wit33

58 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

Of course it would be great for him to play well, but everything is stacked against that happening.

 

The schedule, checked out locker room, and likely more of the same dreadful gameplanning and blocking.  I fully expect it to be all downhill from here.

 

My only hope is he can somehow play well and we still lose.  

Poor Sam Howell lol. No excuses, he must perform. I’m with you on hoping he balls out and Washington secures a top 5-10 pick. 
 

Checking out NFL locker rooms is often times a myth. Bad teams will continue to be bad though. Every player is focused on competing for their next paycheck and yearly incentives. 

5 hours ago, formerly4skins said:

I am truly disappointed you weren't being sarcastic 😂 

 

I just don't think we can achieve success without ditching the desperate coach-centric model where the GM comes after the HC, elite candidate or not.

 

Got to get a GM first...have an over-arching, across-the-board strategy for the team...and let them pick the coach.

 

 

I appreciate the idea of having a GM, regardless of whether the head coach is the one to select them. If I’ve identified a coach who can make a significant difference and they want the autonomy to choose their GM, I’ll support that decision.

The success rate of GMs selecting coaches and winning consistently is extremely low. I’m uninterested in an overarching strategy that consistently fails. However, if there’s exceptional talent in a GM, let them choose the next innovative 34-year-old coach.

It’s more about acquiring exceptionally talented individuals rather than adhering strictly to a predefined model.

6 hours ago, NickyJ said:

Kyle Shanahan and John Lynch are definitely something. An even bigger something is that they were blessed with a third string QB who could dull the pain of repeating the RG3 draft trade and not even getting good play from who they picked. Kyle got to experience RG3 trades twice and was the driving force in the second one. Not many coaches get to experience 2 extreme QB failures and still get to coach through it.

 

But it would definitely be a solid strategy for a Belichick or Rivera to spend half a season stumbling their way down to a 3rd string QB. More teams should try it.

Uhh… Shannahan is still with the Niners because he wins at an elite rate in a league where that doesn’t happen. 80% of the NFL is mediocre and he’s elite. 

2 hours ago, philibusters said:

I don't know why people are whining that Gruden said he would rank the Chargers job over this job.  Having Justin Herbert will make everything easier.  Likewise, having Caleb Williams will make everything easier.  I agree with what he is saying

 

Plus Gruden was a head coach.  He knows how head coach candidates think

Coaches consider the earning potential. The presence of a potential elite QB enhances a coach’s likelihood of earning millions over an extended period.

Gruden 100% believes he’d still be maki g millions of dollars if he had a great to elite QB. 

2 hours ago, formerly4skins said:

 

This has to be sarcasm....right?

 

...right?

 

Dear sweet jesus on thanksgiving day...please tell me you're joking 😆 

I’m just the messenger. Here’s how you can achieve success with an elite candidate.

We might feel traumatized, but this model has proven effective. Take, for instance, the 49ers, considered a model franchise by some. They entrusted a first-time head coach, Kyle Shanahan, to choose John Lynch, who had zero experience and faced substantial criticism for the decision. At that time, the Niners were struggling, showing that sometimes as an organization, thinking outside the box is necessary.

If you truly desire a coach, empower them to select their GM. This way, you secure the candidate you prefer. 
 

The coach won’t opt for the Chargers over Washington if Washington offers more authority. 

4 hours ago, Going Commando said:

 

I'd still be concerned about neglect even if we had McCaffrey in the backfield.  That's how extreme Bieniemy's tendency to abandon the run has been.  It defines his coaching style so far.

 

He can get better, and he's at least significantly better than Scott Turner was.  But this just isn't a good system or offense so far.  I can't stand that we are letting Terry and Jahan go to waste, when slow ass John Bates and Logan Thomas and jags like Pringle/Dyami/Samuel are getting tons of work.

 

I won't trash Gibson or BRob too hard, because I think they are solid NFL rotation backs.  But they aren't weapons.  Gibson just isn't instinctive enough to why the most out of his tools and opportunities, and BRob isn't fast or creative enough to generate a lot of big plays.  His two big plays of the year were created for him by Sam Howell and bad scheme.  In theory, I'd love to get a big time back like you say because the RB room could certainly use an upgrade.  But I don't trust Bieniemy to properly utilize his weapons.

The alpha must emerge.
 

The coach is scheming up “life changing yards” on offense, go out and get them. 

