MCnDaHouse Posted October 24, 2006 Share Posted October 24, 2006 We had a top 5 defense 2 years ago. I think now defense is our biggest problem. Just want to see what everyone's opinion is on what went wrong. The coaching staff is basically the same. So what caused our defense to fall apart? Opinions? I'll step out on a limb and say that now in hindsight, the loss of Antonio Pierce may actually be the biggest factor. His understanding of the defense and making the adjustments was the glue that held things together. Couple that with injuries to Priolou (sp?), Springs and the DT's and the wheels have come off. MC :logo: :dallasuck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@DCGoldPants Posted October 24, 2006 Share Posted October 24, 2006 its the front office. They want the big name again. Instead of hungry blue collar guys. We're loading up with guys who are getting paid without having to prove anything. Marshall is blue collar, Adam is not. Andre is not. Phillip had something to prove. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CounterTrey Posted October 24, 2006 Share Posted October 24, 2006 Lookign at how good AP is right now..letting him go was such a stupid move. If you look at our demise, its mainly because our FO always does a knee jerk reaction when if we left things they way they were we would be really good. Letting go of AP and Ryan Clark totally ruined our chemistry. AP knew our defence inside out and he was a big loss. Its like we deserve to be this bad because our FO thinks it always knows best. I want to go over to Redskins Park and smack the FO again and again for letting AP go, he really was our captian out there. Imagine him and Washington and Rocky in the lineup. Its like Pierce was G Williams out on the field, he knew excelty how we should line up and could cover sideline to sideline. Such a shame..we made this guy only to let him go to a NFC East Rival. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fifty Gut Posted October 24, 2006 Share Posted October 24, 2006 we aren't the same without Big Joe and Griff in the middle, healthy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins11 Posted October 24, 2006 Share Posted October 24, 2006 I think our defense would still be bad this year with Clark, but not nearly as bad. If we had Pierce AND Clark, we wouldn't be bad since Pierce would know what position everyone should be in. If we had Pierce (with Marshall moved to weakside and no Warrick Holdman at all), Clark, and Griff, Joe and Springs were healthy, we'd be good again. The combination of injuries and player departure has taken its toll... and it's been ugly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimm Posted October 24, 2006 Share Posted October 24, 2006 I think the biggest problem is with the secondary. Springs and Rogers being hurt has made us use nickleback as starters and Archuletsa lack of coverage has caused a problem, which is made worse by Prioleau not being there. I dont think Williams is confident enough in the secondary to bring major blitzes which would leave our corners alone in coverage. I think it will improve once Springs and Rogers are healthy and Vincent picks up the system a little more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trillskinsfan Posted October 24, 2006 Share Posted October 24, 2006 NO AP we have two weak LB MArshall is ok ,but he just isnt a MLB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Execution56 Posted October 24, 2006 Share Posted October 24, 2006 Where do I start...? Don't blame the baker when the butcher bakes the bread. In other words, we need a personel man. We need a GENERAL MANAGER! For starters, Vinny Cerrato needs to be fired! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwills1 Posted October 24, 2006 Share Posted October 24, 2006 Smoot, Peirce, Clarck, Arrington..... I mean lets face it people...Lemar Marshall IS NOT A STARTING MLB in this league! This defense hasn't been the same since Peirce left!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neophyte Posted October 24, 2006 Share Posted October 24, 2006 If you guys think for a minute that Gregg Williams and his staff did not sign off on letting the guys go who are gone and bringing in the new ones, you are nuts. Don't blame the "front office". It is a nice thought but I would bet you Williams was licking his chops over the blitz packages he could dial up using Arch. I would also bet Williams and Blache both thought they could get more of Carter than anyone else ever had. I am sure Williams signed off on not countering the Pierce offer from the Giants (I believe I have read where he said as much). No, if you are blaming the talent we have brought in and the talent we have let go then you have to blame Williams. He has a giant ego. Reportedly near legendary. He has said repeatedly that it is not the players who make the defense a success but the system and if that is true than any player should do. If I had to point to just one or two personel moves that have gotten us here, I would say letting Pierce go and signing Carter this last off season instead of Howard. The Giants and the Eagles are both reaping the rewards of those signings while we are hurting from not having gotten them. Add to that fact that Marshall was a much better WILL than Holdman while Pierce was/is a much better MLB than Marshall and you can see the issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Gibbs II Posted October 24, 2006 Share Posted October 24, 2006 Although this woudlnt necessarily be for the best, just imagine this.. Smoot, Springs, Clark, ST, Pierce, lamar (hes good, i dunno wtf you are saying), and Marcus.. that would be just sick Of course, smoot was a dick and i didnt mind him leaving, but right now pierce and clark are biting us in the ass. But pierce isnt the reason, he helped the Defense a lot in 04, but he didnt make us go from 9th to 26th this year. The biggest thing in the loss from clark was that clark wouldnt give up the big play that much and seemed to be quicker on the field. QBs are smart enough to just take a quick look in the 2ndary and see if the saftey is playing a hair too close. Then the Qb pulls the trigger. Thats what happens to arch EVERY GAME. With clark, he may not have been the best, but its not instinctual for a QB to throw to a guy with a saftey in the area and a corner on his back... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beaudry Posted October 24, 2006 Share Posted October 24, 2006 We can't stop the run like we could before, so I'm voting for injuries to the DL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwbiggs Posted October 24, 2006 Share Posted October 24, 2006 They have no depth...once you get a few ist stringers injured we have no quality backup. We blew our load on high priced FA's and gave away our draft picks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwills1 Posted October 24, 2006 Share Posted October 24, 2006 You guys under-estimate the value of Antonio Peirce and his ability to quarterback the defense. Calling out audibles and getting guys in the right place! Peirce was the truth! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATCRedskin82 Posted October 24, 2006 Share Posted October 24, 2006 Gregg williams think he can scheme up anything and plug whoever in. The ego of the coaching staff has hurt the defense as a whole. This team has lost talent on that side of the ball and replaced it players who make us even worse. Letting Smoot, Clark, Pierce, and Arrington go has been a harder thing to fix than originally thought. Im not saying we should have kept them all..but 2 of those names might make a difference right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins11 Posted October 24, 2006 Share Posted October 24, 2006 No, if you are blaming the talent we have brought in and the talent we have let go then you have to blame Williams. He has a giant ego. Reportedly near legendary. He has said repeatedly that it is not the players who make the defense a success but the system and if that is true than any player should do. Yeah, exactly. A lot of this could have been prevented. This is why we need a personnel guy to keep checks on BOTH Williams and Gibbs so we don't overpay for guys like Archuletta, Brunell, etc. Hopefully the ATROCIOUS defense we have with second/third string players is a wakeup call to him/coaching staff/"front office" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest NebraSKIN Posted October 24, 2006 Share Posted October 24, 2006 It is really quite simple. We have a lot of average players that had been playing above their potential. Then you add injuries. Losing your "shut down" corner hurts. What other team in the league could stop the run with two backup, rookie DTs? Then also add to the equation that offenses have had sufficient time to find ways to beat our pressure D. Throw in constant change of personnel from year to year. Factor in an offense that cannot stay on the field . . . . And there you have it. An average defense at best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCnDaHouse Posted October 24, 2006 Author Share Posted October 24, 2006 Arrington (and I don't want to turn this into a debate on his ability) wasn't playing much under Williams, so that would not be a factor in this debate. I'm looking at why we dropped from a top D 2 yrs ago to where we are now. I think Chemistry and the ability for the defense to adapt and adjust are huge. You can plug in all the players you want to but unless they are all on the same page it won't work. Even though I was ok with Pierce leaving, now that I look back I see that we haven't found anyone to adequately replace him. Lemar has done a great job, but it just isn't the same. I see glimpses of us being a decent defense at times but it just isn't consistent. The pieces just aren't fitting together. I think if the DTs were healthy we'd be ok against the run. But I don't think we'll be able to pass defend well unless we can generate consistent pressure. It wouldn't matter if we had Darrell Green in his prime on both corners if you can't pressure the passer you will get picked apart. So I do see some room for improvement, but the big thing I see is that we lost our field general/defensive QB and it appears he was the glue that held it together. MC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldflyerBob Posted October 24, 2006 Share Posted October 24, 2006 Amen!! Williams' ego. He seems to actually believe he can create a purse out of a sow's ear. Because he "created" Antonio Pierce he seems to think he can do it over and over again. The linebacking is simply awful. That being said, when you take Griffin and Salevea out of the middle of your line and Shawn Springs out of your backfield, you have tremendous voids. On MNF one of the yakkers actually said something that made sense. I think it was about the Giant's DC. He finally realized that he had to simplify things and let the players play. I honestly believe that Williams--and Saunders for that matter-- have created monsters with their scheming that inhibit the players from making plays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-Prime Posted October 24, 2006 Share Posted October 24, 2006 All of the above? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hail Gibbs Posted October 24, 2006 Share Posted October 24, 2006 we aren't the same without Big Joe and Griff in the middle, healthy It showed last year and it shows this year. When Griff is out of the lineup or banged up we have been gashed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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