shk75 Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 where did all the poeple go that existed before Christ did they go to heaven or hell to or what sorry if it sounds dumb but i am really curious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsburySkinsFan Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 You'd have to understand the Hebrew understanding of Sheol. [edit] Many people, like myself, believe that the idea of Sheol; the place of the dead, commonly translated as Hell or Hades; is still the the same today as it was then. Think of it like a place where all go until the end times when the final judgment will come. But, not all hold this view. Many today believe that Heaven is the end place for those in Christ, and that heaven is a spiritual realm only. However, if one takes the message of Revelation seriously and understands that there is a very real resurrection and a very real "new heaven and a new earth" then heaven cannot be the final place, but instead must then be the intermediary place for all the dead until the final judgment. There will however, be those who disagree, and that's fine they are free to do so, but if they do then they have to explain how Christians are promised a very real resurrection with a body like the resurrected Jesus which was very real and physical.[/edit] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shk75 Posted January 4, 2007 Author Share Posted January 4, 2007 funny you say that because i do since i am jewish but it still does not make sense to me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prophet Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 not an expert on this but.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abraham's_bosom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shk75 Posted January 4, 2007 Author Share Posted January 4, 2007 ahhhh i get what they are saying but it just seems kind of fishy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsburySkinsFan Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 funny you say that because i do since i am jewish but it still does not make sense to me Check my edit, sorry I was a little quick on the trigger to publish my post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryman of the North Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 according to one priest that Iasked this question, the people of the book (ie jews and muslims) went to heaven because until Jesus came and made beliefe in him a requiremnt for heaven as long as you followed Yahweh you were good to go. however another priest I asked said "no non christians ever went to heaven" and when I asked about moses and john the baptist (who died before Jesus) he made me go sit in a corner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryman of the North Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 ahhhh i get what they are saying but it just seems kind of fishy thats should be voted in as one of the best puns of the year even if it was untintentional. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shk75 Posted January 4, 2007 Author Share Posted January 4, 2007 hey asbury thanks for the edit i defintely get where you are coming from and i respect that idea but like the guy stated before me it is just weird that a guy like moses who is so important or a guy like abraham would not go to heaven guess that my jewish bias lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prophet Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 according to one priest that Iasked this question, the people of the book (ie jews and muslims) went to heaven because until Jesus came and made beliefe in him a requiremnt for heaven as long as you followed Yahweh you were good to go. however another priest I asked said "no non christians ever went to heaven" and when I asked about moses and john the baptist (who died before Jesus) he made me go sit in a corner. Thats some pretty lacking priests you got that info from Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shk75 Posted January 4, 2007 Author Share Posted January 4, 2007 thats should be voted in as one of the best puns of the year even if it was untintentional. lol that was definetely unintentional guess it was divine intervention haha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prophet Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 hey asbury thanks for the edit i defintely get where you are coming from and i respect that idea but like the guy stated before me it is just weird that a guy like moses who is so important or a guy like abraham would not go to heaven guess that my jewish bias lol. Oh they are there! I'm looking for something now that will explain it pretty well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsburySkinsFan Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 according to one priest that Iasked this question, the people of the book (ie jews and muslims) went to heaven because until Jesus came and made beliefe in him a requiremnt for heaven as long as you followed Yahweh you were good to go. however another priest I asked said "no non christians ever went to heaven" and when I asked about moses and john the baptist (who died before Jesus) he made me go sit in a corner. Both of these priests are working with the Augustinian understanding of Heaven and Hell which is understandable if they are Catholic, the problem is that the Hebrew understanding of Sheol predates Augustine and the Hellenistic influences, and thus reflects more of a Jewish understanding which is what the 1st century Christians considered themselves, thus why would they abandon their beliefs about the after-life and re-create entirely different cosmology? To me it makes no sense, therefore it seems much more sensible to understand how the 1st century Jews understood things in order to get a clearer picture of the reality that is being handed to us through the New Testament. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shk75 Posted January 4, 2007 Author Share Posted January 4, 2007 wow asbury you know your stuff lol i am reform so i don't know as much as i should but there are so many things left to be interpreted that you could just sit there all day and go crazy trying to understand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsburySkinsFan Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 hey asbury thanks for the edit i defintely get where you are coming from and i respect that idea but like the guy stated before me it is just weird that a guy like moses who is so important or a guy like abraham would not go to heaven guess that my jewish bias lol. But, you see Abraham and Moses and all those who predate Christ are going to be judged according to the Abrahamic Covenant. Abraham was reckoned as righteous according to his faithfulness not his works, the same goes for Moses, Christ is simply the fulfillment of the Abrahamic covenant and the keystone event in the redemption of humanity through faith. Abraham and Moses will be judged upon their faith in God as God had revealed Himself to them, those after Christ will be judged according to their faith in Christ as Christ has been revealed to them in the same manner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shk75 Posted January 4, 2007 Author Share Posted January 4, 2007 AHHHHHH ok i get what you mean now thanks alot.....on another note this may seem like the stupidest question ever but i always wanted to know why is christmas not they new year? see january 1st is the new year and our calendar is the christian calendar therfore the new year should start when christ was born but it starts 7 days after....why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsburySkinsFan Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 wow asbury you know your stuff lol i am reform so i don't know as much as i should but there are so many things left to be interpreted that you could just sit there all day and go crazy trying to understand. LOL, I've been in the pastorate for 10 years, my Bachelor's degree is in Christian Pastoral studies, and I am in my 3rd year of Seminary. After that much exposure some stuff tends to stick. And, yes you can sit for a very long time trying to understand, in fact the church has been wrestling with these same things for since the dawn of the church and throughout the history of humanity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsburySkinsFan Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 AHHHHHH ok i get what you mean now thanks alot.....on another note this may seem like the stupidest question ever but i always wanted to know why is christmas not they new year? see january 1st is the new year and our calendar is the christian calendar therfore the new year should start when christ was born but it starts 7 days after....why? From my understanding when the Gregorian calendar was developed it was done with the lunar cycle in mind, why it wasn't done with the religious cycle in mind I'm not sure. I'm actually clueless as to why January 1st isn't on Christmas, Easter or Rosh Hashanah. I guess we'd have to check on the history of the development of the calendar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shk75 Posted January 4, 2007 Author Share Posted January 4, 2007 ok cool its just weird that the calendar is B.C. but yet he would have been born before christ who is himself AHHHHH im confusing myself lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prophet Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 ok cool its just weird that the calendar is B.C. but yet he would have been born before christ who is himself AHHHHH im confusing myself lol. December 25 isn't the date that Jesus was born. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shk75 Posted January 4, 2007 Author Share Posted January 4, 2007 so then when was he born? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prophet Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 so then when was he born? I'm not exact on this, but I think it was in the summer months. December 25th was picked to coincide witht he roman celebration of starunalia. If I'm not mistaken? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shk75 Posted January 4, 2007 Author Share Posted January 4, 2007 but then why would his birthday and the new year be a different day if the calendar starts on his birthday and we use terms such as BEFORE CHRIST, sorry if i am being stubborn i was just always curious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prophet Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 but then why would his birthday and the new year be a different day if the calendar starts on his birthday and we use terms such as BEFORE CHRIST, sorry if i am being stubborn i was just always curious. Because people back then were not to bright? :laugh: I have no idea Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shk75 Posted January 4, 2007 Author Share Posted January 4, 2007 lol good answer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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