Pass Coverage Vs. Defensive Line Pressure

[Ernie5]

DL is what the skins need, although the question is whether or not the player they draft will start.

This picks up another threat: if none of the DL guys available at #6 are worthy, then picking someone like Landry might be the better option anyway.

[jamesbondman]

Sure are a lot of experts on here. But the fact remains that when there is no pressure on the QB, receivers will catch the ball all day. I have no idea why some of you do not have an understanding of a concept that is so simple.

Walt Harris became an outstanding corner with the 49ers. He sucked with the Redskins.

Why is this? Because the 49ers have a better pass rush, NOT because Walt Harris finally learned to play cornerback.

Wake up guys. The concept is very simple. Draft pass rushers and your cornerbacks suddenly take on pro bowl status and look very good.

[GamaGoliath]

No, we don't need to build the defeses by adding more d-backs. The saying is true. Games are won in the trenches, and last year our d-line got their asses kicked all over the field. Guys, you can't give opposing quaterbacks 5 or more seconds to complete passes. An average qb will pick you apart with that kind of time, no matter the quality of your d-backs. I'm also opposed to getting an end because any qb with half decent pocket presense will merely step up in the pocket (just like last year) and make the throw. How close was Carter to sacking qbs last season? Many times, he was a split second too late. We need someone with the ability to collapse the pocket, make the qb retreat a little to give our ends a better opportunity to get their hands on them. Carter's sack numbers would have been better last year if we could have gotten a consistant push up the middle.

[Ernie5]

Our cornerbacks were all-pro calibre in 2005 and our pass rush was not scaring anyone. And Walt Harris did not become an outstanding corner; he had some nice stats, but he doesn't influence any QB to avoid his side of the field.

[Skin Patrol]

Perfect, totally agree with this. All of our pressure usually came from blitzes under GW's system. With that gone we saw how much it was covering the D-line, we need work there.

Quantifying that point:

2006: of our 19 sacks, 13 came from Defensive Linemen. Or about 70% of them.

2005: of our 35 sacks, 16 came from Defensive Linemen. Or about 45% of them.

2004: of our 40 sacks, 20 came from Defensive Linemen. Or 50% of them.

Defensive Line pressure has remained fairly consistent. What was missing in 2006 that we had in 2005 and 2004 were blitz produced sacks from Linebackers and the Secondary.

From the Linebackers:

2006: 5 sacks

2005: 11.5

2004: 11

From the secondary:

2006: 1

2005: 4.5

2004: 9

The steady decline in sacks from all levels of the defense is troubling for a number of reasons. Anyone who thinks our front four will magically get more sacks in 2007 than they did in 2006 is dreaming, as that number has been on steady decline throughout Gregg Williams tenure as D-Coord (incidentally, the Redskins overall defense has been on steady decline in that same period). I hope that Coach Williams returns to his blitz packages in 2007.

[gkekoa]

I agree to an extent and said that the whole time. We still needed to blitz to get pressure. We didn't blitz because we could not cover anybody. We have added Smoot to sure up our nickel and Macklin for quality depth. Springs is also healthy again. I harped about this all last year. Noone can do without their #1 CB except NE (can't figure that one out). It just creates to many mismatches.

As for our DEs, they are solid but could use some youth. Considering this is the only spot on our line with no youth, expect to draft one in the first round. AC played reasonably well all year even though his early stats did not show it. Against NY he almost got to Eli 5 times but Eli released the ball on his second step. Daniels is still productive and Wynn needs to be cut or take a huge pay cut.

Tackles are good when healthy. Hopefully we found our diamond with Golston but only time will truly tell. Montgomery can still be productive with his size.

To answer an earlier reply about NGATA, he is good but don't give him to much credit for Baltimore's turnaround. The turnaround can be given to the return of Ray Ray and Reed. They both suffered injuries two years ago.

[Audible_Red40]

Well as the old saying goes....six of one, a half dozen of the other.

I understand the descussion here, and I don't know what side of the fence I am on.

We were just flat out awful last year on defense. We can go and look at stats to make all of our points to back up our opinions. Some stats just aren't recorded or pointed out that are basically the game within the game.

Whether we go DL or DB in the draft is fine. We just have to EXECUTE!!

