skinsmania123

We seem to have decent coaches. We have a legit GM.   We seem to have added some solid players in the draft and FA.  The great unknown is how well they jell together as a team and how well JD plays if he starts.  If he plays well, like C.J. Stroud did in Texas as a rookie, I think we could win 8 games.  But I am 100% confident that the product they put on the field will be competitive and our embarrassing days are behind us. I am patient. I just want effort and competitiveness. 

15 minutes ago, Sacks 'n' Stuff said:

He said that?
 

I hated Saban as an analyst during the draft. He’s too smart. I like to think that I know at least a little something about football, but he made it pretty clear that I don’t actually know ****. I’m a high school dropout and he has a PhD… Also might explain why all that **** I was talking in the quarterback thread didn’t come true. 

Yeah, he did say that about him.  I don't care for Saban as a person.  He can be salty, and he is just not complementary. It made me look closer at Saninristil. 

You know plenty about football. The guy just may be a miserable horse's ass. LOL!

No one has one bad word to say about Mike Saninristil. When Alabama creates their offensive strategy around avoiding Sainristil, you know he is for real. Saban called him the best player in the whole draft. And definitely Saban is not known for lauding players who don't go to Alabama. Heart and soul of the best defense in college football last year. 

I am really pumped about some of the players in this draft.  I feel like we got a steal here, the more I hear about this guy. Hopefully he continues to play big for us like he did for Michigan. 

5 minutes ago, Going Commando said:

Didn't realize Sinnott was so low on the consensus boards.  I had him at 58 on my board, so for me we got him at about his natural slot.  I don't understand why he was outside the top 100 for so many sources.  What am I missing?  I didn't see any weaknesses and he popped on film like LaPorta did last year.

I really like the pic and read more about him based upon what people posted on here to be honest.

  Some in the media have claimed he is an "average" route runner and struggles to consistently make clean breaks.  And that he is an average blocker, but he has put weight on his frame, which should help.  

I think he is pretty versatile. You can line him up in the slot or the backfield and seems to exploit soft spots in coverage, which Kelce with Kansas City does a lot.  

4 hours ago, FrFan said:

I believe Sean would approve.

I did not see the "Sean would approve" before I watched that. And then I thought hell yeah, that is a Sean Taylor type hit.  

I really like the pick a lot. His versatility, moving from QB to WR. Very productive. 126 receptions, 1,700 yards, 18 TD's and you could, in a game situation, keep the D off kilter, by having him throw pass on occasion. He is all around good athlete and he comes from good stock, to say the least. I guess they will use him in the slot. 

21 minutes ago, CapsSkins said:

1) he literally is a running QB, everyone including Jayden himself has talked about his running as a weapon

 

2) nobody has said he’s *only* a running QB, people have questioned his size/durability/ability to protect himself and people have critiqued his passing as they have every prospect, but nobody has said Jayden is a running back who can’t throw

I will say this. I like Nick Saban.  He is not the most complementary guy, can be fairly critical, so when he assesses particular players, I listen. He definitely mentioned the durability concerns, pointing out that conditioning and putting weight on and relying more on his passing game, would really help him grow.  He also said he is a good passer and demonstrates an ability to move up in the pocket to buy time, which many young QB's don't do. They tend to move side to side.

He says he sees the field pretty well but will have to release the ball quicker in the NFL.

When I bought up his passing ability and accuracy here on this board one day, I was told he had great receivers.  Yeah, okay so that should continue with Terry and Jahan. And I still hope they pick up a decent, might I say, big-bodied receiver in the 3rd round.  

Where he differs from RG3 IMO is that he does have a solid passing game. I honestly think, he is a better passer then RG3 ever was.  When you took RG3's wheels away, he was not able to fall back on his passing game as a staple.  I guess I am saying he might want to be more focused on becoming more like a Pat Mahomes, who only runs when he needs to or to shake things up a bit. And I think that capacity to grow in the passing game should be his goal.  

