OaktonSkins/BushFan Posted February 3, 2004 Share Posted February 3, 2004 Originally posted by Ancalagon the Black Philosophy major? Uh, no. But I had a fairly heavy dose of it, relatively speaking, in high school and college. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted February 3, 2004 Share Posted February 3, 2004 From Rush Did You Expect Better From This Culture? February 2, 2004 RUSH: I'm really stunned. No, I'm not saying this... I'm stunned everybody is all upset. Okay, so they had a publicity stunt, and Janet Jackson's right boob shows up at the Super Bowl halftime show and everybody is acting like this is 1950. It's 2004. What do you people expect? This is nothing compared to other stuff going on out there, everybody is getting upset about this. We've got people on MTV practically every afternoon pretending to be making love while dressed while standing up while dancing. The Baptists were right. Baptists don't dance, or they used to not dance because they didn't want anybody to think they were making love standing up. MTV, it's an old joke, but I mean it's just ridiculous. Where do you think this culture has been headed? I'm surprised we haven't gotten farther than this by now anyway. I'm surprised that she came out and didn't undo both of them with no silver spider on either. Did you listen to the lyrics of the song, for those of you who could understand them, I sure as hell couldn't, but I had closed-captioning on because I'm deaf anyway. So I'm reading the lyrics, I'm going to get you naked before the end of the song. What do you think the plan was here? I mean, we've had Britney kissing Madonna, this is nothing. This is absolutely tame. It's been headed this way, you know, it's been headed this way. You parents may not know what your kids are watching out there on MTV, but the kids are out there laughing saying, "This is nothing." I'll tell you what is more disturbing than this. This didn't disturb me; it's throw up the hands time on this stuff. What disturbed me was the absolute horrible quality of the commercials in the Super Bowl. I mean they stunk. They literally stunk. I have to tell you something, ladies and gentlemen, they'd have been better off running the MoveOn.org ad. If you want some controversy, run that BS political ad in the Super Bowl. CBS says no, we're not going to run a political ad for MoveOn.org but they put on a halftime show like this, and CBS is part of Viacom which owns MTV, so it's all under the same umbrella. But I mean let me tell you something, here you had these two guys, one each with a dog; one guy's got a big burly dog, and he says Bud Light, so the dog runs to a cooler and gets a Bud Light then they turn on the other guy and his dog is a mangy wet little mutt, looks like it's just out of the pound, or maybe needs to go to the pound, and the other guy says Bud Light, so the dog bites the other guy in the crotch. You know, at what point are we going to find these commercials not funny? How many times are guys going to have to get hit or bitten in the crotch in commercials before people stop thinking that's funny? And besides not being funny, it's old. How old are these jokes? These jokes have to be 2,000 years old. I'm embarrassed. I'm watching this, I'm absolutely embarrassed. Something else that ought to bother you more than anything else is the NFL must not think their game is good enough to sustain people's excitement. To have to have the commercials be, you know, as big an attraction to one out of every ten people that watch it, and then this silly stupid halftime show, it's not that it was obscene, it's just stupid. Compare the pregame show, now look at the pregame show, there you had a guy, and I've seen this guy sing, Marta and I saw this guy sing live in Las Vegas, his name is Josh Groban, and they did a tribute to NASA in the pregame show, and they had some pretty wholesome, happy-looking kids in the background, him singing a great song, and they had the astronaut coming out standing on the facsimile of the moon. Great tribute to NASA and the Columbia astronauts that perished in that accident a little over a year ago, and then you've got Beyonce Knowles came out and that was a very great rendition of the national Anthem. And then the halftime show, pure trash. But it's not that it's obscene, it was just trash. It's just utter, absolute trash, with a bunch of people who in the days of real talent would never have been able to get out of a talent agency and now they're big stars because they can grab their couch or they can show a boob with a silver spider on it. How smart is Janet Jackson, here's her husband about to go on trial for child abuse well, whatever it is. What did I say, husband? Well, in that family you never know. Here you've got Janet Jackson's brother about to go on trial for child abuse, and she comes out and pulls this stunt. How wise is that? And then Timberlake, keep him on the Mouseketeers, for crying out loud, and Britney Spears, too. You know, the things that are passing for talent these days in the music business really wouldn't have passed muster years and years ago. No, I'm not being old fogie about this, ladies and gentlemen. I'm being advanced in my thinking. Now, of course this wasn't a wardrobe malfunction, this thing was rehearsed it was performed on purpose this way. You know, the only guy that didn't lip sync his performance is Kid Rock, and he should