The Saints game was by far the most impressive defensive game of the year, of course in my opinion. Our major downfall last year was missed tackles, defensive stops on 3rd and long and on a lesser note pass interference against.

No one player will fix all the mental mistakes. You can get all the pressure you want, but if they don't get to the QB on every play, it ain't gonna fix the missed tackles.

You can get all the best cover DB's you want, but it ain't gonna fix the missed tackles.

Regardless of who we take in the draft, sign as a free agent or trade for, we just have to execute better on defense.

What ever the FO does, I have faith we will get back to form with the players we have on the field.

HTTR

[Morneblade]

I know most everyone on this board states that our Defense sucked last year because of the Defensive Line. I would argue this looks like a result of a bad secondary.

Our Defense in 2005 was ranked top 10 as was the year before, yet we had basically the same Defensive Line, with a big upgrade from Andre Carter. So, what changed? Our Secondary. We lost Springs for most of the season, and we lost a veteran Safety, as well as a new Safeties Coach. We noticed a drop in the production of Sean Taylor, which also impacted our Secondary (I would argue this could have been because of or new Safeties Coach). So, if the Secondary is what changed and our Defense dropped in ranking, it would say to me that is what Greg Williams relies on most in his Defense. That being said, I would argue it is having a great Secondary that allows a Greg Williams Defense to really pressure the Quarterback by sending a Safety or Linebackers on the blitz.

Having a great Defensive Lineman would be great, but I don't see it as our Defense will crumble if we do not draft a Defensive Lineman in the draft.

What do you all think? Oh, yes I know I am an idiot, so we can dispense with having to point that out and have a good discussion.

HTTR

I disagree, but I dont think you're an idiot.

You bring up some good points. However, we have upgraded our depth at CB (a real weakness last year). I dont like the fact that I think our Safety Coach seems to be a idiot though, wich he had gone the way of Lindsey. HOwever On the the D-Line.

It's been very ineffective in producing a pass rush since Williams took over. Even when we were getting alot of sacks, most of those were from blitzes. And we blitzed because we couldnt get pressure any other way. Our Line has gotten very old in general. Daniels is 34 and outside of 1 game in 05 has yet to do much rushing the passer. Joe was out of football before Gibbs picked him off the street, and his best years are behind him, not to mention he is getting injured much more frequently. Griff is getting old but is still a good player when he is healthy, which unfortunately is rare. Golston should be playing in Griffs position (both are 1 gap DTs) and Monty doesnt look to be any good. Carter should be have a good season next year, but could have a great one if he got some help.

Then there is the 27th agianst the run part. alot of that has to do with the D-line not being healthy much, and the declining play of the older players.

So yeah, we need alot of help there. In a perfect world, new starters at DE and DT to go with Griff/Golston and Carter.

[Darth Tater]

In 2004 and 2005, we faced lesser offenses. We also suffered no long-term debilitating injuries. These were the primary reasons for our problems last year. Also, don't forget that we're now 3 years on, some of those guys are getting a little long in the tooth.

Can't help who you play, so there's not much you can do about the first problem. We need to figure out how best to increase our depth and where we could most easily risk being light (something 31 other teams have to deal with). We need to think about getting young guys who can start and be relied on to play more games near 100%.

[JMUGator19]

i just want to point out a few things...

first, no kidding more pressure sacks and interceptions is going to lead to more wins.

no one needs to be told that

HOWEVER

i just dont understand why the pressure has to come from the DL...

a good D will do several things

A make the QB make a decision FAST

B make the QB lose his tempo/rhythm

C NOT LET THE QB KNOW WHERE THE PRESSURE IS COMING FROM

D use C to achieve A and B

E sometimes trick the QB into thinking there is pressure when there isnt and vice versa

Greg Williams is a mastermind of this. period. i dont care if he had one bad season that was, by the way, plagued by injuries in an already mediocre defensive roster.

Greg Williams LOVES blitzing with corners and LBs and Safeties and if he could referees...

Carter is a pass rusher.

Griffin is possibly the best DT in the division, and definitely top DT in the conference.

Daniels and griffin are getting old, but when healthy hold up their own.

Golston and Montgomery are hopefully going to pick up where Big Sal is leaving off.

