Questions About Bramlet vs. Palmer

[Thoth]

Questions about Bramlet & Palmer, hopefully answered by people who have actually seen them play. I can read the scouting reports, I'm interested in what you all have seen.

How strong an arm does Bramlet have? Why did he not make the team previous years? Bad decisions? Is he mobile? Smart? Small? Is he a medium talent guy who has maximized potential, or a potential gunslinging stud who is sloppy or prone to poor decisions?

Isn't it risky to put Palmer on the practice squad? Can't another team sign him then? Wouldn't some team take a chance on a 6'5" cannon-armed QB as a developmental prospect? Surely that is why we drafted him? Same questions about Palmer. Is his arm really that strong? Does he just have technique problems that coaching can correct, or is he another Ramsey? Realize it will take time to know for sure, but what has watching him told you?

Is it possible we'll keep 4 QBs, in anticipation of Brunell leaving next year? Given Gibbs' preference for a veteran QB, is getting rid of Brunell realistic? Would we just sign another veteran? Maybe try to trade Bramlet?

It sounds absurd, but this front office has surprised in the past. Could we really keep Brunell and Collins this year?

How long do you keep Brunell? If Palmer learns a lot this year, do you then draft another QB next year? Be great to finally have a full draft for a few years! Do it the year after next? Or just sign a servicable veteran? Stash Bramlet on IR or something?

If you had to let another team have either Bramlet or Palmer, which one would it be?

Lots of questions, hope mods don't get angry, really hoping someone with knowledge can provide some useful insights.

Thanks.

[tgc]

i think carson is one of the best 5 qbs in the world

casey is in the next 10 or so

carsons brother is in the next hundred or so

the same three qbs will be wearing the best uniform in the leauge again this season

i think its the wrong move

i think jc could be a top 10 someday- so maybe it wont ever matter

[Touchdown Redskins]

i think carson is one of the best 5 qbs in the world

casey is in the next 10 or so

Casey Bramlet as a top 15 QB? I honestly think that with most sports tending to scout other leagues, especially European leagues, that Gibbs would know what they had with Bramlet. From what I can tell, Bramlet has a gun, but he just played at a subpar college program (Wyoming), and he's been playing against weaker competition most of his life, so it's hard to tell whether he's ready for the NFL or not. I mean, there's a reason the Bengals released him (before they got good with Carson Palmer). The thing is, NFL Europa is a little more similar in playing style to the NFL, but with simply with worse talent. With Arena league QBs (like Tommy Maddox), they have an easier time adjusting because Arena football is more cramped and the holes for receivers close more quickly. I would probably be higher on Bramlet if he came from the Arena league.

[Touchdown Redskins]

i think carson is one of the best 5 qbs in the world

casey is in the next 10 or so

Casey Bramlet as a top 15 QB? I honestly think that with most sports tending to scout other leagues, especially European leagues, that Gibbs would know what they had with Bramlet. From what I can tell, Bramlet has a gun, but he just played at a subpar college program (Wyoming), and he's been playing against weaker competition most of his life, so it's hard to tell whether he's ready for the NFL or not. I mean, there's a reason the Bengals released him (before they got good with Carson Palmer). The thing is, NFL Europa is a little more similar in playing style to the NFL, but with simply with worse talent. With Arena league QBs (like Tommy Maddox), they have an easier time adjusting because Arena football is more cramped and the holes for receivers close more quickly. I would probably be higher on Bramlet if he came from the Arena league.

[wyofan]

Casey Bramlet as a top 15 QB? I honestly think that with most sports tending to scout other leagues, especially European leagues, that Gibbs would know what they had with Bramlet. From what I can tell, Bramlet has a gun, but he just played at a subpar college program (Wyoming), and he's been playing against weaker competition most of his life, so it's hard to tell whether he's ready for the NFL or not. I mean, there's a reason the Bengals released him (before they got good with Carson Palmer). The thing is, NFL Europa is a little more similar in playing style to the NFL, but with simply with worse talent. With Arena league QBs (like Tommy Maddox), they have an easier time adjusting because Arena football is more cramped and the holes for receivers close more quickly. I would probably be higher on Bramlet if he came from the Arena league.

