nuposse87

Harrison Barnes' athleticism is a joke. Even if on paper, he registered those tremendous scores, he never utilized it in 2 years at UNC. He didn't play dominant ball, and all of a sudden you think he will utilize it against superior competition in the NBA? He may be a decent enough scorer in the NBA, but his game and stats speak for themselves. All he can do is score, and not even efficiently when compared to Beal and MKG's game, although MKG's game is more predicated on smaller things and attacking the rim than long range shooting. Beal did get into a slump but for Barnes' pedigree he's been in a 2 year slump. http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/player/gamelog/_/id/56792/bradley-beal that is beal's game logs. Just looking at it I'd say the middle third of his games was his toughest stretch. He has the right mechanics and has the work ethic to improve, I question Barnes' ability to ever turn it on. I don't want the best potential available, I want the player that translates the best at next level and has demonstrated that. Beal / MKG or bust.

There are some pros and cons obviously about olympic play. On one hand, It will provide good structure and high level of competition for him. I have no doubts that he can become a premier low post threat. His defensive rebounding and TOs are my only concern. Now if he excels in Olympic play and has a stellar season I have a feeling other GMs will take note, and we're going to have to pony up lol. I believe seraphin is J. Noah's backup for the french national team. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/France_national_basketball_team Seraphin is one off season with Hakeem from being where I want him to be. I also see a little Z-bo in his game.

I'll give you rebounding, but booker is no slouch on defense. Robinson isn't the most intelligent defensive player in the world but I think he has the potential to be great. Offensively...he is younger so he does have the potential to be better. If we do get him, I won't throw a tantrum...I'd just like to see how we address our putrid wing play. *btw just an interesting note, Booker had a higher bench press than anyone in this draft. I know basketball isn't necessarily a strong man's game, but it isn't like Booker is getting pushed around the block. I also recall in an interview last season Booker saying seraphin is the strongest player he's banged with down low, we may have some the strongest low post play in the league.

I don't dislike having Robinson on our team...I do have wonders though. Both Booker and T-Rob have the same standing reach, which is most important when guarding opposing 4s, Booker has a higher vertical, and is considerably stronger than Robinson. They have a similar offensive style of play and Booker has finally shown he can hit the mid range jumper. What are we going to get with Robinson that we haven't already gotten with Booker? More hustle plays? Only advantage to Robinson is that we may be able to deal Booker for a mid round pick, and Booker being somewhat injury prone is a bit concerning. That and he has two years left I believe, and odds are we'd rather pay Seraphin than Booker.

not a big stats guy and then you try to make an argument with how much superior Harden is over Beal with stats, LOL (for the record, I'd take Harden over Beal, but I don't see Harden like potential in Beal anyways) Here is my biggest problem with Barnes, he may be a 20 ppg scorer in the NBA if given the opportunity, but the same can be said of Nick Young. Barnes doesn't do anything outside of scoring (and not even efficiently) to help his team. He is a stand-out athlete as demonstrated by his combine scores, but I have never seen him use his superior athleticism to dominate the college game, and he should have had no problem. You claim he had problems with accruing stats because he played at UNC, if anything, having superior talent around you should make you a more efficient player, this was clearly not the case. He was a the number 1 option and still managed to have a worse TS. While Kenny B. was the high scorer for UF this year, but it isn't like Beal was a scrub on the team, he was a close 2nd, just like Zellar was a close 2nd to Barnes. Look at the stats, even though you seem to disregard them when they destroy your argument. If you are suppose to be a star player in the draft, get use to lock down defensive assignments on you, that is how it works in the pro. Barnes proved he can't handle it efficiently, so the whole "oh he was the defensive focal point" thing doesn't really work well IMO. It's also comical you say he put of 17 ppg, he did that at worse efficiency than Beal (btw it was15.6 ppg his first year, I'm nit-picking now, but don't flat out lie). He didn't even improve significantly in his sophomore year. How is that not a red flag? Ray Allen is one of the greatest players to ever play SG, I'm not expecting that from him. His athletic scores are enough to say he could be like Eric Gordon. Harrison Barnes has shown enough offensive aptitude to make me think he could be a Granger like scorer but I doubt he will ever be as good defensively. I'll take the guy that has Eric Gordon like potential..especially considering how rare good SGs are these days.

