TankRizzo Posted May 28, 2004 Share Posted May 28, 2004 http://www.nasm.si.edu/museum/udvarhazy/ It's been open a while now, I would have gone for the opening but I had a broken leg. And..well, I just never got around to going after I got better. So who's been? I think I could go in, sit down indian style in front of the SR-71 and stare at that for my entire visit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted May 28, 2004 Share Posted May 28, 2004 Never been there, but I saw a Blackbird once at an air show at Andrews. One little tidbit that the people who were answering questions/keeping people away from the plane were mentioning about that aircraft: At cruising conditions, the aircraft gets quite warm, so much so that, due to heat expansion, the aircraft is actually 19" longer when cruising than when sitting on the ground. (This, no doubt, made the design of the wiring harness and hydraulic system, well, interesting.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TankRizzo Posted May 28, 2004 Author Share Posted May 28, 2004 Originally posted by Larry Never been there, but I saw a Blackbird once at an air show at Andrews. One little tidbit that the people who were answering questions/keeping people away from the plane were mentioning about that aircraft: At cruising conditions, the aircraft gets quite warm, so much so that, due to heat expansion, the aircraft is actually 19" longer when cruising than when sitting on the ground. (This, no doubt, made the design of the wiring harness and hydraulic system, well, interesting.) I try to read/watch anything I see on that plane. I've been fascinated with it since I was very young. Another interesting tidbit is that the plane leaks fuel like a civ. After it takes off it has to re-fuel in air (again, due to the expanding/contracting the plane does while in flight). One of the pre-req.s to be a pilot is that you have to be married. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thew Posted May 28, 2004 Share Posted May 28, 2004 I've been, and yes you could go and stare at the Black Bird for the entire visit. I've studied and obsessed over that plane ever since it was declasified back in the late 70's. Looking at right in front of you is just incredible. The edges are so sharp, it looks like it's going mach 2 just sitting their on the museams floor. Over all the museum is very cool. I didn't go in the theatre or up the control tower but some of the highlights... black bird SR-71 speed record plane. Enola Gay... Plane that dropped the big one on Japan Flying tiger Concord Space Shuttle A lot of cool fighter planes including WWI, WWII, Korea, Vietnam era planes and jets. One plane which is pretty cool which seems out of place there is William PerPont Langley's old plane. PerPont was an early rival of the Wright brothers. He had recieved government money to build an airplane and had failed dramatically. Even though his plane never flew the Smithsonian had hung his plane rather than the Wright flyer at the Air and Space Museum on the Mall due to their association with William PerPont.. ( he was the curator way back when). Anyway the Wright brothers heirs sued back in the early eighties to get the Wright flyer hung. They threatenned to reclaim it and donate it to the Wright museum down in N. Carolina unless the Smithsonian displayed it. So the Smithsonian capitulated in the early 80's and hung the Wright Flyer. Now they go and hang the William Perpont plane in their new Air and Space Museum.. What a laugh.. It's a great story though and just goes to show you politics is everywhere.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TankRizzo Posted May 28, 2004 Author Share Posted May 28, 2004 quick little story about the Enola Gay. My family used to own a family restaurant in Forestville and my grandfather had various connections through the restaurant. Somehow he got the honor of being the last person to taxi the Enola Gay around Andrews before they put it into storage (in the late 70's I believe). Well...during the visit he kind of stole the serial plate :paranoid: Anyhow, several years later there were a couple guys from the Smithsonian in the restaurant (Somewhere inbetween my grandfather had passed away) and my aunt and grandmother told them about having the serial plate :doh: Needless to say some men in black suits showed up the next day to get it back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thew Posted May 28, 2004 Share Posted May 28, 2004 TankRizzo That's a great story..... I heard a rummor a long time ago that the commander of that plane commited suicide. It was like a popular folklore in Japan. Anyway I was checking that out and read the autobiography of General Paul Tibbits who was the commander. Dude is still alive. In fact he tried to put his crew together again and do some airshows down in Texas. They had this poster, come shake the hand of the man who ended WWII. The Japaneese objected to the airshows and the government stepped in and told him to cool it. Tibbits is totally unapoligetic for dropping the big one. Claims he regularly gets calls and letters from veterans thanking him.. It was a great autobiography.... Right up there with.. Chuck Yeager.. 