Looking For Number Four Posted February 5, 2010 Share Posted February 5, 2010 As promised, here is a breakdown regarding the "other" option. I have two feet of snow surrounding my house, so why not, right. 2009 Jason Smith (#2 overall) STL Andre Smith (#6) CIN Eugene Monroe (#8) JAX Michael Oher (#23) BAL 2008 Jake Long (#1 overall) MIA Ryan Clady (#12) DEN Branden Albert (#15) KC Jeff Otah (#19) CAR Sam Baker (#21) ATL Duane Brown (#26) HOU 2007 Joe Thomas (#3 overall) CLE Levi Brown (#5) ARZ Joe Staley (#28) SF Ben Grubbs (#29) BAL 2006 D'Brickshaw Ferguson (#4 overall) NY Jets Davin Joseph (#23) TB Nick Mangold (#29) NY Jets 2005 Jammal Brown (#13) NO Alex Barron (#19) STL *Aaron Rodger (#24) GB *Jason Campbell (#25) WAS Chris Spencer (#26) SEA Logan Mankins (#32) NE 2004 Robert Gallery (#2) OAK *Phillip Rivers (#4) NY Giants *Sean Taylor (#5) WAS Shawn Andrews (#16) PHI Vernon Carey (#19) MIA 2003 Jordan Gross (#8) CAR George Foster (#20) DEN Kwame Harris (#26) SF 2002 Mike Williams (#4) BUF Bryant McKinnie (#7) MIN Levi Jones (#10) CIN *Albert Haynesworth (#15) TEN Marco Colombo (#29) CHI Kendall Simmons (#30) PIT *Patrick Ramsey (#32) WAS Busts Levi Jones (started 40 games, last four years, we saw 1st hand last season) Kendall SImmons (started 16 games 3 of 8 seasons) Mike Williams (was saw 1st hand last season) Kwame Harris (allowed to start 12 of 28 games played in over last two seasons) Robert Gallery (classic bust) Alex Barron (Bulger can handle this one) ------------------------------------------------- Notes Only Kendall Simmons (Guard) and Logan Mankins (Guard) have won Super Bowls... Tony Ugoh was drafted by the Colts in the 2nd round w/ pick 42, he currently protects the Super Bowl favorite Colts's Hall of Fame and former #1 overall QB's blind side... Alan Faneca was drafted with the 26th pick of the 1998 draft, protected blindside for 2 Super Bowl wins... Tarik Glenn was drafted 19th in 1997, protecting Peyton's blindside on the way to winning Super Bowl (2007), also made 3 Pro Bowls ('04-'06) David Diehl protect Eli's blindside on the road to beating NE in the Super Bowl, preventing the 1st ever 18-0, he was drafted w/ pick 180 (rd. 5) Matt Light, Brady's LT in all 3 Super Bowls and 2 time Pro Bowler, was selected pick #48 (Rd. 2) Roman Oben, #66 in round 3, journeyman (Giants, Browns, Bucs, Chargers), ushered Brad Johnson to winning Gruden his only Super Bowl ------------------------------------------------------------ Average lineman with elite QB wins Super Bowls, elite lineman with average QB has not won a Super Bowl in recent history... Courtesy of Grantarchy, quote: I agree - you don't have to draft an o-lineman in the first round. Look no further than the famed hogs. Only one first rounder -- Joe Jacoby - undrafted Jeff Bostic - undrafted Mark May - first round #20 Russ Grimm - third round #69 George Starke - 11th round #272 Not to mention picking up guys like Lachey, back when our FO didn't suck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsHokieFan Posted February 5, 2010 Share Posted February 5, 2010 It is all right here my friend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhouse Posted February 5, 2010 Share Posted February 5, 2010 Jason Smith (#2 overall) STL Andre Smith (#6) CIN Eugene Monroe (#8) JAX Jake Long (#1 overall) MIA Joe Thomas (#3 overall) CLE Levi Brown (#5) ARZ D'Brickshaw Ferguson (#4 overall) NY Jets Robert Gallery (#2) OAK Jordan Gross (#8) CAR Mike Williams (#4) BUF Bryant McKinnie (#7) MIN Levi Jones (#10) CIN Only 25% of those team that picked Oline in the top 10 have accomplished something significant in the nfl. (ARZ, NYJ and MIN). But not a Superbowl. To top it off, there's no indication that drafting those lineman is the cause of appearing in championship games. You can make the argument that Warner is the key for Arz, Favre for MIN and defense for NYJ. I know we need help with our OLine but #4 is too high. If we don't want clausen or bradford then take a playmaker or trade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kvarlo12000 Posted February 5, 2010 Share Posted February 5, 2010 I am sold. Take a QB or trade back! Go OL in the second and fourth. Its a QB league Jason maybe serviceable but I think we tender him and hope someone jumps on it and we get some compensation and can invest that in more OL in rounds 2-4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Looking For Number Four Posted February 5, 2010 Author Share Posted February 5, 2010 It is all right here my friend Very true, thanks for the link... Some good discussion in there. Aaron Rodgers being discussed by Berman, Keiper, and crew with KC on the clock at #15... Mention of Gibbs looking at Campbell despite the hype and push the NFL and scouts were giving Rodgers. Who knows what would have happened had we lost one more game that year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gorebd82 