Just my two cents on the QB position, this team and this team's fanbase

[urblessed00]

First, let me apologize if this turns into a ramble. Secondly, I respect everybody's opinion. Lastly, I do recognize the need of this team to upgrade the offensive line...which has been a pressing need for at least 5 off-seasons. ................................Now, after getting all of that out of the way, I have grown increasingly frustrated with this fanbases views about the quarterback position. I feel we are prisoners of a team two and thirty years in the past almost. The Gibbs 1.0 era did not have free agency, and was a different brand of ball. Yes, you could ground and pound riggo, for 3 to four yards a carry and wear defenses down. However, that style of ball, has become outdated. Yes, we are a north eastern team and will always have to run the ball a lil bit. However, this is a pass.............happy......league. More importantly, you MUST..have a Franchise qb. There are 32 teams...so you may not have a top 3 qb on your roster. However, you must have a franchise qb. The conference championships had four first-round choice qb's at their helm. Now, that happened for the first time. Is that an abberation............or a trend? Just my opinion,...I think it's the trend going forward. A franchise qb hides and in some cases erases a lot of blemishes on an offense. Our team has been devoid of a franchise qb since the days of Joey T. I'm sooooooooooooooo tired of hearing about if you have a line you can.................. NO,....Trent Dilfer is the biggest pagan god to folks who believe in this style of ball. He was the supreme aberration. He was the benefactor of a top 5 defense. That will more than likely never happen again.

I'm glad somebody ....even if it is Chad Dukes...who I don't normally agree with on a lot of things, feels the sameway as I do about the qb position. Fans of this team, need to get over the fact that this is not the 80's/early 90's era of Football. The days of having a Mark Rypien/Doug Williams lead your team to a super bowl win are over. In 2011..........you GO AS FAR...AS YOUR QB.

So all of that being said, I'm glad to see a small minority of people supporting the pick the best player available stance at #10. Even though I value qb's if there isn't one that grades at #10......don't reach. It's become increasingly difficult to trade back in the first round, so all these thoughts on trading back to acquire picks for lineman are great in theory. However, I don't think it's highly likely that it will actually occur. And unless one of these qb's....Gabbert, Locker...Newton is available and grades out at 10..I'm not a proponent for drafting a qb at 10 either. I just want the best available player there to be chosen. And an o lineman is not ...going to go at 10. I'm gonna need ............just like somebody convinced the owner...to stop trotting out the three Lombardi trophies for every press conference.........to let the past go. You need further evidence? How did that Gibbs offense fare in his second go around? The line was not terrible when he first came back. Portis was in his prime. Yet the counter..........gets run down all the time now because of the speed on the back end. He didn't have a quarterback, or enough playmakers at wr other than moss. He had to bring in Saunders to "modernize" his pre-historic offense. There is a generation of skins fans that don't know what winning is all about. New memories need to be made.....and a new championship needs to be won. But it's not going to happen without a qb.

If that's Locker, ...so be it. He did have a terrible cast around him in college...but the inaccuracy is a concern. My thing would be accuracy...especially in Kyle Shanahan's offense. You have to be able to make the reads...and make the throws where they need to be placed so the wide receivers can catch the ball on the move and make a play. Maybe Kapernick or Dalton are in play as well? Don't know. But if possible, I hope this drought without a Blue Chipper...a franchise qb..is about to end...and soon. And I also hope this love affair with the past.........while nice to look back........gets put in it's proper place. It's a hindrance to the future at this point. You cannot know where your going..unless you know from whence you have come. ...........Very True. But you also can't see where you are going...if you always looking behind you. Let's move forward into the future......withhhhhhhhhhhhh a upgraded line...especially the interior..but hopefully threw the middle rounds and free agency. Let's embrace the new pass happy, points galore league that the NFL is bending all rules to produce...and let's hope this team obtains the qb..to thrive in this league.

[Boston Skins]

I do agree with some of your points here.

However, drafting a franchise quarterback will not fix this team overnight. Consider the Detroit Lions; Yes, Matt Stafford has had injury problems but he didn't make the Lions winners overnight. In fact, about the only team he consitently embarasses is... well... you know.

You MUST have the majority of the pieces of the puzzle in place if you want to even think about putting a rookie under center. A good example is the Rams. They've had top 10 picks for I don't know how long now. Is their offense completely assembled? No. But there was enough effective players surrounding Bradford to make his first year acceptable.

