The Sour Kool Aid Thread - How good is our Defense?

[skinsn24]

Top 5 is a number you made up. Nobody is saying that, unless they are quoting you.

Our full set of starters have played roughly 4 quarters together. That's if you include the Baltimore game without Marcus Washington.

In that time, we have given up 143 yards and 3 points. Those 3 points came because the Titans started their drive on our 28 yard line and kicked a field goal from the 23.

That is lights out defense no matter how you slice it. Turnovers or not.

Umm Isnt a touchdown worth 7?

[laxpck]

I think the yards that McNair threw for are the LAST YARDS THIS DEFENSE GIVES UP THIS WHOLE SEASON.

Season long 0-fer about to get pitched (yes I am excited)

[[[ghost]]]

Was McNair's TD against the first team. I think it was a combination between 1st and 2nd, because I know McIntosh missed on that play, and Taylor was right behind him. I think our Dline was done by that time though.

[skinsn24]

]']Was McNair's TD against the first team. I think it was a combination between 1st and 2nd' date=' because I know McIntosh missed on that play, and Taylor was right behind him. I think our Dline was done by that time though.[/quote']

Lol, i couldnt tell you who our "starting Dline" is as we are going to rotate so many guys.

But lets be real the play was on Rocky and ST, if those are not starters, then i dont know who is.

I mean if ST gets beat i think we can put it agaisnt the first team. He is an "all pro"

EDIT: Just check the game book to see who else was playing that drive. Let it be known the TD was scoed with 9:40 to play in the second quater, so that alone should tell you it was the first team.

Here are other players on the field: Golston, Fletcher, Mongomery, Daniels, Landry, Mcintosh, Taylor, smoot, rogers...

I think you get the picture.

[APBT]

Based on the pre-season, some here are predicting a monster defense this year. I've seen a "12-4" defense or top 5 defense as "realistic" predictions in other threads.

While we seem to have learned how to tackle (this is a BIG step forward), I'm not seeing domination here. Lets take the Baltimore game:

1. How many turnovers did our first team defense get?

2. How good was our front four pressure on McNair? Here's a hint - McNair was 14/19 with one TD and no INTs.

3. Yeah, Baltimore only scored 7 points, but had a bevy of penalties. Every time they seemed to get something going, they followed it up with a few illegal procedure penalties. So was it our top 5 D which stopped them from scoring or was it Baltimore's mistakes?

I will say that our run defense on the first team looks much improved, but It certainly helps though when all-pro tackle Jonathan Ogden takes the game off.

Bottom line, it's certainly fair to say that our speed improved, and our open field tackling has taken enormous strides. For this reason, we can certainly have a very realistic hope for a better defense. But without turnovers, our defense will only be average at best (which is still a huge improvement). It's also a fair prediction to say that our front four isn't gonna inspire fear this year. LBs and safeties? Perhaps...

Very good argument. I was concerned about our lack of defensive pass rush as well as our teams lack of turnovers and then I realized Greg Williams has never really had many turnovers and we will be Okay.

The name of the game is to get the ball back to our offense and if that means lack of pass rush and lack Turn overs, then I'll take the 3 and outs, all day.

[SinisterJay]

All I can say is that defense this year will be better than last years........

[kevin11]

Our defense didnt force many TO in 2005 either. We dont force alot of TO. Our defense isnt that talented, but im sure we can be a top15 defense with only having TO in the middle. He have a QB who doesnt throw many interceptions and Portis who unlike BEtts can hold onto a ball.

Im sure we wont be putting our defense in bad positions.

[kevin11]

Umm Isnt a touchdown worth 7?

:doh:

its worth 6.

[skinsn24]

:doh:

its worth 6.

touche! The 7ths point i guess techincally is scored agaisnt the special teams. I dont know how it is offically scored (as in if it counts agaisnt total defensive points given up).

Either way, nice detective work.

[kevin11]

touche! The 7ths point i guess techincally is scored agaisnt the special teams. I dont know how it is offically scored (as in if it counts agaisnt total defensive points given up).

