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inmate running the asylum

The mythology of Spurrier winning in his 3rd year

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Recently someone -- whose name shall go unmentioned -- :laugh: stated that Spurrier should be given a 3rd year because most top coaches usually seem to win in their 3rd year as coaches.

That is true, but with a QUALIFIER. In checking the records, I noticed something that had been overlooked. And that was the records of the coaches in question indicated IMPROVEMENT won-loss wise from the first season to the second season and then further improvement from their second season to their third season. In other words there was some indication of IMPROVEMENT won-loss wise in their second season, not REGRESSION.

For those who think that Spurrier's team's have shown improvement from last season through this season, you are living in denial. :laugh:

In spite of an upgrade in personnel from last season -- which most of us agreed in the spring had taken place -- last year we had a top 10 defense and this year it has slipped to what 25th or so? Last year we could at least run the ball if we so desired -- Davis, Betts, Watson had multiple 100 yard games -- this year our running back by committee approach sucks and we have had only one 100 yard game. Last year we were not one of the league leaders in penalties and false starts, this year we are. Last year we finished 7-9, more then likely this year our record will be 5-11. Unpreparedness and REGRESSION is everywhere you look on this team. :puke:

But I digress. Lets look at the records of coaches from their first season through their second season, won-loss wise.

Jimmy Johnson:

Went from 1-15-0 to 7-9-0 his 2nd season - IMPROVEMENT

Bill Parcells:

Went from 3-12-0 to 7-8-0 his 2nd season - IMPROVEMENT

Dick Vermeil:

K.C. Went from 6-10-0 to 8-8-0 his 2nd season - IMPROVEMENT

Phil. Went from 4-10-0 to 5-9-0 his 2nd season - IMPROVEMENT

Chuck Knoll:

Went from 1-13-0 to 5-9-0 his 2nd season - IMPROVEMENT

Bud Grant:

Went from 3-8-3 to 8-6-0 his 2nd season - IMPROVEMENT

Joe Gibbs:

Went from 8-8-0 to 8-1-0 his 2nd season - IMPROVEMENT

Tom Landry:

Went from 0-11-1 to 4-9-1 his 2nd season - IMPROVEMENT

Vince Lombardi:

Went from 7-5-0 to 8-4-0 his 2nd season - IMPROVEMENT

For those who want continuity, it makes no sense when a team is not showing improvement. Just because you bring in a new coach does not necessarily mean you have to blow up the team personnel wise. Parcells proved that this year with the Cowboys,

who are winning with basically the same starters that finished 5-11 last year. :)

And lets not forget that Spurrier did not inherit as bad a team as most of these other coaches. Whereas it is true that the personnel did not fit Spurrier's fun n' gun, Spurrier nevertheless inherited an 8-8 team from Marty. In other words a team only 1 or 2 additional victories away from making the playoffs. :rolleyes:

The handwriting is on the wall. Next year at this time, the Skins under Spurrier will be just about where they are now. :(

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Inmate, wanted to tell you that they were talking in the pregame about lavar and champ not resigning, and sonny used the phrase "inmates running the asylum." No thread relevance, just thought it was funny.

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Guest SkinsHokie Fan

You convienently left out Vermiel's first and 2nd year in St. Louis and forgot to mention Norv improving from 3-13 to 6-10 with clear signs of improvement.

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Like I said in another post.........those guys probably just don't want to come back to this mess.

This is also another reason why you shouldn't discuss contracts during the season, just another bad FO move.

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There are two main reasons this team didn't improve from year one to two IMO. And neither of them fall on Spurrier's shoulders.

1. Marvin Lewis leaving. No fault on Marvin, no fault on Spurrier. But if our front office had any idea that he would leave in one year on the job, he should of never been hired in the first place.

2. Our QB situation. The good teams prepare for their QB being out by having a quality backup, and one that meshes with the coaches on hand, going into the season. Rob Johnson wasn't the answer, it would of been nice for our front office to know that before September.

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I put as much onus on Spurrier's assisstants as I do Spurrier himself.

You mentioned our regression our defense, but in my book, that's clearly on the the shoulders of George Edwards. Marvin Lewis doesn't get enough credit around here.

Our defense was directly responsible for several losses this season and I'm hard-pressed to believe that we would've collapsed in that manner had Lewis been here.