Posted February 5, 2010 Share Posted February 5, 2010 A few things. Tony Ugoh is not a starter for the Colts anymore, his spot was taken by Charlie Johnson (6th rounder). Levi Jones is not a bust. He was a very good player in Cincy before he was plagued by injuries. Also, if Levi Jones is a bust, then so are Davin Joseph and Shawn Andrews. If Gallery is a bust, then so is Vernon Carey because he couldn't cut it at the position he was drafted for. There are also others that are decent linemen, but weren't worth a first. Also, you left Gosder Cherilius off the list. The second half of that 2008 class looks real suspect, but we'll have to wait and see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Looking For Number Four Posted February 5, 2010 Author Share Posted February 5, 2010 I am sold. Take a QB or trade back! Go OL in the second and fourth. Its a QB league Jason maybe serviceable but I think we tender him and hope someone jumps on it and we get some compensation and can invest that in more OL in rounds 2-4. I would love to trade back, the value of the pick is worth MASSIVE amounts and their is tons of talent sitting all over the top 3 rounds; however, both Bradford and Clausen seem like they are Rivers, Manning, so on and so forth. I just do not see that Jamarcus Russell bust written all over it with those guys. With Russell the only thing you herd anyone talking about was that he could throw the ball half a football field from his knees. Absurd. With these guys you debate Bradford's 5 TDs against Texas and Clausen being tutored by Weiss for years to the point of throwing 28 TDs vs. only 4 INTs. Either way, it is win in my book, unless we go Okung. The NFL, now more than ever, is a league where Campbell like QBs don't make the cut. He is very talented and better than many QBs that start on other teams, but he is not going to led his team to a Super Bowl. Sure, there are you Brad Johnson and Trent Dilfer stories, but there are a lot more Roethlisberger, Brady, Manning in the win column. We must find a Peyton Manning, some how some way. Charles Brown will be sitting there in the second and will start for us at LT for many years--- Link: http://www.squidoo.com/2nd_Round_NFL_Mock_Draft Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Looking For Number Four Posted February 5, 2010 Author Share Posted February 5, 2010 A few things. Tony Ugoh is not a starter for the Colts anymore, his spot was taken by Charlie Johnson (6th rounder). Levi Jones is not a bust. He was a very good player in Cincy before he was plagued by injuries. Also, if Levi Jones is a bust, then so are Davin Joseph and Shawn Andrews. If Gallery is a bust, then so is Vernon Carey because he couldn't cut it at the position he was drafted for. There are also others that are decent linemen, but weren't worth a first. Also, you left Gosder Cherilius off the list. The second half of that 2008 class looks real suspect, but we'll have to wait and see. Thank you for adding some great points. Will add Cherilius now. Carey has started 16 games in four straight seasons, plays RT because they draft Jake Long with the #1 overall. If you recall, that move was made by Parcells because he would sign a more reasonable contract the the others the justified the pick and was considered a potential perennial pro bowl LT. Gallery had back surgery and broke his fibilia after numerous seasons getting handled by DE after DE to that point he was move to gaurd. That is a complete debacle. His latest...problem: http://www.fantasysp.com/player/nfl/Robert_Gallery/732118 Shawn Andres made the Pro Bowl in 2006 and 2007: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shawn_Andrews 1st team All-Pro in 2006.... Given 7 year contract in 2006: http://www.philadelphiaeagles.com/team/player3.html Levi was released, signed by us, and then proved why he was released...currently has no contract. I think the Ugoh point really helps drive home the fact we do not need a 1st round tackle. Here is good break down of why Ugoh busted (video): http://www.nfl.com/players/tonyugoh/profile?id=UGO266972 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HailfrmDEN Posted February 5, 2010 Share Posted February 5, 2010 Did you guys know that only two teams a year go to the superbowl. Also the two teams that made it this year have the best OLs in the league. 