have. I mean Kid Rock, here's a guy the NFL has made a big star because he can pass out Coors Light in commercials during games - he's out there wearing this American flag smock, and then they go to Nelly, and Nelly grabbed his crotch every three seconds, so it really is no talent. And it's also, I'll tell you something else, folks, if you're older than 12, the NFL is not interested in you. I mean this is a show geared for 12-year-olds. By the time you're 16, you've done all this; you've seen all this and this is not even exciting. And then you've got, you know, another commercial, I'll tell you, the beer commercials are leading the way here. Everybody knows that you advertise beer to the yutes of America. You advertise beer to people that not even of legal drinking age yet because people that are 30, 40, ancient, don't change their minds. They drink their beer they like. They go out and buy it; you're not going to change their mind so you go out and get young skulls full of mush to like your brand before they're even illegally able to buy it, then you sneak in a couple of don't-drink-before-you're-21 commercials and then you're covered. And so they're advertising to all these little skulls full of mush out there, these prepubescent adolescents, and here you've got some guy and a girl driving along in a horse-driven sleigh out in the snow, and it's a very romantic evening, and this guy out of nowhere pulls a candle, a lighted candle, she doesn't know it's there because she's a ditz. Here they are in the middle of winter in a snow-covered sleigh being pulled along by a horse, out of nowhere this guy pulls a light. You never see the light, it's just sitting down there at her feet but she's too idiot to see it, she acts surprised, oh, how cute, and he turns away to grab the beer, and the horse lets loose with a giant...they may as well...say the horse farts. I mean that's exactly, the horse farts, blows her hair into a burnt piece of, what is it, steel wool. Now, I'm telling you, this is just absolutely childish. It's probably funnier the way I describe it. I mean you laugh the way I describe it, when you watch this, it's just, you sit there and say this is juvenile. You don't even go ooh, I'm offended. It's juvenile. Where's the talent? You know, they had a show on part of the pregame show, I guess it was Saturday night, NBC did a show, great Super Bowl commercials from years past, and there were some classics in there. Those Larry Byrd, Michael Jordan McDonald's commercials - there were just some really, really fabulous, creative commercials, but, you know, what passes for creativity today is if the joke's been done a thousand times, let's do it again in a different way. Let's be as vulgar as we think we can, let's cross the line a couple of times so everybody will spend the next day talking about it, talk about how brave and courageous we were, when it's not brave or courage at all; it's just childish, it's just immaturity, and really what it boils down to is a total lack of creative talent, when you've got to go have a guy get hit in the groin again, for how many times... it would be easier to count the number of years this has been going on, than the number of times. And as a guy, by the way, I'm getting offended. If we're going to do this, let's have a woman get hit in the groin and let's see what the reaction to that is. I mean, even Mr. Snerdley, I can't believe you said that. Why can't you believe I said it? We can sit here all day and talk about men getting it in the groin and we laugh about it, why can't we talk about women? Hmm? Hmm? No, I don't know why. You tell me why. I really don't know why. Oh, don't give me the violence against women. What about violence against men? You're having a dog biting a guy in the crotch. We laugh about it. We can be violent against men all day, "well, men are violent, Rush, who's playing the football game?" I don't know, did you tune in to watch the Lingerie Bowl? Damn it, neither did I, but hell Lingerie Bowl was probably a cleaner display than the halftime show at the National Football League. I'll bet you the Lingerie Bowl was fun. I'll bet it was probably nothing more than suggestive. These the thing these people have so little talent that they can't use your own mind to imagine things, they've got to show you. I wouldn't even go so far as to call it vulgar. It's just childish, and totally talentless. And the NFL, I mean look at the things the NFL gets upset about, hint, hint, and the things the NFL couldn't care less about, in fact promotes, such as this absolute worthless waste of time that they called their halftime show. You know what the best commercial was? Tell me what the best commercial was. No, I don't know that I saw a McDonald's commercial. The best commercial was the donkey that wanted to be a Clydesdale. COMMERCIAL BREAK RUSH: I know the McDonald's commercial you're talking about, but that was not a good commercial, and I'll tell you why it was not a good commercial. I just got a note here from a friend, said that commercial with the guy getting yelled at by the ref was pretty funny, too. And I said yeah, that was a funny commercial. And then you tell me that was the McDonald's commercial? Well, oh, I thought you just told me it was a McDonald's commercial [talking to program observer.] What company was this commercial for with the guy being yelled at by his wife? See, you can't