OK here's the deal on Bramlet, he was cut at Cinci because the owner wanted a Ohio State kid on the team, Krinzel not because of ability. Krinzel was a bust, don't even know if he's still around now. He does have a gun, played well at Wyoming and NFL Europe. As I have written many times there is a difference in talent level in NFL Europe, mostly speed. But there is more speed on the offensive line too protecting the quarterback. Bramlet can make the transition to the NFL with no problem, just needs a chance to play. Bramlet showed he can run an offense, make the throws and manage a game in NFL Europe, valuable experience no matter where the game is played. If your a facts guy, his quarterback rating for the championship game was over 150 and the season rating was 100.

And there have been more than a few good quarterbacks come out of the NFL Europe experience. ie: Werner, Delhomme, Kitna, Johnson, three Super Bowl Champions, not too bad of company to keep.

[wysknz1]

Best research the conference and teams before you make an "eastern" statement like that. A lot of Mtn West players and QB's are in the league. There's even several from WY on teams. OK so it isn't THE U but it ain't bad ball.

[wyominghansen]

I mean, there's a reason the Bengals released him (before they got good with Carson Palmer). .

Yeah like the above poster mentioned Krenzel won the job because of his Ohio connection, and it was a FO cut, not a coach based cut. Casey actually outperformed Krenzel during the preseason. And the season before, he had the best QB rating out of all of the QB's, including the older Palmer. And when Palmer was injured many of the fans wanted Casey in and Kitna out.

But getting back to the main part of the tread. Casey has a good strong arm, who uses good touch on his passes when needed. During college and NFLE (the first time) he threw a few too many int's statistically (but look at Farve's carreer int's). But like Farve, despite his int's, he crushed team records in both college, and NFLE. I am not saying that Casey is the second coming of Farve, I am just stating that both QB's have thrown a few more int's than a statistician based scout would like, but they have both also thrown for alot of yards and TD's.

During his second NFLE season he took care of the TD/INT ratio (15/5 for the season, with 4 TD's in the World Bowl and a 155.5 QB rating). He displays great leadership and pocket pressence, and would make a better starter than a backup, because of his winning attitude and desire to get on the field.

I think it would be a shame if we let him go, but I think it would really be a shame if we screwed him over by keeping him until the final cuts. Not giving him the opportunity to get signed by another team early enough to get a good bond with the new team.

I just wish that if we are planning to release him, that we treat him like O'Sullivan (the QB that Casey outperformed in the World Bowl), who was released early, and picked up almost immediately by the Lions.

[2006Skins]

i think carson is one of the best 5 qbs in the world

casey is in the next 10 or so

carsons brother is in the next hundred or so

the same three qbs will be wearing the best uniform in the leauge again this season

i think its the wrong move

i think jc could be a top 10 someday- so maybe it wont ever matter

I had some interest in this thread until that comment. After that I stopped reading.

[CDH]

None of this matters because like An old coach likes old players and that means he will have two over teh hill good for nothing backups. Collins and Brunell will keep up with the Team motto of "Too old to Play" That is what our team is in for until some drastic changes are made.

[Wyvern]

Bramlet -- a 40% chance of making squad as 3rd QB. This goes up to 90% if Collins retires.

Palmer -- a 80% chance of making the practice squad.

[str1ck]

Here is my argument for Bramlet.

1. Todd Collins has never demonstrated an ablility to play. He may be the 40lb brain when it comes to the Redskins Playbook, but that really doesn't translate to much on the field. We don't need him as assistant coach. Its my opinion we have too many coaches. I don't know what his contract looks like. But at this point its "welfare with dignitity". The reason I say this is that Collins get paid to almost nothing. He really brings nothing to the table with respect to value to this club. Todd is never going to play a single down for the Redskins, I say its time to cut our losses, and invest in a young guy.