I already showed you a statistical breakdown of how Beal was a better played in his freshman year than Barnes has been in his 2 seasons. You haven't given one coherent argument other than explaining why Barnes is a better prospect. Do I have to give you the break down again? ---------- Post added June-15th-2012 at 03:16 PM ---------- He is also a FA after 2013, depending on who we draft will let us know if we're going to make a big run at him. As it stands now, I would see OKC paying up to keep him, even if that is near max money.

Harden can't make a team relevant on his own. He would also likely have to sign an extension for Cha to really consider it. I thought Cho was going to build through the draft like OKC? That sort of trade reeks of incompetence.

Love's problem is they drafted pretty weird players initially to build around him. He is no "hyper-star" in my book, the top 5 players in the game. He is definitely a Star with superstar potential. The only PFs clearly better than him as players you would want to build around are LMA, and Bosh. Those guys have their faults but they can carry teams. I don't include Griffin because I think without a top 5 talent Blake would never make the Clips relevant, he is a good rebounder, and good at dunking and laying...and now that the league is going to look into flopping (hopefully) his hype will hopefully die, as it should. Getting it back to the Draft and FA debate. Realistically what I would want comes down to what the lolcats do. If they take T-rob I would go with this approach: Draft Beal. Trade the first 2nd round pick+Booker to buy us back into the 1st mid round. I'm expecting a mid teens like 13-16 with that package. I would then attempt to draft Ross/T. Jones/Moultrie in that order, whichever one is first available. I'm going to assume we don't get Ross and for argument sake we get T. Jones who I think is the perfect Forward off the bench for us. Our last 2nd round pick we'd hopefully use on a guy like....Darius Johnson-Odom. I think he would be a better backup than Mack. So via the draft we'd add perimeter shooting and hybrid forward for the bench. Cut Lewis, Bench Blatche till the trade deadline cause I doubt Ted will actually amnesty even though he should. With the new cap Space I'd offer a generous package to Ersan Ilyasova who actually helps us in the defensive rebounding department, and functions as a stretch 4, making Wall's job a helluva lot easier. Plus playing with Scott Skiles, I imagine he has a good enough concept of team defense to not be a liability for us. Wall/DJO Beal/Crawford C. Singleton/ T. Jones Ersan/Seraphin Nene/Vesly My hope is C. Singleton returns to early season form and actually becomes the 3 and D forward we expected from him.

exactly, and even when you compare the two, Love is an exceptionally better athlete than Sullinger. Sullinger is a poor man's Z-Bo. While I like Z-bo he has legit size to bang without athleticism. I see no evidence to believe sullinger can ever be effective as Z-Bo. ---------- Post added June-13th-2012 at 07:30 PM ---------- As Wizards fans, we've been deprived of a Big man with TRUE star potential since Kwame friggin brown. It is hard for me to not root for T-Rob. I believe Beal is still the best grab for us, I'm just hoping the franchise views this objectively and chooses him just because he is a hometown kid. If we could get the 5th pick from Sac in some way a beal+T-rob draft would be ideal. I'd offer Booker+future 1st pic+ 2nd pick for him, and maybe a salary swap for them. Not sure they'd bite on that though.

Millsap, Bass, Boozer and even Kevin Love all have significantly better agility scores than Sullinger. Al Jefferson is a bad comparison, he is a true center and his fat ass was only .3 seconds slower than Sullinger. While pick and pop players have a place in the NBA, if they don't have the ability to guard effectively I don't think they warrant picks in the top 20. Sullinger is too small to bang with even mediocre centers and too slow to deal with average PFs. Doesn't help one of his legs is actually longer than the other, won't take long for his back problems to keep him out of games.

