wit33

Nowadays, offensive coordinators prioritize tailoring their strategies to better support their young quarterbacks, to the extent that it's almost an expectation for the coach to do so. Just imagine suggesting this trend a decade or two ago.

If Jayden Daniels encounters difficulties in his rookie season, it's less probable he'll become a star in the league. However, the beauty of an elite dual-threat quarterback lies in their ability to struggle as a passer initially while still making a significant impact on the game, rivaling or even surpassing some of your favorite QBs ranked between 8th and 25th in the league, all while continuing to learn.

Conversations surrounding the quarterback position have shifted over the years, moving away from merely discussing statistics and a bit more towards assessing impact—a term rife with subjectivity but crucial for meaningful dialogue.I do value some stats at the QB spot such as, TD passes, that’s often pretty reliable. 

34 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

RG3 wasn't known as a dude who loved to study.  Kyler Murray ditto.    As to running QBs. 

 

Daniels' work ethic comes off in that upper tier strata.   Doesn't of course guarantee success but it should increase the odds. 
 

He's probably one of the first, if not the very first, to fully commit to being an elite runner while also mastering throwing from the pocket. Those who came before him often seemed to struggle against the stigma of being labeled a running QB. I get it; it's been a tough battle against the traditional perceptions of what a QB should be. But he's different. He seems like a guy dead set on shaking up the league his own way, without giving a damn about what others think. That's just my gut feeling about him.

If a season hands him a thousand-yard rushing season, he'll take it. If it's 500 yards, he'll take that too. He's out there balling to win and compete, plain and simple. Some might say "competing" is a broad term, but spend some time around young athletes, and you'll quickly spot the real competitors from the rest.

Just my feel early as I get to know him. 

I used to have high hopes for RG3, thinking he might be football's version of Michael Jordan. Yet, it seemed he leaned too heavily on his natural athleticism and didn't fully commit to honing his craft. But now, with Jayden Daniels, there's a new excitement. He's got that freak athleticism, but what appears to set him apart is his dedication to mastering the game. It's rare to see a dual-threat QB like him prioritize both physical prowess and the mental aspect of the game. While many elite dual-threat quarterbacks before him were known for their physicality and intense workout regimens, Daniels seems to embrace the importance of fundamentals and game processing. It's refreshing that he doesn't solely rely on his physical gifts; he's invested in the process, striving for greatness day in and day out. 
 

It wouldn't be surprising if he harbors insecurities about his physical stature, which could have led him to prioritize other aspects of his game from an early age. But who knows for sure? It's all just speculation, but it's fun to think about nonetheless.

Comparisons are being drawn to Anthony Edwards and Michael Jordan, not just because of his physical abilities, but more importantly, because of his competitive drive and relentless work ethic. Dare I say, I see some similarities between Ant Man and Daniels.
 

Yup, not one snap and he’s being put in same paragraph as Michael Jordan. lol 

Its May, be easy on me. 

As a fan, I selfishly prefer a QB whose focus is solely on success on the field, without too many distractions from hobbies or other interests. While this might not be the healthiest approach for the individual, it can allow them to channel all their energy, even tapping into the darker side of motivation, especially in the early stages of their career when they're striving to accumulate thousands of hours of experience.

Early signs suggest that Daniels doesn't have many interests beyond football, though this is purely speculative as I'm still getting to know him.

Not saying it’s right or wrong, but as I get older and spend more years as a fan, it’s clear that inaccurate quarterbacks often struggle to succeed. I’m willing to overlook inaccuracy if there's great running ability, but even that model seems to have a ceiling. I wouldn’t be surprised to see quarterbacks like Brock Purdy, who may not have elite tools, compete with those who do.
 

A who cares to most thought:

I still believe that as the NFL continues to evolve towards a more positionless game in open space, the QB position will become increasingly athletic. Similarly, the point guard position in basketball once featured players like Scott Skiles as a ball-dominant PG on a Shaq team, but it has since shifted towards giving the ball to the best athletes on the court, with the traditional PG role almost eliminated. There are still players like Mike Conley (Brock Purdy), who are tasked with getting the ball to the real QB, such as Anthony Edwards, within 4-8 seconds of the shot clock.