1 hour ago, Koolblue13 said:

Mike Evans is going to be a FA.

TE option?

14 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Missing the math, how does it cost less to cut him that the guaranteed money on the contract?

 

7-8 million cost you a player.  It's peanuts compared to paying stars big money.  But its a player or two players in FA.   Not every contract is Montez Sweat.  You got plenty in other ranges.  We should know because this FO majors in that range.

Part of the guaranteed money was paid out this season, which reduces the amount owed the following season.

It's 7-8 million spread out over two seasons, but he's not a 7-8 million per year player. The cap hit is 3 million this season and 5 million next.

This level of free agent provides organization ability to remain lean while continuing to explore ways to add talent, hopefully through the draft and not overpriced free agents (my opinion). The whole story isn’t written on Gates, he’s the type of dude that will bounce back even if it’s as a back up. 

52 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Not really.  He's not some superstar with a big contract.  But this isnt exactly a minimum contract, nothing burger either. 

 

7 million cap hit if you let him go in the off season, 8 if its pre June.

Peanuts. 

No reason to get rid of him. It didn't work out as the starting center, but now he transitions to a backup role at all three interior positions. He's also a player with extremely high intangibles.

It will cost 5 million this offseason to cut him. As I mentioned, there's no reason to do so unless he suffers a serious injury.

52 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Speaking of the Baker comparison.  Baker by his own admission wasn't the easiest guy to get along with.  Baker is high strung as heck.  Howell is as calm as it can be. 

100%. 

5 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Speaking of the O line, was listening to Keim talk about how the protections have improved with Larsen in the fold.  Apparently, Gates wasn't the hottest FA signing.

Fortunately with this type of signing, you adapt and move on without any real financial implications. 

5 hours ago, MisterPinstripe said:

What an indictment of this coaching staff that they kept rolling out Gates for 7 games letting Howell get crushed because they refused to make a change. Suddenly the last two games Howell has a lot more time. Incompetence or ego to refusing to admit you made a bad signing and continue to let your young QB get crushed. How many games did we lose because of letting Gates who is clueless with protections continue to call them. 

Must also indict the staff for having replacements. I don’t make the rules. 
 

4 hours ago, TradeTheBeal! said:

I’m watching ESPN and todays trivia question revealed that Baker Mayfield broke Dan Marino’s record for most TD passes by a rookie.  I bring this up to because 1) Howell’s skill set/physique is very similar to Mayfeld’s and 2) some of y’all may wanna pump the brakes a little bit with this corny “10 games ZOMG!!!” nonsense.

Intangibles seem to matter at the QB spot. Seems like Howell is pretty strong mentally, you know, from all personal conversations I’ve had with him lol

6 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

Purdy is good, but he's also come back down to Earth a bit over the last few weeks.

 

But also remember that Purdy has the benefit of playing for possibly the best offensive mind in the NFL in Shanny. Just take a look at Jimmy G. He was at least seen as a very good QB in SF (though not elite). Then he went to LV, bombed, and has now been benched in favor of Aiden O'Connell.

I wonder when Lamar Jackson will come back to earth 🌏 👀

8 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Here's more from Russini.

 

The Kirk stuff will be heartbreaking for @wit33, looks like he's not coming here

 

 

Haha... Kirk and his team will likely try to reshape the narrative of his entire career this offseason by accepting a lower salary to remain in Minnesota, despite having negotiated hefty deals throughout his career.
 

I speculate that Minnesota may part ways with him. The coach is speaking highly of him and might be inclined to retain him in an effort to maintain mediocrity and secure more paychecks for everyone involved. 
 

Full disclosure, Kirk at 6-8% of the cap is something I can get behind. 

1 hour ago, oraphus said:

I honestly don't get the narrative that the new HC will automatically want to bring in his own QB. Howell has already shown that he can play at this level and be successful. At worst he is 2nd half of the league starting QB caliber. Any new HC will look at his tape and see him as a potential starter.. now he might have to compete for a job next year but he will get his shot unless:

we tank badly and draft in top 5 - you have to take a QB at that point.

we trade a bunch of capital to get in to the top 3pics to draft a QB  - this is less likely if we finish with 6+ wins and since Howell has shown enough to be given another year. 

even if one the above things happen - which i doubt since this team has a lot of holes...