I agree 100% that the Redskins should take the best player at #10 simply because of the fact that the only position that is secure on this team is Tight End. At this point, if it's a Quarterback then so be it. I'm willing to give Shanny a chance to build the roster how he wants it.

[Chump Bailey]

I agree with you in that QB is an issue and need. I think now is as good a time as any to draft a QB. The interior of the OL needs to be revamped too. Unfortunately, I see Rabach returning and resuming his role as starter. I think that's a mistake, but so be it. We'll need help in every facet regarding offense. Whether we stick with Rex and draft a rookie or sign a veteran like Bulger, which I'm not entirely opposed to - Whomever the QB might be, they will need better protection, more production from the WR's and a consistent ground attack. We cannot rely on Torain to stay healthy either. I hope Kelly is healthy by September because that IMO will be a huge lift to the offense. I think we will see plenty of movement by us in FA if a new agreement can be worked out. Locker IMO is the better prospect than Cam or Gabbert. I still believe good things are on the horizon.

[ST21]

Heck, the middle of the line can be shored up through free agency in my opinion. However, we still need to get back to drafting some o-lineman. I see the skins going after two guards in free agency and assuming brown gets resigned they only have center to worry about and they could address that in the later rounds if a player is available or if they pick up more picks. I do agree that our biggest fault is that none of our QB picks have panned out in the last 20 years. I keep saying we are due but it does not seem like it. The best we have been able to do is journeyman and it seems we are usually just a little too far down in the draft order to get the right guy!!

[scruffylookin]

I think you make some good points but I really don't think it's because people are stuck in the distant past (Gibbs 1) that they are gunshy about a first round QB, I think it's because of the last 3 1st round QBs we've taken (Heath, Patrick, Jason) all failed to varying degrees.

There doesn't appear to be a "can't miss" at QB in this draft and even if there were, we are not in a position to get him. Because every quarterback being discussed comes with flaws, people automatically envision a Heath, Patrick or Jason 2.0 situation and it scares the crap out of people.

I'd like to think if we were picking first and Andrew Luck is sitting there, everyone would agree that he is the pick we have to make.

I do agree with your overall point though, we can't use past mistakes as a crutch for not taking a chance now. If there is a QB at 10 we really like, we have to take him. I too disagree with the notion that the Oline must be built first before getting the QB. If the QB is there and we like him, you take him. Period.

Gibbs was lucky enough to inherit Joe Theismann and this allowed Beathard to focus on the Oline in that 81 draft. I always did wonder though what would have happened if Marino fell one more spot and was available at 28 in 1983. Would Beathard/Gibbs have taken him? No offense to D Green, but picturing Dan Marino behind the Hogs and throwing to our receivers for the balance of the decade is a tantilizing alternate universe to dream about.

[Dallascrushers]

I do agree QB is an issue of need.....I am not really sure when Dalton is projected to be drafted.....but in my opinion he is one of the more accurate throwers coming out this year and isn't considered a top three qb as of now....I think Mcleroy is also another accurate passer....I think both of these qbs could be a qb we should go after....here is my thought on this.....we can address what you were talking about in your original post about the offensive line needs in the first or second round...(a guard or a center) and a defensive player either OLB or DT. Then hopefully we get draft picks from some trades with McNabb and Haynesworth in the 3rd round range so we could go after Dalton if he is still available....or acquire more picks to move up the draft board if Dalton is projected to go higher, because of a good Senior Bowl and combine.

[Brotherz]

I certainly think a QB is a necessity but I also think the "pass happy league" business is a bit overdone. You talk about Dilfer as a "false God" because he had such a great defense. I understand the point you are trying to make but I think a strong running game and an excellent defense change your requirements for your QB drastically.

I don't believe, nor will I ever believe that a strong running game and a great defense has become (or will become) an outmoded way to win football games. There is nothing about the game itself that has changed that. Rule changes regarding pass interference have certainly added value to the passing game but it hasn't diminished the strength of a running game and a brick wall defense at all.

I'd love a franchise QB. I don't disagree with your fundamental point. If someone told me that the plan of this franchise however was to build a top notch defense and a great running game first, I wouldn't complain. I think MCnabb could still work. He CANNOT work with the dead last defense in the league and a terrible running attack. I feel like we threw out Mcnabb because he couldn't win by himself.