NOT all defenses HAVE to have a big DT whos a NT... if for some reason you end up with 4 smaller quicker DTs then you can run a 1 gap defense... WHATEVER, NT are nice, but not necessary to have a good defense. look at the colts... they run a 1 gap D... talk about cover 2 defenses that work... PS before you blow some steam about how the Colts run D sucked and maybe thats why look at the playoffs and read this article http://www.colts.com/sub.cfm?page=article7&news_id=4093 where dungy explicitly states that it was b/c they were just lacking discipline.

soo the point of this overly long rant/interesting points i thought people should know... is that frankly DL problems is age which needs to be rejuvenated and was in last years draft, but the bigger issue is actually the secondary depth.

PP is awesome but hes no god... at the very least decent depth behind your SS is probably necessary... the skins just got back Stoutmire, and has V. Fox.. they are decent backups nothing to drool about neither that young... i understand there is Reed Doughty but who knows how good hes going to turn out to be. (i feel hes a bit slow and rigid) and who is the backup behind ST? honestly i feel the most important position in a Greg Williams scheme is his Safeties... a backup behind ST is in order. (i vote Laron Landry)

Next is the corners... last season the skins had Springs, hurt that is, Rogers, who i believe is pretty good, and Ade Jimoh, Special Teams Ace. Am i forgetting anyone? if i am, thats how good they were. how do you play well with 1 starting quality CB? remember springs was hurt and not playing. ps don't forget that CR broke his hand, makes it hard to catch doesn't it? sounds bad but i don't think you can play well with a broken hand, even if it was soccer.

then there is the LBs, dont really have much to say there, i think LF is gonna set that straight.

[MRMADD]

Quantifying that point:

2006: of our 19 sacks, 13 came from Defensive Linemen. Or about 70% of them.

2005: of our 35 sacks, 16 came from Defensive Linemen. Or about 45% of them.

2004: of our 40 sacks, 20 came from Defensive Linemen. Or 50% of them.

Defensive Line pressure has remained fairly consistent. .

That's not consistent. We've seen a 35% reduction in sacks from the defensive line in 3 years -- and that's with the addition of Carter. That's a huge drop-off.

[GamaGoliath]

i just want to point out a few things...

first, no kidding more pressure sacks and interceptions is going to lead to more wins.

no one needs to be told that

HOWEVER

i just dont understand why the pressure has to come from the DL...

Are you serious? The pressure doesn't HAVE to come from the d-line, but if when it does, it give the defense a lot more options. You don't have to over commit other players to the blitz in order to create pressure. In those situations, you create a do or die scenario. If your blitz doesn't get through, then you open yourself to getting burned BADLY. Or if you don't commit to the blitz and drop everyone back into coverage, then you have situations were the opposing qb has all day long to connect. We just saw this happen last year. Do you really feel like seeing this again? I know I don't. Getting pressure from the d-line helps to make the defense better over all. I don't know why some people don't recognize this.

[Skin Patrol]

That's not consistent. We've seen a 35% reduction in sacks from the defensive line in 3 years -- and that's with the addition of Carter. That's a huge drop-off.

You are correct about this. I don't know what was happening while I typed that, but I was thinking "consistent decline".

[Pedro]

No, we don't need to build the defeses by adding more d-backs. The saying is true. Games are won in the trenches, and last year our d-line got their asses kicked all over the field. Guys, you can't give opposing quaterbacks 5 or more seconds to complete passes. An average qb will pick you apart with that kind of time, no matter the quality of your d-backs. I'm also opposed to getting an end because any qb with half decent pocket presense will merely step up in the pocket (just like last year) and make the throw. How close was Carter to sacking qbs last season? Many times, he was a split second too late. We need someone with the ability to collapse the pocket, make the qb retreat a little to give our ends a better opportunity to get their hands on them. Carter's sack numbers would have been better last year if we could have gotten a consistant push up the middle.

Bingo!!!

Add a run stuffing 2 gap and Carter will be more productive. On a personal note as a player v player I would like Anderson. How can you not like anyone who converts from WR and has a breakout in his second season - however we need a 2 gap DT anyway, and a good (even if not great) one will make our LBs better against the run AND help Andre do what he does best. Trade down if we can but not too far that we miss him.

Nice to see people from 'different' 'skins camps are uniting. Must say something to many different people - namely let's allow a GW D to do what it does when it works best. Stop the run, create third and longer than they know they can run so we can blitz from position x.