Shawn Springs?

[wit 33]

Your the first one that decided take time out in a day to do so. Hey, it's really no big deal though, I just felt like talking about Shawn Springs. I just wanted to bring my side of the issue up. Do you think we should keep him?

[HateYanksDukeCowboys]

Your the first one that decided take time out in a day to do so. Hey, it's really no big deal though, I just felt like talking about Shawn Springs. I just wanted to bring my side of the issue up. Do you think we should keep him?

which you could have brought up in any one of the other hundred shawn springs threads.

yes, we should keep him.

[Rufus T Firefly]

He's not likely to become less injury prone the older he gets. All the people wondering "Who is the number 1 CB if he's gone?" could just as easily ask "Who is the number 1 CB when he gets hurt?".

He also looked lousy when he did play last year. Nowhere near what he had been in the past and nowhere near being a real #1 CB. Now, some of that was probably his injuries, but some was natural aging (he didn't look as good in 05 as 04, either, though it wasn't nearly as dramatic a drop).

There aren't many 32 year old CBs who stay at an elite level. And Springs' body is realistically older than the average 32 year old with all the injuries it's sustained.

To consider him the #1 CB you have to assume the following:

1. He'll be healthy enough to stay on the field for most of the season.

2. A large majority of the drop-off last year was due to those injuries.

3. No other injuries willl cause a similar drop-off next year.

4. Natural aging won't cause him to drop-off to that level anyway.

Really, if one of those 4 doesn't hold up then he is a real expensive nickel CB, at best.

Measure that vs. making a large chunk of salary cap room in the future and potentially getting a decent draft choice for him. If Detroit was offering their 3rd (as was rumored), that is beyond a no-brainer, imo.

[Chick_in_B&G]

I hope we keep him considering we've made no serious moves to replace him. There's no way I feel comfortable with Carlos and Smoot as the starting duo.

[McD5]

Shawn Springs is the bomb, and he is the single most important player on our entire defense. The second he went down last year--our season was over.

Forget the Clinton Portis injury being important--Betts stepped in and ran for a higher ypc than Portis ever has as a Redskin.

But when Springs went down, our defense was dead. Carlos"I can't catch" Rogers was a complete embarrassment. It even made Taylor look bad because he had no decent help on the field.

If you really want Carlos"I can't catch" Rogers and Fred"Shake what your momma gave you" Smoot to run the show....then trade him. That would be the end of the Skins season again.

Could you imagine Carlos Rogers trying to cover CJ? LMAO.

:logo:

[TotalRecall]

if rogers plays nickel for a year, our coaching staff is retarded, and ill be very mad. hes a good CB, we saw that in 05. dont blame him for our dline sucking. if you wanna relegate somebody to backup duty, pick any of the 3 DLmen we have other than carter.

GET REAL!!! Rogers has sucked since he got drafted! Not only is he bad, but he doesn't even try hard. He gives up on a lot of plays. No way should he be a starter!

I'd be at work discussing the redskins with coworkers who watch NFL football or college football. Out of the blue, they will always say, "I don't know who he is, but that #22 is awful." This is from people who only see this guy every now-and-then. In 2005, I would say he's a rookie, but yeah he sucks. Last season, all I can say is he sucks and a waste of a 1st round draft pick.

[shagman]

lol at him being a top 10 corner. he isnt even top 20. weve done this before, the guy has had 2 INTERCEPTIONS the past 2 years. thats less than rogers, who 85% of you think is awful. springs isnt that great, hes solid WHEN hes healthy, which is never. some of you are insane. the guy hasnt played a full season in 6 years, and you guys all think hes a top 10 cb. most football fans dont even know who he is.

My thoughts exactly! The voice of reasoning on the situation. Im 99.9% sure that Fred Smoot will be our #1 CB by September. Youth over dilapidation for 2007. Sorry to be harsh SS but what have you done lately?

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

rogers is good. no one complained about him in 05 when we were getting pressure on the QB. the guy had like 6 dropped INTs, he just needs to learn how to catch. hes always around the ball, whcih is incredible considering how poor our dline and LB corp was last year. if he had held on to half of those we'd be singing a different tune.

and so many people just remember him dropping the pic in the SEA game. newsflash, get over it. he was a rookie who hadnt even played all season, so much pressure to be in a playoff game and he made a mistake. lets all get over it, the seahawks were better than us that year anyways.

rogers will be awesome, we need a dline. if he stil sucks when were getting pressure, ill eat my words, but hes too talented to suck with a real front 7 playing in front of him.

and yanksdukecowboys, ive been in this thread. and hes a 32 year old injury machine. he could be a 29 year old injury machine for all i care, dude hasnt played a full season in 6 years. explain that.

