If we draft a QB we can sit him his first year

[dy44]

You're going to have to provide game logs to prove your point.

Prove it and you're correct, until you do it's talking out your ass.

I guess you havent watched every game the last 3 1/2 yrs

[Chopper Dave]

Looking at Bradford's body of work and stats, how can you say that? And if Shanahan feels that Bradford is his QB, then you go after him.

I remember Pioli saying that if they thought Brady would be as good as he is, they would have drafted him in the first round even if he would have been there in the seventh because you don't risk losing a franchise QB.

You can't second guess yourself. If they feel Bradford is the QB of the future, you grab him.

And I'm telling you that anyone who is a competent talent evaluator WILL NOT feel that he is the QB of the future. If they take Bradford before the bottom half of the first, which is still too high for him, you should have serious doubts about Allen's ability to run a team.

The way I can say that after looking at Bradford's body of work and stats is the same way people can say that about Tim Tebow (who, honestly, has a better chance at making it at QB than Bradford), or Colt McCoy, and the same way people said it about Chase Daniel, and Kliff Kingsbury, and Graham Harrell. He has a noodle arm that got the **** beaten out of it this past season. Best case scenario he returns to his previous level of probably being able to make only 80% of NFL level throws. On top of that, he's going to have to completely relearn how to play QB. The only difference between Tebow and Bradford is that Tebow is a good athlete with a strong arm, and Bradford has good mechanics. Other than that, the issues are basically the same.

[ciscofan]

And I'm telling you that anyone who is a competent talent evaluator WILL NOT feel that he is the QB of the future. If they take Bradford before the bottom half of the first, which is still too high for him, you should have serious doubts about Allen's ability to run a team.

The way I can say that after looking at Bradford's body of work and stats is the same way people can say that about Tim Tebow (who, honestly, has a better chance at making it at QB than Bradford), or Colt McCoy, and the same way people said it about Chase Daniel, and Kliff Kingsbury, and Graham Harrell. He has a noodle arm that got the **** beaten out of it this past season. Best case scenario he returns to his previous level of probably being able to make only 80% of NFL level throws. On top of that, he's going to have to completely relearn how to play QB. The only difference between Tebow and Bradford is that Tebow is a good athlete with a strong arm, and Bradford has good mechanics. Other than that, the issues are basically the same.

Are you KIDDING ME!?!?!?! I can pull up several scouting reports from reputable sites that say the EXACT OPPOSITE of what you are saying. Tebow has poor mechanics and a slow release while Bradford has textbook footwork and a good release with great accuracy.

I'm not going to argue with an obvious gator fan. Especially if you are going to consider yourself a better evaluator of talent than anyone in the NFL getting paid a ton of money to do what they do best.

[Redskinzfan30]

When then you're a poor evaluator of talent. Even the surest thing at the QB position coming out of college is a coinflip. Bradford's arm was never great, this whole shoulder thing just raises even more questions about it. Add that to the fact that he plays in a gimmick spread offense, and has pretty much never taken a snap from center, and you have a really ****ty QB prospect. Just about every aspect of Clausen is better, other than his record, which still isn't bad, but he's still far from a sure bet. I'd rather take my chances next year when the stakes aren't as high, when we've improved the offense and offensive line, and when we've exhausted Campbell as a potential option.

Not all QBs are a coinflip. Again I believe Bradford and Clausen will be good QBs. Not all spread QBs are bad. Some of them even turn out to be great. Bradford has an intelligent football mind and that is one of the things that the scouts love about him.

[Redskinzfan30]

And I'm telling you that anyone who is a competent talent evaluator WILL NOT feel that he is the QB of the future. If they take Bradford before the bottom half of the first, which is still too high for him, you should have serious doubts about Allen's ability to run a team.

The way I can say that after looking at Bradford's body of work and stats is the same way people can say that about Tim Tebow (who, honestly, has a better chance at making it at QB than Bradford), or Colt McCoy, and the same way people said it about Chase Daniel, and Kliff Kingsbury, and Graham Harrell. He has a noodle arm that got the **** beaten out of it this past season. Best case scenario he returns to his previous level of probably being able to make only 80% of NFL level throws. On top of that, he's going to have to completely relearn how to play QB. The only difference between Tebow and Bradford is that Tebow is a good athlete with a strong arm, and Bradford has good mechanics. Other than that, the issues are basically the same.

Location: Gainesville, FL (UF)

I wonder why you think that?

[Chopper Dave]

Are you KIDDING ME!?!?!?! I can pull up several scouting reports from reputable sites that say the EXACT OPPOSITE of what you are saying. Tebow has poor mechanics and a slow release while Bradford has textbook footwork and a good release with great accuracy.

