Going Commando

I think New England has been desperately hoping we pick Daniels because they want Maye.  They've been chumming the water like crazy to try and speak that into existence.  I think they trade out of three if we pick Maye, and the Raiders give up 13, 44, and two future firsts to get Daniels.  Then I think Minnesota will move up to four or five for McCarthy.  I don't think New England likes Daniels, and if they have a mandate from Kraft to pick QB and Maye is off the board, then I could see them taking McCarthy instead.  Then Arizona would have a bidding war for Daniels and be able to milk the Raiders and Vikings.

2 hours ago, Llevron said:

The kid himself has said and done literally nothing that’s the funny part. People are gonna hate him because of a bunch of **** other people have said about him. Reading into EVERY word on Twitter has never worked for anything 

He uses these people as his mouthpiece.  His mom, his agent, his publicist, there is a clear pattern of them speaking for him when he doesn't want to get his own hands dirty.  The other two top QBs in the class have been no stranger to controversies and intense media speculation, why is Jayden the one who looks like his circle is a big problem?

The dude is such a horrible fit for this franchise and we all know it.  The only ones who are still lying to themselves about it are his cheerleaders in the media.  He needs to go to the Raiders.  An old, grizzled fan base on the East Coast won't put up with his act.  He is way too soft and too much of a diva to play in DC, NY, or New England.  He'll get eaten alive in those markets, not to mention he would greatly benefit from playing in a dome.

47 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

Depends on how outsized a role she plays. If he's mostly shy and reserved and she...for lack of a better phrase..."wears the pants" and he does what she says and follows her lead then yeah, that could be problematic I'd think. 

She has an outsized role.  She's in the injury tent with him, which means she's on the sidelines during his games.  And she personally participated in recruiting violations at Arizona St.  She has had a completely inappropriate amount of program access for a player's parent, and I don't care who demanded that access between either her or Jayden, it's a red flag either way.

I think we all know why Jayden needed that huge suitcase on his visit.  His mom:

1 hour ago, Forehead said:

.  (Side note for those of your ranking OL, stay away from Caeden Wallace.)

What's wrong with Wallace?  I really liked the cut ups I saw from him.

54 minutes ago, seantaylor=god said:

Thanks for putting this together.

 

I’m not sure if you have heard this, but a few sources said that Kingsley S. transferred back to BYU because he missed home.

 

Being that he is only 21, there was concern that he may not be ready to be a pro and start on his own in a new city, etc.

 

If he slips in the draft that’s likely why, and I don’t really want another Docston situation.

 

Just food for thought.

I'd rather that be the reason he transferred than he couldn't crack the starting lineup at Oregon.  I had heard the rumors about him lacking maturity, and wondered what they were based on.  If that's what it is, and it's not a work ethic issue, then I would be fine taking a chance on him.  If it's a work ethic issue, then I would probably pass.

Bottom line for me is that I think his upside is so high that I'm willing to take risks on the personality.  This guy is a Penei Sewell type athlete where he was just blessed with elite physical might even be NFL standards.  The game is so much easier for guys like this.  We're going to see reps where he blocks TJ Watt with his left hand while helping out inside with the right.  He's the kind of player I would take a big swing in at 36.  Much as I love Jordan Morgan, he's just not as talented.  And he got touched up by Bralen Trice.

1 hour ago, Warhead36 said:

You're super low on Alt. I agree that he's not a slam dunk superstar LT but I think he'll be a high quality LT or RT for a decade+. Fashanu might end up being the better pass protector though and a more natural long term LT.

 

I'm with you on Fuaga though. Have loved him for quite some time. He might legit be going top 10. (Jets should take him 10th but they'll probably find a way to eff it up)

 

But there is a big mish mash of guys after and I'm not sure how to rank em. Like I don't think there is much discernible difference between, say, Guyton and Saumataia. Mims is such a massive Wild Card and I'm not sure we're in a position to take him(but he'd do really well on a team like the Ravens or 49ers).

 

Personally think Fautanu and Morgan are more Gs than Ts.

I've been lower on Alt than the consensus this entire time.  I have him in the early 20s.  I think he's good but not great.  I like his athleticism and balance and size, but what kills him for me is I think he has weak hands.  If a guy can't sustain his blocks, then he has a toughness/motor/functional strength issue that will follow him into the NFL and put a low ceiling on his pass protection.  And I value pass pro above any other skill for OTs.

The guy I'm far lower on than the consensus is Guyton.  I've got him OT15 and a third rounder at best. He can't hold blocks for **** and is not even a good college tackle.  All of the size and athleticism in the world is worth nothing in an OT that can't perform the basic requirement of blocking.

