herrmag Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 people believe what they want, and get upset when something is brought up that dispells their beliefs. Brilliant post, thanks for the insight. To whom this is directed, I can only assume, but who exactly is upset? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
318 SKIN Posted August 22, 2005 Author Share Posted August 22, 2005 people believe what they want, and get upset when something is brought up that dispells their beliefs. Herrmag if you find out please let me know... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbooma Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 :doh: every QB throws int..... the point is Ramsey is making progressbut hey lets give up on him... so he can go somewhere else to blossom.... like Trent Green, Kerry Collins, Rich Gannon, Jim Plunkett, Sonny Jurgenson, Kurt Warner, Jake Delhomme, Flutie.... and many others Bubba you do remember the last QB that made mistakes under Gibbs yet showed promise right?? He was shipped off to LA. The point is unlike the other QB's and their coaches our coach HATES TO's if Ramsey keeps making mistakes he won't be here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sith lord Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 There probably was very little being seen in Aikman's early years, and even Peyton Manning's early years, to tell anyone that either would stop making interceptions...but what people focused on was the positives both DID show along with those mistakes. That's what pointed to a promising career in the NFL, not the absence of mistakes. The difference between Ramsey and Aikman/Manning is that those guys were top notch, bluechip QB's coming into the NFL. You had a good idea that they had the talent to suceed. If memory serves me right, Ramsey wasn't even Spurrier's first choice for a QB. Gibbs comes along and his first order of buisness is getting Brunnell. Then the next year, he drafts a QB in the first round. What does that tell you? Lets get this straight, "WE ALL WANT RAMSEY TO SUCCEED", but this is his make or break year and the excuses need to stop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubba9497 Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 Brilliant post, thanks for the insight. To whom this is directed, I can only assume, but who exactly is upset? check your ego, it was a general overall observation on both sides of the great Ramsey debate..... when the doubters bring up a point the faithful scouff, and vice versa 2/3 rds of these threads are just denial on both sides....while having a pissing match :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herrmag Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 check your ego, it was a general overall observation on both sides of the great Ramsey debate.....when the doubters bring up a point the faithful scouff, and vice versa 2/3 rds of these threads are just denial on both sides....while having a pissing match :laugh: Point taken. And to think, I usually stay out of the political threads for this exact reason, yet here I am instigating. I need a good flogging Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
318 SKIN Posted August 22, 2005 Author Share Posted August 22, 2005 check your ego, it was a general overall observation on both sides of the great Ramsey debate.....when the doubters bring up a point the faithful scouff, and vice versa 2/3 rds of these threads are just denial on both sides....while having a pissing match :laugh: OK, sorry about that, just misunderstund your msg. Ego is checked..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flave1969 Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 people believe what they want, and get upset when something is brought up that dispells their beliefs. The only thing that will dispell my beliefs will be Patrick showing he can play without becoming a liability at any given moment he loses his head. I am all for Patrick starting and getting his chance to shine. I just am concerned that I see the same things each game, and he does not seem to draw confidence from the support structure that is around him. I hope he succeeds but I am not excited by him, he still worries me. It does not mean I support him any less. Those people at Fed Ex who boo his every move should be supporting him not undermining him. When Patrick is confident he looks great. With the improved blocking, solid run support, favoured targets and speedy receivers and his status as starter he should be looking less nervous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
318 SKIN Posted August 22, 2005 Author Share Posted August 22, 2005 Sorry Herrmag, didn't mean to throw you under the bus... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 The difference between Ramsey and Aikman/Manning is that those guys were top notch, bluechip QB's coming into the NFL. You had a good idea that they had the talent to suceed. If memory serves me right, Ramsey wasn't even Spurrier's first choice for a QB. Gibbs comes along and his first order of buisness is getting Brunnell. Then the next year, he drafts a QB in the first round. What does that tell you? Lets get this straight, "WE ALL WANT RAMSEY TO SUCCEED", but this is his make or break year and the excuses need to stop. But there are two problems. One--Being in a non-NFL system, having nearly half the starts other young QBs were given--these are not excuses. These are REASONS or EXPLANATIONS. Two--Make or break in what way? How do YOU define success? What if the team's D takes a nosedive but he throws for 3800 yards and has a mid-90s rating? What if he doesn't have gaudy numbers or a super high rating but is obviously a reason for the Skins to be winning? Would you even recognize his role? Because of the standards many critics use, there are many possible outcomes in which ramsey will still have been considered a 'failure' while objectively achieving a measure of success. What if he starts slow but ends really well? Will the doubters merely say, "Oh, he's inconsistent." What if he has a bad game like ALL Qbs have? What if he throws a dumb pick like BRady threw against Miami, but we win the division anyway--is that success? With each success comes new expectations, however