1 hour ago, Llevron said:

I feel like his leadership style is just to out work everyone in the building and see who wants to come with him. I hope thats correct im sure there is a lot of projecting of my own going into me thinking that. But i hope thats correct. 
 

Young players grow over time, whether they're introverted or extroverted. It's usually after gaining some experience and maybe even becoming parents that they truly step up as vocal leaders. At this stage, it's more about putting in the work rather than emphasizing leadership. After all, which veteran would really take a rookie's enthusiastic speeches seriously? 

The weight factor is an interesting one and one that has lost a lot of value in the NBA in recent seasons. I always like to compare both and feel that the NBA is typically about ten years ahead of the NFL in most areas. I haven’t taken the time to do extensive research on weight related to injuries at any position, and it would require deciphering which injuries are actually weight related.

Walter Payton weighed 203 pounds.

Jerome Bettis 251 pounds.

Both were ironmen at the running back position.

No argument from me that injuries are a concern and part of his growth must include avoiding hits. 

Just now, Jumbo said:

I've posted enough about my take on Ron the HC from day one and throughout his devolution, football wise, from poor to atrocious during his tenure.

 

But regarding the roster aspect specifically, I'm thinking of the (generalized) camps most regs here fell into on that matter as of his last year.

 

One, a medium sized group that includes me, thought less than half the roster were average or better NFL players, and that we had maybe three to five "upper tier" players total on both sides of the ball with arguably zero "elite" players. Payne, Terry, or Allen were close to elite, but not quite there.

 

Then there was a fairly sizeable group who thought the roster wasn't that bad though def needed serious improvement. 

 

And there were a few who thought the roster had enough talent on it that coaching changes and a new QB would do a lot and that the roster didn't need to actually be "blown up."

 

I think the moves being made echo that "group one" position. The roster was that bad, coaching aside.

 

No doubt competent coaching will help a few become worth keeping, but it needed to be blown up.

 

Love that they aggressively did just that, starting in free agency, and we will see a fair number of even more signings before they're done.

 

 

I was all in on the defense coming into last year; it's unreal how that unit performed. The regression to being among the league's worst is wild. Completely wrong on my part.

Group one definitely won out, no doubt. Most rosters turn over a great deal depending on the year and the team's situation, but it's still quite telling that Washington is among the league leaders in roster turnover at this point in the offseason.
 

It's quite telling that most of the standout players were from the regime before Ron took over. I expect new names to emerge as cornerstone players for Washington as soon as next year. While all the roster turnover is interesting, it's crucial to identify not only great and elite players league-wide but also those within the team’s own ranks.

1 minute ago, redskinss said:

 

That doesn't seem like it'd be a great first impression especially considering her past.

I agree. 

Allowing punters and kickers to wear single-digit numbers is one of the more lucrative opportunities for those players. If I were running a team, I'd reserve single-digit numbers for prime time positions and assign punters and kickers numbers in the 30s or 40s instead (not sure what the number rules are for those dudes though lol). 
 

If I were Daniel's mom, I'd be all over social media calling out the Way family.

On 5/4/2024 at 9:42 AM, HTTRDynasty said:

 

Some one find the order date 🕵️‍♂️

1 hour ago, 88Comrade2000 said:

Fields start and Tomlin has his first losing. If Russ is done, Steelers won’t be winning if they have to rely on Fields.

 

If Russ is cooked, Steelers will be looking for a new qb in 2025 and likely under a new coach.

You might be onto something there. I'm not saying Fields is a guaranteed success, but he does offer them a chance to adopt an elite ground-and-pound style of play.

1 hour ago, mistertim said:

 

Wait, how come whenever I ask you to give me specific numbers for what makes a college QB "dual threat" (for example in the Daniels vs Maye debate) you ignore me but I have to answer you when you ask the inverse?

All QBs these days, except for Goff, are dual threats—props to him for bucking the trend and excelling as a pure pocket passer. Elite dual-threat QBs come in all shapes, sizes, and speeds, just like RBs and WRs. Howell's got some serious rushing skills, running a 4.8 or 4.9. But let's be real, a QB with a 4.3 is a freak athlete at that position.

