DeSeanA Jackson...

[ArmchairRedskin]

I know one thing is for sure. I've never seen Desean make any game winning catches. Where is he in the clutch? Usually he's busy trying keep his elbows attached to his sides.

[Tweedr01]

I know one thing is for sure. I've never seen Desean make any game winning catches. Where is he in the clutch? Usually he's busy trying keep his elbows attached to his sides.

shhhhhhhh. man between you and hitman you guys are ruining their agenda. don't bring up facts or questions because those aren't necessary when the deseana come out, lol, what a bunch of homers.

[brdawk20]

I know one thing is for sure. I've never seen Desean make any game winning catches. Where is he in the clutch? Usually he's busy trying keep his elbows attached to his sides.

I can only look at a weird stat he has. This year, in games when the score is tied in the second half, he has 8 receptions for 274 yards. That's a whopping 34.2 yards per reception, with 4 td's and three first downs (7 if you count the td's as first downs as well). I can't argue against that; it helps the team too much. He may not get the game winning catch, but he sure as heck helps the team get into position to win. In all situations when the tean was behind, he has 17 receptions, avg. over 11 yards per catch. He has 38 receptions this year. 17 when his team is behind, 8 when tied, and 13 when his team is in the lead. Seems like he gets most of his catches when the team needs it. Calling him not clutch (if there really is a thing called clutch) is not fair. No, he's not going to run across the middle all day, but he doesn't have to. When you have Maclin, Avant, McCoy, Celek, and Vick, no one has to be a superstar.

[ArmchairRedskin]

Game winning catch. It's not as convoluted as your stats there, brd.

I'm saying with time running out and your team behind and driving, where is Desean with the difference making catch? The one that breaks the other team's heart. I know there are other weapons on your team. You guys have a lot of young playmakers. Nobody is saying he has to be then only guy. But as the number one playmaker on that team, he should have one to his credit somewhere, shouldn't he? Maybe he does. I don't know. I've never seen it though. To mee it seems the alligator arming and pressure filled situations seem to go hand in hand with DJ. Wasn't that why his coach grouched at him?

[celj1234]

30+ page thread on a bad player

haha smh @ haters

[Tweedr01]

that is one of the only well thought out deseana responses brdawk, and I can appreciate that kind of rebuttal, although I'm still in agreement with armchair on this.

and lol at birds fans who add nothing to this thread except "haters" because people don't agree with them and that hurts their wittle feewings. it's ok, their half a sentence + haters, with absolutely no facts, stats, or even a real opinion already show that they either have no idea what they are talking about, or aren't very smart. either way it's not helping deseans groupie stereotypes.

[celj1234]

and if he was a skin yall would love him

but instead yall drafted 2 bust

[Hitman21ST]

and if he was a skin yall would love him

but instead yall drafted 2 bust

True. But how does that affect what type of player he is?

Answer: It doesn't. He's still an alligator-arming, can't catch in traffic, afraid of contact, doesn't want to do anything but run deep speed merchant, no matter the color of the jersey he wears.

[celj1234]

True. But how does that affect what type of player he is?

Answer: It doesn't. He's still an alligator-arming, can't catch in traffic, afraid of contact, doesn't want to do anything but run deep speed merchant, no matter the color of the jersey he wears.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zT6Sd8W28XU

moss was never a between the numbers wr

dj has a job and he does his job damn well

the eagles dont need 10 to go over the middle 10plus times a game

he is a top 3 deep threat in the game and he does his job

you all who want to look at his number and numbers only are dumb and prove how much of the game u understand. When DJ is on the field he take 2 players away from the D ALL GAME LONG

why?

because no corner in the league can defend him without help over the top

thus the reason maclin is having a huge year, avant will have 60+ catches as a number 3 wr and mccoy is on pace for 80+ catches

the eagles are avg 5.2 yards a carry this year (1st in the NFL) one reason is vick of course but another is the fact that safties are 20 yards off the LOS on EVERY PLAY

oh and the kid is avg 20+ yards everytime he catches the ball

stop hating on him just because he is one of MANY BIG TIME YOUNG playmakers wearing eagle green

#youngguns

[Hitman21ST]

And you, right after you call us out for posting numbers, post numbers.