The hardest part of the rankings for me was Olu or Latham for OT2.  Latham has so much more power and nasty in him, but Fashanu is so much faster.  That call very much comes down to which traits you favor, and I ended up going with speed even though I think Latham's film is better.  Normally I try not to put traits over film for OLs, so I don't feel as confident in that ranking.

The most functionally powerful OL in the class is Kingsley Suamataia.  I've got him as a late teens, early 20s pick on my overall big board (still adjusting it).  I think he's the best all around athlete and biggest raw talent of any of the OLs.  I liked his film way more than I expected to going in, where I had the preconception that he was this super raw player whose film would be ugly.  Nope, his film is actually pretty good.  And then it finally clicked for me when I went back through the senior bowl videos and saw his drills in the context of all of the OLs.  This kid is dominatingly powerful and he has super heavy and fast hands.  He gets easy wins without conventional technique because he resets his hands so well and he is such a tenacious fighter with ridiculous natural strength.  I think mock drafters have been sleeping on his upside and that he's gotten lost in the crowd.  Getting him at 36 would be about a +15 value pick for me, and I think he should be a first rounder.

Fautanu was one of the hardest for me to place.  I think his game is ugly, but his tools are elite and his character is supposed to be outstanding.  He's going to work out for somebody, and I could see him ending up somewhere like the Rams and becoming a Pro Bowler.  There would be some years where he could be OT1 or OT2.

The most underrated OT in the class to me is Caedan Wallace.  He is better on film than Fashanu, and really doesn't have any weaknesses.  He's nasty, he's consistent, and he is a good athlete. I think he is a starter and the last of the second round picks.  I thought about putting him at OT10, but decided to shoot for more upside with Paul and Amegadjie and Fisher instead.  But I could accept a case for Wallace as OT10.  He's good and he's not really going to have to improve a ton to be good in the NFL.

I think Ethan Driskell is super underrated too.  His profile suggests a big stiff who can't bend or move and gets his ass kicked at the SB when he has to play against the big program guys, but he did well.  He's a tenacious pass blocker with elite size and length, and he was nasty.  Way tougher and more consistent than Guyton. He's the kind of day three project that interests me.

18 hours ago, @DCGoldPants said:

What stood out to me is the tempo and pace both GMAP and AGMLN speak.

GMAP is bad enough.  Just say Newmark.

This is my OT position ranking.  Not all of these guys are going to be on my top 100, but it will only be a couple that get left off.  Everyone already knows this, but my position rankings made it clear to me that WR and OT are the two strongest and deepest positions in this year's class.  Some of the others won't yield 20 draftable players, much less 20 worthy of going in the top 100.

1 - Taliese Fuaga
2 - Olu Fashanu
3 - JC Latham
4 - Kingsley Suamataia
5 - Joe Alt
6 - Amarius Mims
7 - Graham Barton
8 - Troy Fautanu
9 - Jordan Morgan
10 - Kiran Amegadjie
11 - Patrick Paul
12 - Blake Fisher
13 - Caedan Wallace
14 - Roger Rosengarten
15 - Tyler Guyton
16 - Isaiah Adams
17 - Ethan Driskell
18 - Javon Foster
19 - Dominick Puni
20 - Christian Jones

16 minutes ago, SkinsFTW said:

I thought you said that the team needs 4+ elite NFL starters? If those 2 in the first turn out to be elite then that is definitely more value than 2 depth players picked up in the 2nd.

Kingsley and Legette wouldn't be swings on obtaining depth players.  Legette's upside is Terry McLaurin/AJ Brown, and Kingsley's upside is Penei Sewell.  I'm also not sure Olu Fashanu's upside is as an elite player.  IMO the only OT in this year's class who is a strong bet to become an elite player is Fuaga.

Fashanu is legit, but I think Peters is going to earn his money and find value with those early seconds.  Personally, I think I would rather have Kingsley and Legette than just Fashanu, and I think it is realistic to get both at 36 and 40.

We can still have a home run draft without both 36 and 40, but it's harder to get a ton of value from our picks without those.  Especially when we'd be moving up to the mid teens and picking Fashanu around his slot.

8 hours ago, Dah-Dee said:

Is that really who you think Keim is talking to? Really??

He's talking to Jay Gruden.  So he's talking to a high ranking idiot, but an idiot nonetheless.

The NFL is largely populated by Jay Grudens.  And many times, even when the people in charge are smart and not stupid like Jay, they are toxic and unprofessional nutjobs unfit for any kind of senior management job, like Daboll.  Joe Gibbs was one in a million, people like him are not the ones that make up the league.

