Alex Sulfsted

[RabidFan]

Anyone know why on earth we released him just to make room for the rookies???? If I remember, he filled in admirably for an entire game for Samuels and gave up zero sacks as a rookie........Just to make space, couldn't we have released Flowers or some undrafted FA........I hope he is not picked up by someone else because I would much rather cut Rod Jones and his bigger salary and backside and keep a young learning tackle who seemed to have proved himself in real time battle last year. Anyone have an inside scoop on this?

[Golgo-13]

Honestly, I'm WAY more upset about them releasing Sulfsted than Skaggs. Skaggs was never going to cut it and never really showed us much during real games. OTOH, Sulfsted filled in admirable during real games against good teams. This one baffles me.

[RabidFan]

Plus Skaggs just came off a knee injury......I mean its not like every street free agent we signed will make the team....and I know how StevO and others here seem to think Wood**** has a shot even with our plethera of WRs ....but there can't be any chance for Richmond Flowers....so why on earth cut Sulfsted when we know he can be effective in a reserve role where we maybe could cut Jones(I know dockery is new but will be a reserve OT as well) and apply his money to a Champ deal??? boggles my mind.

[milliondollarslim]

Sulfstead's release (this early anyway) was kind of a surprise. but from comments i vaguely remember last year, the line coach wasn't as impressed with him as we fans. Rod Jones does not make a lot of money and has played LT,RT and G. at times he has played well in his career , at times poorly. the skins do need an adequate backup for Samuels who will allow them to continue to throw and keep Ramsey safe.

[Golgo-13]

Chalk this up as another one of ASF's "Helton conspiracies."

[Art]

Sulfsted was a guy unlikely to make the team. Rod Jones is a better player and he's certainly more proven as a left tackle than Sulfsted, though Sulfsted did do a fine job in his game against the Packers. I am also surprised he was released this early, but, to be honest I think it may have been a favor to him by the team to release him now so he has a chance to find a home elsewhere, rather than later when he'd have almost no chance and about the same chance of making the roster.

We're probably keeping 10 lineman including Albright. Thomas, Jansen, Samuels, Fiore, Dockery and Moore are all locks. That leaves Jones, Friedmann, Johnson, Brown and Smith competing for the final two spots. I think the team prefers Smith as a tackle prospect more than Sulfsted and Brown can back up the center giving him the edge.

[panel]

You don't think Tre` is a lock, just to make the team?

[Art]

I don't think Tre is even close to being a lock. I can certainly see a situation in which he doesn't make the team, though, that situation would mean neither Fiore nor Friedmann show they are capable of making the line calls and snapping the ball to the QB and into shotgun at the center spot forcing Brown onto the team for that reason.

In the end I suspect Fiore and Friedman will backup -- or replace -- Moore and that gets Brown out of the picture. Smith is almost certain to be practice squad fodder again. That leaves Jones as the only backup tackle with a huge hope from Dockery. That puts one spot up for grabs between Friedman and Johnson and if Friedman can also prove a capable backup center, Johnson won't make the team.

[NavyDave]

Wilbert brown must have some compromising pics of Helton because his performance left much to be desired last season and Sulfstead did have a nice game for us last yr vs the Pack hope he lands on a team we arent facing this ear and has success l

I'm rooting for Tre J but if he still has injury issues its not happemimg.

Isnt dockery considered a backup tackle as well?

[redman]

I was thinking the same thing ND. Wilbert Brown over Sulfstead? WTF?

Art, saying that Jones is better than Sulfstead is all well and good - and may, MAY be true - but don't forget that Jones is coming off of a season ending injury that occurred after he arrived at camp horribly out of shape last year, and there's no guarantee that he's going to regain shape or form. And Sulfstead is younger, cheaper, and no less versatile in terms of where he can play on the line. I just don't get this move, especially since we're talking about a backup here, not a starter.

Again I say, WTF?

[Art]

Redman,

The point that would make it easier to understand is knowing that there is no may about it with regard to whether Sulfsted and Jones are comparable players. Jones is ahead of Sulfsted at left tackle. Sulfsted did a good job for us, but he's more a guard type than a left tackle. He has no real future. Smith is probably a better prospect there and Jones is a better player. Losing Sulfsted would have happened eventually. I think the team did right by him to let him go early so he could find a new place to try out.