Hey pot, this is the kettle, you're black.

Oh, and out of all those stats you just posted, none of them change that he alligator arms a pass whenever there's someone about to hit him, and that he hasn't made a game winning clutch catch in his career. You'd think, with as much of a "deep threat incredible weapon" as he is, he would already have one or two to his name. His playoff stats: 14 catches, 221 yards (15.8 ypc), 2 TDs in 4 games. That's an average of 3.5 receptions, 55.25 yards, and .5 touchdowns per game. That's pretty pedestrian.

[celj1234]

And you, right after you call us out for posting numbers, post numbers.

Hey pot, this is the kettle, you're black.

Oh, and out of all those stats you just posted, none of them change that he alligator arms a pass whenever there's someone about to hit him, and that he hasn't made a game winning clutch catch in his career. You'd think, with as much of a "deep threat incredible weapon" as he is, he would already have one or two to his name. His playoff stats: 14 catches, 221 yards (15.8 ypc), 2 TDs in 4 games. That's an average of 3.5 receptions, 55.25 yards, and .5 touchdowns per game. That's pretty pedestrian.

dont act like this wasnt a big time catch in a big moment

pretty sure this was a big time play in a HUGE game:

and what is this game winning TD catch stat.......thats the mark of a great wr?

lets see the list

[Hitman21ST]

dont act like this wasnt a big time catch in a big moment

pretty sure this was a big time play in a HUGE game:

and what is this game winning TD catch stat.......thats the mark of a great wr?

lets see the list

To quote Armchair, not 10 posts ago:

Game winning catch. It's not as convoluted as your stats there, brd.

I'm saying with time running out and your team behind and driving, where is Desean with the difference making catch? The one that breaks the other team's heart. I know there are other weapons on your team. You guys have a lot of young playmakers. Nobody is saying he has to be then only guy. But as the number one playmaker on that team, he should have one to his credit somewhere, shouldn't he? Maybe he does. I don't know. I've never seen it though. To mee it seems the alligator arming and pressure filled situations seem to go hand in hand with DJ. Wasn't that why his coach grouched at him?

Now, tell me. Does he have one of those? Didn't think so. Big time, sure, but game winning/clinching, late TDs? Nope.

[celj1234]

To quote Armchair, not 10 posts ago:

Now, tell me. Does he have one of those? Didn't think so. Big time, sure, but game winning/clinching, late TDs? Nope.

and where is the list of big time wr game winning tds

ill wait

i know someone from the jags has one this year.......does that make him a better wr then jackson!?!? haha

---------- Post added December-10th-2010 at 04:04 AM ----------

His playoff stats: 14 catches, 221 yards (15.8 ypc), 2 TDs in 4 games. That's an average of 3.5 receptions, 55.25 yards, and .5 touchdowns per game. That's pretty pedestrian.

again another hating a** stat about djack without seeing what other top wr have done

lets look at a decent WR playoff numbers like say RANDY MOSS:

avg 3.9 catch 72yard .8tds

he is about a catch behind what moss does in the playoffs. moss is a 1st ballot HOF WR who is prob the best wr of the decade.......so keep doin what you doin youngin in your 3rd year in this league just having your 24th c-day your doin pretty damn good

haters are gonna hate...even if it was a cure for cancer they would hate

people hate on those that are successful....there wouldnt be a 30 page thread on a skins website about djack if he wasnt doing something damn good

http://www.youtube.com/user/mrljjr11#p/a/u/1/M3yV1MkIDK8

[Hitman21ST]

and where is the list of big time wr game winning tds

ill wait

i know someone from the jags has one this year.......does that make him a better wr then jackson!?!? haha

Nope, it just makes him more clutch. When Jackson has some like Moss (a la Monday Night Miracle and the Jacksonville game) I'll start calling him a clutch receiver who doesn't just show up when there's nothing on the line.