I am super excited to turn the page and I look forward to seeing what Jayden can do. I think it is going to be exciting. 

16 minutes ago, Dah-Dee said:

 

Yes, this feels like the weak link, both coaching and personnel wise, that could bring down the whole house of cards if not adressed/handled perfectly. Haven't done enough yet FA-wise, and kind of thought we'd move back into late first before all the 'top' OT were gone, but we'll see what happens with the rest of the draft and (hopefully) with additional FA signings.  Who knows whether Bobby Johnson can get the job done, skeptical but fingers crossed.

I agree. I was very aware during the 1st round how they kept coming off the board. I like Suamataia. He is the only one I have really looked into.  I think we have a decent shot at him, and he can play either right or left tackle. I don't know what we would have to give up, maybe our other 2nd round pick, hopefully not, but the O line desperately needs to be shored up heading into the season, with any QB, but especially JD. I don't think he could take the pounding Howell took.  

2 minutes ago, BayouBrave86 said:

JD5 is gumby, bendable not breakable. The one shot that knocked him out of a game was a cheap shot by Dallas Turner, a future top 10 pick. And again…a cheap shot. 

Hope you are right. I have been thinking that, but my gosh he is a small glass of water. 

 I am starting to be concerned. Like we could be rolling into an RG3 2.0 with JD. He looks so tiny, like a small gust could blow him over like a cheap tent.  And I have been so supportive of him, but he looks like a boy among men with that physique.  

23 minutes ago, DiscoBob said:

 

When I listened to that John Beck interview, it didn't leave me hopeful that he can change significantly.  If your QB coach says that "he knows its a problem" and then follows up by saying, "I'm not sure it can be taught" - that doesn't leave me hopeful.  It implies that Jayden has talked to his coaches about it, and that they aren't sure what to do about it (obviously, I'm speculating a but here - but it seems reasonable).

I don't know. I can't wait to hear the process they went through to come to their decision, whoever it is. 

Just now, KDawg said:

Mild curiosity…

 

People who are in the Jayden Daniels camp and can’t fathom why anyone would be worried:

 

Can you not see people’s concerns with Daniels?

 

And those of you in the Maye camp:

 

Can you not see Daniels potential?

 

I feel like these things get ignored in this convo when people are all in for one or the other.

 

 

I said the same thing relative to Daniels. But I think your 100% right about Maye as well.

I guess the thing I don't get @KDawg is if there is so much concern about injury risk, why wouldn't you take Maye over Daniels?  

  I don't think it is worth taking a guy that could burn bright for a season or two and then crumble, literally. 

I am glad I am not making the decision.  I have already admitted I am leaning more towards Daniels.  

11 minutes ago, jg77 said:

 

RG3 and Richardson are injury prone and both missed time in college. RG3 even tore his ACL at Baylor. 

 

Yeah Jayden is slight but he's missed one game in 55 starts.  The kid is tough just watch the videos of him chasing down defensive players after they pick his pass.  He has that dog in him.

I think some of the videos of Jayden getting blown up being that "dog" in college have been overemphasized, to the point that his competencies and assets are overlooked. I do agree with posters that point out that some of his tendencies will NOT fly in the NFL. He will be destroyed if he does that in the NFL. But with that said, he has made some adjustments to his game, which means he is not too stubborn to learn. RG3 in my opinion, is a very fixed stubborn personality. Sometimes you just have to adjust to thrive.  I am thinking JD can with proper coaching, and relying on his teammates.  

3 minutes ago, Llevron said:

 

 

Yall are easily played. All they need is one new athlete or parent to see their names and remember them next time around and its worth it. Dude is going #2 or #3 overall most likely and now yall cant stop talking about his agency. Its free publicity and I guarantee not one team cares about this guys agent if they think he is that talented 

I thought the same thing earlier in the thread. Why would he care if goes 2nd or 3rd? He sure doesn't care. After all the **** this kid has been through, he is just happy to be here. I have never, until now, heard anything regarding character concerns. Geez it is almost like a re-run of Williams and his mother.  Bring on the draft.  

