Sailor Posted June 24, 2001 Share Posted June 24, 2001 Man, has this been a slow week. We've already discussed books and movies. Before somebody starts a thread on their favorite soap opera I thought I'd try to get a little football talk going. Here are a couple of puzzling questions: 1. Everybody wondered about picking Rosenfels in the draft. Some felt it was a show of confidence in Husak as the #2, some felt that it was a show of no confidence in Husak. CBS Sportsline has reported that Trent Dilfer has turned down offers from the Packers and the Colts because he doesn't want to be a backup. So the question is, did Marty know that Dilfer wouldn't come to DC, and, not seeing another veteran backup he liked go to the draft for the third QB? Or is he really that sold on Husak? 2. According to the Post, "Coach Marty Schottenheimer said he is interested in trying to sign Pro Bowl kickoff returner Michael Bates, a free agent, but not immediately." What is this about? Why not sign him now? Does Marty know he will be cutting Deion and freeing up the cap dollars he needs to sign Bates? How does Marty know that Bates will still be around when he is ready to sign him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickalino Posted June 24, 2001 Share Posted June 24, 2001 I'll give you those answers as soon as I finish watching my favorite soap opera..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cskin Posted June 24, 2001 Share Posted June 24, 2001 I think what we're not seeing about the Rosenfels pick is that someone within the coaching or scouting draft sees something special about him. Now..his statistics aren't eye popping, but it appeared to me that he did the most with little talent around him. And...some have pointed out his bad mechanics, but those things can be taught... especially having two of three years of solid NFL coaching. I can vaguely rememberpeople talking about some other curent QB's with poor mechanics.... as in: Brett Favre Doug Flutie Drew Bledsoe So...with that said, I think that Husak has really impressed the Redskins enough to think that....with both Husak & Rosenfels behind George...we're pretty solid. I mean...it's not like Rosenfels is getting on the field in the next two years anyway. We've got George starting for one more year after this one, then Husak steps in as the starter (with another two years of "seasoning" in the NFL, and more specifically within the Raye WCO), and Sage will eventually be our back-up, unless of course he competes, and wins, the starting job. If that were the case, the draft of Sage in the fourth will appear to be "dream like". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickalino Posted June 24, 2001 Share Posted June 24, 2001 I think everyone is trying too hard to justify the Rosenfels pick, just to make themselves feel better. Let's face it, no matter how you slice it, Sage was a BAD 4th round pick. Even if Sage had the potential everyone describes, and we had the need, he would have been there in a later round, and we could have used that 4th rounder MUCH more wisely. And it was worth the risk to wait til a later round, because even if he was snatched up, there's quite a few free agent veteran QB's out there who would have sufficed as a #3 guy. Meanwhile, we could have had a future fixture on the O-line, such as Pork Chop Womack, or a linebacker, safety, etc [ by Mick on June 24, 2001.] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bulldog Posted June 24, 2001 Share Posted June 24, 2001 evidently Marty is of the opinion that the team can't have enough quarterbacks or wide receivers because that is where the focus of the draft was. Except for Smoot, who was a gift at #2, you count Gardner, Rosefels and McCants as the top 3 of 4 picks. You then throw in that of our undrafted free agent signings that Latef Grim out of Pittsburgh, another wide receiver, was perhaps the most highly rated by draft people. Meanwhile, it seems Marty is willing to gamble on spots like DL and RB with little if any attention paid to those spots in the offseason. And while some of that has to do with limited funds, you can't tell me that a rookie #3 quarterback with a mountain of work to do to improve is worth more to this team in 2001 or even 2002 than say a veteran DE or DT that can backup Bruce and Marco. If Deion is cut perhaps we will add those players later, but until that happens it does seem that the choice of a quarterback rated as a #6 or #7 pick in a year with a good quarterback crop is a pick that could have been delayed until next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KMP Posted June 24, 2001 Share Posted June 24, 2001 Interesting questions Sailor. My own .02 cents says Marty has the confidence he needs to say Jeff George is gonna play 16 games and Husak is ready to step in should George get injured. But we're also a month away from camp and many things can happen between now and San Diego. Wherever Dilfer signs it will be as a backup. He knows it and so do 31 general managers. As for Bates it would appear Marty is prone to tell the Post one thing to keep everyone guessing. How many safeties did Marty say he was interested in yet didn't sign any of them? The Deion question lingers and as long as it does we won't know if Bates will be a Redskin. ------------------ <IMG SRC="http://www.joegibbsracing.com/joe_gibbs/joegibbs_images/driver_prof_joe.jpg" border=0><IMG SRC="http://www.joegibbsracing.com/current_season/jgr_wc_18/jgr_wc_18_images/car/bobby_car_race.gif" border=0><IMG SRC="http://www.joegibbsracing.com/current_season/jgr_wc_20/jgr_wc_20_images/car/drive_pontiac_tony.gif" border=0> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montilar Posted June 24, 2001 Share Posted June 24, 2001 In a post draft interivew with the local news, Marty commented on Sage being taken in the fourth by stating that he was their projected 4th rounder all along. And he compared him to a young, inexperienced Grbac. Now maybe he thought he was talking about Weinke who went slightly higher in the fourth.... When Weinke was gone, maybe Sage was the "alternate plan". If marty truly felt Sage was a Grbac clone, I could see targeting him. But who else sees him as a Grbac clone? Did anyone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Posted June 24, 2001 Share Posted June 24, 2001 Husak, by all accounts, is having an outstanding pre-season thus far. From being dismissed by Marty when pre-season started, to earning the #2 spot and thus far taking off the pressure to sign Dilfer, Husak has been a pleasant surprise, to say the least. So one has to wonder, was the cost of getting Husak to elevate his game to the point of becoming a solid #2 option at QB, the 