-Howell could still start as the new qb gets acclimated to the NFL

-having Howell as backup at <1mil a year is a deal.. and i am sure we will get a number of offers for him. 
 

The prospect of Howell starting for a new coach is a situation that's not lost on anyone. For me, it simply delays the inevitable: the coach will likely want to bring in their own preferred quarterback. This misalignment between the GM, coach, and QB can leave the team in a vulnerable position.
 

While exceptions exist, unless the QB performs exceptionally well, a change is probably in the cards.

6 minutes ago, CapsSkins said:

 

I'm not thrilled with EB. If we end up hiring a coach like Ben Johnson, Howell will be staying in a WCO scheme anyway so I'm not sure the continuity is worth such a large premium vs. giving the new staff carte blanche. 

What Howell and EB accomplished against the Eagles last week was truly exceptional. They completely dismantled the Eagles and effectively neutralized their pass rush throughout the entire game, led by the young QB. Many discussions revolve around breaking free from mediocrity, and this is it – the quarterback and offensive coordinator taking control of games and placing the outcome in the quarterback's hands.

I couldn't care less about who the opposing quarterback was because EB and Howell were in sync. Achieving this level is what Washington needs to consistently attain double-digit win seasons. Hearing Mark Schlereth trying to quantify the value of how EB and Howell neutralized the Eagles' pass rush by throwing 50 times was a delightful moment.

I prefer an Andy Reid-style West Coast offense over Ben Johnson's approach. However, I do wish that EB would utilize Howell as a runner more, as he's similar to Josh Allen in the sense that he excels when he gets the opportunity to run and make contact. Full disclosure, I only know a little bit about Ben Johnson, not at all saying I don’t like him as a potential coach. 

2 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I don't think it would be that surprising.  8-9 I think was still on the table.  Less so now.  that might be enough to make it in the weak NFC.  But I am tired of peak success is a wildcard and one and out every 3-4 years.  I want off that treadmill.  

 

 

Will see.  I am hoping for a new GM-new regime.  EB has been a roller coaster.    I could swallow it as OC perhaps.  But I think I've seen enough where I don't think I want him as the next HC. 

What OC hasn’t been a roller coaster this season? Not to say he isn’t working kinks out and learning. No doubt been some rough patches. I still want to see more. 

Just now, goskins10 said:

 

 

Maybe I am missing something. But how is Josh Harris being a ****ty owner? He can make personel changes due to lack of performance. The team is 3-5 and woefully underperfroming (or performing just as it should, niether is good). So they are making some moves that will help the team. I was one of the longer Ron hold outs thinking he was jsut struggling under mini-me's ignorance. But the game has passed him - and that includes JDR. Ron is a great guy but he lost his edge as a good coach. So Ok, just move on. If I missed something said let me know. 

 

If they fire Ron tomorrow it's not being a ****ty owner unless he goes out of his way to embarress him, ala Bruce Allen and Scott M.

 

Last sentence really makes no sense. WHat was all a mistake? Trading 2 players from an underperforming until that are both on last contracts that would have eaten a lot of CAP space even if you just sign 1 much less two? And you get a 2nd and a 3rd for them. 

 

I am just not seeing how any of that is being a ****ty owner. 

**Not all directed at you, side tangent:

The NFL is known for its unpredictability when it comes to wins and losses. It's often a fine line between being a double-digit winning team and a team drafting in the top ten. I'm not in favor of parting with good players that a new regime could use to initiate a turnaround. I might be biased, as I have an overall liking for the roster, although there's not much to support that sentiment these days.
 

Nonetheless, there's a considerable amount of time until the next season, and we'll need to wait and see how things unfold.

Personally, I believe that rebuilding teams should use their draft capital to acquire established NFL players to aid in the rebuilding process, especially when they aren't picking within the top 5. It's interesting to note that the Bears are receiving criticism for a strategy similar to what the Niners are being praised for, and the Bears are in a position to transition swiftly due to financial flexibility. In my opinion, the media and fans often have this perspective reversed.

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

if we get back on the 8-9 gravy train after beating the mighty Patriots and get to 4-5 -- it would be very awkward?

 

 

 

 

I'm not a fan of trading away good players for pennies on the dollar (just my opinion). However, in Chase's case, if he's causing trouble off the field, it's easy to justify parting ways with him. It's challenging to succeed with players who aren't fully committed or have off-field issues; the risk isn't worth it.
 