I'm not going to argue with an obvious gator fan. Especially if you are going to consider yourself a better evaluator of talent than anyone in the NFL getting paid a ton of money to do what they do best.

Reading is fundamental.

Bradford has great mechanics, and well, that's just about it. Tebow does have a slow release (more low, the speed is less of a problem than the motion itself). However, this isn't a Bradford vs. Tebow argument. I do have some bias, but that bias is irrelevant; I'd be pissed if we took either before the 2nd round. And if you actually read and comprehended my post, you would realize that I didn't say the exact opposite of the scouting reports you mention.

I don't consider myself a better talent evaluator than EVERYONE in the NFL; just you, and anyone that considers Bradford a good QB prospect, which honestly, probably won't be that many (unless he shows improved arm strength somehow), and hopefully won't be anyone associated with the Skins.

[Chopper Dave]

Location: Gainesville, FL (UF)

I wonder why you think that?

I see you have no logical counterargument to my actual point. Figures, coming from someone who thinks drafting Bradford is a good idea.

[Chopper Dave]

Not all QBs are a coinflip. Again I believe Bradford and Clausen will be good QBs. Not all spread QBs are bad. Some of them even turn out to be great. Bradford has an intelligent football mind and that is one of the things that the scouts love about him.

That's one of the only things there is to love about him. He could be decent, but when I say that, it means he could be Trent Green, or Matt Hasselbeck; not Tom Brady or Peyton Manning, or even Drew Brees. Hell, he probably can't even be Jay Cutler.

And statisically speaking ALL QBs are, best case scenario, a coinflip. When even the most universally coveted QB prospects fail about half the time, that is the connotative definition of a coinflip.

[RocketCitySkins]

25% of Campbell's TD numbers and stats were inflated by garbage time. His numbers look somewhat impressive but he had multiple games where he threw late TD's when the other team was in prevent and having us drain the clock.

If that were true his numbers would be better in the 4th quarter. He actually has a higher completion percentage and qbr rating in the 3rd quarter.

[Oldskool]

I guess you havent watched every game the last 3 1/2 yrs

I guess you haven't watched the last 2 years, especially this year when he put up career numbers while running for his life.

Some people simply live in a completely bizarro world where their hate for something or someone overrides everything else.

[Redskinzfan30]

That's one of the only things there is to love about him. He could be decent, but when I say that, it means he could be Trent Green, or Matt Hasselbeck; not Tom Brady or Peyton Manning, or even Drew Brees. Hell, he probably can't even be Jay Cutler.

And statisically speaking ALL QBs are, best case scenario, a coinflip. When even the most universally coveted QB prospects fail about half the time, that is the connotative definition of a coinflip.

First don't insult me like you did in the post above this one. You're right Bradford will never be Cutler because Bradford is not a gunslinger. And what I meant was that I don't think Bradford or Clausen are a coinflip. I truely believe that they will both be good QBs.

[Chopper Dave]

First don't insult me like you did in the post above this one. You're right Bradford will never be Cutler because Bradford is not a gunslinger. And what I meant was that I don't think Bradford or Clausen are a coinflip. I truely believe that they will both be good QBs.

Well, you're entitled to your opinion, but your opinion is wrong. Most people who knew what they were talking about thought Ryan Leaf and Peyton Manning would both be good QBs. Guess what? Roughly 50% of them ended up being good QBs. I don't care what you truly believe, I look at the facts, and the facts show that even QB prospects that are universally believed to be solid are a 50/50 shot; it would only stand to reason that those with major question marks have, at best, the same if not worse odds of succeeding. I'm sorry if you can't understand that.

And that wasn't an insult. That was equal treatment. You make assumptions about me, I'm going to make assumptions about you.

[gorebd82]

Tender JC

Dump TC15

CB5 #2

Bradford sits until O-Line is fixed.

Can I tweak your suggestion?

Tender JC; then trade him for a 2nd or 3rd to be used on OL

Keep TC15

Keep CB5

Let them compete for starter

Bradford sits

Wildcard: Sign Jeff Garcia and let him compete with TC and CB. Loser gets cut.

[SkinsHokieFan]

We are going to pick Bradford at 4.

Get used to it

[SkinsHokieFan]

Can I tweak your suggestion?

Tender JC; then trade him for a 2nd or 3rd to be used on OL

Keep TC15

Keep CB5

Let them compete for starter

Bradford sits

Wildcard: Sign Jeff Garcia and let him compete with TC and CB. Loser gets cut.

I don't think TK is making "suggestions"

[Oldskool]

We are going to pick Bradford at 4.

Get used to it

Again, Nostradamus you aren't.

We have a real GM/HC now. No more Vincenzo drafts.

[SkinsHokieFan]

Again, Nostradamus you aren't.