3 minutes ago, Going Commando said:

 

There is no room for equivocation on this.  This FO and coaching staff need to understand that they are 100% married to this QB prospect.  If they want to keep their jobs, then they need to find a way to make it work.

I know not all evaluators of QB talent are always correct and trust our FO to make the right decision. I mean even watching Daniels play and Maye play I have clearly walked away with different observations then a lot of posters on here. And I will admit many of you on here know a lot more then myself. All I have is my own perceptions based upon what I see. I admit I am a just fan of NFL football.  

But I did go out my way to support Daniels because I think he is better than Maye at this juncture and I believe in his ability to further adjust, so I see a lot more upside for him with proper coaching and good conditioning.

With that being said I noticed that Kiper, was all in on Daniels in comparison to Maye.  I think he has made some good observations.  Some of you have even pointed out that at times that Maye is inconsistent and does not always deliver the ball accurately.  Also, I agree Daniels had superior receivers, but he delivered the ball accurately. 

This is what Kiper said:  Mel Kiper Jr. debates value of Jayden Daniels, Drake Maye as NFL Draft prospects (on3.com) 

“Drake Maye had three games, even after Tez Walker came back — Clemson game, Virginia game, NC State game — I keep harping on it because I went back and looked at those games time and time again. I said, ‘OK, why were those throws not accurately delivered?’ There was no reason. I think you look at Jayden, how many games like that did he have? Zero.

2 minutes ago, ILikeBilly2 said:

Jim Plunkett won it, beating out Joey T.  Plunkett won two Super Bowls beating Theismann in one of them.  Joe must really hate running into Plunkett at a party.  

I know. I was screwing around with one of the posters.  

4 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

He had two superstar WRs

I am going to say your 100% correct about that. But you still have to get the ball them in stride.

4 minutes ago, DogofWar1 said:

 

So but here's something else to chew on.

 

If he adjusts, how much does that adjusting lower his ceiling.

 

If he gets out of bounds or slides earlier to avoid big hits, how much does the delta between him and Maye/JJ decrease in the mobility aspect?  And how does that change the totality of them as prospects?

 

And how long does he have to change his game before his current game catches up with him?  Can he make those changes quickly?  Dropping ones eyes because you learned to take off running for 5 years is a lot of muscle memory to retrain.  We hit Maye for not being pro ready because of his footwork, is Jayden thus not pro ready?  Sure, using your legs like that CAN result in better plays than having bad footwork, it will create a lot of positive-yard-plays but how long does it take to retrain and during that interim, how much more danger is he in?

 

Maybe the answer is, he flips a switch and instantly throws instead of running off, and when he does run he's protecting himself but he's still just racking up so many first downs we don't miss the 40% less yardage he gets per rush to help protect himself.

 

But you gotta analyze that with running QBs, because when the alternative is a prototypical QB who needs a little work but otherwise is everything you normally want in a QB prospect, you better have positive answers for the above questions.  The opportunity cost is large.

One of the reasons that Daniel's won the Heisman was his pass completion rate.  Also, when you look at the number of yards he threw, as I have said in other posts, the yards were comparable to both Williams and Maye.  So, it is not as though he can't complete passes accurately and just takes off. That is just not true. 

But he has used his legs more because he is a dual-threat QB, and they designed plays for him. He will have to make some adjustments.  I really do not think it is going to take a long time. He can rely on his ability to pass and to be accurate. This is why I think we really need to pick up a big, bodied receiver and an excellent TE receiver. And I think he would be great with Terry and Jahan.  I really think this guy can be coached up. Some QB's can't. 

One concern I have is the strength of our O line. If it is not substantially better than it was for Howell, and we draft Daniels forget it. He would develop so many bad habits, all the concerns you are raising will happen.  But they already added some pieces, and they will add more through the draft. 

