BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93

I think we have the same type of range for Sam except you obviously think his ceiling is higher. I think his best case upper bound outcome is Kirk. It’s my opinion that you can’t pay guys like that unless you’re in your contention window and have a roster chock full of young, cost controlled talent. We obviously don’t have that so with a potential high draft pick in April, I’d be willing to gamble on another guy with higher upside. In my mind, it’s a bit of waste to go into 2024 with Sam, thinking/knowing he has a middling ceiling and that he’s due a big raise in the ‘25 offseason. However, if you still think his ceiling is pretty high (and we’ve seen folks in this thread say they’d rather him than Josh Allen and Jalen Hurts) then I guess it makes sense and give him another year.

Yeah he’s a solid young player with upside. He’s also going to likely wear a 4-13 finish that likely will give the team a chance at QB with even bigger upside. It’s not just a Sam debate at this point. The last few weeks has sent the season to hell and now all options are on the table.

Without question lol. That would be a ridiculous trade for NE to make. They would then have 2 young QBs on their roster that they’d be unsure about extending in the next year or so.

It literally has to matter. There are financial implications tied directly to where someone is drafted.

I will say that Bienemy sucks and there’s a reason why he’s never gotten a shot as a HC. The tough guy **** only works if your offense is elite or at least QB’d by Mahomes

But he’s not being the driving force behind the offense. If he’s just going to be a passenger to everything surrounding him, he’s not the guy. There will be a lot of changes next year but he likely still won’t have an ideal situation next season either. And then after that, we have to start talking money. I was really hoping Sam could get to the point where he legitimately was a solid QB that was capable of leading a capable offense every week. Where I could go into a week and say “well they’ve be underdogs of course but I know the offense will be good so we definitely have a chance.” Instead there’s even more questions. It will always be harder for him to get the validation he needs bc 1) he wasn’t picked by the football ppl hired by current ownership and 2) he’s a 5th round pick. He pretty much has to be how Shroud is and reach out and take it. He’s not doing it. In fact, he’s regressing and looking exactly how you’d think a 5th round pick would look. You cannot finish 4-13 and struggle to score 20 points and expect to be a starter the next season if you’re someone in his position. Maybe he lucks out and it’s not realistic to acquire one. If so, he better be ready to go from week 1 on.

I think I’m out on Sam at this point. I won’t freak out if they start him next year but I’ll definitely have lowered expectations. I always thought his absolute ceiling was Kirk but I’m not sure he gets there. Too much working against them and not all of it is his fault. That’s part of the life of late round players. He has arm talent and some off schedule ability but he doesn’t look like a franchise QB to me. Just my opinion. The offense stinks. If he was truly The Guy, it wouldn’t stink. They struggle to score TDs. They struggle to sustain drives. His deep ball accuracy is spotty. Being a “gamer” and “tough” is cool but if those are the best words you can use for a QB, you’re usually describing a backup. Really remind me of Gardner Minshew and before you all freak out, I think Minshew is a fine Qb. Just not a guy anybody wants to have long term. Again, just my opinion. If he’s the QB again next year, I hope he proves me wrong. He really had a chance to guarantee his future by playing well. No one expects wins but a functional offense would suffice. Now, I think his best hope is that 4-13 is too good a record to secure a top QB without a potentially costly trade up. I’m not sure I’m comfortable trading up for a QB based off the history of doing that. However, performances like today are his floor and it’s a really ugly floor.

I’ve been reading some version of this post on ES for about 14 years now.

Ron Rivera is well liked around the league. That is it. He had better PR. He didn’t do anything

I don’t understand how a head football coach can improve culture when the issue with the culture is related to sexual harassment and financial infidelities that didn’t involve football people. Meanwhile he had a trainer involved with a DEA scandal and a first round pick on the verge of literal jail time and still playing every week.

He’s been like this for weeks. I think it’s the injury and also just reflecting on how he’s wasted his prime here.

On the first Hill TD, Achane torched Davis for a would be TD on the other side of the field 52 still sucks

You can’t stand by Ron and let him fire JDR and then turn around and fire Ron the next week, guys lol

Absolute garbage on both sides of the ball. No one should be exempt. They all have had a hand in sucking

There will be complete wholesale changes this offseason. At this point, I’m expecting that to include QB. You’re making as many changes as possible to this defense. You’re making as many changes as possible to an offense that struggles to score. I know some folks have become personally involved with the QB. Prepare your feelings and emotions now before they get hurt.

When you’ve struggled to score 20 points for the better part of a month, you just gotta run it back so everyone can be “properly evaluated”

It would really behoove Sam to play his best football the rest of the way and maybe steal a few wins. That way, the team won’t have the opportunity to even be tempted by another QB prospect. I didn’t think so a few weeks ago but 4-13 is truly on the table and I’d imagine getting there would involve more middling/poor play from the QB spot. If we get there, all bets would be off especially with an analytically inclined front office. So it’s asking a lot but he really needs to not just be ok but he needs to play well for his sake.

In terms of sheer volume of throws, I definitely agree. That’s a fair point

I said 7-10 in the offseason Legit have a shot at 4-13. Today was the last game I would have been ok with winning. Now? Keep losing. And honestly, keeping RR might be the best way to get that.

??? Not sure what you mean here.

I mean I got you but what first year QB isn’t being asked to put his team on his back? That’s the case for almost every first year starter except for Brock Purdy last year. That’s not a burden exclusive to Sam. He’s going to have succeed in less than ideal circumstances. This will likely be the case to a (hopefully) lesser degree next season.

They have been held under 21 points 3 out of the last 4. The offense is not doing enough at this point in the season. It’s ok to admit it.

First off, the number 1 target of my ire is Bieninemy. He stinks. I’m sorry. I’m not all that interested in waiting on a 55 year old coordinator learn on the job. If he was truly a great offensive mind, he would have had a HC years ago This was bad. Very bad. First time they’ve played a good defense and they scored 10. That was concerning.

Dude, they scored 10 points. The yards are completely irrelevant. Come on. The offense as a whole sucked today.

I know they don’t win but dues he have a rep for being difficult to work with? Haven’t heard that one even when I lived in LA last year. Granted, there’s barely Chargers fans or any real care about them in LA but still lol