Obviously the team, one would think, has to have some confidence in Jones' return from injury and we've never seen anything about him being slowed by that injury early on to this point. His was a bicep injury as well, so his legs will be good and he probably was well enough to play by about week 10 last year.

I think the team's comfort in his health and knowledge that Smith is more natural at the position and Jones is more experienced made Sulfsted an easy cut. Wilbert Brown is still around because he can play center. Until we have Fiore or Friedman show the same he's a valuable guy.

[Even Madder]

We're probably keeping 10 lineman including Albright. Thomas, Jansen, Samuels, Fiore, Dockery and Moore are all locks. That leaves Jones, Friedmann, Johnson, Brown and Smith competing for the final two spots. I think the team prefers Smith as a tackle prospect more than Sulfsted and Brown can back up the center giving him the edge.

That's the final 3 spots, not two (Thomas, Jansen, Samuels, Moore, Fiore, Dockery, Albright = 7). Albright may not be a lock if Brown or Fiore or Friedman want to be the long snapper, but that's unlikely. So there are 3 spots left, and one of them is going to be a tackle.

I'd guess that Jones, if healthy and in shape (big if's), is the leader because he can play tackle and guard. Friedman is probably second -- he missed a lot of time last year due to a thumb injury, but he started 14 games in 2001 for the Broncos. That's 2 spots.

That leaves Akil Smith (unless he can beat out Jones at tackle), Tre Johnson, and Wilbert Brown fighting for one spot. Akil Smith was a tackle in college, like a lot of NFL guards, but he really hasn't demonstrated the ability to play tackle at this level. If Jones looks good at tackle, I'd say Tre is the leader. If Jones looks bad, I'd guess Smith is the leader because the Skins will want some depth at tackle.

That still makes dropping Sulfsted odd. He was cheap, so it wasn't the contract. He played a position, tackle, where they don't have a lot of depth (although Fiore could play tackle as well). There must be another reason. Could he really be worse than Jones and Smith?

[Utah]

The only thing that gives any insight to this point is that Johnson ended up taking the starting role from Brown last year for the final 3 games.

What does that mean?

Not a damn thing.

In football, its what have you done for me lately. That battle should be good and fun to watch.

To me, if the Big Banga comes in a bit of shape and has that nasty streak in him again, I think he gets the nod. Helton by the end of the year just wanted someone who could maul and I think Tre fits that bill.

But we'll see.

[PennSkinsFan]

I think they are looking for depth guys that can step in a play a decent amount of time if needed. I can remember when I interview Ron Nay that it was a downfall on Sulfsted. he coudl step in for a few games, but they coudln't rely on him for more than five games, that is the only rationale i can think of. I actually thought he played well last season, so Nay's comments were a bit stunning.

[Even Madder]

This could be one of those situations where Sulfsted's perceived value by the fans is much higher than the team's, who see him everyday in practice. I, for one, thought he was a pretty decent backup tackle -- not anywhere near starting quality, but pretty decent. Maybe that's wrong.

It's not like he was cut because the Skins have so much depth at tackle. They only have Fiore, Jones, and Smith. Fiore is certainly capable, but Jones and Smith are huge question marks. Hopefully the team knows what they're doing here.

[sashae]

Hopefully this just means they're seeing better things from the other linemen than Sulfsted, so he was expendable. Trying to keep a positive spin on things, natch

-s

[RabidFan]

I hear you .....but wilbert brown??? wow i know he's Trotter's best friend but cumon

[panel]

This is my list. I really think that this is how things will go down, maybe Friedmann can take Brown's spot, but I think Brown will win out.

T- Jansen, Samuels, Jones

G-Thomas, Fiore, Dockery, Johnson

C-Moore, Albright, Brown

[Coach Williams]

sulfstead must have shown up in camp overweight and out of shape, but that can be fixed ?

why would they cut him even under those conditions anyways.

__________________________________________________

as for brown....he made everyone P.O.'ed last year esp. when a faster DT got to him....he allowed a bunch of sacks, and backfield tackles in his 3 game reign of terror.......im rooting for fan fav. johnson, or jones......