More NFL owners than not are terrible people who build organizations with terrible culture, they manage their teams via whim, and their front offices are riddled with ego and unprofessionalism.

Peters went to a bunch of UNC practices.  He's known about Drake Maye for a while.  NFL personnel people absolutely track players who show NFL potential in future classes.  Not finalizing your evaluations on them is different than not scouting them.

24 minutes ago, Conn said:

This won’t happen but my tentative ideal might be Chop at 36, best OT at 40, then some combo of CB, WR, TE in the 3rd if it falls well for us 

Personally, I'm not that high on Chop.  Tools are as special as it gets, but he just isn't an impact player.  Maybe that changes if you give him a featured role in a Dan Quinn defense, I don't know.  But I don't like making those kinds of bets.  To me, Jonah Elliss, Bralen Trice, and Austin Booker are all much better players, all in that second tier of edge rusher behind the top four guys (Verse, Turner, Latu, D Robinson), and all likely to be cheaper than Chop.

My ideal scenario is to get Kingsley Suamataia and either Xavier Legette or Ladd McConkey or Kool-Aid McKinstry with 36 and 40.

48 minutes ago, The Consigliere said:

You're really that dedicated to that interpretation of what the take away should be on that play?

 

I watch that and I see someone w/the same ability to avoid body trauma as Super Dave Osborne. That's the take away, not that that evil meanie on FSU decided to hit the idiot who decided to run head first, upright, into a gigantic pile of defenders and thank god there was a penalty. 

I do not understand what he was thinking.  It was a first down scramble, not a short yardage run where you might move the chains by leaping over the pile.  Why the **** did he try and hurdle a defender in the middle of the scrum?  Well I know why, it's because the guy literally can't see past the man in front of him and he had zero plan beyond making that DT miss.  He has terrible vision as a runner.

Also that was never going to be a targeting call.  Jayden's head is way up in the air because he jumped, like a dummy.  No ref is going to bail out a ball carrier for doing something that stupid.

I want to know what MH Jr's 40 time is.  Is it in AJ Green/CeeDee Lamb territory?  Or is it in Calvin Johnson/Julio Jones territory?  Put it this way, if he were running low 4.3s in training, he would have run for scouts this offseason. 

So assume he runs in the upper 4.4 to 4.5 territory like Green and Lamb.  When deciding between Nabers and Harrison Jr, you ask yourself who would you rather have?  Jamarr Chase or CeeDee Lamb?  You're getting an All Pro either way, but I'd definitely rather have Chase.

15 minutes ago, KDawg said:

1. Marvin Harrison Jr - don't overthink this. He is the class of the class.

I like Nabers over Harrison because I think he's faster and more explosive.  I've had him over Harrison for a couple of months, but haven't posted my board in a while.

I recognize that Nabers had a big advantage at QB this year compared to Harrison though.  McCord sucked, and Harrison looked a lot better when Stroud was running the offense.  But Jayden was just erratic enough with his vertical pass placement to let Nabers show off how good his ability to adjust to throws in the he air is.

On my overall big board, I have Nabers #4 in the class, between Bowers at 3 and Harrison at 5.  I think he's a faster OBJ.

13 minutes ago, DWinzit said:

I am thrilled to see someone else as high on XL as I am. He seems to have slipped some especially after he "shrank 2"" on many boards. As much as you like McConkey, I would have figured you'd have at least him over XL.

I think the consensus has fallen way too far on XL.  I still think he's a first round talent.  I see AJ Brown in his film, and I put him over Ladd even though Ladd is more skilled because he is so much more of a beast in his physical traits than Ladd.  At the end of the day, Legette is a 6'1 220 pound horse who plays like he is 220.  He runs as fast as McLaurin and has a 40 inch vertical.  He's a stud on contested catches and Spencer Rattler made life hard on him, and he always answered the bell despite getting the absolute hell beaten out of him all year.  He also has a great top gear that he can hit in the open field, and you're just not going to bring down a guy that powerful running that fast once he hits it.

The late breakout age is a concern, but the light bulb came on big for him this year.  I love his combo of pure toughness and aggression and speed.  I would love to get him at 36, and feel that he is just as good a value there as McConkey.

15 minutes ago, philibusters said:

 

The things that sticks about that list to me is just how much lower you are on the Texas WR's than the consensus.

I think they stink, but I can't leave them off my list because of how fast they are.  Worthy is a skinny straight line burner with no functional strength and no elusiveness and no ball tracking nor contested catch skill.  Mitchell is a diva WR without the aggressiveness that makes you put up with a diva WR.  He's the kind of prospect that will fall through the cracks in an NFL receiver room, but he'll get a chance because of his return skills.