tell me the product. That's my point. The guy sent me a note doesn't know what product is being advertised in the commercial. The reason you liked the commercial is because it stereotypes about women. The commercial was a guy sitting there, a referee, on the sideline being really just yelled at, screamed at, insulted by a coach. The guy is not reacting at all, just stone-faced. And then they say, raise the question, how does this guy manage to do this? Well, they cut to the guy at home, his wife is screaming at him, do this, do that, you're a louse, you're a rotten son of a gun and the guy is sitting there as stoically. I can't tell what company advertised that, it was a funny little 30-second interlude but I can't tell what commercial it was for or what product it was for. But even that's a stereotypical attack on screaming, yelling, domineering over-the-top wives. I guess the NFL doesn't care about appealing to women. I mean it just really, if you're going to tell me a good commercial, a good commercial, you've got to at least tell me, be able to tell me the product or the company that was advertising. I don't know about a McDonald's, that's what I'm trying to tell you. Can you tell me what the McDonald's commercial was? What was it? Just send me an e-mail. Send me an e-mail. Send me an e-mail because they can't hear you, and I'll sit there and go hm-hm, hm-hm, hm-hm, for 30 minutes while you tell me what it is. In the meantime Dave in Lafayette, Indiana. Welcome to the EIB Network. Nice to have you with us, sir. CALLER: Mega dittos there, Rush, but I have to take you to task. You missed the best commercial. The best commercial was the Frito-Lay commercial that had the two seasoned citizens battling it out over a bag of chips. RUSH: Yeah, that was pretty funny, but that's not a Super Bowl commercial, that commercial has been running for two or three weeks during the playoffs, so that's why I don't count it as a Super Bowl commercial. CALLER: I had not seen it during the playoffs, but I mean in my mind it covered everything that you just threw out there. I mean it had seasoned citizens fighting, the man fighting the woman, I mean there's your equal rights. RUSH: That's an interesting way to look at it, that it's an equal rights commercial. Let me describe this commercial for you, folks, in case you don't know what we're talking about here. Some young guy somewhere with a bag of potato chips, he's walking out of an old folks home or something, and he drops the bag of lay's potato chips, and there's an old woman and old man and they both have their eyes on this bag of potato chips so he gets up and starts shuffling after, or she gets up, starts shuffling very slowly after the bag, the old man trips her with his cane, she falls flat on her face, he then shuffles past her, picks up the bag, smiles at her like, a-ha, got you, and then she looks up from the floor, very happy, showing that his teeth fell out, and she's holding his dentures, then the young guy comes back in, steals the chips from both of them and walks out. And, by the way, the guy did beat the old woman with the cane once when she tried to get up. I mean, this is real wholesome stuff too, yeah, the senior citizens do this all the time at the old folks retirement home beating each other with canes, chasing after bags of potato chips, stealing each other's dentures. I mean, if you people are outraged at this stuff, I can't believe that you are. I mean you know where this culture has been headed for I don't know how many years, been chronicling the cultural decay on this program for 15 years, and this is just the natural extension of where it's headed. And you parents, I can't believe that any of you parents are out there screaming bloody murder about this. You parents are the ones letting your boys stay home and live with you until they're 30 and live off of you while you go buy the potato chips they're eating, they're still living in the room they grew up in with the dolls and the GI Joes that they had or whatever, or some of you other parents went ahead and gave your teenagers your bedroom to have sex because it's cleaner than the car, and then you provided a pack of cigarettes and a condom so they'd get the full benefit of the experience. Then we sit here and get upset over Janet Jackson. I mean, let me tell you something, folks. I don't know a woman who would put something like on a nipple and not intend it to be seen. I mean, you do that, there's no reason to do that if it's not going to be seen. This idea that this was an accident, Justin Timberlake, it probably did take a whole bunch of rehearsals to get this right, for a whole host of reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prosperity Posted February 3, 2004 Share Posted February 3, 2004 Culture was so good in the 1950's give me a break. At least these days black people are not being lynched week. If anything American culture has become exponentially better since times ago. of course its not surprising why Rush loves the past Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OaktonSkins/BushFan Posted February 3, 2004 Share Posted February 3, 2004 Originally posted by Equality If anything American culture has become exponentially better since times ago. As reflected by modern day statistics relating to various degrees of crimes involving moral turpitude. RRRIIIIIIGGGGGHHHHHHTTTTT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panel Posted February 3, 2004 Share Posted February 3, 2004 Originally posted by Equality Culture was so good in the 1950's give me a break. At least these days black people are not being lynched week. If anything American culture has become exponentially better since times ago. Yep, The envolope will ALWAYS be pushed. People got pissed when Elvis wiggeled on TV. People got pissed when They could see Genie's belly button on TV. People got pissed when The song "Will you spend the night with me" was sung on TV. 2 Live Crew when to COURT because people though songs like that should be illeagal. People got pissed when Micheal Jackson Grabbed his crotch on TV People got pissed when Briteny and Modona kissed Now they are pissed over the Jackson boob. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panel Posted February 3, 2004 Share Posted February 3, 2004 Originally posted by The Elated OaktonSkinsFan As reflected by modern day statistics relating to various degrees of crimes involving moral turpitude. RRRIIIIIIGGGGGHHHHHHTTTTT. Your don't think that the MASS racial terrorism that existed back then was immoral? And it isn't like sex crimes didn't happen back then, they were just talked about a lot less then they are today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OaktonSkins/BushFan Posted February 3, 2004 Share Posted February 3, 2004 Originally posted by panel Your don't think that the MASS racial terrorism that existed back then was immoral? And it isn't like sex crimes didn't happen back then, they were just talked about a lot less then they are today. Panel - Don't try and stuff words in my mouth. As a whole, our soceity today IS worse off in a spiritual and moral sense. A comparative study of criminal statistics is demonstrative. Your problem is that you are narrowly focused on one issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panel Posted February 3, 2004 Share Posted February 3, 2004 Originally posted by The Elated OaktonSkinsFan Panel - Don't try and stuff words in my mouth. As a whole, our soceity today IS worse off in a spiritual and moral sense. A comparative study of criminal statistics is demonstrative. Your problem is that you are narrowly focused on one issue. Actully not true, a common misconseption likley due to the increasing reporting done on decreasing crime. All the charts I founr on the Bureau of Justice Statistics. http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/glance/hmrt.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OaktonSkins/BushFan Posted February 3, 2004 Share Posted February 3, 2004 Originally posted by panel Actully not true, a common misconseption likley due to the increasing reporting done on decreasing crime. All the charts I founr on the Bureau of Justice Statistics. http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/glance/hmrt.htm "Racial terrorism", as you described it, didn't exist in 1973. If you go back farther, you'll see that crime has gone up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ancalagon the Black Posted February 3, 2004 Share Posted February 3, 2004 Originally posted by The Elated OaktonSkinsFan Panel - Don't try and stuff words in my mouth. As a whole, our soceity today IS worse off in a spiritual and moral sense. A comparative study of criminal statistics is demonstrative. Your problem is that you are narrowly focused on one issue. You focus on criminal statistics and then accuse someone else of a narrow focus? What about racial discrimination, sex discrimination, homophobia, life expectancy, infant mortality, family wealth? OK, those last three aren't spiritual or moral, but let me tell you that America is a far better place for racial minorities, women, and homosexuals than it was fifty years ago. And the ones who are complaining are the whites, men, and heterosexuals who no longer have a monopoly on the good life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OaktonSkins/BushFan Posted February 3, 2004 Share Posted February 3, 2004 Originally posted by Ancalagon the Black You focus on criminal statistics and then accuse someone else of a narrow focus? What about racial discrimination, sex discrimination, homophobia, life expectancy, infant mortality, family wealth? OK, those last three aren't spiritual or moral, but let me tell you that America is a far better place for racial minorities, women, and homosexuals than it was fifty years ago. And the ones who are complaining are the whites, men, and heterosexuals who no longer have a monopoly on the good life. AtB - Sorry, but criminal stats are perhaps the largest indicator and reflection of severe problems with moral turpitude in any society. