Washington Times: Agents nab <two> w/ terrorist connections crossing U.S. border (in CA)

[Alaskins]

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/dec/30/pakistanis-terrorist-connections-nabbed-us-border/

 

 

The Border Patrol nabbed two Pakistani men with ties to terrorism at the U.S.-Mexico border in September in the latest instance of illegal immigrants from so-called “special interest countries” using the southern border as a point of entry to the U.S.

Muhammad Azeem and Mukhtar Ahmad, both in their 20s and from Gujrat, were caught Sept. 20 by agents south of San Diego and just over the international border from Tijuana. When agents checked their identities through databases they got hits on both of them: Mr. Ahmad popped up as an associate of a known or suspected terrorist, while Mr. Azeem’s information had been shared by a foreign government for intelligence purposes.

 

 

Some scary stuff given the San Bernardino Terror act.

 

 

 Thoughts?

[TradeTheBeal!]

Considering they have been in custody since September and the December shooting in San Bernardino was committed by U.S. Citizens, I'm not really sure how scary this is supposed to be. In fact, it really has no connection to the shootings at all.

[Alaskins]

Considering they have been in custody since September and the December shooting in San Bernardino was committed by U.S. Citizens, I'm not really sure how scary this is supposed to be. In fact, it really has no connection to the shootings at all.

 

I think that it shows a pattern that is concerning.  Especially since there are multiple sources that indicate that BP apprehends less than 30% of crossers.

 

I live in Cali.  It concerning that they were caught there given the violence in SB.

[TradeTheBeal!]

I think that it shows a pattern that is concerning.  Especially since there are multiple sources that indicate that BP apprehends less than 30% of crossers.

 

I live in Cali.  It concerning that they were caught there given the violence in SB.

What pattern?

Cite your BP 30% sources.

[BornaSkinsFan83]

What pattern?

Cite your BP 30% sources.

It's much higher on the California border. They've worked hard to shut that down since the 80's. It's not wide open in the least like Texas and Arizona are. (Source: me)

"Latest instance"...what were the other instances? Because if this is true it's the first confirmed case of terror suspects illegally crossing the southern border that I've heard of. And I seriously doubt coyotes would help people like this. They're trying to money and there's already plenty of it to be made. They don't want this type of heat.

[Alaskins]

What pattern?

Cite your BP 30% sources.

 

 

Beal, I like you brother...  But I could post anything counter to your political views and you'd argue.  Re: pattern, we've discussed in other threads about the other middle easterners caught at the border.  I'd be happy to cite some references if necessary.

 

To be clear, I'm not opposed to immigration from ME countries.  I'm concerned that some ill-meaning folks from those countries have and are getting through our borders.

 

Re the stats, I have to sincerely apologize for the previous post.  My estimate was off.  From CBP's own data, the apprehensions were at 494,397 in FY 2013 and there were 11,300,000 illegal crossers.  That's 23%.  That's the most recent data that I can find from CBP.

 

Source:

 

http://www.dhs.gov/sites/default/files/publications/secretary/14_1009_s1_border_slide_508.pdf#page=26

 

Source:

[BornaSkinsFan83]

Lol 11 million illegal immigrants didn't cross the border in 2013. Are you insane? That's how many illegal immigrants are in the country. Which is down from previous years (newsflash they're going back)

[Alaskins]

LOL, my bad.  I'm terrible at math today.  

 

 

That chart does show an alarming trend.  More agents + less apprehensions given the media coverage that immigration is at a record high.

[BornaSkinsFan83]

And I have no idea how you got 494,397 being 24% of 11,300,000. Either you suck at math or I'm reading you wrong

LOL, my bad. I'm terrible at math today.

That chart does show an alarming trend. More agents + less apprehensions given the media coverage that immigration is at a record high.

The crossings are down and thus the apprehensions are down. The problem is getting better, not worst. And trust me, the San Diego *BORDER* is locked down pretty tight.