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How can a team that has lost 11 of its last 12 games to the Cowboys in a supposed rivalry, not be able to get up for this game......

when you are playing at HOME,

when you are playing on NATIONAL TV,

when the Cowboys kicked our a$$ last game,

when they had a chance to knock the Cowboys out of the playoffs,

And then in spite of all these incentives, GET SHUT OUT 27-0!

This is sorry. :puke: They should have put 40 players on inactive, instead of just 7, because very few players came to play anyway.

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I think that the Skins team is made up of better players than Dallas. The team looks lazy out there missing tackles and leaving holes open on the field. They look like they are poorly coached and do not care when something bad happens. It takes a proven winner to turn around a team with a losing tradition and few coaches have the ability. We are going to be bad for as long as we experiment with coaches and front office staff. These guys are as discombobulated as the professor from Back to The Future. They've quit on Spurrier and it shows.

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come on folks.

here we are near the end of Year 2 and this regime is flat on its back.

it isn't only Spurrier, but he is a good part of the problem. And I say this because this is HIS choice of assistant coaches and HIS style of team management and preparation.

The Redskins got their butts handed to them today not because Dallas has a HOF roster but because their coaches actually gameplanned for the Redskins :laugh:

They didn't merely do the same things they did several weeks ago.

See, that's the difference between the NFL and college.

Teams in college run the same plays out of the same formations, sometimes for YEARS.

Teams are predictable. Their schemes by and large are not that complex.

You can employ the same general gameplan each week and be successful if you have a talent edge.

But in the NFL that talent edge is minimal so the difference IS preparation and discipline.

Discipline NOT to commit stupid penalties, turnovers, etc......

The front office on the other hand failed to provide Spurrier with a credible defensive line, which meant the team was going to have to score points to win because the fourth quarter was never safe.

This is a cluster F**K and it is organization-wide.

In case anyone is curious, where are the contributions of our top draft choice?

Jacobs was supposed to come in here and knowing the system, become a productive rookie.

Instead he has been on the bench the entire season and even after recovering from an early injury has been invisible.

Players such as Patrick Johnson that had 11 receptions last season elsewhere still play ahead of this guy.

And after acquiring Coles and Gardner the past couple of seasons wasn't the drafting of Jacobs a gratuitous move, given the weaknesses we had on the DL, at RB, S and TE?

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Originally posted by fish

Like I said in another post.........those guys probably just don't want to come back to this mess.

This is also another reason why you shouldn't discuss contracts during the season, just another bad FO move.

No loyalty to the team....then ADIOS amigos.

Hell, we aren't winning with them!

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well, who wants to be reasonable about their own contracts when they see other players around them that are less productive get paid outrageous salaries? :)

I like Coles, but if I were Bailey I would say, "hey, I have been a pro bowler for three of four years and Coles has not yet made a pro bowl.............so if he got $13 million I should get $20 million".

Snyder has boxed himself into a corner where NOBODY is going to sign for reasonable dollars anymore for the sake of the team.

What Darrell Green did several years ago is not going to happen again here.

You may get a guy like Brett Favre do it in GB but that is because he believes in the program.

Who can believe in this program?

What exactly is this program?

Have we ever seen what Spurrier wants to do actually acted out on the field instead of on the drawing board in two years?

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This program is... ****e. Basically.

As for seeing it acted out on the field, Redskins vs 49ers in Osaka, when Danny Wuerffel looked like Joe Montana.

Heh.

-s

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I have no faith in Spurrier winning in year 3. Synder will spend his usual dollars in free agency. We may even had a good start to the season and then things will fall apart.

I have no faith in Spurrier doing any better in 2004.

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at this point there has been enough bumbling and re-starts to this program to doubt that the current set up is going to produce positive results.

rarely have I seen a sports program in this much disarray in Year 2 go on to be successful, at least one that did not start off as an expansion team.

I see people here looking back at Jimmy Johnson in Dallas or Chuck Knoll in Pittsburgh to look for examples of programs that took awhile to get started.

Let's remember that the Steelers were 1-13 when Knoll got there :)

The Cowboys were 3-13 the final year under Landry too.

Spurrier came here and he had a much better core of players than that.

He took over a team that won 8 of its last 11 and had one of the NFL's leading rushers in Stephen Davis, a pro bowl tackle in Samuels, a pro bowl corner in Bailey and up and comers in Arrington, Jansen and Smoot.

No way that Parcells, Johnson or any quality NFL coach regresses from 8-8 to 5-9 with this club in 2 years.

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