I think we could run a very fast offense with him. He is ahead of some of the other prospects, and yes, he has played longer in college, and right now that is a plus.  So, his development is key. That to me is the most important element for any young QB who comes into the league.  I think we have the coaches to get the most out of him and ensure longevity if he listens. 

2 minutes ago, bh32 said:

Montana didn't win no Heisman...lol

LOL! Your right do you know the two QB;'s that did?

3 minutes ago, SkinsFTW said:

 

Jim Plunkett is the last one.

 

That was back during the Lombardi days.

And Roger Staubach I think.

1 minute ago, bh32 said:

Heisman don't mean squat in the NFL either..list all the QB'S that won the Heisman and also won a SB.

Two and he will be the third.  Joe Montana is one. 

2 minutes ago, Sacks 'n' Stuff said:

His only game when **** goes sideways is to run. He never avoids the rush, resets, and throws. He never escapes and throws on the run. He pulls down the ball, stops looking downfield, and takes off running. That is not going to work in the NFL. It’s going to get him killed.

I can't figure out how he had so many completions then. The guy won the Heisman. He had an amazing year, and I think it is transferable even though some on here actually said college stats don't matter. Yes, completions matter. The ability to use your legs in the modern NFL matters.  

I don't think he is going to get killed in the NFL. I think he will continue to make adjustments like rookies have to. I think the will pass the tests. 

6 minutes ago, Sacks 'n' Stuff said:

Outside of Lamar (and JD ain’t Lamar) the quarterbacks who use their legs, predominantly do so to buy time and then beat you with their arms. His only game is to run.

That is not true. He threw for more yards than Maye, as a comparison.  Caleb threw for around 4,500 I believe and he threw for about 3,800.

7 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

The point is that he uses his legs too much and in bad situations and/or uses them improperly and puts himself in a position to get hurt.

 

Your running should be a supplement to your passing, not a necessity to function.

He had just as many yards passing, meaning comparable to the top prospects.  Caleb Williams had 4,500, and he had 3,800. Maye had around 3500.  I have not checked the other QB's on running the ball, but he definitely had about 500 more in terms of yardage in running the ball then they did, if my memory is correct.  So, his running is not supplemental IMO to his passing.  

5 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

When he has a clean pocket and open guys? No.

 

When he's pressured? Absolutely he does. And that shows in the numbers as well. He was at about 50% run when pressured vs pass or sack, which is a huge amount. You can see it in the tape as well. Often when he's pressured he's very quick to pull his eyes down and look to run, regardless of whether there's room to stop up or slide in the pocket or if there's an open guy downfield after he gets moved off his spot.

But isn't that the beauty of having a QB that can use his legs?  I mean how many QB's get pressured and fold like a cheap tent? I think that is the beauty of this guy, and what @Dah-Deeposted agree with regarding Daniels.  Does he need to make some adjustments? Yes.  Does every rookie QB that comes in have to make adjustments? Yes. I know many of you think he cannot adjust.  He already did. Can he make more adjustments? Absolutely with a decent staff. I think we have the right staff plus Mariotta to get the best out of Daniels if they choose to go in that direction. 

11 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

Most NFL QBs do not get hit like this every Sunday

 

 

As @Rufus T Fireflynoted it's also the way he takes hits and how his body reacts to them. Some guys have a natural instinct to get compact and tighten up when they get hit, but some guys are the opposite and basically splay out and flop like ragdolls when it happens. That's how Daniels seems to be. It was also how RG3 was. It's a bit concerning because that's going to open you up to more potential ligament and joint damage. 

Honestly, and I just said it, I think he will adjust on this level.  I don't see the same personality as RG3. And I still think he took a lot more unnecessary hits at Arizona. I kind of agree with what @Llevron said about him not taking certain risks and playing a bit more like Mahomes. I think he can be coached up.  I do not think RG3 took coaching. I think Daniels has and will.