We have a real GM/HC now. No more Vincenzo drafts.

Of course not.

Thats why Bradford will be the pick at the right spot.

And why we'll bring in plenty of o-lineman via the draft and FA

By August, we'll both be happy with the FO moves

[BlackBush]

I guess you haven't watched the last 2 years, especially this year when he put up career numbers while running for his life.

Some people simply live in a completely bizarro world where their hate for something or someone overrides everything else.

I was a fan of JC before this year's "career numbers". I looked at it as what has he done with what he is given. I know the sucky line, sucky RBs, developing WRs all of that I give credit to JC and I'll NEVER question the man's toughness. That said he isn't the future here. He has missed open receivers, had bad pocket presence, and held onto the ball too long. He may get a year as a RFA but that should be it. Drafting a QB now or next year while we rebuild the team is the best for the team.

[darklight1216]

No start Colt or a rookie behind this line. People want Campbell gone? Let em go. Campbell wants out and I cannot blame him.Let 1 hip Colt take the beating

If you start Colt Brennan, who is going to play the other fifteen games?

Dude get the quarterback if you can. Look at the playoffs. The quarterbacks are the top ones. Favre, Romo sits to pee, Brees, Warner division winners.

Brady, Palmer, Peyton, Rivers -- division winners. We have not had a top quarterback in years. Get one and compete for ten years.

Carson Palmer is not a top quarterback, unless your talking top 15-20.

Every last one of those teams have good offensive lines, all but the Chargers and sometimes the Vikings have serviceable rushers, and basically good defenses... proving once again that football, though qb driven, is still a team sport.

[Chopper Dave]

We are going to pick Bradford at 4.

Get used to it

I think if it's anyone, it's Clausen. It's just so obvious that Bradford is a) damaged goods and physically not up to snuff that I doubt anyone takes him before the second half of the first unless he heals up better than he was before and wows everyone at his workouts.

And forget Bradford, I don't want anyone at #4. I want to trade down.

That said, if we do take Bradford, #4 or otherwise, I hope I'm proven wrong.

[RocketCitySkins]

Can I tweak your suggestion?

Tender JC; then trade him for a 2nd or 3rd to be used on OL

Keep TC15

Keep CB5

Let them compete for starter

Bradford sits

Wildcard: Sign Jeff Garcia and let him compete with TC and CB. Loser gets cut.

Not with Garcia. And I'm not knocking him. I like Garcia, but he would be an idiot to come here. He will be 40 years old next month and probably won't play but one or two more years anyway. It will be hard to completely fix the o-line in one draft/offseason. If I'm Garcia, I don't want to spend my retirement in rehab.

[Chopper Dave]

Of course not.

Thats why Bradford will be the pick at the right spot.

And why we'll bring in plenty of o-lineman via the draft and FA

By August, we'll both be happy with the FO moves

Who exactly do we bring in via FA that isn't a 1st round tender?

Also, let's forget about the whole scouting aspect. Let's set all QB prospects are equal for the sake of argument. Why take one this year when we can take one next year for 1/3 the money?

[SkinsHokieFan]

I think if it's anyone, it's Clausen. It's just so obvious that Bradford is a) damaged goods and physically not up to snuff that I doubt anyone takes him before the second half of the first unless he heals up better than he was before and wows everyone at his workouts.

And forget Bradford, I don't want anyone at #4. I want to trade down.

That said, if we do take Bradford, #4 or otherwise, I hope I'm proven wrong.

You will be. His release, smarts and ability to throw on the run will be a perfect fit for Shanny.

His arm isn't Jason Campbell strong, but thats not nearly as important as being an on time very accurate passer in the 21st century NFL

[Chopper Dave]

You will be. His release, smarts and ability to throw on the run will be a perfect fit for Shanny.

His arm isn't Jason Campbell strong, but thats not nearly as important as being an on time very accurate passer in the 21st century NFL

Forget Jason Campbell strong, his arm isn't even Campbell Brown from CNN strong. He's also 100% shotgun, and has no experience in a pro-style offense. Those are the things that IMO make Clausen a better prospect.

[SkinsHokieFan]

Who exactly do we bring in via FA that isn't a 1st round tender?

Also, let's forget about the whole scouting aspect. Let's set all QB prospects are equal for the sake of argument. Why take one this year when we can take one next year for 1/3 the money?

1) The rookie scale will be phased in, according to reports from people like Mort. You won't go from 40 million dollar bonuses to 10 million dollar bonuses over night

2) Who knows where we will be picking next year and who the prospects are. When you have a guy like Bradford who has the pin point accuracy, quick release, and intelligence, you grab him when you got the chance

3) No reason for 1st round tenders in FA. This is where the scouting dept needs to find the right fit for the Shanahan offense