As for the list:

Moss

YZ6i1-e87u8

IKCvtoFqWOQ

Calvin Johnson

LSYDYI4F4xs

Andre Johnson

JII37r-5cT8

Plaxico Burress

Ksw94aJXvTc

Santonio Holmes

BOfouSAAkZY

want more?

[celj1234]

all of those videos are great and i am glad that they all have gw td catches

1 - they have all been in the league longer dj

2 - so what your telling me is dj is just 1 to 2 gw td to being as great as those guys!!!! OMFG!!!

1 game winning td this week vs dallas and then dj is on santanas level LMAO

you know you are desperate for an point againt this kid when you say ........ well he doesnt have as many game winning tds as santana moss so he isnt that good

child please

here ill help you out kid.....if you want to make an argument against dj talk about his 2nd half production during his 2 and half years in the league

he is a much better first half player than 2nd half

but that also has a lot to do with the fact the eagles often have played with a lead in the 2nd and wont take shots down the field

---------- Post added December-10th-2010 at 04:30 AM ----------

pinkston has a GW td catch i guess he is better than jackson

[Hitman21ST]

all of those videos are great and i am glad that they all have gw td catches

1 - they have all been in the league longer dj

2 - so what your telling me is dj is just 1 to 2 gw td to being as great as those guys!!!! OMFG!!!

1 game winning td this week vs dallas and then dj is on santanas level LMAO

you know you are desperate for an point againt this kid when you say ........ well he doesnt have as many game winning tds as santana moss so he isnt that good

child please

Did I say good? I said CLUTCH. BIG difference. When he has a catch like that, I'll consider him CLUTCH. What makes a good receiver great is that he can be counted on to make CLUTCH catches consistently, which DeSean hasn't even had one. When he has one or two to his name, I'll start considering him CLUTCH. But considering that his arms crumple when someone's about to hit him or when it comes time to make a catch like that, it won't be for a long while.

Keep trying to kid yourself that DeSean is on the level of Andre or Calvin Johnson. When you wake up, come start talking to the big boys.

Not desperate for a point, just not buying into the hype for a speed merchant who hasn't shown that he can be counted on to make a play when it counts.

Oh, and way to "pwn" me with your OMFG and LMAO, that definitely shows that you can have an intelligent conversation with someone.

[celj1234]

Did I say good? I said CLUTCH. BIG difference. When he has a catch like that, I'll consider him CLUTCH. What makes a good receiver great is that he can be counted on to make CLUTCH catches consistently, which DeSean hasn't even had one. When he has one or two to his name, I'll start considering him CLUTCH. But considering that his arms crumple when someone's about to hit him or when it comes time to make a catch like that, it won't be for a long while.

Keep trying to kid yourself that DeSean is on the level of Andre or Calvin Johnson. When you wake up, come start talking to the big boys.

Not desperate for a point, just not buying into the hype for a speed merchant who hasn't shown that he can be counted on to make a play when it counts.

Oh, and way to "pwn" me with your OMFG and LMAO, that definitely shows that you can have an intelligent conversation with someone.

pinkston

now that guy is clutch!!!

lmao

and again see the play vs KC he has 2 lbs right on him when he catch the football

ever wr get gator arms from time to time doesnt mean he isnt a damn good WR

mean lie women lie numbers dont

there are a lot of fast guys in this league play WR tell me why they arent putting up DJ's numbers

hester is fast banks is fast breaston is fast

[Hitman21ST]

pinkston

now that guy is clutch!!!

lmao

And this helps your point out how exactly?

[celj1234]

And this helps your point out how exactly?

he has a GW TD he must be legit

the birds have had a lot of fast guys at wr during reids time yet they (besides t.o.) havnt put up djack numbers

the league has a lot of fast guys who dont put up djacks numbers

hmmmmmmmmm must be luck

[Hitman21ST]

he has a GW TD he must be legit

Wow, way to skew my post to try to make you sound right.