I still think MKG is crafty enough to score effectively in the NBA, he isn't a good shooter from the perimeter, really that is the only gamble with him. And with his work ethic, I think it is worth it. As to your wait and see approach for Sullinger...I don't even think he is worth a 1st round pick, and I am dead serious about that. He has back issues, compile that with all my reasoning in my previous post, I can't see how anyone would think he is worth waiting and seeing on. Sorry but I'd rather not see any franchise waste a pick on him, let alone it be my beloved Wizards :/ Well...if you clicked my link you would have seen Barnes shot 42% his first season and 44% his next season. In Beal's rather "mediocre" by some of the people's here standards...first year, he shot 44.5%. Of course I'd rather look at eFG% instead of FG%. Barnes' eFG% was nearly identical in his rookie and sophomore campaign , 48.8 and 48.7 respectively. Beal's eFG% was 52.5%. Oh and it doesn't end there, Beal had a better Per and TS%. When Beal and Barnes was on the floor , Florida and UNC were about the same defensively, but Beal also led to more offensive production when he was on the floor than Barnes. Outside of Barnes being marginally better from the 3 point line, there is not statistical argument you could tell me to take Barnes over beal. Beal is simply better. Not to say Barnes isn't worth a lottery pick, but at the 3rd pick, it is an easy decision between the two.

OK people need to wake up and realize how terrible Sullinger will be at the next level. He may be the most skilled big man in the draft, but he will be an AWFUL defensive liability. His lane agility is on par with Brendan Freaking Haywood. You can't possibly twist the fact he won't be able to keep up with PFs in the NBA let alone rotate quickly enough to provide any sort of weak side help. Robinson has shown he has some post moves, and I don't see why he won't improve. Robinson's jump shot doesn't even look all that bad, if Booker can improve as much as he did, I don't see why anyone would doubt Robinson could. We've already seen how woeful Sullinger performs when confronted with NBA size as the match against Kansas clearly demonstrates. Sully may be a decent big man off the bench, but he has NO potential to be a starter in this league. At least T-rob has that going for him.

T-Rob...Ugh...I'm really torn on him right now. He has shown signs of a face up game, which could make a dominant PF in the NBA...but still it is just signs. Add the fact his "story" just makes you want the guy to succeed. I think he has the safest floor among all the draft pics not named A. Davis. I think he could easily be a 15-8 PF, possibly higher, but that is contingent on quite a bit of development. If we draft him, we gotta use booker and our 2nd round pick (first one) to get back into the mid first round. Being a junior also makes you wonder what really is his ceiling. Beal and MKG have shown very good signs at very young ages. I just see more potential in them. We're going to beat to death this 3rd pic issue, I'm curious what people see as plausible ideas for our 2nd round pick or the possibility of moving into the first round.

We're in an odd situation now. Personally I see the Bobcats swinging for the fences with Drummond. The team really has nothing to build with so they'd probably be best served with a player that is more potential than production. Barnes' numbers are quite impressive, but he never seemed to use his athleticism to dominate games. I see this as a bit of fools gold, he may go 4 now to the cavs but I still have my doubts about him. Beal's athletic numbers aren't as gawdy as Eric Gordon's but it is enough to make me think w/e inefficiencies he has with his size, he can make up with his superior athleticism. MKG is pretty much where I thought he'd be, his stock only goes down because others helped themselves more than people thought. My only issue with Zeller is his T-rex arms, not sure how that will translate for him in the next level. He is a skilled player though. Being a senior also limits his potential, I could see him falling into the late teens. It is still a toss up between MKG and Beal for me.

I think he played out of position at Baylor to be honest. He is a wing player in my mind that can defend the 4. I would draft him to be our 3. PJ III still has demonstrated skills to play at the next level so I think its worth some risk, but i might be in the minority here.

guess it depends on whose scouting reports you believe. I personally like ross as the 2nd best SG in this draft. He has great size for the 2 and great athleticism. Beal is the only guy I feel who could be more of a "sure thing" at the two spot than Ross. As the PJ III, he has huge question marks, but if you're in the camp of drafting players out of potential, like Drummond you can't help but marvel at PJ III's massive athleticism advantage over others. With him and drummmond, you can coach up players that need to get motivated. I don't mind taking a player like that at 10, at the 3...I'm not so sure. I think Sully will be gone by 10 honestly, and the team that takes him will more than likely end up with a poor man's milsap in my opinion. His advanced stats are great, I have no idea how his game will translate in the next level, that makes it gamble to me. I'd rather gamble on someone who has the potential to dominate than someone whose best case scenario is a the first big off the bench on a playoff team.

