Grossman vs Campbell

[chaught76]

Grossman may be fine as long as he keeps a good, not above average, but good supporting cast around him. Otherwise, I think we will be looking at the next Trent Dilfer.

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

grossman is bad. all his good games came from heavebomb passes that guys made nice catches on or just torched their CBs/DBs. he rarely throws any good passes short or over the middle. plus he fumbles like a madman.

[iceman330]

JC is better than Rex hands down. Rex git over b/c the first 6 games or so DBs were dropping picks. And I mean picks hitting them in the chest. Then the later part of the yr guys start holding onto the ball and everyone asks wat happened to Rex? I would say Rex is doing what he's always done. In a year or two you'll c; Rex and JC are not in the same class of player.

[jeronimobrat]

Grossman has barely played, what a season and a half? It takes time to develop a QB. He has the tools. He does play on a team with an incredible amount of talent on the offense. Great line, Vet WR in Moose, good TE and Jones carried that team like Portis carried us.

Does anyone else catch that Koolblue may have been referencing about Campbell in this paragraph. Nice of Koolblue to recognize that Campbell has the potential though.

:logo:

[EersSkins05]

Campbell...I have no idea. Anyone who has formed an opinion on him yet is an odd person.

Couldn't agree more. If you saw enough in the first season to say either way, then you probably went into it with some prejudices one way or the other.

[Koolblue13]

Does anyone else catch that Koolblue may have been referencing about Campbell in this paragraph. Nice of Koolblue to recognize that Campbell has the potential though.

:logo:

He does have potential, the both of them. As far as Cambell goes, I've seen a lot of young QB's come through that looked like the savior. I'm optimistic he is the one, but I don't know anything and either do you. I like our chances this year, especially with JC under center. If you are going to call me out, call me out.

[AceSkinsFan]

JC may not have proven much yet, but what has Rex Grossman really proved? He certainly isn't the one who led the Bears to the Superbowl. If anything, he was responsible for losing a few games for the Bears last year. He is VERY turnover prone, but what else can you expect from a Steve Spurrier QB (remember he went to UF during Spurrier's tenure.) I don't see Rex's turnover ratio getting any better, so fantasy league or not I think he's a huge risk. Say what you want about JC, but in the short time he did play, he did a halfway decent job of taking care of the football. We'll just have to wait and see how it plays out this season.

[whatmeworry]

Ask a simple question.

Would you trade Campbell for Grossman? I bet few, if any, Redskin fans would say yes. But I bet a substantial amount of Bears fans would.

[Juniorbandit]

JC: 76.5 passer rating

RG: 73.9 Passer Rating

Preatty even, but JC up

[ceviker]

Rex is a proven loser who can't do squat. Close to the worst starting QB in the NFL right now. Bears will take a QB in the 1st round next year.

[Omeletpants]

No way those guys are Bears fans. Bears fans HATE Grossman...

You don't know what you are talking about. Bears fans are disappointed and yes a percentage hate Grossman but most are behind him. I've seen every game he has played

Grossman had more 100+ rating games than any QB in football last year. He has one of the strongest arms in the game and no QB throws the seam route as well as him. For the first 7 weeks of the season the national media was calling him the league MVP. He destroyed the Giants, Seahwaks (twice) and Saints

He did fall apart at the end of the year but the guy has only started about 22 games in his career.

[AJWatson3]

I like how the Bears guy brought up a game played 4 seasons ago when we lost on a fake FG, yet 2 years ago, we beat them 9-7 in spite of playing 1/2 a QB in Brunell.

i had the pleasure of sitting next to him at this game.

sadly, the chicago tribune reported the week prior to the game that the Bears were planning to use Urlacher on trick plays/as a pass catcher. i mentioned it to my friends and when the Bears were lining up for the FG, we all noticed Urlacher. then we all noticed Urlacher going in motion.

unfortunately nobody in the organization seemed to be taking tabs on their upcoming opponent....

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

JC: 76.5 passer rating

RG: 73.9 Passer Rating

Preatty even, but JC up

passer rating is a horrid stat. brunells was 86.x. its a misleading stat. grossman is horrible, campbell at least showed promise this season. we will find out a lot about him come september.