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OaktonSkins/BushFan Posted February 3, 2004 Share Posted February 3, 2004 http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A5746-2004Feb2?language=printer FCC Is Investigating Super Bowl Show Halftime Performance Faces Indecency Standards Test By Frank Ahrens and Lisa de Moraes Washington Post Staff Writers Tuesday, February 3, 2004; Page A01 The Federal Communications Commission launched an investigation into Sunday's controversial Super Bowl halftime show yesterday and FCC Chairman Michael K. Powell telephoned Mel Karmazin, president of CBS parent Viacom Inc., to express his outrage, saying the entertainment giant should have known what was going to transpire during the show. The FCC probe will encompass the entire halftime program -- including the brief exposure of singer Janet Jackson's breast and the sexualized dance routine precipitating it -- to determine if it violates indecency standards set in law and enforced by the FCC. If indecency violations are found, each of Viacom's 200 owned and affiliate stations could face a penalty of up to $27,500. FCC officials said the agency may also pursue penalties against CBS and the individual performers, Jackson and Justin Timberlake. The FCC announced its probe as NFL Commissioner Paul Tagliabue promised that the league would change its policies to ensure that future halftime shows are "of far more appropriate quality for the Super Bowl game." Powell said the investigation will be "thorough and swift." "I am outraged at what I saw during the halftime show of the Super Bowl," the FCC chairman said in a statement. "Like millions of Americans, my family and I gathered around the television for a celebration. Instead, that celebration was tainted by a classless, crass and deplorable stunt. Our nation's children, parents and citizens deserve better." The other FCC commissioners issued similar statements. In addition to the racy halftime show, some of the commercials shown during the game featured previews for violent movies and jokes employing scatological humor. The controversy surrounding the halftime show for Super Bowl XXXVIII -- which was watched by an estimated 99 million viewers in the United States and around the world -- stung the NFL. In addition to its U.S. audience, this year's game was telecast to 229 countries and territories, including China for the first time. Joe Browne, the NFL's vice president of communications and government affairs, said the league had expressed its concerns to MTV, a Viacom subsidiary, which produced the show for CBS. "We expressed our concerns to MTV all during the preparations for the game and we had assurances that the entertainment would be appropriate to all aspects of our audience," Browne said. "We are extremely disappointed and feel consistently let down in that we believe the show was inappropriate for our audience and embarrassing to us and to our fans. . . . "We applaud the FCC's investigation into the MTV-produced halftime. We and our fans were embarrassed by the entire show." In a statement Sunday night, Browne said it was unlikely MTV would be asked to produce halftime shows for future Super Bowls. "We were asked very early in the planning stages by CBS officials to give some serious consideration to have MTV produce the [halftime] show," Browne said. "At this point, I'm not sure it was a wise decision." Jackson and Timberlake's number -- the final act of the 12-minute halftime show at Reliant Stadium in Houston -- saw the two of them dancing and grinding suggestively to Timberlake's tune "Rock Your Body," which includes the lyric, "I'll have you naked by the end of this song." As the routine ended, Timberlake reached across Jackson's chest and pulled off the right breast cup of her black leather bodice, revealing her breast, which was adorned with a piece of jewelry that looked like a silver sunburst. After a dramatic pause, Jackson clasped her arms over her breast. CBS and MTV maintained yesterday that they had been unaware of the stunt beforehand. A CBS source said that there was never any choreography during the rehearsals last week that hinted Timberlake would get that close to Jackson to pull at her top. "We feel like we were duped by the whole thing," the source said. "Could it have been an accident? Who knows? . . . The only people who would were Janet Jackson and Justin Timberlake." A statement issued by CBS said: "The moment did not conform to CBS broadcast standards and we would like to apologize to anyone who was offended." Jackson issued a statement late yesterday that said the bodice-ripping incident was a stunt gone bad. "The decision to have a costume reveal at the end of my halftime show performance was made after final rehearsals," she said. "MTV was completely unaware of it. It was not my intention that it go as far as it did. I apologize to anyone offended -- including the audience, MTV, CBS and the NFL." Timberlake expressed regret in a statement Sunday night that attributed the incident to a "wardrobe malfunction." But assurances made by Jackson's choreographer to MTV.com before the halftime show that viewers would see "some shocking moments" in her performance left some questioning their sincerity. MTV boasted "Janet Gets Nasty!" on its Web site Sunday night shortly after the halftime show. "Jaws across the country hit the carpet at exactly the same time," the story read. "You know what we're talking about, Justin Timberlake and a kinky finale that rocked the Super Bowl to its core." MTV Networks President Judy McGrath said the finale of the Jackson-Timberlake act caught the network by surprise. "I'm mostly horrified as what I think would have been an entertaining, exciting great halftime show that ended so badly in five seconds none of us knew anything about," she said. Powell said his unhappiness with the halftime show went beyond Jackson's exposure. It "wasn't even the most offensive part," the FCC chief said in an interview. "It was the finale of something that was offensive. The whole performance was onstage copulation." He added, "This really crossed a heinous line." The FCC has