Cowboys get the Chiefs and the Broncos at home.

The two NFL teams with the most lopsided home field advantage. Two teams that are COMPLETELY different on the road than they are at home.

That is bullsh!t.

.......

And you get the Chargers and Seahawks at home, we don't. And as far as KC's home record, theyve been anything but world beaters at arrowhead over the last couple years

[MAATopDogg]

lol, you know how that one turd comes back up after the flush

Just like we blew up the 9ers last week, and the Giants had their day, they will settle down and come back to earth real soon.

95% of the world would rather have the Skins D over the Giants, hands down, we shall see when its all said and done.

AMEN. That my thinking. The Giants are highly overrated.