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

You don't know what you are talking about. Bears fans are disappointed and yes a percentage hate Grossman but most are behind him. I've seen every game he has played

Grossman had more 100+ rating games than any QB in football last year. He has one of the strongest arms in the game and no QB throws the seam route as well as him. For the first 7 weeks of the season the national media was calling him the league MVP. He destroyed the Giants, Seahwaks (twice) and Saints

He did fall apart at the end of the year but the guy has only started about 22 games in his career.

its because teams didnt know what kinda game he brought. the second they figured out all he did was throw the long ball, they took it away from him, and he SUCKED. the same way Romo sits to pee looked great and started to dwindle because people started figuring out what he was bringing.

grossman blows. hes the main reason they lost the superbowl.

[AJWatson3]

Gary's reply to my "GrossMan" post, the final in the first entry in this thread:

Gary:

"OK hold on. You're getting ahead of yourself. What're you even trying to say?

"This is the kind of stuff Rex threw up (no pun intended) when it came down to crunchtime... he obviously got very comfortable and had no need to perform with CHI up comfortably on their division rivals..."

If he is comfortable with such a big lead and there was no need for him to perform..how is that considered crunchtime?

I don't know about you but I consider crunchtime to be when there is something you are playing for. And when every team in the league started out even, Grossman came out throwing 98.6+ in 5 of 7 games. Everyone knew the Bears had control of their division so early that there was no pressure. When there was pressure once the playoffs came around he was an average QB, but no worse, and I heard many times before the Superbowl hearing about how Rex was having a better playoff run than Manning.

Damn, the guy has 5 bad games including 1 when he should have just been given the week off and another one that hardly mattered and everyone thinks the guy sucks.

But lets take a look at the stats you decided to throw out there and call "just plain PITIFUL"

Week 11 @ NYJ- 11/22 50% 119yds 1td (win 10-0)

Week 12 @ NE- 15/34 44% 176yds 3int (lose 17-13)

Week 13 vs MIN- 6/19 32% 34 yds 3int (WIN 23-13)

Week 16 @ DET- 20/36 56% 197 yds 1td (win 26-21)

Week 17 vs GB- 2/12 17% 33yds 3int

(lose 26-7)

Week 11- QB rating of 81.4 last time I checked that wasn't bad

Week 12- he played like crap against a very good defense

Week 13- Played like crap against an ok team in a game that didn't have much affect on the season.

Conveniently you left out weeks 14 and 15.

Week 14- NFL Offensive Player of the week.

Week 15- 104.3 QB rating

Week 16- 80.4 rating, again not bad

Week 17-crappy game on New Years Eve and they had the conference locked up.

So he had two pitiful games and another he shouldnt have even been playing in. (Once again led his team to 13 wins)

"he's had 4 years in the league now. lots of time to study since he and Mike Brown seem to have the same injury history. and he still can't crack a QB rating of 80 for a season"

You make my point for me here. So what if he hasnt broken 80, it was his FIRSTfull season after a couple freak injuries. And by he way. If you take out the Green bay game, which he shouldn't have been playing in anyways...he'd have an 80.58 qb rating. Not that that's anything special, I was just curious.

Lastly, you say "3200 yards, 23 touchdowns and 20 interceptions may be enough to get you to the Super Bowl in Chicago, but that's about it. "

Think about what you just said.

Is there much more you can do than go to the superbowl? You think Lovie Smith is going to say, "OK I need a new QB. This one can only get us to the Superbowl. I need some real talent. Is that Jason Campbell available?"

Any more Redskin fans out there wanna put in their 2 cents?"

My reply:

"Not much time. Will reply in full later.

Crunchtime.

Playoffs.

Nobody cares what you do in September.

The whole point was that Rex loses games. That he isn't/won't be as good a QB as Jason Campbell.

I didn't conveniently omit the 2 good games he had in the last 2-1/2 months of the season. I was pointing out his penchant to perform poorly/not help his team win as the season progressed. As defenses adjusted to Chicago (ie- take away the run and win the game). As the weather got progressively worse. Not a great indicator for a CHI QB.

More to come later."