1 hour ago, mistertim said:

 

I don't think there's a certain number of yards, just think of athletic QBs who can use their legs well but who's primary weapon is their arm. Mahomes, Allen, Dak, Love, Herbert, etc. Those guys can all use their legs and get yards when they have green grass in front of them, but their primary weapon is their passing ability.

Comparing those guys to Daniels and trying to confine him to a specific mold is just not fair. None of them, except for Allen (who's a bit out of place in this discussion), have ever rushed for 400 yards. Do we really want Daniels to mirror Prescott, Herbert, and Love, who each barely hit 200 rushing yards in entire seasons?

1 hour ago, mistertim said:

 

There's only one successful QB who's primary weapon is his legs and that's Lamar. But as I said, he actually sucks in the postseason when teams have more time to game plan for him and can mitigate his running ability. Take away his ability to run and he's only a mediocre QB.

Let's look at Love, Herbert, and Dak's playoff performances. Herbert has a subpar winning record, while Love hovers around .500 for their careers. Just imagine the criticism Jackson would face if he didn't maintain a 70% winning record during the regular season. It's a bit ironic, isn't it?

Playoffs are difficult, ask Rodgers, the best QB I’ve seen in 20 plus years watching. 

1 hour ago, mistertim said:

 

So yeah I'd bet that Peters and Quinn prefer that Daniels be like those former guys who are primarily passers first, scramblers second. For injury reasons and because running QBs don't win **** in the postseason if their legs are mitigated. Neither Peters or Quinn are stupid. They knows it's a passing league and that's how you win long term. Even in his post day 1 presser, Peters only mentioned Jayden's running ability AFTER he talked about his passing abilities, etc.

Daniels isn't really in the same category as those other quarterbacks you mentioned. He doesn’t at all appear to identify with the dudes you’re listing. He seems focused on becoming an elite passer while also setting his sights on breaking rushing records held by the likes of Vick, Newton, Jackson, Fields, and Cunningham. He's even voiced his ambition to surpass their achievements on the ground. Daniel’s isn’t the number two overall pick if he wasn’t an elite runner. 

1 hour ago, mistertim said:

 

I know you really really want running QBs to become a trend, and you've said "it's happening" for years now, but it's just not the case.

Peters: “Take the souls of a defense”

Daniels: ”Turn on the Florida tape”

The QB position continues to evolve, with athleticism becoming increasingly crucial. This trend has been noticeable over the past 15 seasons, and it's a topic I've been discussing for over a decade. While there will always be varying degrees of athleticism and approaches, the baseline expectation for QBs to create, extend plays, and gain rushing yards has been steadily rising.

9 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

Bet you dollars to donuts that Peters and Quinn want Daniels to be primarily a pocket passer and use his legs when necessary but NOT as a primary weapon like actual running QBs. They know perfectly well that passing wins in the NFL and that if Daniels runs as his main weapon it would probably be, at most, half a season before he's in the hospital.

How would you describe someone as "primarily a pocket passer?

Rushing and pass attempts? Yards?
 

Injuries no doubt are a concern, no argument from me. 

1 minute ago, mistertim said:

 

Nobody is "coming around". I know you have a borderline fetish for running backs who cosplay as QBs, but the NFL doesn't, even if you live in a fantasy land where it's headed that way.

And…

Adam Peters/Dan Quinn

31 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

How do you guys not realize what a ****ty QB Fields is? It's kind of amazing that some of you think Russell Wilson needs to "watch his back" or massive 1st round bust running back Justin Fields is somehow going to magically become an actual NFL QB and take the starting job.

You’ll come around in due time  

Honestly, I'd be shocked if the locker room doesn't start (if not already) leaning towards Fields over Wilson. Wilson will have to put his body on the line and return to running to not be a below average QB. 

45 minutes ago, MartinC said:

Russell Wilson played decent to good last season. He was far from the problem in Denver - but he just wasn’t what Payton wanted at any point. Wilson was doomed there the moment Payton was hired.