80% of the lineman on your list are good. A well rounded team gets you wins. One player will not change anything. We need two tackles a guard and a center. We are the only team to not draft oline in the first round since 2001. We dont have depth either. Did we not go to a superbowl because we drafted chis samuels. He was are best lineman. I personaly would like to see us trade back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander Adama Posted February 5, 2010 Share Posted February 5, 2010 Chris Samuels Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted February 5, 2010 Share Posted February 5, 2010 We must find a Peyton Manning, some how some way. The only way we're going to find a Peyton Manning is if the Colts agree to some sort of ridiculous trade. Sorry but that notion is very naive. Guys who are that good are pretty close to a once in a generation talent. There really are only a handful of what most would consider "elite" QBs in the NFL right now. Peyton, Brees, Brady, etc. They certainly don't grow on trees and they certainly don't show up every draft. Even the top picks recently who have had some measure of success early in their NFL careers haven't exactly been world beaters. Ryan and Flacco looked pretty good their first years but also had great surrounding casts. Ryan had a dominant rushing attack and pretty decent OL, Flacco had a good supporting cast on offense as well as a dominant defense that got turnovers and created short fields. Stafford has tons of talent and seems he might have what it takes to be good but he was drafted and then thrown in behind an OL that was almost as bad as ours with a crappy run game. What happened? He got thrown around like a rag doll and ended up injured. Sanchez was one of the statistically worst QBs in the NFL this year, but he had a very good OL, dominant running game, and dominant defense that he rode deep into the playoffs. IMO neither Bradford or Clausen are as good of prospects as Ryan, Stafford, and Sanchez. If our FO REALLY thinks one of them can be great at the next level, then that is fine. IMO they both have possible bust written all over them. Neither are even close a sure thing. If they don't value one of them at 4 and also don't value a LT that high my guess is they will trade back and stockpile OL, and also grab a mid round RB. The teams you mentioned with good OL drafts that weren't top 5 or top 10 picks are also teams that have some of the best scouting departments around and also tend to actually KEEP their draft picks; sometimes trading back as much as possible to stockpile so they can take more later picks and rely on their scouting department to find them a gem or two. The Skins have been the antithesis of this up until now but hopefully with Shanny and Allen that will change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hitman21ST Posted February 5, 2010 Share Posted February 5, 2010 OP, what's with the astericks? We need two tackles a guard and a center. Unless, you're talking about the Redskins specifically (in which case it could be argued we only need one tackle), normally teams have two guards, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gorebd82 Posted February 5, 2010 Share Posted February 5, 2010 Let me start by saying that I'm in complete agreement with your position. I just commented on a few points on the list and want to give some insight into my comments. Carey has started 16 games in four straight seasons, plays RT because they draft Jake Long with the #1 overall. If you recall, that move was made by Parcells because he would sign a more reasonable contract the the others the justified the pick and was considered a potential perennial pro bowl LT. Carey has been a consistent starter, but he wasn't a very good LT. He is a very, very good RT, however. My point was that like Gallery, he was drafted to be the LT of the future, but had to move to another position. Both have become excellent players at their respective position, but weren't worth their draft position because their status was based on the value place on LT. Gallery had back surgery and broke his fibilia after numerous seasons getting handled by DE after DE to that point he was move to gaurd. That is a complete debacle. His latest...problem:http://www.fantasysp.com/player/nfl/Robert_Gallery/732118 Gallery has certainly had his struggles, but has emerged as a great guard for Oakland. Because of this, I put him in the category with Carey. Shawn Andres made the Pro Bowl in 2006 and 2007:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shawn_Andrews 1st team All-Pro in 2006.... Given 7 year contract in 2006: http://www.philadelphiaeagles.com/team/player3.html Levi was released, signed by us, and then proved why he was released...currently has no contract. There has been recent talk that the Eagles should release Shawn Andrews. He had a nervous breakdown and has been consistently injured for the past few years. Same with Davin Joseph, who took a leave of absence because of some other issues. That's why I put them in the category with Levi. Levi was an excellent LT for Cincy before injuries really began to hurt his play and make him more of a liability than an asset. I think the Ugoh point really helps drive home the fact we do not need a 1st round tackle. Here is good break down of why Ugoh busted (video):http://www.nfl.com/players/tonyugoh/profile?id=UGO266972 I concur. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Looking For Number Four Posted February 5, 2010 Author Share Posted February 5, 2010 The only way we're going to find a Peyton Manning is if the Colts agree to some sort of ridiculous trade. Sorry but that notion is very naive. Guys who are that good are pretty close to a once in a generation talent. There really are only a handful of what most would consider "elite" QBs in the NFL right now. Peyton, Brees, Brady, etc. They certainly don't grow on trees and they certainly don't show up every draft. Even the top picks recently who have had some measure of success early in their NFL careers haven't exactly been world beaters. Ryan and Flacco looked pretty good their first years but also had great surrounding casts. Ryan had a dominant rushing attack and pretty decent OL, Flacco had a good supporting cast on offense as well as a dominant defense that got turnovers and created short fields. Stafford has tons of talent and seems he might have what it takes to be good but he was drafted and then thrown in behind an OL that was almost as bad as ours with a crappy run game. What happened? He got thrown around like a rag doll and ended up injured. Sanchez was one of the statistically worst QBs in the NFL this year, but he had a very good OL, dominant running game, and dominant defense that he rode deep into the playoffs. IMO neither Bradford or Clausen are as good of prospects as Ryan, Stafford, and Sanchez. If our FO REALLY thinks one of them can be great at the next level, then that is fine. IMO they both have possible bust written all over them. Neither are even close a sure thing. If they don't value one of them at 4 and also don't value a LT that high my guess is they will trade back and stockpile OL, and also grab a mid round RB. The teams you mentioned with good OL drafts that weren't top 5 or top 10 picks are also teams that have some of the best scouting departments around and also tend to actually KEEP their draft picks; sometimes trading back as much as possible to stockpile so they can take more later picks and rely on their scouting department to find them a gem or two. The Skins have been the antithesis of this up until now but hopefully with Shanny and Allen that will change. Rodgers was primed to go top #5 and dropped to #24, Rivers (pure stud) #4 was traded for #1 Eli Manning (won Super Bowl), Peyton Manning was #1 overall, Roethlisberger was #11 (2 Super Bowls), McNabb was #2 overall, Palmer #1, then add Ryan, Flacco, Stafford, and Sanchez and you have almost every top QB in the NFL. Brees and Favre were both taken in the 2nd round. Therefore, Romo sits to pee-Brady-Warner-Schaub are really more of outliers than typical. If you take a QB at #4 you have a great shot at a top 15 QB and a good shot at a Rivers/Rodgers/Manning/McNabb/Roethlisberger/Palmer.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted February 5, 2010 Share Posted February 5, 2010 OP, what's with the astericks?Unless, you're talking about the Redskins specifically (in which case it could be argued we only need one tackle), normally teams have two guards, too. I think the case could be made that we could use a young starting caliber LT as well as RT. Heyer is just awful and Jones was so bad at LT that I wonder if he would really be much better over on the right side. As far as what he was saying about Guard I think we might have a solid guy in Rinehart (he seemed to come on a bit before his injury) but Randy Thomas is old and can't stay healthy an entire season. Rabach is old and sucks. Good combination. He just doesn't have the size or athleticism to deal with the NTs, etc he has to go up against in the NFCE. He got blown up off the LOS so much that it hurts to even think about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Looking For Number Four Posted February 5, 2010 Author Share Posted February 5, 2010 Let me start by saying that I'm in complete agreement with your position. I just commented on a few points on the list and want to give some insight into my comments.Carey has been a consistent starter, but he wasn't a very good LT. He is a very, very good RT, however. My point was that like Gallery, he was drafted to be the LT of the future, but had to move to another position. Both have become excellent players at their respective position, but weren't worth their draft position because their status was based on the value place on LT. Gallery has certainly had his struggles, but has emerged as a great guard for Oakland. Because of this, I put him in the category with Carey. There has been recent talk that the Eagles should release Shawn Andrews. He had a nervous breakdown and has been consistently injured for the past few years. Same with Davin Joseph, who took a leave of absence because of some other issues. That's why I put them in the category with Levi. Levi was an excellent LT for Cincy before injuries really began to hurt his play and make him more of a liability than an asset. I concur. GREAT Stuff, thanks for posting! Lost of details and logical explanations, love it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HailfrmDEN Posted February 5, 2010 Share Posted February 5, 2010 So you dont like Dockery? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HailfrmDEN Posted February 5, 2010 Share Posted February 5, 2010 OP, what's with the astericks?Unless, you're talking about the Redskins specifically (in which case it could be argued we only need one tackle), normally teams have two guards, too. So dockery isnt good? I know whats positions are in the football offensive line. We are talking about the redskins. Whos starting at right guard next year? Not mike williams. who is starting at center next year? Rabach is a free agent. Who is starting right tackle next year? Heyer is a good backup. Who is goin to start Left tackle? Chris is not coming back. You do know your in the stadium right?:beatdeadhorse: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted February 5, 2010 Share Posted February 5, 2010 Rodgers was primed to go top #5 and dropped to #24, Rivers (pure stud) #4 was traded for #1 Eli Manning (won Super Bowl), Peyton Manning was #1 overall, Roethlisberger was #11 (2 Super Bowls), McNabb was #2 overall, Palmer #1, then add Ryan, Flacco, Stafford, and Sanchez and you have almost every top QB in the NFL. Brees and Favre were both taken in the 2nd round. Therefore, Romo sits to pee-Brady-Warner-Schaub are really more of outliers than typical. If you take a QB at #4 you have a great shot at a top 15 QB and a good shot at a Rivers/Rodgers/Manning/McNabb/Roethlisberger.... Rodgers also sat for, what, 3 years while learning the NFL game in the same system every year before he started? That is why I didn't really count him as a guy who came in very early in his NFL career and had success. Rivers is an excellent QB. Eli is a good but not great QB IMO (nowhere near a Peyton, Brady, Brees) despite the team's SB win. We've already discussed Peyton; pretty much once in a generation player and one of the best to ever play the position. Big Ben is a very good QB but I wouldn't put him in the "elite" class of QBs. When he first started he obviously had success with his team but keep in mind how downright bad he was that year, including a horrid SB performance. He had an outstanding cast and an absolutely dominant defense. Once he had more experience he definitely got more dependable but I still wouldn't put him up there with the elite guys. McNabb is/was a very good QB but also remember that the only truly elite year he had was their deep playoff run with TO on the team. He also isn't the most accurate QB as his career comp % is 59. Contrast that to a guy like Peyton, Brees, Brady. Palmer was #1 overall and was a great prospect. They also sat him a year to get him experience and build the team up a bit. Be that as it may, he has had a couple of excellent years but then some very mediocre ones. He is a very good QB but I wouldn't say that he has necessarily lived up to what one would hope for from a #1 overall pick. Keep in mind I'm not saying that these guys aren't very good QBs; but you were talking about how we "must find a Peyton Manning" and my point is...it just doesn't happen more than once in a very long time. As far as how good your shot is at a top 15 QB, yeah you certainly are more likely to have a better shot at that than if you pick a guy in the 4th round. But the question in hindsight, if the guy you picked top 5 ended up being a good but not great QB (top 15) with a HUGE amount of money invested, did you really do your due diligence when scouting him? Were you just too enamored of some part of his game that you overlooked other weaknesses? How good are your shots at drafting a Peyton type player? Extremely slim. As I said before, with rookie and young QBs in general it is important to have at least some of the building blocks around him in order for him to succeed. We have none. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Looking For Number Four Posted February 5, 2010 Author Share Posted February 5, 2010 OP, what's with the astericks?Unless, you're talking about the Redskins specifically (in which case it could be argued we only need one tackle), normally teams have two guards, too. 1st *= Interesting picks I ran across while doing the research, seems like we were consistently one pick too late, Rodgers and Rivers. Had to point out the Ramsey and Campbell with the respective years that good lineman were taken. Haynesworth also could have been had (#15) which would have given him to us for a much longer period and a good portion of that would have been cheap. 