5 x ace in wwII and all around stud who broke the sound bariar back in the late 40's. Pappy Boyington... Flying tiger, Marine Ace who formed the famed Black Sheep squadrin in WWII. Highlights of his autobiography [1] fleeing the US due to gambling depts to become a mercenary for the Chineese. [2] Describing all the places he traveled too by the liquer they drank and the quality of their whores [3] Desserting the Chineese army on the eve on the American take over because he didn't want to be in the Army he wanted back into the Marine Corps. [4] Parking cars in Baltimore as America entered the war as he tried to get his comission back. [5] Becoming the top pacific ace in WWII prior to being shot down [6] Winning the Congressional Medal of Honor [7] Being a POW in Japan [8] Getting drummed out of the service shortly after WWII for being a drunk. Paul Tibbets [1] Pissing off just about the entire army in preparing for his drop.. [2] Securing the secret of the bomb [3] Being smart hard nosed and determined Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted May 28, 2004 Share Posted May 28, 2004 About the 'bird leaking fuel: A co-worker who worked at the AFB in Okinawa during Viet Nam told me about that plane (which was based out of Oki for the war). Said, because of the leaking, special proceedures had to be used for the aircraft. It was towed, empty, out to the threshold of the runway. Once there, it was fueled at that location, with just enough fuel for a short flight. (And, immediatly began leaking jet fuel on the runway.) As soon as the plane becan fueling, all flight ops at the field had to be halted. (No aircraft could take off or land). Once fueled, the 'bird would start up, and immediatly taxi onto the runway and take off (it already had clearance.) He said the aircraft often flew at night, and at night, when it took off, as the aircraft ran down the runway, leaking jet fuel, the engines would ignite the spilled fuel, so the aircraft would leave trails of burning fuel on the runway, behind it. ---------- I also recall a Popular Science article on the plane. One photo showed a jet engine on a test stand (no sheet metal covering it, or anything). The engine was glowing. (I'd say orange, but it was a B&W photo). The caption stated that, to test the engine under "cruise" conditions, to simulate the low oxygen and high intake speeds anticipated, the test fixture involved firing the exhaust of one jet into the intake of the prototype. It also mentioned that the engine shown, Prototype #2, was destroyed shortly after the photo "when it ingested the Pratt & Whitney nameplate, which had been rivited to the intake cowling". (There's a reason they test these things in explosion-hardened fixtures.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan T. Posted May 28, 2004 Share Posted May 28, 2004 Originally posted by TankRizzo I try to read/watch anything I see on that plane. I've been fascinated with it since I was very young. Another interesting tidbit is that the plane leaks fuel like a civ. After it takes off it has to re-fuel in air (again, due to the expanding/contracting the plane does while in flight). One of the pre-req.s to be a pilot is that you have to be married. A great read is "Skunk Works" by Ben Rich, former head of Lockheed Martin's Skunk Works division and builder of the airplane. It talks about what they went thourhg to get the plane built. The museum is awesome. The guided tour is worth the time. The guy we had was really knowledgeable about everything, and entertaining too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan T. Posted May 28, 2004 Share Posted May 28, 2004 Originally posted by Larry About the 'bird leaking fuel: . .. He said the aircraft often flew at night, and at night, when it took off, as the aircraft ran down the runway, leaking jet fuel, the engines would ignite the spilled fuel, so the aircraft would leave trails of burning fuel on the runway, behind it. How cool is THAT? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cskin Posted May 28, 2004 Share Posted May 28, 2004 That Langley plane was more a boat than a plane. Mr. Langley launched it off of a platform built on top of a house boat. It would leave the guiding mechanism and plunge straight down into the water. Never even glided? I'm amazed they can place that in an air and space museum, considered it never saw "air" or "space". It belongs in a naval museum. As for Tibbits, I had the pleasure of meeting him at a Memorial Day celebration in Roswell Georgia several years ago. I asked him about the Japanese "poor" opinion of him.. considering he could be considered directly responsible for the deaths of hundrends of thousands of Japanese citizens. He looked me right in the eyes, shook my hand and said... "Better them than our American boys". A true honor for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted May 29, 2004 Share Posted May 29, 2004 Actually, as to the Wright plane: As I understand it, Langly never recognised the Wright brothers as the first pilots, claiming that he had flown first, but hadn't invited reporters because he wasn't satisfied with his aircraft. Also as I understand it, when the Wright brothers offered to donate their first aircraft to the Smithsonian, Langly decided that the museam didn't have a proper place to store the aircraft, and declined the offer. The Wright brothers used the parts of their aircraft to build their next aircraft, which is why the "first aircraft" no longer exists. (The one in the NASM is a replica.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thew Posted May 29, 2004 Share Posted May 29, 2004 About the Blackbird leaking fuel. That could be true. Suposedly the plane was build with cracks in the outer skins which would seal at high speeds when the skin would expand due to the heat of the atmosphere at high speeds. Never heard it leaked fuel though. I do have a story about the black bird though. The Plan wasn't an airforce plane but rather was run by the CIA. Anyway during the six day war in the Middle East supposedly we ran daily recon trips over Israel. We knew Israel had the bomb back in 67 and we wanted to make sure that they weren't going to nuke Egypt. Anyway, the pilot who flew the missions came up on the Israeli radar as a UFO. The Israeli's would scramble interceptors.. French Mirages... The Black bird pilot would slow down so they could get airborn and reach altitude. When they fired the A2A missiles at him he would hit the Afterburners and outrun them. He was faster than the A2A missles. The story I heard was the pilot was quite the hotdog. He did this for six straight days during the war.... The plane was untouchable... I also remember in the 80's when N. Korea fired missles at one of our spy planes in international waters. I remember wondering if it was in international waters when the missle was fired or just when the missle ran out of gas. larry The Wright brothers used the parts of their aircraft to build their next aircraft, which is why the "first aircraft" no longer exists. I've got to read more about that. I know there was a huge controversy and the Smithsonian didn't hang the Wright flyer until the early 1980's. The Smithsonian also did not acknoledge the Wrights where the first in flight but rather called them one of the firsts along with Perpont. Who your also right never actually flew, least their is no evidence of it. ( Perpont wasn't the pilot only the plane designer, his pilot quit on him after three dunks in the icy potomac, the last one almost drowned him. Just as you say. It's a great story. You wonder why the Smithsonian is so freaking stuburn about it. It's not like the Wrights cant document their claim... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bulmer1 Posted May 29, 2004 Share Posted May 29, 2004 From what I remember of the Perpont story (it's been a while) is that the Smithsonian had a replica built from the original plans using newer materials and the plane had very little success but still flew and because the plans worked they said he made the first plane although the Wright brothers flew first. On another note I live in Ohio and in Dayton there is a wonderful air musem with the sr-71 black bird as well as the F-117a. Both are a sight to behold. The rumors that I have heard about the black bird are that it was designed for recon but it could outrun any missle or bullet at the time. What an incredible plane (still the fastet plane in the world after nearly 30 years) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted May 29, 2004 Share Posted May 29, 2004 Originally posted by bulmer1 What an incredible plane (still the fastet plane in the world after nearly 30 years) Well I think there is one faster, although it's only a glider. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TankRizzo Posted June 1, 2004 Author Share Posted June 1, 2004 Originally posted by Larry Well I think there is one faster, although it's only a glider. :confused: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted June 1, 2004 Share Posted June 1, 2004 There's one aircraft that capable of Mach 60. But, they're grounded right now while a committee from Congress thinks about doing something about them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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