__________________________________________________

[Art]

Jones is an experienced, capable player who is ideal for a backup role at both tackle spots. Dockery, we should also remember, might be able to play right tackle at the least, if not left tackle. Fiore does have the ability to swing in and play left tackle as well. In all that versatility coupled with Jones experience and ability gives us some comfort behind Samuels and Jansen.

I'm not sure I understand why Sulfsted is such a head scratcher to everyone here. He only made the roster a year ago because we had injury and he can't play center, which Brown can and that makes Brown more valuable today than Sulfsted. Especially with the team as high on Smith's potential down the road as indications have been.

[redman]

Originally posted by Art

Redman,

The point that would make it easier to understand is knowing that there is no may about it with regard to whether Sulfsted and Jones are comparable players. Jones is ahead of Sulfsted at left tackle. Sulfsted did a good job for us, but he's more a guard type than a left tackle. He has no real future. Smith is probably a better prospect there and Jones is a better player. Losing Sulfsted would have happened eventually. I think the team did right by him to let him go early so he could find a new place to try out.

Obviously the team, one would think, has to have some confidence in Jones' return from injury and we've never seen anything about him being slowed by that injury early on to this point. His was a bicep injury as well, so his legs will be good and he probably was well enough to play by about week 10 last year.

I think the team's comfort in his health and knowledge that Smith is more natural at the position and Jones is more experienced made Sulfsted an easy cut. Wilbert Brown is still around because he can play center. Until we have Fiore or Friedman show the same he's a valuable guy.

Your conclusion may well be right in that it reflects what the team is thinking, but I think this decision is very debateable.

Wilbert Brown showed me zero last year. I'd equate his performance with Ross Tucker's. The fact that he can play center means absolutely nothing to me given that we have three proven NFL centers on our roster. Fiore and Friedman don't have anything to prove in that regard. And the fact that Brown can also (supposedly) play guard means even less given that everyone else on the O-line roster aside from Jansen and Samuels has NFL guard experience too, or else is projected for playing time there in the case of Dockery.

As for Jones, neither you nor I seriously believe he's a left tackle. To my knowledge he's never played a regular NFL game there. He's played both guard positions and has also started at right tackle, a very different position. I don't regard him as a backup at LT, and his pre-injury struggles last year just to play guard didn't do anything to change my mind. Yes, he's proven more than Sulfstead overall in the league, but Alex had at least shown he could fill in at LT adequately; we now have no one on our roster who can claim that aside from Samuels.

My thought on this is as follows: We must be high on Dockery's ability to play LT to have allowed this to happen. If we're right, then I'm not worried because, as you said, Sulfstead was never going to be a Pro Bowler. Otherwise, Sulfstead showed up out of shape and Jones showed up in great shape, or else Gilbert Brown has even more naked Helton Polaroids than he did last year. Otherwise, I just can't make a lot of sense of this.

[Art]

Redman,

I fear you have pretty bad information my friend. Rod Jones has never played either guard position. He only played right tackle for the Rams. He was a franchised left tackle with Cincy and was for a spell considered one of the rising stars at the position. He fell out of favor battling depression and some injury and never has regained a trusted role as a starter.

Jones played outstanding at left guard for us last year before he got hurt at left tackle. He'd have been our starter at guard a year ago where he has some good traits to be a solid interior lineman, but he was so unaccustomed to the requirements of the job at right guard he was moved to left guard which is far easier for him to convert to after playing tackle his whole career.

Jones is an immensely comforting player to have in reserve with 37 starts at left tackle out of his 38 starts as a pro.

[redman]

My bad, Art. You're right, he did start at LT for the Bengals. I had that wrong. I was thinking what he did for the Rams - play RT - what what he'd done for the Bengals.

Incidentally, he did play guard at least a couple of times for Cincy according to his bio:

1998

Jones played in a reserve role for the majority of the year while starting in two games at left guard vs. Buffalo (12/6) and at Indianapolis (12/13).

[Art]

Cool.

I remember reading about his conversion to guard here and how he was being asked to do it for the first time and presumed he never had been at guard before. Must have been that he'd never headed into a season slated to play that spot or something.

Thanks.

[Zen-like Todd]

What makes it a head scratcher to me is that he performed pretty well when I saw him last year, and while I agree that he may not have made the roster, we have 5 OTs on the roster right now who look like absolute bums/camp fodder. Was he really no better than any of them?