unreasonable. What if we go to the NFC Title game and Ramsey has a good year but he throws a critical INT in the NFC Title game and we don't go to the SUper Bowl? Can you imagine this board after such an event? You DO know how many people will forget an entire year because of one play, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PREDICTOR Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 You guys sound like Spurrier now. Like being bad is exceptable because someone else is worse than you are. No, but you need to open your eyes and and accept the bigger view. What this is all about is comparing somebody's skills to somebody else who has an equal or greater amount of experience. Patrick Ramsey came into the league the exact moment that Harrington and Carr did and he has less starts than either of them. So I think it is interesting when you compare Patrick to them although I could make a case that both of the other 2 should be ahead of Patrick since they have played in the same system longer and both have more playing time. Remember, Patrick was hurt 2 years ago and he logged a lot of bench time last year....while those other 2 were playing every game. Don't be too quick to write off Ramsey just because he threw an int or 2. McNabb threw his first pass for an int that was run back for a TD last week. Its early yet and some QB's will look good and others won't look good at this point int time. Patrick has about 2 years of experience in starts and he is going to get better as time goes on. If not...he will be replaced. End of story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbooma Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 Those people at Fed Ex who boo his every move should be supporting him not undermining him. When Patrick is confident he looks great. With the improved blocking, solid run support, favoured targets and speedy receivers and his status as starter he should be looking less nervous. I disagree here. I think Pat should hear the fans booing, they have been waiting for him to show us what he can do and he has not been able to stay on the field no matter who is at fault. What I hope happens is he can grow from that. Getting booed by your own fans will prove once and for all if you can be a QB in this league. If this hurts his pysche at all then why is he even an NFL QB. We can not baby NFL players, that is a joke. Ghost you can not compare Ramsey to Brady, that is a joke. Everyone has a mistake here and there, just Pat does it a little more, and hasn't proven he can put a team on his back and win yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins24 Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 Everyone has a mistake here and there, just Pat does it a little more, and hasn't proven he can put a team on his back and win yet. Actually in '03, it was all Ramsey that led us to that good start. He carried the team. He won despite our O line, despite our coaching, despite of our lack of a legit ground game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sith lord Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 But there are two problems.One--Being in a non-NFL system, having nearly half the starts other young QBs were given--these are not excuses. These are REASONS or EXPLANATIONS. Two--Make or break in what way? How do YOU define success? What if the team's D takes a nosedive but he throws for 3800 yards and has a mid-90s rating? What if he doesn't have gaudy numbers or a super high rating but is obviously a reason for the Skins to be winning? Would you even recognize his role? Because of the standards many critics use, there are many possible outcomes in which ramsey will still have been considered a 'failure' while objectively achieving a measure of success. What if he starts slow but ends really well? Will the doubters merely say, "Oh, he's inconsistent." What if he has a bad game like ALL Qbs have? What if he throws a dumb pick like BRady threw against Miami, but we win the division anyway--is that success? With each success comes new expectations, however unreasonable. What if we go to the NFC Title game and Ramsey has a good year but he throws a critical INT in the NFC Title game and we don't go to the SUper Bowl? Can you imagine this board after such an event? You DO know how many people will forget an entire year because of one play, right? I wouldn't forget a good season based on one bad play in the playoffs. I define success by completion % and touchdown/int ratio and overall smarts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubba9497 Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 OK, sorry about that, just misunderstund your msg. Ego is checked..... no apologies needed I Was replying to Herm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbooma Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 Actually in '03, it was all Ramsey that led us to that good start. He carried the team. He won despite our O line, despite our coaching, despite of our lack of a legit ground game. we haven't won since 2000, if you call 2 good games out of 7 winning then i am scared Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 I wouldn't forget a good season based on one bad play in the playoffs. I define success by completion % and touchdown/int ratio and overall smarts. That's good. All we need then really for Patrick to do is up his overall smarts from last year. I still say, if something happens this year, prepare for the stream of threads, no matter how good Patrick is overall or what he did in other games to win them for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sith lord Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 That's good. All we need then really for Patrick to do is up his overall smarts from last year. I still say, if something happens this year, prepare for the stream of threads, no matter how good Patrick is overall or what he did in other games to win them for us. He also has to put together strings of good games. No more 1 good game out of 3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
318 SKIN Posted August 23, 2005 Author Share Posted August 23, 2005 :laugh: :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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