My followup:

"Grossman's first 7 games:

@ Green Bay Win 26-0: defense forces 3int's. 84 yd punt return for TD. 4-14 on 3rd down conversions. G'man 18/26 262 1/1.

vs Detroit Win 34-7: defense forces 3 lost fumbles. G'man 20/27 289yds 4td. opposing QB's averaged a passer rating of 92.3 against DET last season, 2nd worst in the NFL... to WAS:(

(and people wonder why we drafted the best defensive player available-- a safety...)

@ Minnesota Win 19-16: G'man 23/41 278yds 1td 2int against good pass defense. throws GWTD on 37 yd scoring drive (defense forced fumble) . G'man interceptions lead to 10 MIN points (FG, INT return for TD).

vs Seattle Win 37-6: No Sean Alexander... he was the NFL MVP in 2006 and ran against you for 108 yds and 2td's @ CHI in the playoffs... G'man 17/31 232yds 2td. opposing QB's averaged a passer rating of 86.1, 7th worst in NFL. Score 10-7 CHI before defensive INT leads to FG (34yd drive to 2yd line), and defensive INT leads to offensive TD (10yd drive).

vs BUF Win 40-7: defense forced 4 turnovers against 30th ranked offense. average distance of CHI scoring drive was 41 yards. G'man 15/27 182yds 2td.

@ ARI Win 24-23: G'man 14/37 144yds 4int 2 lost fumbles against league's 30th ranked pass defense. team 4/14 on 3rd down conversions. G'man 4/12 47yds 2INT's returned for TD on 3rd downs. CHI wins on 40yd fumble return for TD and 83yd punt return for TD.

vs SF Win 41-10: G'man 23/29 252yds 3td against league's 26th ranked pass defense. CHI defense forces 5 turnovers. avergage scoring drive of 44yds.

Bears record 7-0."

Gary's reply:

"All that that proves to me is that we need the defense to stop causing so many turnovers so that Grossman can get more passing yards to go with his TDs.

But if we must live with such a great defense, we'll have to make due I suppose."

My final post:

"That's some blind homerism if I've ever heard it. I know I can't convince you to see the light on Rex. Maybe they'll have a schedule more difficult than a pee-wee league team in 2007. Let's see what happens then."

[Diesel70ChipOnWhite]

You don't know what you are talking about. Bears fans are disappointed and yes a percentage hate Grossman but most are behind him. I've seen every game he has played

Grossman had more 100+ rating games than any QB in football last year. He has one of the strongest arms in the game and no QB throws the seam route as well as him. For the first 7 weeks of the season the national media was calling him the league MVP. He destroyed the Giants, Seahwaks (twice) and Saints

He did fall apart at the end of the year but the guy has only started about 22 games in his career.

Did you just use Rex Grossman and strongest arm in the game in the same sentence?

:doh:

Sorry chum, but if your going to bring up his 4 games of over 100 ratings, why don't you go ahead and mention the other games too.....

3 @MIN 64.9

6 @ARI 10.2

9 MIA 36.8

12 @NE 23.6

13 MIN 1.3 - HOLY MOSES A F*&**** 1.3 and you are trying to say MVP worthy?

17 GNB 0.0 A Zero, a big fat 0 - goose egg - nilche - nada - nothing - 0.0?

Playoffs

SEA 76.9

NO 73.2

IND 68.3

Before you start saying anything about best seam passer or strongest arm, let the guy have a consistent season, and im sorry but the strongest arm has just got me wanting to barf. Do you know how many underthrown balls Grossman had last year?

[GroundNPound]

It was JC first year as starter, and he did well for his first year.

I just can't beleive the "He led his team to the superbowl" comments. He didn't lead his team there. His defense did. And the bears run game may have only been mediocre... but that's all they needed. Grossman screwed up many more games than he helped. Thats a plain fact.

[Omeletpants]

Did you just use Rex Grossman and strongest arm in the game in the same sentence?

:doh:

Sorry chum, but if your going to bring up his 4 games of over 100 ratings, why don't you go ahead and mention the other games too.....

Actually, Grossman had 7 games with a passing rating of 100+, most in the NFL. Yes, he did fall apart at the end of the year but that's what you get with a QB that has only started 22 games. If I remember correctly, Terry Bradshaw sucked early in his career. And BTW, Grossman does have one of the strongest arms in football and no one throws the seam route like he does. Check out the game tape and scouting reports on that one.