Either way, nice detective work.

its given to kicker. Now, is the 2 point coversion considered part of the QB stats?

[skinsn24]

its given to kicker. Now, is the 2 point coversion considered part of the QB stats?

Yes i know the points are scored to the kicker, i am asking if the extra point is scored agaisnt the defense. I assume it is becuase a field goal is, however an int for a TD is not scored agaisnt the D.

QBs only score points if they make it into the endzone, whoever catches a 2 pointer is given 2 points, the qb is not credited with any official point, except 2 fantasy points.

[jimster]

]']Was McNair's TD against the first team. I think it was a combination between 1st and 2nd' date=' because I know McIntosh missed on that play, and Taylor was right behind him. I think our Dline was done by that time though.[/quote']

I think our projected starting DL were done after the first defensive series it seemed. After that, it looked to be a mixture - Carter stayed on, but Montgomery Evans and Golston came in, then Carter out, Wilson, in,etc.

[skinsn24]

I think our projected starting DL were done after the first defensive series it seemed. After that, it looked to be a mixture - Carter stayed on, but Montgomery Evans and Golston came in, then Carter out, Wilson, in,etc.

Lets be real guys that TD was on the first team D..Smoot, Rogers, Fletcher, Taylor, Landry and Daniels.

I beleive Golston is a starter as is Daniels. Monty started that game as well.

Please no excuses for that TD. Mcnair beat Rocky and ST plain and simple.

[angel2]

Based on the pre-season, some here are predicting a monster defense this year. I've seen a "12-4" defense or top 5 defense as "realistic" predictions in other threads.

While we seem to have learned how to tackle (this is a BIG step forward), I'm not seeing domination here. Lets take the Baltimore game:

1. How many turnovers did our first team defense get?

2. How good was our front four pressure on McNair? Here's a hint - McNair was 14/19 with one TD and no INTs.

3. Yeah, Baltimore only scored 7 points, but had a bevy of penalties. Every time they seemed to get something going, they followed it up with a few illegal procedure penalties. So was it our top 5 D which stopped them from scoring or was it Baltimore's mistakes?

I will say that our run defense on the first team looks much improved, but It certainly helps though when all-pro tackle Jonathan Ogden takes the game off.

Bottom line, it's certainly fair to say that our speed improved, and our open field tackling has taken enormous strides. For this reason, we can certainly have a very realistic hope for a better defense. But without turnovers, our defense will only be average at best (which is still a huge improvement). It's also a fair prediction to say that our front four isn't gonna inspire fear this year. LBs and safeties? Perhaps...

Just what are you saying? Your thread is premature and should wait until the real season gets underway - at least the 3rd game before you can climb back up on the fense.

[jimster]

Lets be real guys that TD was on the first team D..Smoot, Rogers, Fletcher, Taylor, Landry and Daniels.

I beleive Golston is a starter as is Daniels. Monty started that game as well.

Please no excuses for that TD. Mcnair beat Rocky and ST plain and simple.

I'm not being unreal. I am responding to the question about our D-line. McNair didn't score that TD - the WR that was able to make Rocky miss did.

Seeing how it took ten quarters of play to score a TD on our D, no matter who is playing, is encouraging.

[skinsn24]

I'm not being unreal. I am responding to the question about our D-line. McNair didn't score that TD - the WR that was able to make Rocky miss did.

Seeing how it took ten quarters of play to score a TD on our D, no matter who is playing, is encouraging.

I am not saying out D is not promising this all started with someone saying our Starters only gave up 3 points so far, which is unreal and false.

Also stating the Golston, Daniels and Montgomery are not possible starters it false.

[mi6]

I think the Skins defense will be much improved this upcoming regular NFL season. They have improved the quality of LBs - speed and tackling capabilities, and the secondary is much better.

Sean and Laron are going to be a good tandem. The weak link here is Carlos Roger - who in my opinion is a first round bust. This is his year to shine - if not, we need to draft a franchise shut down corner next year!