defined broadcast indecency as "language or material that, in context, depicts or describes, in terms patently offensive as measured by contemporary community broadcast standards for the broadcast medium, sexual or excretory organs or activities." The halftime show was noteworthy in light of recent events surrounding broadcast indecency, said Jonathan Cody, Powell's legal adviser. Radio giant Clear Channel Communications was fined $755,000 last week for several sexually explicit broadcasts. Two weeks ago, a bill was introduced in Congress that would increase FCC fines for indecency tenfold. Actress Diane Keaton uttered a profanity on a recent awards show and the FCC said it is considering tougher sanctions against indecency, such as broadcast license revocation. Also, Powell has asked his fellow commissioners to overturn a ruling by the FCC's enforcement bureau that determined a profanity uttered by rock singer Bono during an NBC awards broadcast in January 2003 was not indecent. "These guys have been put on clear notice," Cody said. "We are all questioning with great wonder what exactly CBS was thinking. [The FCC] is going after them for this." Cody said FCC lawyers were studying statutes to ascertain how far the agency's authority extends to investigate the incident. "There's not a stone that's going to be left unturned as to what our abilities are," he said. 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Coach Gibbz Rulez!!! Posted February 3, 2004 Share Posted February 3, 2004 Both of you guys need to take another look at the Homicide Rate 1900-2001 chart. It's the only one that covers a sufficiently large timespan. You'll notice that there's a peak in the homicide rate around 1930, and golly-gee-whiz! I wonder why? Could it be....THE GREAT DEPRESSION??? The trough in the 50-60s can rightly be attributed, at least in part, to the period of (relative) social/political calm and economic prosperity that followed WWII. It's been well established that crime and poverty go hand-in-hand. It's also interesting to note that the homicide rate again starts peaking around 1970, and fluctuates slightly up and down throughout the next 20 years. While the 70s began marking another economic downturn, many might wonder why the homicide rate stayed higher, throughout the 80s. Well, contrary to what many people might like to think of as a decade of great economic prosperity, the Reagan years were very tough for the majority of Americans. Sure, jobs grew, but what kind? If we all want to work at Burger King, then the 80s were wonderful. Let's not get into that. I don't want this to turn into a blame game, or a partisan discussion about whose policies did what. That's already been done, so we can all go out and read the books, remeber what we remember, and decide on our own subjective opinions about that. Basically, though, you can see the homicide rate begin to fall again, starting in the early 90s, and it continues to do that, right up to the present. Actually, it's starting to rise again, and I wonder why that might be... Conclusion, you're both right, and you're both wrong. Society isn't necessarily better or worse now, than in the past. You can take one set of measurements and use it to make a point, but even this chart only shows a line going up and down. My point was to draw some correlation, but I'm not going to sit here and say that it's in any way, shape, or form, the final word on the matter. The set of variables that collectively contribute to shifts in social behavior on a national level, are enormous. You could look at global statistics and would probably see some general correlation for these time periods as well, although, they wouldn't be exact. If crime is going down right now, great. That doesn't mean society is better than it was. It's just different. And if you want to harken back to "the good old days," that also is unfair. It's certainly a more open society that we live in today, but that doesn't necessarily make people any more or less immoral. Assuming you bothered to read all of this, I'm sure you won't agree with all of it (or perhaps even any of it), but that's ok. I'm not interested in trying to get people to change their minds. I just read your posts, and decided to add my own insight. I am, by the way, a sociologist. And this is way over-simplified. That's basically my whole point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ancalagon the Black Posted February 3, 2004 Share Posted February 3, 2004 CGR, thank you for that post. I was going to write something about crime being a function of societal prosperity (and, to a lesser extent, of wealth disparity), but you've done a far better job that I could have! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SS-Skin Posted February 3, 2004 Share Posted February 3, 2004 Actually, homicide rates tend to increase during times of prohibition; both acohol and drug. High murder rates (actually gang war casualties) are a natural consequence of prohibition. :2cents: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlitzFiftySix Posted February 3, 2004 Share Posted February 3, 2004 I'm not sure if the pic was posted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Gibbz Rulez!!! Posted February 4, 2004 Share Posted February 4, 2004 Why, thank you, Ancalagon (blushes)... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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