I would do T-rob/MKG at 3 and either terrance ross, or PJIII with the 10. I think sullinger could be an OK pro but you have to really think, is he going to be THAT much better than seraphin? I doubt his game translates as effectively in the pros as seraphin has recently demonstrated. If you take Beal at 3 and take sullinger at 10 I have no major irks with that. Wing play must be addressed though. Name some players we can trade in plausible scenarios to befit the idea of taking Sullinger and T-Rob with the the two top 10 pics.

ah another RealGMer. Yah I saw this trade and..I'm not against it because I wanted cap room to sign James Harden in '13 but now it seems more and more OKC will shell out near max money to retain him. My concern is that Ariza, while good on D is a career 32% shooter from the 3. Flipping Okafor for Gordon would be ideal, he might be the perfect 6th man for us. I would try to flip Ariza for Marvin Williams, their contracts are near each other, we can add filler, my only reasoning there is that he knock down the corner 3 a lot better. I would then see if we could move Booker+32 pic to get back into the middle of the first round. I think it is reasonable to think within the 14-16 range.This gives us the opportunity to draft based on talent rather than need (I prefer doing it the other way but I'm just seeing what I can create here). I would be surprised if LOLcats didn't take Robinson, they need a sure thing, I'm pretty sure Robinson is the most NBA ready player. We would have the 3rd, 10th, 15th or so, and 45. Drummond is our value pick. We will be expecting a lot from him but he can sit behind Nene and pray to w/e he doesn't bust. 10th I'd go Terrence Ross. Dude will be a solid swing-man. 15 I'd T. Jones, energy forward off the bench. He has a chiseled frame, might be able to to develop as the guy we need to lock down on guys like LBJ and Melo. 45th I'd take the best PG available or just flip it for cash considerations. If tyshawn taylor is there, perhaps him. Roll out next season with Wall/T. Taylor Ross/Gordon/ J. Crawford M.Williams/T. Jones/C. Singleton Vesly/Seraphin Nene/Drummond I switched Jan and seraphin as the starting PFs just to have bench scoring balance in the low post..I'd probably still try to get rid of crawford and sign the best spot up 3pt shooter we could. D. Green preferably.

well, I doubt that would be the open day line up. My scenario would include signing one of either D. Green, B. Rush. Both of those guys have a better concept of not jacking shots up than Crawford and play team defense better. Wall D. Green/B. Rush MKG Booker Nene OR if we draft a SG Wall Beal/Lamb/Rivers/Ross D. Green/G. Green/ J. Green(although he may be a bit overpriced Booker Nene I put booker in over seraphin because he did develop an outside jumper last year. He certainly is undersized at 6'7 but his standing reach and superior strength and athleticism last year was commendable was it not? Oh and Nene certainly open's up room for slashers he has a fairly nice shot from the high post. Wall and MKG are the only guys in either scenarios that haven't consistently proven to knock down a J.

Regarding the best SG arguments: http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/bradley-beal-1.html http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/austin-rivers-1.html http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/jeremy-lamb-1.html Lamb and Beal are fairly efficient players with Rivers just being alright. Lamb's mid range game is pretty solid, if coaching really was the problem, i would trade back and try to grab him. Defensively Rivers was also the worst of the bunch, but he did go against fairly good ACC talent so I can cut him some slack. If you are drafting on potential I'd say Lamb, he has a very smooth game but he'll need some coaching. Beal measures like Eric Gordon...but he isn't the athlete he was. He lacks that explosive first step, so he would need to grow a little to compensate.

