Murilo Bustamante Posted September 27, 2002 Share Posted September 27, 2002 IMO, one thing the Skins' management needs to be concentrating on is making sure the NFL stops calling games against us in such a biased fashion. For years, we always got "ref breaks" against the Cards and Eagles, and then were shafted against the Midgets and Cryboys. But JKC would keep the pressure on the refs (even getting one ref banned from any Skins-Cryboys games in the early 80s) and so did CC and Gibbs. In fact, CC and Gibbs pushed instant replay so hard *because* of problems the Skins traditionally had with refs. But for our owner to make that case in the NFL's back rooms, he needs to have a two-pronged strategy- 1) be respected like JKC. Be a team player. As funny as the swipes against Modell are- DON'T DO THAT. It's NOT classy and it doesn't win you any friends. Try to come up with money-makings schemes for the whole NFL, not just the Skins. And show how much revenue the Skins generate for the NFL. This is the "speak softly"part. 2) make it clear, without overtly threatening, that if speaking softly doesn't work, you will carry a big stick. Be ready for NFL exposes in US News (courtesy of Mr. Drasner) and have lawyers locked and loaded on the sidelines. I hate lawyers, but if the NFL is going to stick it in our face every week, we need to stick it back. Of course, Marty last year could beat the refs, as in the victory over the Midgets, when the refs gave phantom TDs on non-existent interference to the Midgets, and Marty still beat 'em. And the 2000 Ravens were the league's heels and still beat everyone up so badly that they won the Super Bowl. But when a game is close, the calls do make a difference, especially when they seem designed to derail anything good we get started. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Diesel Posted September 27, 2002 Share Posted September 27, 2002 Do you really think there's a conspiracy against the Redskins? I don't. I think we were just on the receiving end of some bad calls. With the level of officiating being where it is in the NFL right now, we are certainly not alone there either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@DCGoldPants Posted September 27, 2002 Share Posted September 27, 2002 I don't think its just against us. I think in ever game, there is on team that gets away with murder. Sometimes it's us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted September 27, 2002 Share Posted September 27, 2002 It's pretty over the top to say we are the target of poor calls against us. I don't believe that is the case. I was surprised in the Niners game to see that NFL refs don't do what NBA refs do though when the know they made bad calls. They have make up calls that are equally bad. That whole punt fiasco should have given us a handful of calls later in the game in an attempt to make up for just how bad that was. But, it didn't. We have had a surprising number of bad calls against us this year. But, I don't believe it's targeted against us. Clearly the officials aren't calling it both ways, but, I think you'll start seeing that even up some over time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murilo Bustamante Posted September 27, 2002 Author Share Posted September 27, 2002 I hope you're right. In general, though, I have noticed over the years that we get shafted against the NFL's darlings (the Midgets and Cryboys especially, but also the Whiners and the Squealers) and then we get advantages against smaller markets (like Arizona). If it works that way, we may get a few calls for us in Tennessee, "Wycheckian geometry" notwithstanding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rdsknbill Posted September 27, 2002 Share Posted September 27, 2002 Do you folks remember Red Cashin? There was a class NFL Ref. Remember his trademark "FIRST DOOOOOOOWWWNNN!" :notworthy: Those were the days when Refs were respected. Yes, they made the rare bad call, but no where near the frequency they are cropping up in the game today. Guys like Red and Jerry Siemen got it right. :thumbsup: Siemen was the Exec in charge of the refs after leaving the field. I think that he had retired, and this may be one of many reasons for the lack of quality officiating recently. I'm not one to buy into this conspiracy theory BUT, isn't Jerruh Jones on the competition comittee that oversee the refs. Isn't he one of the guys that decides who stays and who goes? :doh: Gives one something to think about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NVskinsfan Posted September 27, 2002 Share Posted September 27, 2002 No conspiracy, but just bad calls in period! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awesome Posted September 27, 2002 Share Posted September 27, 2002 The non interference call was f*cking absurd! The guy was two inches in front of Green after he signaled the fair catch. And replays showed that Smoot never touched him. In my mind, that was one of the most botched calls I have ever seen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowghost Posted September 27, 2002 Share Posted September 27, 2002 The punt fiasco was one thing. I think the biggest no calls were the blocks in the back, there were several. Either our guys had their jerseys on backwards or the refs just had a blind eye towards those plays. Oh well we just need to find ways to win. HTTR Lowghost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murilo Bustamante Posted September 27, 2002 Author Share Posted September 27, 2002 I also thought it odd that more than once, flags flew on offensive plays of ours, and then suddenly there was "no foul" when the play didn't work anyway. Then later in the game, Davis ripped off a big run, flags flew early again, and this time it was the phantom holding against Loverne, and it wasn't retracted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MRMADD Posted September 27, 2002 Share Posted September 27, 2002 Kinda interesting... Tagliabue was in attendance at the 49ers game. The refs looked real tentative, and made calls that they knew they could review. They also made some awful calls, but it's incredibly whiny to blame any losses on the refs. Those calls didn't come CLOSE to determining the outcome of the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phanatic Posted September 27, 2002 Share Posted September 27, 2002 Ok, the eagles were the recipient of some very bad calls in their first game against the Titans. Twice in their(titans) game winning drive they had a clear delay of game penalty that was never called. When the media asked reid if he would write the NFL his response was: no, theywill see the mistakes and we needed to play better in that second half to win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brave Posted September 27, 2002 Share Posted September 27, 2002 The calls against us don't mean sh!t to me. Not saying they don't exist ... but they have yet to cost us a