I never said that if you have a GW TD, it means you're legit. I said that Jackson isn't clutch because he doesn't have a game winning catch, and that the ability to make clutch catches, when your team needs them the most, is what makes good receivers great. Therefore, until Jackson has one or two to his name, he will continue to be, while a speed merchant, only a good receiver.

---------- Post added December-9th-2010 at 11:54 PM ----------

mean lie women lie numbers dont

there are a lot of fast guys in this league play WR tell me why they arent putting up DJ's numbers

hester is fast banks is fast breaston is fast

What happened to

you all who want to look at his number and numbers only are dumb and prove how much of the game u understand

Oh, and Anthony Armstrong has a higher ypc, with about 4 fewer catches than DeSean. Mike Wallace has a higher ypc than DeSean. Sidney Rice has the same ypc as DeSean, and he only has nine receptions. DeSean is an astonishing 18th in yards per game, and 8th in yards per catch. So, yeah, there are a lot of receivers putting up his numbers.

[Big Blue Joe]

mean lie women lie numbers dont

there are a lot of fast guys in this league play WR tell me why they arent putting up DJ's numbers

hester is fast banks is fast breaston is fast

The problem with Jackson isn't that he is a bad receiver. It's the crazy hype that he gets. There are plenty of fast WR's around the league putting up similar numbers who don't get ridiculous hyperbole attached to their accomplishments. Players like Mike Walace, Mike Williams, and Johnny Knox are all having seasons similar to Desean without people falling all over themselves to call them the best WR's in the NFL. Even "someone from the Jags" Mike Thomas is having a pretty good year.

[Hitman21ST]

The problem with Jackson isn't that he is a bad receiver. It's the ridiculous hype that he gets. There are plenty of fast WR's around the league putting up similar numbers who don't get ridiculous hyperbole attached to their accomplishments. Players like Mike Walace, Mike Williams, and Johnny Knox are all having seasons similar to Desean without people falling all over themselves to call them the best WR's in the NFL. Even "someone from the Jags" Mike Thomas is having a pretty good year.

My favorite part of this whole conversation is how all the DeSean supporters tell everyone else that we can't use stats because "they don't tell the whole story" but then go and use stats to try to help their cause.

[Westbrook36]

DeSean had a 60 yard TD with 4 minutes remaining in the 2008 NFC Championship game which put the Eagles up after coming all the way back against the Cards. The defense folded and the Eagles lost so that makes that catch, as a rookie, not clutch. The rules have been made.

[Westbrook36]

NOT clutch.

Same exact catch as Santana's but the Skins defense held. If they didn't, does that make Moss' GW catch against the Cowboys less clutch?

Man, ST's argument just got blown up. Wonder what the reply will be?

[Hitman21ST]

DeSean had a 60 yard TD with 4 minutes remaining in the 2008 NFC Championship game which put the Eagles up after coming all the way back against the Cards. The defense folded and the Eagles lost so that makes that catch, as a rookie, not clutch. The rules have been made.

Good catch, not a clutch catch. It was first down. If he hadn't made the catch, the Eagles would still have had a chance to drive and score. Had the catch been made on 4th down, or with under a minute to go, then there you go. But as there still was plenty of time, and it wasn't a critical catch (meaning if he doesn't catch it the drive is over), it's not really clutch. It's like hitting a grand slam while down by one with no outs in the 8th. Very good, but not exactly clutch.

---------- Post added December-10th-2010 at 12:21 AM ----------

Same exact catch as Santana's but the Skins defense held. If they didn't, does that make Moss' GW catch against the Cowboys less clutch?

Man, ST's argument just got blown up. Wonder what the reply will be?

Part of the original parameters was "time running out." 4 minutes to go in a football game isn't "time running out." Against the Cowboys, Moss's first catch was on 4th down. Drive over if he doesn't make that catch.

And to answer your question, going by the parameters given, the second catch wasn't clutch. The Skins would have had another chance to score, given that it was 1st and 10. Just because you take a shot deep when you have momentum and the receiver makes a catch doesn't make it clutch.