If you think his putrid FT shooting which if he doesn't improve will be used against him, is the only reason his TS was bad than I might to have to concede you just pick and choose the stats you like to befit your argument. UCONN was dysfunctional yet you don't want to say Drummond may have shouldered some of that blame? Drummond was an ineffcient player given his size, on a much lower level. Even Withey's per in his freshman year was better. Scouts say a lot of things, and like me or anyone else. They get things wrong. You say shot selection is part of being a great shooter yet you think Austin Friggin Rivers is an option, lol. That is a vulgar joke. We have his slightly shorter clone in Jordan Crawford. As to your win-now argument. With Nene we did rather well. Did we play ****ty competition? Yes, but good teams blow bad teams out. We had our struggles but we have people can start and play efficiently. Nene and seraphin can be a starting frontcourt tandem for a playoff team. I've seen enough from Seraphin to think he will fix his most glaring shortcoming which is defensive rebounding, and say it is worth a gamble to pick the best wing talent available. MKG doesn't have to be a knock down shooter for us improve at the 3, he just needs to get average, I'd rather put my faith in his work ethic than Drummond's.

Being a superb shot blocker doesn't mean he will be a good defensive big man. I am aware the article claims he has defensive rotational ability but from what few games I was able to catch, he seemed slow and out of place.You can make the argument that the whole team may have been the problem but I take it for what it is. http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/andre-drummond-1.html http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/jeff-withey-1.html http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/anthony-davis-5.html Drummond's defensive rating and opponent offensive rating is significantly worse thant Anthony Davis and Whitey(Someone who I mocked, and will gladly eat crow for doing so). What is worst Offenses are stagnant with Drummond in the game as represenative by the Ortg. Not to mention his rather, Meh TS% which is a giant red flag given his absurd physical attributes. So yeah, he is a bad defensive center. ---------- Post added June-8th-2012 at 02:54 PM ---------- It absolutely does, we aren't in win-now mode with drummond. You are building for a future...Again. Wall still has a chance on becoming a top 5 pg, my hope is he will but if things stay the same I could see ernie Drafting potential with Drummond should he be there. This franchise only goes as far as Wall can take us. If he can't I don't blame them for trying to prepare for his potential departure.

Davis has a floor though, even now, that could be effective for the wizards. Looking at those highlights, all Drummond can do effectively is dunk. Jan can do the same thing, but not with the same authority. Drummond has also shown to be quite incompetent in defense...which would take time to fix, and the fact that he may actually be able to fix it. Drummond's floor IMO is current Kwame Brown..a serviceable Big man that is bigger than most in the league (but ever Kwame plays competent Man D). Davis' floor is Camby IMO. Davis' main concern is his need for bulk in order to bang down low. His frame suggests he can do that. As stupid as the wizards are at developing bigmen, they wouldn't have trouble in finding a nutritionist to help him gain weight. It must be said though, I think Drummond's ceiling is higher than Davis'. A team doesn't necessarily need to extend their rebuild plan with Davis, I guess that is what I am trying to get at. ---------- Post added June-8th-2012 at 02:17 PM ---------- I've heard he is atrocious in defense. He has the same awareness McGee had. He may make some highlight reel blocks, but if he doesn't know how to rotate we get set back another year or two. If we draft him we have to trade away any decent young assets we have in order to land veteran FAs that can make a difference. *I'm not uber against taking him...just don't see us being able to get the talent we need to satisfy Wall in the mean time. We would have to trade 2 of Jan, Booker, And Seraphin(don't want him to go) in order to get a serviceable 3. The option of giving Lewis for ariza+Okafor+10 pick also exists...but that is a lot of salary talent for Meh talent.

Drummond is a project player though...he isn't exactly refined in the low post. I'm not sure that John Wall would appreciate us trying to develop another big man (who has franchise potential). Drafting Drummond would lead me to believe the organization doesn't believe wall has the ability to develop to be a top 5 pg, and they may be looking to a future without him. Cause I doubt Wall sticks around for another two years of futility. We'd have to trade away big men for this to work.

helps his stock a lot...his problem is his frame isn't really conducive to adding much weight...for his sake, I hope he is.