4 minutes ago, JamesMadisonSkins said:

We lose the trade, but if our guy is Maye all along and we still get him, it doesn't matter. Get your guy and add a future pick. Pats win the trade on trade-value pretty big, but they're being asked to essentially forego a QB so that makes sense.

 

One can dream

The Pats take a massive L on value and would never accept that deal.  Those three first round picks are not even remotely close enough in value for the Vikings to jump to three, let alone two.

It'd take 3 first round picks AND day two change AND players for Minnesota to get to #2 from 11 in a QB class this strong.

This is my WR ranking:

1 - Malik Nabers

2 - Marvin Harrison

3 - Rome Odunze

4 - Brian Thomas

5 - Xavier Legette

6 - Ladd McConkey

7 - Troy Franklin

8 - Keon Coleman

9 - Ricky Pearsall

10 - Jamari Thrash

11 - Roman Wilson

12 - Malachi Corley

13 - Ja'Lynn Polk

14 - Malik Washington

15 - Johnnie Wilson

16 - Tez Walker

17 - Jacob Cowing

18 - Xavier Worthy

19 - Jalen McMillan

20 - Adonai Mitchell

One thing that Top Golf-gate revealed is that this team has a first round grade on Michael Penix and not on Bo Nix.  He's peer to McCarthy, Maye, and Daniels, and Nix is not.

Penix is the also-ran who feels like he could end up winning the race.  Something about that dude worries me.  Like he's going to drop, end up on a good team, and then be the best QB of the bunch, and we're going to get an endless narrative about how dumb we were to pass over him for the duration of his career.

Anyway, I'm glad we're getting a QB this year instead of next, or not having to try and make it work with a mid rounder like Travis or Rattler.  The five first rounders in this year's class are all head and shoulders better than those two, as well as any of the top guys for next year.  Ewers and Beck's film isn't even on the same planet as Maye's sophomore film, and Milroe's film is downright painful.  He is terrible.  And Kyle McCord was almost as bad.  Shedeur Sanders comes with a three ring circus, but he already has a massive lead for QB1 next year.  He is going to be over hyped to death.

JJ McCarthy was ready to go pro, and he'll end up in a better situation as QB4 this uear, but if he'd gone back to school for another year I think he easily would have been QB1 in 2025.

2 hours ago, Panninho said:

Maybe it's nothing, but I find it interesting nonetheless

I know what you mean.  ESPN likes to sell themselves as having the professionalism and prestige of a traditional news media even though they have a massive conflict of interest in their reporting because they are broadcasters.  They absolutely have a huge SEC bias, and I'm sure that promoting the conference has nothing to do with wooing them and finally getting them to leave CBS for ESPN.

It's going to get worse when CFB realignment coalesces D1 into a two league system where ESPN controls the TV rights to one of them (SEC-ACC), and CBS, NBC, FOX control the rights to the other (B1G-BIG 12).

There is no way MIT has a football team.

21 minutes ago, Conn said:

This is interesting. It makes me think the vibe they got dealing with our FO was that Jayden was not our guy and wouldn’t be the pick. Getting out in front of not being the #2 pick by making Washington look clueless is the only possible motive here. Otherwise this is fruitless and makes your client’s life harder when he’s drafted here. Only makes sense if they think he’s not the guy.
 

Similar to when Ben Johnson’s agent leaked that he thought Harris was a “basketball guy” who didn’t get football, when it became clear he wasn’t an instant front-runner for the job before the in-person interview that was eventually cancelled by Johnson. Getting ahead of things. 

 

Feels like if my interpretation is correct, we’ll start seeing media people change their guesses and mocks to be Maye, as the agent leaks all over the league. 

I don't want Daniels here at all, I am 100% a Maye guy, but stuff like this happening is part of why I don't like it when we go off the beaten path.  We gain nothing by alienating players and agents.  Maybe Jayden has never been our guy.  I certainly have never even remotely believed he was our best choice.  But what if this had happened, and he actually was our only good choice?

We should have picked our guy by now, and we should be spending our time developing a partnership and rapport between him and our FO and coaching staff, like KC did with Mahomes.  And they didn't even have a high draft pick at the time all of that happened.  QB-HC-GM relationship is not an adversarial relationship where the QB must pass all sorts of tests and succeed in spite of what his franchise puts him through.  It's a true partnership, and QB prospects do need a lot of support and commitment from their teams.

15 minutes ago, DWinzit said:

Wow, what did he do to deserve that take?

Yeah I'm curious too.  I actually liked what I saw from his cut ups.  It wasn't love, but I was definitely intrigued.