[TradeTheBeal!]

Okay. So this is what we have...

Two guys from Pakistan were caught at the border in September.

Two Muslim US citizens killed some former coworkers at a party in December.

I'm supposed to find this frightening, but because I don't....its political.

Our border with Mexico is very large and sparsely populated. There is a great deal of money to be made, and being made, by parties on both sides of the border if it remains largely crossable by those with experience doing so. None of these parties are interested in Jihad of any kind.

You have failed to make any substantive point that should cause any reasonable person to have grave fear of a Jihadi invasion via Mexico....cause it's not gonna happen. ISIS doesn't have the juice. They're not even remotely close.

[BornaSkinsFan83]

Exactly.

It's the politics of fear.

[Alaskins]

Not a smoking gun, but "Other than Mexican" (OTM) apprehensions:

 

FY12: 99,013

FY13: 153,055

FY14: 257,473

 

Sources:

 

https://www.cbp.gov/sites/default/files/documents/U.S.%20Border%20Patrol%20Fiscal%20Year%202012%20Sector%20Profile.pdf

https://www.cbp.gov/sites/default/files/documents/U.S.%20Border%20Patrol%20Fiscal%20Year%202013%20Profile.pdf

https://www.cbp.gov/sites/default/files/documents/USBP%20Stats%20FY2014%20sector%20profile.pdf

 

I'm not saying that there are a majority of ME countries, but surely those are increasing along with the rest?

 

And here is testimony from a CBP agent saying that only 30-40% pf crossers are apprehended

 

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2015/03/17/border-patrol-agent-60-percent-of-illegal-us-mexican-border-crossers-succeed/

 

 

 

Ask any line Agent in the field and he or she will tell you that at best we apprehend 35-40% of the illegal immigrants attempting to cross. This number is even lower for drug smugglers who are much more adept at eluding capture

[TradeTheBeal!]

Not a smoking gun, but "Other than Mexican" (OTM) apprehensions:

 

FY12: 99,013

FY13: 153,055

FY14: 257,473

 

Sources:

 

https://www.cbp.gov/sites/default/files/documents/U.S.%20Border%20Patrol%20Fiscal%20Year%202012%20Sector%20Profile.pdf

https://www.cbp.gov/sites/default/files/documents/U.S.%20Border%20Patrol%20Fiscal%20Year%202013%20Profile.pdf

https://www.cbp.gov/sites/default/files/documents/USBP%20Stats%20FY2014%20sector%20profile.pdf

 

I'm not saying that there are a majority of ME countries, but surely those are increasing along with the rest?

 

And here is testimony from a CBP agent saying that only 30-40% pf crossers are apprehended

 

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2015/03/17/border-patrol-agent-60-percent-of-illegal-us-mexican-border-crossers-succeed/

Nope. They're from Honduras. And links from Breitbart don't carry any water around here...cause they're pure garbage.

[Alaskins]

Yeah, OK...

 

I'm crazy and just spewing fear.  

 

Even though the "two Pakistani guys" are actually two Pakistani guys with ties to known terrorists per the story.

 

Can you awknowlege that there is a chance that the CBP doesn't catch all crossers?  That's reasonable right?

 

OK, now can you awknowledge that these two may represent others that were not caught?

Nope. They're from Honduras. And links from Breitbart don't carry any water around here...cause they're pure garbage.

 

 

Yeah you've said this before, until it was confirmed by other sources.

 

Granted they twist the story to their own ends sometimes, but they are generally right about the core facts.

 

So here's his testimony:

 

http://www.hsgac.senate.gov/download/?id=fc08702f-6bc4-4092-87d8-e5664ff26a47

 

from the Senate.

[TradeTheBeal!]

if I were a black Christian, I'd be scared as hell if a white kid walked into my historically black church. I can give you that.

And yet, I'd still go out in the world every day and deal with white folks and give em the benefit of the doubt.