We are not in the top 10 yet ... but getting there.

[adamyesme1111]

2. How good was our front four pressure on McNair? Here's a hint - McNair was 14/19 with one TD and no INTs.

And the reason you didn't include the yards...was because all the passes were short 3-5 yard outs, that the defence ended up swarming on the ball carrier.

[kevin11]

2. How good was our front four pressure on McNair? Here's a hint - McNair was 14/19 with one TD and no INTs.

And the reason you didn't include the yards...was because all the passes were short 3-5 yard outs, that the defence ended up swarming on the ball carrier.

Mcnair was 14/19 for 98 yards. That sucks. What is the average? 7 something? 6 something?

w00t 2222 posts. I want 6666 posts.!!!!

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

I think the defense is going to be dramatically improved simply because it can actually tackle now. Tackling was kind of a problem last year.

I think Top Five is a little optimistic, because I still think our Front Four is ordinary at best. But, I can see it ranking somewhere in the 10 to 15 range.

[kevin11]

Yes i know the points are scored to the kicker, i am asking if the extra point is scored agaisnt the defense. I assume it is becuase a field goal is, however an int for a TD is not scored agaisnt the D.

QBs only score points if they make it into the endzone, whoever catches a 2 pointer is given 2 points, the qb is not credited with any official point, except 2 fantasy points.

Its not scored against the D cause the offense unit is out there.

[kevin11]

I think the defense is going to be dramatically improved simply because it can actually tackle now. Tackling was kind of a problem last year.

I think Top Five is a little optimistic' date=' because I still think our Front Four is ordinary at best. But, I can see it ranking somewhere in the 10 to 15 range.[/quote']Our top 4 is good at stopping the run. So ordinary is a little harsh.

[jimster]

Also stating the Golston, Daniels and Montgomery are not possible starters it false.

I never said Daniels or Golston were not starters, but Evans and Montgomery clearly are not at this time and I believe they were in the game when the TD was scored. Every player on the team is a "possible" starter. So stating that someone that is a "possible" starter who is not really a starter is false. Are you starting to see the starter menatlity starting to start?

http://www.redskins.com/team/depthchart.jsp

Geez. Why is everyone so defensive today?

[skinsn24]

I never said Daniels or Golston were not starters, but Evans and Montgomery clearly are not at this time and I believe they were in the game when the TD was scored. Every player on the team is a "possible" starter. So stating that someone that is a "possible" starter who is not really a starter is false. Are you starting to see the starter menatlity starting to start?

http://www.redskins.com/team/depthchart.jsp

Geez. Why is everyone so defensive today?

Uhh Montgomery started that game. So tell me how he was not part of the starting D?

[jimster]

Uhh Montgomery started that game. So tell me how he was not part of the starting D?

are you serious? I gave you a link and everything. Because he started a pre-season game, he's now a starter? So is Heyer and Pucillo starters too?

http://www.redskins.com/team/depthchart.jsp

Position 1st String 2nd String 3rd String

LDE 93 - Phillip Daniels 97 - Renaldo Wynn 90 - Alex Buzbee

LDT 96 - Cornelius Griffin 94 - Anthony Montgomery 71 - Bryant Shaw

RDT 64 - Kedric Golston 95 - Joe Salave'a 79 - Lorenzo Alexander

RDE 99 - Andre Carter 92 - Demetric Evans 77 - Chris Wilson

SLB 53 - Marcus Washington 50 - Khary Campbell 55 - Dallas Sartz

MLB 59 - London Fletcher 54 - H.B. Blades 56 - Kevin Jones

WLB 52 - Rocky McIntosh 59 - Anthony Trucks

LCB 24 - Shawn Springs 27 - Fred Smoot 35 - Jerametrius Butler

RCB 22 - Carlos Rogers 38 - David Macklin 32 - Ade Jimoh

SS 30 - LaRon Landry 20 - Pierson Prioleau 39 - Vernon Fox

FS 21 - Sean Taylor 37 - Reed Doughty