Earning a playoff spot would indeed be a surprising and somewhat amusing turn of events. To escape the 8-9 pattern, it's crucial for Sam Howell to grow into a proficient quarterback while on a rookie contract. This issue is more quarterback-related than it is about the front office.

Regarding the defense, there have been serious concerns, and Ron and Jack are responsible. On the other hand, EB, the offensive coordinator, has shown promise and delivered some outstanding offensive stretches that haven't been seen in this area for a long time.
 

Given the circumstances, it's evident that change is needed. If EB and Howell continue to progress as they are, I would be thrilled to find a way to keep them together.

Awkward if Washington wins and tied for a playoff spot after next week lol

1 minute ago, method man said:

Sure but you also get into trouble giving non elite guys elite money and the Gary deal is going to have Sweat looking for $25m+ a year

I'm thinking a bit unconventionally here, and I acknowledge it's not the standard approach. My suggestion would be to retain the talent, possibly through extensions or by using both the franchise and transition tags, unless we receive an exceptional offer.

I have reservations about the idea of trading a player for anything; I'm more intrigued by the concept of acquiring players in return. This approach aligns more with the strategy often seen in NBA franchises.

Draft picks can often be overrated, especially when trading them for a known, high-value asset. It's akin to trading California beachfront real estate for a one-in-a-million lottery ticket. I rather get players back in return, but that’s not how business is often done NFL yet. 
 

Retain the talent within the organization and allow the new regime to handle it. Utilize franchise and transition tags when necessary. Adjust financial resources strategically and consider trading players when the right opportunities arise. 

Great fun to listen Mark Schlereth fumble and struggle to connect Howell throwing the ball 26 times in a half and it being a good thing in regards to protecting Howell without a run game. 

On 10/14/2023 at 8:16 AM, 88Comrade2000 said:

The quest for that franchise qb will be going strong next year. I think the veteran market will cool after busts like Russell Wilson.  Of course, the draft isn’t no gaurantee either but it’s cheaper.

 

Raiders- Do they stay with Jimmy G or if they have a Top 10 pick, draft a replacement?

 

Broncos- Russell is cooked. Despite the huge cap hit, they are moving on and likely drafting a replacement.

 

Titans- They May move on from Tannehill but already drafted his replacement this year, Will Levis.

 

Browns- haven’t gotten the Watson they traded for and they gave him that guaranteed. He gets that money regardless, so they will stick out with him for another year. Hoping 24 is better than what 23 is looking to be.

 

Pats- Mac Jones is a bust. Since Bill is likely to be gone after this season; next coach will be drafting a qb.

 

Jets- likely to ride with Aaron but maybe they draft someone in the lower rounds to take over, after Aaron is done.

 

Giants- After giving Jones all that money, will they take the cap pain and move on? Or hope he’s better in 24, if thing doesn’t get better the rest of this year.

 

Boys- Dak likely to let them down. Think he has one more year after this. I don’t see Dak getting an extension. Maybe they see what Lance can do next year and move on from Dak.

 

Comms- New coach will want his own qb to at least compete with Sam for starting job.

 

Vikings- they are moving on from Kirk; so need to draft a qb.

 

Packers- Love is showing he’s a bust. They will need to draft someone else.

 

Bears- Unless , Fields leads a turnaround; they will draft a qb.

 

Falcons- Ridder has to solidify his hold on the job or else they will look elsewhere.

 

Bucs- Mayfield is passing his one year audition so far. He may earn a new long term deal with Tampa.

 

Cards- Likely moving on from Murray, despite cap hit. Will look to draft a replacement.

 

 

I think the veteran qbs that will be on the market in 24, will find a tough market. The best a veteran qb can hope for is a situation like Tampa, where a vet gets a one year deal to prove himself.

I agree.

The jig is just about up for the midlding entitled veteran QB taking up 10-15% of teams cap.
 

Would love for these contracts to be more incentive driven for this level of QB. Who knows, maybe someday. 

4 hours ago, AlwaysBeRedskins2Me said:

That's why I got confused. I thought why would koolblue be upset about the Eagles losing a crucial player. Lol.