2nd If we did not take Jarmon (4th pick in 3rd) Henson who called us morons (6th): Following the victory, Henson tweeted: "All you fake half hearted Skins fan can .. I won't go there but I dislike you very strongly, don't come to Fed Ex to boo dim wits!!" Barnes (3rd)- We have Smoot, Rogers, and Hall but ZERO depth at o-line Tryon (4th)- Undersized and had TONS of critques against him... D. Thomas, M. Kelly, and F. Davis (2nd X 3)- Have Moss and Cooley, but yeah let us not pick a single lineman in 3 2nd round picks...UGH Did not have a pick in the 2nd, 3rd, OR 4th rounds in 2007 Bringing in Jason Taylor cost us a chance to grab an o-lineman in the 2nd last year or 6th this year... We did not have a 1st, 3rd, or 4th in 2006 We did not have a 2nd or 3rd in 2005 Glenn, 5th round, converted to LB from RB and is now playing for Colts Just a terrible mess, all around, gamble after gamble after.... We need to get a franchise QB, meaning top 10 in league, which either Clausen or Bradford will likely produce. To debate they are not top 5 is one thing, but they will be top 10. Get the lineman in all the other rounds, except maybe 4th where I would go McKnight to add pass catching, speed back, and puts a game changer in the return game. Then, through the off season and next years draft we finish the line and start making this more of a win for a decade than when tomorrow franchise. We can also trade Campbell for 2nd or 3rd which would jump start the lineman revamping process. If do not run a lot of two TE sets, almost no team does, then we could probably add another 2nd or 3rd by trading Davis or Cooley. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gorebd82 Posted February 5, 2010 Share Posted February 5, 2010 The only way we're going to find a Peyton Manning is if the Colts agree to some sort of ridiculous trade. Sorry but that notion is very naive. Guys who are that good are pretty close to a once in a generation talent. There really are only a handful of what most would consider "elite" QBs in the NFL right now. Peyton, Brees, Brady, etc. They certainly don't grow on trees and they certainly don't show up every draft. Even the top picks recently who have had some measure of success early in their NFL careers haven't exactly been world beaters. Ryan and Flacco looked pretty good their first years but also had great surrounding casts. Ryan had a dominant rushing attack and pretty decent OL, Flacco had a good supporting cast on offense as well as a dominant defense that got turnovers and created short fields. Stafford has tons of talent and seems he might have what it takes to be good but he was drafted and then thrown in behind an OL that was almost as bad as ours with a crappy run game. What happened? He got thrown around like a rag doll and ended up injured. Sanchez was one of the statistically worst QBs in the NFL this year, but he had a very good OL, dominant running game, and dominant defense that he rode deep into the playoffs. IMO neither Bradford or Clausen are as good of prospects as Ryan, Stafford, and Sanchez. If our FO REALLY thinks one of them can be great at the next level, then that is fine. IMO they both have possible bust written all over them. Neither are even close a sure thing. If they don't value one of them at 4 and also don't value a LT that high my guess is they will trade back and stockpile OL, and also grab a mid round RB. The teams you mentioned with good OL drafts that weren't top 5 or top 10 picks are also teams that have some of the best scouting departments around and also tend to actually KEEP their draft picks; sometimes trading back as much as possible to stockpile so they can take more later picks and rely on their scouting department to find them a gem or two. The Skins have been the antithesis of this up until now but hopefully with Shanny and Allen that will change. Here's the thing, when Bradford gets his 1st start in 2011, I can see the supporting cast being on par with the situations on those teams. Here me out. First, I think the Skins will have some success next year. We may not win the division, but I wouldn't be surprised to see us sneak into the playoffs. The main reason...competent coaching. Consistency and structure in preparation. Creative game planning and good decision making during the games. Putting players in the best position to be successful. Jim Zorn and Greg Blache did not get the most out of our talent and lost quite a few games for us. I expect Shanahan to begin restructuring the offensive line, re-establishing the run and not asking JC to do too much. That combined with Haslett being more aggressive should but us in the 7 to 9 win area. When Bradford takes the field in 2011, the team around him should be very good. Devin, Malcolm and Fred will be in year 4. Portis will likely have rejuvenated his career. The line should be rebuilt. I wouldn't be surprised to see us add a gamebreaker on offense, maybe a guy like Noel Devine