4th round selection of Rosenfels? Was Sage drafted to push Husak (and to be pushed himself)? If we'd have picked up Dilfer, Husak would have looked forward to some serious clipboard duty, and likely would have remained the 3rd wheel. Why try to push yourself, and what shot would the coaching staff give you to do so? But with no Dilfer, and instead another rookie QB trying to take his job, Husak appears to have responded to the challenge and stepped up big time. I'm not saying that Marty planned it this way, he may just have been looking for competition at the backup QB slot and get a head start on looking for our QB of the future. Husak wasn't his guy, Sage was, let them battle it out for #3. But while waiting for the money to clear for Dilfer, it seems to have serendipitously provided an opening for Husak and he's made the most of it. So now, instead of Jeff/Dilfer/the winner of Husak and Rosenfels, we have Jeff/Hsak/Rosenfels. I'd imagine that even Marty is surprised. As for not picking a lineman, say Womack, instead of Sage we won't know whether that was a good or bad decision for at least a season or two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sailor Posted June 24, 2001 Author Share Posted June 24, 2001 Good points, Terry, but I'd like to think that Marty planned it that way. A fourth round pick is an awfully expensive way to generate competition at the #3 QB position. Especially with all the holes that needed filling. The other great thing about it is that we filled out the QB slots pretty cheaply. Any idea what it would have taken to sign Dilfer? We now have those cap dollars to spend elsewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bulldog Posted June 24, 2001 Share Posted June 24, 2001 I'm guessing that Dilfer will end up with a backup deal for around $1 million and incentives. The fact Dilfer didn't go to Denver where Brian Griese has had significant injury problems is somewhat surprising. The Broncos signed Beuerlein and Steve has been an effective quarterback at times in the NFL. But he is where Bernie Kosar was at the end of his career, all beat up and bruised having played behind a shaky line for several years in Carolina. At 37, I can't believe Beuerlein was Shanahan's #1 choice off the bench. How many knee and shoulder surgeries has Steve had? But, Dilfer may have talked himself out of a couple of chances to come in and contribute to a winning team by holding out for a starting job. Even Cincinnati went in another direction with Jon Kitna, who is very lightly regarded judging by the interest he himself garnered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyDave Posted June 25, 2001 Share Posted June 25, 2001 I tend to think Marty had this planned. Why upset your starting QB (George)by repeating a situation from last year at QB? His goal was to have a backup QB that does't pose a threat initially to George but can step in when needed and it appears to be Husak. I can't defend the Sage pick as I was hoping for a lineman at that spot. But it appears that we have a solid O line with depth at guard,center and tackle. I like the potential of our depth at certain spots especially receiver and Corner ------------------ Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Posted June 25, 2001 Share Posted June 25, 2001 Yeah Sailor, I think that as you say, Marty wanted to generate some competition at the #3 QB slot, and see who might be a candidate for long term. But Husak then stepped it up and has almost proven to Marty that he can be the #2 guy. We gotta remember that Sage was drafted before Marty got a chance to see what his QBs looked like at the QB camp. So he might be regretting the Rosenfels pick himself, now that he's seen how things have turned out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bulldog Posted June 25, 2001 Share Posted June 25, 2001 There was nothing wrong in my mind with taking a quarterback somewhere in this draft, my objection is the Skins seemed to do what Dallas did with Quincy Carter, ie take him several rounds ahead of where the player should have gone. Now, that may not matter if Rosenfels turns out. But I think the Skins could have gotten him in round #6 and made another selection for the DL, RB or LB at that pick and gotten a player that could have contributed THIS season. The other thing is, this was a very weak group of quarterbacks in 2001. Only ONE qb was selected in the first round. That is unusual. Guys like Mike MacMahon had far more sterling stats in college than Sage did and he was taken at #6. To me, Rosenfels is no better a prospect than Husak was last year, and we took him at #6. That tells me the Skins overpaid for Sage regardless of his ultimate value to the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted June 25, 2001 Share Posted June 25, 2001 Bates would be an interesting guy to add because I'd like to see him in the backfield on third down situations. He, obviously, is a guy that can get loose in the open field, and I'd like seeing what he can bring out of the backfield against a linebacker or safety in certain situations. He wouldn't be all we need for depth at running back, but, he'd be a nice guy to have as a fail safe and option. I'm not sure the Rosenfels pick was the best thing we could have done, but, maybe it lit a fire under Husak a little, as all reports of Husak is that he struggled before the draft, but he has done well thereafter. I don't like being too critical of second-day draft picks. I think you take guys on Day 2 that fit into what you want to do. Marty had a good feeling about Rosenfels, so, that's good enough for me. I'd have done differently, but, I'm not in charge. ------------------ Doom is in the box. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bulldog Posted June 25, 2001 Share Posted June 25, 2001 The entire thing with Bates boils down to the dollars. At age 30, is Bates worth a one year deal for $750,000? Sure. Is he worth a multiyear deal with a signing bonus? There is the question. I think in 6 years in the NFL Bates has shown himself to be a return man, period. He fits into the Ron Brown mold. Yes, he has lined up in the slot before as a WR but he has not shown the ability to contribute regularly in the regular offense. I am not sure that Bates has the instincts or experience to be an asset out of the backfield. Has Bates every played RB in the NFL? Because return men go down each year with serious injuries, I would be very leery of signing ANYONE to a longer term contract at that position. A one year deal could have value to the Redskins. Anything more and I would pass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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