[Alaskins]

if I were a black Christian, I'd be scared as hell if a white kid walked into my historically black church. I can give you that.

And yet, I'd still go out in the world every day and deal with white folks and give em the benefit of the doubt.

 

 

What in the heck does this even mean?

[TradeTheBeal!]

What in the heck does this even mean?

It means that there are real things to fear but you can't let them rule you. Letting fear of things that haven't ever happened rule you is insanity.

No Jihadi has ever crossed the Mexican border and committed an act of terrorism...ever. So, really, what the heck are you going on about?

What's your angle?

[Alaskins]

My angle is that I'm concerned that 2 guys with terrorist ties were apprehended trying to cross the border in CA.

 

I'm concerned that the appreshension represents others that may be in the US illegally.

 

I was seeking comments on those concerns.

 

That's it.

[Redskins Diehard]

My angle is that I'm concerned that 2 guys with terrorist ties were apprehended trying to cross the border in CA.

I'm concerned that the appreshension represents others that may be in the US illegally.

I was seeking comments on those concerns.

That's it.

Well its not like people wishing to do harm could gain any access to weaponry. That would be impossible.

[Forehead]

If I may be allowed to chime in, considering I actually work for CBP, most of the OTM's are from central America, not the middle East.

Please note these are Border Patrol stats only. Border Patrol handles areas between legal POE's. CBP officers man the legal ports, international airports, etc. Different set of statistics. Middle Easterners who are intent on harm are far more likely to attempt to come on through a legal port with false docs.

I read thousands of these cases per year. You can disagree with me if you would like, and be wrong.

[Redskins Diehard]

If I may be allowed to chime in, considering I actually work for CBP, most of the OTM's are from central America, not the middle East.

Please note these are Border Patrol stats only. Border Patrol handles areas between legal POE's. CBP officers man the legal ports, international airports, etc. Different set of statistics. Middle Easterners who are intent on harm are far more likely to attempt to come on through a legal port with false docs.

I read thousands of these cases per year. You can disagree with me if you would like, and be wrong.

Pretty sure nobody presented an argument that most were middle eastern. Nor would anyone make an argument most middle easterners are terrorists.

Are you disputing the facts of this particular OP? Or are you saying it represents a singular incident that will never be repeated?

Statistics are always on the side of not being the victim of terrorism. Also on the side of not being the victim of a dirty cop....even for black people. In my opinion it doesn't mean you just shrug them off.

[BornaSkinsFan83]

Is 2 people out of 500,000 apprehended on the border every year worth sweating over? .000004%. I think that's the point?

And again this is the first confirmed case so God knows what the stat would be of people apprehended since 9/11. 2 out of millions.

If .000004% kills me then yeah, it sucks but it was probably my time. The odds are so astronomical. I'm not going to live in fear of that. Let me know when they get nuke.

[Redskins Diehard]

Is 2 people out of 500,000 apprehended on the border every year worth sweating over? .000004%. I think that's the point?

And again this is the first confirmed case so God knows what the stat would be of people apprehended since 9/11. 2 out of millions

The percentage of people coming across the border who have terrorist ties is an absolutely inconsequential statistic. It means nothing.

The question is "is this a viable tactic for those who wish to do harm?". And yes there are plenty of other ways to gain access.

Just my observation. But if I'm studying the U.S. as a potential target I'd probably want to understand the ways to gain access. And then whether or not weapons were accessible once I got here. It doesn't take the 75th Ranger Regiment parachuting in to cause fear

[Redskins Diehard]

If .000004% kills me then yeah, it sucks but it was probably my time. The odds are so astronomical. I'm not going to live in fear of that. Let me know when they get nuke.

That percentage you keep referencing is completely irrelevant. And really you shouldn't fear even when they get a nuke. At least from a math perspective. More people survived the bombing of Hiroshima than were killed by it.

[BurgundyMalaise]

You know the Washington Times just COULDN'T WAIT to run this story.