To your point, I don't think a QB wins games by himself. We can go get Cam Newton, Locker, or hell even Luck and it wouldn't turn this franchise around by itself. Mcnabb is serviceable. He could be succesful in this system (in any system quite frankly) if he is given the time to make the reads instinctively, learn the playbook instinctively and play instinctively. Giving up on him after one year seems like a mistake to me. If we worked on getting that defense together and got it in the top 10 in the league and had a running game, Mcnabb would work.

If we aren't going to invest to make a top ten defense and a top 5 running attack, then sure, go get the QB and play the air it out game. But pick a direction. Our problem seems to be we have no identity at all. To me, the defense MUST be fixed regardless of whether you run it or throw it. But I refuse to believe that a top 10 defense and a top 5 running game or vice versa can't win in this league. Its really not as complicated as we make it. Don't let all the talk shows and radio outlets fool you. Its still a 100 yard field. Its 10 yards for a first down. Its a 60 minute game. The clock continues to run if tackled in bounds and the clock stops with an incomplete pass. Controlling the clock, getting turn-overs, forcing your opponent into 3rd and long repeatedly, and being more physical then your opponent for 60 minutes can still win you alot of football games and in fact, I'd take that plan over airing it out all day with a gun slinger.

[hitmandm]

I agree with your points. Here is how I clarify it.

1. If a franchise QB exists, you have to get him.

2. The Giants, Jets and Bears pretty much have set that it is very difficult to overpay for a franchise QB.

3. While you can almost always get a superior player at almost every position in the draft every year, QB is not that case. Sometimes there are years when one isnt available, then they come in bunches. Because of this, you can't say" get one next year after we draft all the pieces." First, as the Rams proved, you have to be in the right position- and they wouldnt trade a franchise QB for multiple first rounders. Then you have to pick the right year. If one is there and you think he is the guy, you must sell out for him ala Giants, Jets and Bears.

---------- Post added January-26th-2011 at 03:28 PM ----------

And I agree with your point regarding the fanbase. It is rooted in past logic and most people cant seem to grasp it is a pass happy QB league.

All anyone needs to do is look at the playoffs almost every year and you see a common thread- a franchise QB usually picked in the first round

[USS Redskins]

Great Post. I still get sick to my stomach that the Skins passed on Brees in 2006... b/c they had Brunell and Campbell.... I was screaming my head off to grab him in free agency - But oh, well.... without a Franchise QB there will be no Superbowl titles for the Skins- plain and simle.

In 2009 the top 10 QB's in the league all had 4,000+ yards passing... this is a passing league... w/o a consistent passer, they better get used to the view from the bottom of the East.

Do I know who the next franchise QB is? No clue... I just hope Shanny and Allen do.

If its a young Qb they want -they have to get him this year... that gives them 2 years to get him going and hopefully by year 3, he makes noise... b/c by year 3 or 4 of the Shanny reign.... he better be winning or he is out on his rear.

[Jbank31]

The reason it makes sense to draft a qb with the 10th pick is simple. It is a high enough pick where you are able to get a real quality quarterback with excellent skills, but at the same time if he doesn't pan out you haven't mortgaged the house to get him. Salary cap wise if you have to cut the guy loose in two or three years because he isn't the answer then it doesn't set the franchise back half a decade (ala Jamarcus Russell). It cost the Redskins more to get Jason Campbell at the end of the first round than it would cost for Jake Locker or whomever the coaches decide is the guy.

[bhi4582]

I totally agree. A lot of people thought the Bears gave up way too much for Cutler but in retrospect, a franchise quarterback is worth it and more. They would not of won 8 games without Cutler this year. Yes, I know he's a gunslinger and throws a lot of interceptions but so did Brett Favre. As we learned with Jason Campbell, playing safe "no mistake" football without taking chances and shots down the field will get you nowhere. I believe a franchise quarterback can make up for many other weakness on your team including on the offensive line. Rodgers and Cutler were 2 of the most sacked Quartbacks in the league so I say if we truly believe there is a franchise QB available, we go out an get him. Even if that means trading up for Gabbert.

[tr1]

First, I respect the OP and his post...however...give me a team that can get 4 yards and a cloud of dust, and I'll show you a winner.