Well, if you know his backstory…. Never mind lol

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

OK, here's some trade deadline buzz:

• Washington is listening to calls on both Chase Young and Montez Sweat, and there's interest in both. The Commanders have also received inquiries on quarterback Jacoby Brissett. Sitting at 3-4 with Philly on deck, this week could be big for them in regards to trade plans.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/insider/story/_/id/38749725/nfl-week-8-predictions-fantasy-sleepers-stats-latest-buzz-2023

Man, losing Chase Young doesn’t sit right, but as long as the Harris is 100% spearheading with whoever he consulting him I’m cool with it. Dislike idea of Ron having any sort of power trading young talent away (talent that will be in its prime for next 2 year build). 

1 hour ago, Conn said:

Were you one of the kids that had a hard time understanding the relationship between a square and a rectangle? That every square is a rectangle but not all rectangles are squares. 
 

How young are we talking? 

1 hour ago, zCommander said:

 

wit33 only played with stars and circles lol

Don’t join the fraternity.

PFF getting trashed while we celebrate the hire of an analytics specialist lol

I love this board!

53 minutes ago, lovemaskins said:

Nah, it’s starting to affect him. His body is flinching and reacting from the punishment. He’s starting to look skittish in the pocket. The pick he threw Sunday was thrown off his back foot moving away from the pressure and the ball floated. If he steps into that throw and fires it’s a completion. 
 

I remember hearing a boxing analogy years ago of how knockouts occur. Essentially it says the body falls asleep to protect itself from further damage because it calculates the mind won’t or can’t retreat from the lethal damage it’s taking, so night night.

 

Sam is no different.

It’s concerning to see criticism affecting his play and coaching undermining his ability. He’s become overly focused on quick passes, diminishing his unique ability to create and extend plays. While relying on his abilities might offset some drawbacks, it’s evident that we’re witnessing a different version of Howell as he strives to avoid sacks.

Furthermore, it’s baffling that he’s not utilized as a running option occasionally in games. When he runs, it generates a lot of excitement. It seems like his running ability has the potential to boost his performance. I was concerned EB wouldn’t prioritize this aspect of his game. Having 3-5 designed run options per game could be tremendously beneficial for him.

3 hours ago, Koolblue13 said:

I don't usually quote myself. I feel like EB talking to EB, but this thought has me really really excited.

 

That would be incredible.

Why does a hire like Ian excite you (not being disingenuous)? Is it due to his communication skills or connections to draft picks and free agents, or simply the potential he brings?

I've always found it challenging to evaluate the value of front office personnel since they often support each other publicly, forming a sort of fraternity that seeks to maximize earnings while maintaining an average status.

2 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Just listened to the Keim-Bram podcast.  Really pessimistic.  to combine their takes.

 

Running game isn't working -- they attributed it to blocking and scheme.  the holes aren't there.  It's a bottom feeder defense (which they find shocking) against a weak schedule so far.  Payne and Allen not having impact seasons like we are used to.  Hinting some discontent internally about play calling with Terry in that mix of people wondering about it.   All the hits that Howell has taken might be getting to him, where he's not the same player he was earlier this season.  

 

Keim talked about Gates inconsistency and wondered if its on the table that he's benched but also said they aren't benching Wylie.

 

As for trading deadline, their takes was Ron is unlikely wanting to do anything because it doesn't serve him.  Maybe Harris interjects and pushes it but they are skeptical (but don't know) that he does it because its not his style to interfere like that.   Keim seems confident that there is league interest but he's equally confident that there is no team that will offer a first for either edge rusher

 

I prefer that Ron doesn't make any decisions regarding the team's future. It's crucial to retain all our top-performing players and enable the upcoming leadership to utilize their skills in the desired direction. Harris should take the lead in ensuring that talent isn't mishandled.
 

Losing Sweat for just a 3rd round pick would be a significant loss. It's essential to re-sign Young and build the team's identity around his star power until an elite quarterback is found. 
 

Do you have a preference for a defensive or offensive coach for next season? 

39 minutes ago, Est.1974 said:

I can’t see that being a balanced use of our available resource at all.

I see it as a matter of holding your cards close and waiting for the next regime to make their moves. I understand it might be challenging, given that both are set to become free agents in the same year 😕. Keep both knowing each will have value turn the market with or without a long term contract. 

It will demand some creative thinking. Simply letting go of valuable or exceptional players for a fraction of their worth doesn't make sense. I have zero interest in trading Sweat for a second-round pick; the chances of that pick becoming even an average starter are slim. If we can acquire other players in exchange, that's when I get interested. At the moment, the impending massive overhaul makes things complex.