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

grossman sucked, D gave him short fields, and all he threw were bomb passes and dump offs. hes awful, regardless of his lame QB rating.

[Omeletpants]

And the bears run game may have only been mediocre... but that's all they needed.

Another guy that doesn't know what he is talking about. Thomas Jones and Benson combined for 2000 yards rushing last year and the Bear's OL is one of the best run blocking units in football. You'll see that when they play us this year. You'll wish we had a defensive line after that game

[Omeletpants]

grossman sucked, D gave him short fields, and all he threw were bomb passes and dump offs. hes awful, regardless of his lame QB rating.

It was a tale of two seasons for him. After 7 games the national media was calling him the league's MVP. The second half he sucks. No one is saying he is great but he has only started 22 games and has potential. Did you see all the games that Peyton sucked last year, like the Titans game? Manning looked like Mark Brunnell in that one

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

It was a tale of two seasons for him. After 7 games the national media was calling him the league's MVP. The second half he sucks. No one is saying he is great but he has only started 22 games and has potential. Did you see all the games that Peyton sucked last year, like the Titans game? Manning looked like Mark Brunnell in that one

i can honestly say i thought he sucked from week 1. i hate the way he plays. all he did was throw up bombs, and its just really poor QBing. from the first sportscenter highlight reel i saw on him i thought he blew. sure he got away with some of that stuff, and it inflated his numbers, same way mark brunell inflated his numbers by throwing 2 yard dump offs so his completion rating looked great. grossman was incapable of anything other than the deep pass, and when teams took that way, he was AWFUL.

every QB has a bad game or two, grossman had bad months. and when he was bad, he was BAD. i know hes young, but until he learns how to throw over the middle or anything other than hail mary passes, hes going to struggle. that TE they got might help him with some shorter stuff. and hester could turn out to be awesome.

[Diesel70ChipOnWhite]

Actually, Grossman had 7 games with a passing rating of 100+, most in the NFL. Yes, he did fall apart at the end of the year but that's what you get with a QB that has only started 22 games. If I remember correctly, Terry Bradshaw sucked early in his career. And BTW, Grossman does have one of the strongest arms in football and no one throws the seam route like he does. Check out the game tape and scouting reports on that one.

There is no way in hell you could force me to watch game tape of Grossman. You keep bringing up his 7 games of over 100!! Wow, great job Rex, why don't you justify the sub 60's games he had, which is down right embarrasing for an NFL quarterback. By the way there were 5 of those. Comparing Terry Bradshaw to Grossman is just about the most disrespectful thing you could say to Bradshaw. And BTW, here is the latest scouting report on good ol Rex....enjoy....and please stop with your nonsense.

2007 Scouting Report - Scouts Inc.

Grade: 72 | Key

Alert: D

Comment:

Grossman is athletic and has a natural feel for the game. He has good overall mechanics, a quick setup and nice footwork on his drops. He shows a high release and a consistent delivery. He plants, follows through and releases quickly. He is accurate on short and intermediate passes and throws a very catchable ball. He has decent pocket awareness and will move around to avoid pressure. He can dump off to his backs with touch and accuracy. He is competitive and appears to have good leadership qualities. He doesn't shy away from crucial situations. But Grossman's arm strength is just average, and he forces too many throws into tight spots. He has little pro game experience and seems limited in his reads and progressions. Injuries have cost him considerable time, and his durability is a factor. He isn't yet a proven commodity, and his coaching staff seems to protect him with a safe, conservative passing scheme. He winds up throwing a lot of simple routes. If he stays healthy and makes progress, he can be an effective--but not great--NFL starter.

[Omeletpants]

Diesel, you aren't listening. Grossman had some terrible games and cost them the SB, but in 7 games he looked like the best qb in football. My point is the guy has potential to be a very good QB. As i remember Johnny Unitis was cut early in his career, Bradshaw sucked early.

[Omeletpants]

i can honestly say i thought he sucked from week 1.

Come on, at least try to be fair. He was the league MVP for the first half of the season and you say he sucked? He has big issues that need to be fixed but has big upside. You want to throw away a qb after 22 games?