Green Bay has a great qb, but they almost lost this past weekend, because they couldn't run the ball to get first downs. Momentum had changed completely, and 3rd string qb was about to each their lunch (though, many will forget he had two picks for that one TD he threw...one pick resulted in another team's TD and the other resulted in the end of the game.)

NFL champions have very good running games.

[Gerald362]

Amen to this. To add a bit more, I dont think that you can yet count Cutler as a great QB. Nor do I think that BR is a great QB..........good, possibly bordering there, but not great. All 4 teams in the conference championship games DID share one thing in common though. They all played solid, hard nosed DEFENSE. Peyton Manning is perhaps the best example to use to refute the idea that a great QB will carry you consistently to the championship. Championship teams are just that...........TEAMS, and to win consistently, you have to have more than one piece in place.

Am I saying to pass up on a QB who has real potential in the draft at # 10, no, but you have to get value at that pick. If the QB potential is there, grab it, grab it fast, otherwise, build the team while you wait for the franchise QB is coming. Dont just fish with that pick and hope. Use the later rounds for that if you wish, but the 1st round pick has to be a winner

First, I respect the OP and his post...however...give me a team that can get 4 yards and a cloud of dust, and I'll show you a winner.

Green Bay has a great qb, but they almost lost this past weekend, because they couldn't run the ball to get first downs. Momentum had changed completely, and 3rd string qb was about to each their lunch (though, many will forget he had two picks for that one TD he threw...one pick resulted in another team's TD and the other resulted in the end of the game.)

NFL champions have very good running games.

[mi6]

Heck, the middle of the line can be shored up through free agency in my opinion. However, we still need to get back to drafting some o-lineman. I see the skins going after two guards in free agency and assuming brown gets resigned they only have center to worry about and they could address that in the later rounds if a player is available or if they pick up more picks. I do agree that our biggest fault is that none of our QB picks have panned out in the last 20 years. I keep saying we are due but it does not seem like it. The best we have been able to do is journeyman and it seems we are usually just a little too far down in the draft order to get the right guy!!

Agreed.

I sincerely wish the Skins evaluate and consider, Colin. http://www.nevadawolfpack.com/ViewArticle.dbml?SPSID=45375&SPID=4082&DB_LANG=C&DB_OEM_ID=10000&ATCLID=530619&Q_SEASON=2010

[Brett81]

Agreed.

I sincerely wish the Skins evaluate and consider, Colin. http://www.nevadawolfpack.com/ViewArticle.dbml?SPSID=45375&SPID=4082&DB_LANG=C&DB_OEM_ID=10000&ATCLID=530619&Q_SEASON=2010

Do you seriously need to post this in every single thread where the word draft or QB is muttered under someone's breath at the very least...talk about spamming the hell out of something...you're seriously approaching :beatdeadhorse: status. Just change your sig to "Draft Colin" and put a pic of you kissing his cardboard cutout then you won't need to do this in every thread and we'll all know. See posters who want Gabbert, or other prospects...they don't pull this crap every thread.

As for the OP I agree with pretty much every point you made, but I'm not completely sold on this QB class as a whole yet or any single individual and would rather see this team fix the lines, lb's, fs, and offensive skill positions this year and pull a mike ditka next year for Andrew Luck so that the team is already in place for him to come in day one.

[grego]

Do you seriously need to post this in every single thread where the word draft or QB is muttered under someone's breath at the very least...talk about spamming the hell out of something...you're seriously approaching :beatdeadhorse: status. Just change your sig to "Draft Colin" and put a pic of you kissing his cardboard cutout then you won't need to do this in every thread and we'll all know. See posters who want Gabbert, or other prospects...they don't pull this crap every thread..

mi6, are you selling amway? or a timeshare, perhaps? its like groundhog day.

[Hitman21ST]

mi6, are you selling amway? or a timeshare, perhaps? its like groundhog day.

The funny thing is, he only has one post in the Kaepernick thread.

He couldn't post his links or anything, so he didn't know what to post

[Brett81]

The funny thing is, he only has one post in the Kaepernick thread.

He couldn't post his links or anything, so he didn't know what to post

:ols:

I was thinking the exact same thing...it was some sort of Copernicus sensory overload when he saw the thread title.