game. When the Redskins play well they usually win. When they don't they usually lose. It is as simple as that. When the day comes that Washington soundly outplays another team and loses the game because of bad calls I'll start whining too. Until then I'll be much more interested in the quality of their play rather than the quality of the officiating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedStick Posted September 28, 2002 Share Posted September 28, 2002 I agree with Lowghost . i saw many block in the back that were not called. You also saw those same illegal blocks on film during ESPN breakdown of the game. No one ever memtioned it. It happened several times. Yes, I agree we need to score many more points in order to get past that point of questioning calls. Let's rally up and get those points... allah damn it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrangeSkin Posted September 28, 2002 Share Posted September 28, 2002 Instant replay has kind of screwed up officiating. They just sort of stand around and talk after a controversial play, sometimes make a feeble call, and just wait for a coach to throw the red flag. Not that I'm against instant replay, it's great. It's just some of the rules concering it are dumb, like if a ref sees something in the replay that he didn't call but wasn't challenged, then he can't fix the play accordingly. But you know who has a real case for a conspiracy...The Raiduhs. The NFL hates Davis' guts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StuckinIA Posted September 28, 2002 Share Posted September 28, 2002 As a fan, I have always felt every call goes against the Skins:D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCS Posted September 28, 2002 Share Posted September 28, 2002 You mean they don't? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GatorEye Posted September 28, 2002 Share Posted September 28, 2002 The best way to beat poor officiating is to be far enough ahead that one bonehead call (like the punt fumble/interference) won't cost you the game. Maybe Snyder needs to make a large donation to the referee's retirement fund. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rtandler Posted September 28, 2002 Share Posted September 28, 2002 Good point, GatorEye. If you're kicking ***, the zebras don't come into play. While there was a blatent push in the back against Wilkenson on Owens' TD run, the bad calls went both ways. Mariucci had to burn both of his second-half challenges on blatently bad calls. Once it was (incorrectly) determined that J. Green wasn't interfered with on the punt return, there was no doubt that the ball bounced off of Green. And the Bailey "interception" was clearly, obviously trapped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OaktonSkins/BushFan Posted September 28, 2002 Share Posted September 28, 2002 Originally posted by Brave The calls against us don't mean sh!t to me. Not saying they don't exist ... but they have yet to cost us a game. When the Redskins play well they usually win. When they don't they usually lose. It is as simple as that. When the day comes that Washington soundly outplays another team and loses the game because of bad calls I'll start whining too. Until then I'll be much more interested in the quality of their play rather than the quality of the officiating. Bringing attention to a problem such as this that shows no signs of abating and seemingly is growing every week is not an attempt to make excuses for the way our team is performing. That's just simply not the point of this discussion which I have previously raised in another thread. Whether it's due to incompetence, apathy, bias or a combination thereof, the problem must be rectified. It's shameful for the NFL and reflects poorly on a league that is supposed to be representative of a top flight professional sports league. :puke: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rtandler Posted September 28, 2002 Share Posted September 28, 2002 Originally posted by OrangeSkin It's just some of the rules concering it are dumb, like if a ref sees something in the replay that he didn't call but wasn't challenged, then he can't fix the play accordingly. I don't think that's correct. Remember in the Denver game last year when a Bronco back caught a pass, fumbled almost immediately and Bailey recovered near the sideline? The call was that Bailey recovered the fumble out of bounds. Marty challenged, saying the recovery was inbounds. After further review, the ref determined that the pass was incomplete to begin with, so the recovery was a moot point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brave Posted September 28, 2002 Share Posted September 28, 2002 Bringing attention to a problem such as this that shows no signs of abating and seemingly is growing every week is not an attempt to make excuses for the way our team is performing. That's just simply not the point of this discussion which I have previously raised in another thread. Your previous thread was about poor officiating in general, Oakton. Not a bad thread even if I didn't agree with all of it. A lot of THIS thread has been about perceived injustices against the Redskins in particular. Conspiracy theories if you will. Sorry, but it comes off as a lot of whining to me. And I will NEVER whine about officiating as long as the Skins play ball the way they've played the last two weeks. That's my only point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted September 28, 2002 Share Posted September 28, 2002 RT, Let me just say that on that punt return, it might have been possible that the officials knew the ball hit Green and were hoping to give the make up call right there. Of course, that's not real likely. What I am interested in though is that a muffed punt, I thought, had the same rules as a fumble. The officials ruling on the field was there was no fumble and the play was dead. When they ruled that the Redskins couldn't have known to go for the ball. I'm not sure that play is supposed to be up for review, but I could well have the incorrect impression there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurman Posted September 28, 2002 Share Posted September 28, 2002 Art, I am going to guess that the difference might be the fact that a ball rolling on the ground after a player is ruled down is a dead ball and technically the play cannot continue forward thus there is nothing to review. But a punted ball - touched or not by the punt returning team - is always a live ball until downed. Of course I am guessing and have no knowledge of the exact rules to back this up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted September 28, 2002 Share Posted September 28, 2002 Could well be Lurman. I know the muff rules are slightly different, but, I likewise have no real knowledge to back up the thought here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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