2. Wyoming football isn't some Division I-AA school, and even if it was who cares. Plenty of NFL stars have come up through Div I-AA, II, and even III. Next NFL EUROPA, ok so maybe the game is a little slower or different. Big deal remember Casey asked to go to NFLE. It gave him a chance work on his game and develop his leadership on the field and in the locker room. You guys can hate all you want to, but at the End of the Day Casey Bramlet excelled to be the best player he could with his given circumsances. Casey hasn't given anyone any reason to doubt that given the chance he will develop and mature into a quality NFL quarterback. If the our Club isn't ready and willing to take a chance on Casey, I would hope that they would trade him to a team that could utilize player with Casey's abilities.

Anyway that is just my opinion.:eaglesuck

[tml6157]

If we dont keep Bramlet as our 3rd QB then we are totally stupid.

[laurent]

No team in their right mind would waste a roster spot by signing a project like Palmer. What we'll likely see is either Brunell or Collins get the boot/traded and Bramlet rounding out the roster as the 3rd backup QB.

Palmer will be on the practice squad and will get a chance to get a backup spot next year.

[WSHRedskins3ATLBraves3]

Krinzel was a bust,

Did anyone actually think Krenzel would do anything in the NFL? For the record, Troy Smith will not do anything in the NFL either.

[WSHRedskins3ATLBraves3]

If we dont keep Bramlet as our 3rd QB then we are totally stupid.

Really? The only two times, I've seen him (training camp and the scrimmage) he didn't look that good. In training camp he had to throw a ball about 30 yards and it hit 6 or 7 yards in front of the ball boy. I'm not saying that's any indictation of how well he can play as an NFL QB but how many times has anyone actually seen him play enough to actually make a statement like that?

[jnhay]

i think carson is one of the best 5 qbs in the world

casey is in the next 10 or so

If you can find one other person who thinks Bramlet is top 15, I'd rank him in the top five most overrated quarterbacks. :laugh:

[wyominghansen]

Really? The only two times, I've seen him (training camp and the scrimmage) he didn't look that good. In training camp he had to throw a ball about 30 yards and it hit 6 or 7 yards in front of the ball boy. I'm not saying that's any indictation of how well he can play as an NFL QB but how many times has anyone actually seen him play enough to actually make a statement like that?

How did he not look good in the scrimmage? From what I heard he was 2 for 2 for 14 yards. Isn't that a 100% completion day? Did you want him to complete more passes than he threw?

[Wyvern]

Let's agree to watch the pre-season games and discuss this further. Final evaluations are somewhat premature and we're putting way too much weight on third party observation's of a very small sample activity.

Over the next month, Bramlet, Palmer, and Collins are all going to get their chances to show their stuff. And it's about the entire package that they show to the coaches over the pre-season that will infuence the outcome, not a few 7-on-7's performances or early-camp miscues.

Personally, I still think Bramlet will prevail and win the #3 QB slot. His NFL-E experience does count for something -- seasoning and reps. Now, it's how well Bramlet showcases himself to Gibbs & Co. and proves he's a good fit in the Saunder's scheme. And I really hope, he is that good, because Bramlet could wind up as backup QB soon, considering Brunell's age and physical condition.

[HailSkinz1]

Isn't it risky to put Palmer on the practice squad? Can't another team sign him then? Wouldn't some team take a chance on a 6'5" cannon-armed QB as a developmental prospect? Surely that is why we drafted him? Same questions about Palmer. Is his arm really that strong? Does he just have technique problems that coaching can correct, or is he another Ramsey? Realize it will take time to know for sure, but what has watching him told you?

You are exactly right, in my opinion. Putting Palmer on the PS is far more risky than putting Bramlet there. Everyone knows Bramlet as a very average, at best, QB. He's been around the league and hasn't stuck anywhere.

Palmer though is unknown and as you mention, has the measurables. Teams would be more willing to take a chance on an unknown with Palmer's measurables than an average known QB in Bramlet.

I would cut Collins and have Palmer holding the clipboard.

Hail,

H

[tgc]

i think carson is one of the best 5 qbs in the world

casey is in the next 10 or so

carsons brother is in the next hundred or so

the same three qbs will be wearing the best uniform in the leauge again this season

i think its the wrong move

i think jc could be a top 10 someday- so maybe it wont ever matter

this guy is an idiot

what he meant was- i know nothing about carsons brother

i think bramlet is an nfl qb

there is no such thing as a qb competition- any level any time