[McD5]

Carlos Rogers had 3? interceptions in 4 years of college football. 3 interceptions! People act like they are surprised that he can't catch. He could NEVER catch. Add that to his love of playing 10 yards off the receiver, especially on 3rd and 3s, and you have a disaster. If he is so fast....why not employ the bump and run?? Afraid of contact maybe?

The only reason people defend him is because he is a beloved Redskin. Put another teams' jersey on him, and you would say he sucks hard. You would also want the Redskins to throw the ball at him whenever possible--without fear of interception.

Is anyone on earth stupid enough to believe that teams are contacting us to try to trade for Rogers? Reality check--they aren't.

If he is were even decent, why would teams be more interested in Springs, who has maybe 2 expensive years left, rather than Rogers who is 10 years younger? It isn't brain surgery--he sucks beyond belief.

:logo:

[Hamilbone13]

Trade Sean Springs and next years 3rd round pick for Kris Jenkins!! Then draft Landry at #6!!!! Smoot and Rogers at DB will work out fine (besides, it will probably be that way once Springs gets injured...as usual).

[IWANTOBEGM]

7.5 mil cap for a guy who played half the games last year......if healthy nice, but he needs to take a pay cut

[Rufus T Firefly]

Just for the record, using INT numbers as some kind of be-all, end-all measure of how good a CB is, is just preposterous.

[shagman]

Carlos Rogers had 3? interceptions in 4 years of college football. 3 interceptions! People act like they are surprised that he can't catch. He could NEVER catch. Add that to his love of playing 10 yards off the receiver, especially on 3rd and 3s, and you have a disaster. If he is so fast....why not employ the bump and run?? Afraid of contact maybe?

The only reason people defend him is because he is a beloved Redskin. Put another teams' jersey on him, and you would say he sucks hard. You would also want the Redskins to throw the ball at him whenever possible--without fear of interception.

:logo:

Believe there were plenty of games that I thought he sucked as well, but with some work on catching, and confidence like he had against Steve Smith, the guy could be very good.

You could say the same for (place 2006 D player here) nobody played well last year. Not even Shawn Springs or Sean Taylor for that matter.

[Smoot Point Really]

For those who think Springs isn't worth the $7M cap-hit... Think of the following:

1) If we don't have Springs, Macklin is our nickle instead of our dime. Jimoh is our dime.

2) If Rogers or Smoot gets injured, Macklin has to start (which isn't as bad as Kenny Wright, but it's not ideal)

3) If we trade for Asante Samuel, we give up the #6 and have to pay Samuel at minimum $5M for this year (at least $3M would be his cap-friendly bonus).

Although Springs costs $7M on the cap, we seem to be able to afford that number right now.

Some of you asked "What have you done for me lately?" Well? When he did go down with injury, we sucked... When Springs is at CB, we're a top 10 defense... When Springs is injured, we're near the bottom. We give up more big pass plays than any other team.

[SkinsManNJ]

Just for the record, using INT numbers as some kind of be-all, end-all measure of how good a CB is, is just preposterous.

Agreed. 100%. A good CB (Darrel Green) can't be measured just by INT's how about how many times he has the ball thrown to his side, how many batted passes, and how many catches giving up when the ball is thrown to their side.

Imagine how many INT's D.G. would have if they threw the ball to his as much as they throw to Asante or even Champ.

By the way put Darrel in the H.O.F. this year right along side of Art Monk. They need to be put in this upcoming year. This is B.S. how can they deny either one of them.

[chaz13]

7.5 mil cap for a guy who played half the games last year......if healthy nice, but he needs to take a pay cut

What does it matter what he gets paid this year if we are done adding FA and don't need the money for other players? To save Snyder money? It makes no sense. If it was before FA started and we needed money to sign players then it would make sense. But FA is pretty much over and we don't need to free up any more money, so it doesn't matter what Springs makes this year.

[Bleed Burgandy and Gold]

i have no problem at all with rogers as our #1. hes young, fast, gets near the ball enough to make plays (he drops enough of them haha), and he hits extremely hard for a guy his size. great in run support as well, which is what williams likes. but none of this matters without a pass rush. we could have champ bailey and deon sanders with our dline and theyd look awful. when quarterbacks have 4 minutes to throw the ball, someone IS going to get open. now, if the quarterback has 3 seconds to throw the ball, rogers and smoot can make plays on the ball. besides, springs is brittle, isnt good in run support, will miss 6 games probably with god knows what injuries (i cant wait for the headline "shawn springs battles attack from killer bees, will miss 3-4 weeks") and hes overpaid and underproductive.

guys. 2 picks in 2 years. 2 picks in 2 years. think about that.