or Shane Vereen. Our defense has all of the elements to have a dominant 3-4 and the transition should be complete for 2011. We have a dominant DL like Ngata in Big Al. We have a dominant edge rusher like Suggs in Orakpo. Hopefully, Haslett can help Laron reach his potential as a dynamic safety. Sam Bradford will be put in an excellent position to be successful immediately and he has the tools to take full advantage and emerge as an elite QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted February 5, 2010 Share Posted February 5, 2010 We need to get a franchise QB, meaning top 10 in league, which either Clausen or Bradford will likely produce. To debate they are not top 5 is one thing, but they will be top 10. No offense but saying that both of those guys with "likely" be top 10 QBs in the NFL is a bit wishful thinking isn't it? Seeing as how neither has taken an NFL snap and both have some pretty decent size question marks. As far as an RB in the 4th I would be more inclined toward Blount, myself. I think he has raised his stock into the mid rounds after his Senior Bowl performance and practices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gorebd82 Posted February 5, 2010 Share Posted February 5, 2010 So dockery isnt good? I know whats positions are in the football offensive line. We are talking about the redskins. Whos starting at right guard next year? Not mike williams. who is starting at center next year? Rabach is a free agent. Who is starting right tackle next year? Heyer is a good backup. Who is goin to start Left tackle? Chris is not coming back. You do know your in the stadium right?:beatdeadhorse: Not too hard to put together a reasonable line for 2010. LT: 2nd rounder (Bruce Campbell or Charles Brown) LG: Dockery C: Lichtensteiger RG: Ben Hamilton (unrestricted FA) RT: Levi Jones This is worst case scenario. Keep building in 2011. Hopefully found a mid-round gem in 2010. Chris Kuper will be unrestricted and doesn't fit McDaniels system. Many other OL will also be unrestricted. The offensive line class is also very deep next year. There's about 8 OTs, 5 OGs, and 2 OCs worthy of consideration in the 1-2 round area. And that doesn't consider juniors. Our offensive line will be ok. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted February 5, 2010 Share Posted February 5, 2010 Not too hard to put together a reasonable line for 2010.LT: 2nd rounder (Bruce Campbell or Charles Brown) LG: Dockery C: Lichtensteiger RG: Ben Hamilton (unrestricted FA) RT: Levi Jones This is worst case scenario. Keep building in 2011. Hopefully found a mid-round gem in 2010. Chris Kuper will be unrestricted and doesn't fit McDaniels system. Many other OL will also be unrestricted. The offensive line class is also very deep next year. There's about 8 OTs, 5 OGs, and 2 OCs worthy of consideration in the 1-2 round area. And that doesn't consider juniors. Our offensive line will be ok. I don't see Bruce Campbell getting past the 1st round. He has had some injury concerns but he is just too athletic and has too much upside. I would guess that, barring a poor combine or individual workouts, he is a mid 1st guy. Charles Brown is an interesting prospect. Athletic and a pretty good finesse player but is light (6'5, 285 I think) and, from what I've read, isn't very powerful so has a hard time dealing with bull rushes in pass pro and getting to the 2nd level in run blocking. If he put on some muscle mass and worked on his strength but kept his finesse qualities he could end up being excellent. I could possibly see him going high 2nd round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted February 5, 2010 Share Posted February 5, 2010 As promised, here is a breakdown regarding the "other" option. I have two feet of snow surrounding my house, so why not, right. Why again are you saying that we shouldn't draft an OL with the 4th pick? Because you're list shows plenty of OL that were top picks that have solidified an OL position on there respective teams. Especially the more recent guys on that list. Also, just because some teams find prospects in the later rounds doesn't mean that should be your 'plan'. I think i've seen a team whose 'plan' was to skip on OL in this 1st and 2nd rounds. And that hasn't worked out so well in my opinion, we didn't find many hidden 'gems' to build our OL. Conversly you mention in another post all the QBs that were taken in 1st round that have made it but you fail to mention all the other QBs taken with top picks that didn't make it and when a QB 'bust' you can't play them at FB or RB. Also, imo to have a 'franchise' QB the team around him has to be good enough to give him a chance to succeed. I'll trust whatever decision they make, but i would prefer to see us trade down or take an OT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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