Um I wouldnt go as far as to saying that we wouldn't be any better with champ bailey. Denver ranks in the bottom half of the league for sacks a year, and they lack pressure yet they always have a pretty good defense. Why is this? Because they have a great secondary, and solid line backers. We get rid of springs this year, and we aren't nearly as good as we would be. Is he worth the money we are paying him? Absolutely not. Are we better off with him? Absolutely.

[Bleed Burgandy and Gold]

What does it matter what he gets paid this year if we are done adding FA and don't need the money for other players? To save Snyder money? It makes no sense. If it was before FA started and we needed money to sign players then it would make sense. But FA is pretty much over and we don't need to free up any more money, so it doesn't matter what Springs makes this year.

:applause: Exactly. I could care less about our cap situation because free agency is over, and you know we will still some how have money to sign our top picks. Stop worrying about what we pay our players. We overpay for almost everyone.

[hellonothing86]

I agreee with all the people that want him to stay... I think it would be a mistake to let one of the best DB's in the game go. He is a great player when on the field. Skins should not let their players go... I think that the skins are set with CB. The only position that needs to be addressed somewhere in the draft is "S" I would be OK with Laundry at 6, but I don't like picking that position when the d-line isn't even able to hold it's own. I would also like the skins to sign another S b/c Arch is gone

[HateYanksDukeCowboys]

and yanksdukecowboys, ive been in this thread. and hes a 32 year old injury machine. he could be a 29 year old injury machine for all i care, dude hasnt played a full season in 6 years. explain that.

ok, for starters, i'm glad you're finally onboard with the fact that he's 32, not 33. secondly, he played 15 games two seasons in a row. by my standards, that's a full season (yes, i realize the schedule calls for 16).

finally, when i posted my first comment i hadn't read all the way through and saw that you indeed, had joined the discussion. Once i saw that springs was the discussion topic though, i could've bet the farm that you'd be involved.

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

Um I wouldnt go as far as to saying that we wouldn't be any better with champ bailey. Denver ranks in the bottom half of the league for sacks a year, and they lack pressure yet they always have a pretty good defense. Why is this? Because they have a great secondary, and solid line backers. We get rid of springs this year, and we aren't nearly as good as we would be. Is he worth the money we are paying him? Absolutely not. Are we better off with him? Absolutely.

theyre 21st in pass defense with the best CB in the league. doesnt that tell you something? bailey is just good enough man up to make sweet plays on the ball, theres no one else like him in the league. but still, regardless of him, theyre still bad against the pass. think of how theyd be if they had a good pass rush??

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

ok, for starters, i'm glad you're finally onboard with the fact that he's 32, not 33. secondly, he played 15 games two seasons in a row. by my standards, that's a full season (yes, i realize the schedule calls for 16).

finally, when i posted my first comment i hadn't read all the way through and saw that you indeed, had joined the discussion. Once i saw that springs was the discussion topic though, i could've bet the farm that you'd be involved.

haha glad to hear it. still, when youre missing a game a season, that means youre not 100% for a good portion of it. even when guys play a full season, theyre not 100% (see daniels and griffin) and thats just as bad as missing a few games. springs needs to go.

[Rufus T Firefly]

theyre 21st in pass defense with the best CB in the league. doesnt that tell you something? bailey is just good enough man up to make sweet plays on the ball, theres no one else like him in the league. but still, regardless of him, theyre still bad against the pass. think of how theyd be if they had a good pass rush??

That's if you judge pass D on total yards, which is foolish.

Using Passer rating against, they were 9th in the NFL last year and 4th the year before. That's while finishing 15th in sacks last year and tied for 28th the year before. And with the slow John Lynch and a couple of mediocre CBs to go with Bailey.

Chmp has actually raised the level of their pass D quite a bit by himself.

[pjfootballer]

I don't think he is worth the 7 million cap hit, but he is the best we have and I'd cringe if we actually cut him. I say pay him the 7 million this year and give him an ulitmatum in March of next year. If he doesn't restructure, cut him.

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

That's if you judge pass D on total yards, which is foolish.

Using Passer rating against, they were 9th in the NFL last year and 4th the year before. That's while finishing 15th in sacks last year and tied for 28th the year before. And with the slow John Lynch and a couple of mediocre CBs to go with Bailey.

Chmp has actually raised the level of their pass D quite a bit by himself.

wow, so champ made them not the 25th passing d in the nfl. haha, hillarious. the point is, they still gave up more yards in the air than 20 other teams. passing rating is the worst stat ever. mark brunell had a great one, and he was beyond awful. david carr had a great passer rating too, and he was extremely ineffective.