 

I think he will play well for the Steelers and they have the infrastructure and team around him where they could make some noise

Roughly 30 quarterbacks could manage decently given the right support. Though, being paid league minimum and being a decent QB carries some value. My guess is the lockeroom will side with Fields from the get and it will require Steelers getting off to a hot start to avoid being benched for Fields. Not even sure Wilson wins the job. 
 

Full disclosure, never been a huge fan of Wilson’s. 

1 hour ago, Command The 414 said:

All things equal I totally agree, but I think Fields at some point of the season will become the starter in Pittsburgh as I think he is head and shoulders better at this point of their careers then Russell Wilson, and he will do fine and have his choice of options, 1 being a return to the Steelers as the starter 

The elite dual-threat QB runner opens up the opportunity to adopt a ground-and-pound strategy in today's pass-friendly environment. It makes perfect sense for the Steelers to shift towards a more athletic QB to focus on power football. The delay in this approach was likely due to Big Ben and a desire to avoid mirroring their division rivals' style.

Russell better step up his game and get in top shape if he wants to keep Fields at bay. He's gotta embrace being a dual-threat QB again if he wants to stay relevant; he’s a terrible pocket QB If that’s all he’s doing. Wonder if he's finally realized he needs to humble himself.

22 minutes ago, BMagic said:

Hmm... That doesn't quite add up the same way. Oh well, never mind! 😄 

On 4/23/2024 at 7:22 PM, bh32 said:

I just watched every pass and run by JD and the way the media was hyping him i was expecting much more..He is not the elusive runner like people make him out to be..He has more long speed than he does burst.

His jump cut is elite/special so much so it channeled thoughts of Adrian Petersons jump cut. 

14 hours ago, clskinsfan said:

Believe it or not Daniels has this exact same issue. He airmailed plenty of balls when pushed off his base in the pocket. He definitely maintains his mechanics better than Maye right now though. The dude lacks no confidence. I will give him that:

 

 

I love that he's stepping into this with confidence. One of RG3's biggest struggles was not staying true to himself and trying to fit into others' expectations of a QB. Thankfully, many outdated coaches and media figures have either adapted or retired, and QBs who both look and play like him have excelled in the league, paving the way for him to be bold and speak his truth.

He comes off as very comfortable in his own skin. 

44 minutes ago, redskinss said:

 

Herbert has 17223 yards passing with 114 touchdowns and 42 interceptions in 4 years.

In the entirety of this franchises history we've never even sniffed that type of production over a 4 year period.

 

Wins and losses are not a quarterback stat.

Most QBs have cool stats these days. Those also look really cool. 
 

For great to elite QBs, wins and losses are indeed a QB stat. Winning in the playoffs, I would agree, is influenced by facing other great to elite QBs, so the team and coaches play a significant role. In the regular season, if your QB is great, they should generally have a winning record.

As for the  70-80% of QBs starting who are mediocre, I agree, it's less about wins and losses and more about other factors. 

21 minutes ago, CapsSkins said:

I am a pessimist when it comes to this team so my prediction is they draft Daniels, he can't stay healthy, and Maye turns into Herbert. I am ready for it. Onto hockey playoffs.

Herbert is still fighting to have more wins than losses four years into his career. But as we know, those who fit the model of what QBs should be get a great amount of grace. 

1 minute ago, mistertim said:

 

If he continues his historically low amount of times he throws after being pressured I fear he's going to get absolutely demolished when he takes more hits than necessary.

You've really been leaning on that stat for the past month or so, huh? It must be frustrating to see Maye performing just as poorly! Just imagine the comparisons you could've made if Maye had been 7-8 percent better. It would've given you some real ammunition.

Daniel's day one offers a genuine chance to excel in the run and play-action game while projecting to protect the football at an elite level. It all adds up to a playoff ceiling in year one.

Perhaps Maye doesn't need as much time on the bench to refine his mechanics and footwork like Mahomes, Rodgers, and Love did. Luckily, I'm all for backyard football, and I believe Maye is solid as a runner, although not quite at Howell's level, but still good. I’m down for a YOLO season while he learns, I can see him having the guts to endure a 20 plus INT season— I can get behind a gunslinger. 

46 minutes ago, SoCalSkins said:

Daniels and his mom played a huge role in that dysfunction!! Daniels played a role in multiple coaches getting fired. 

This is the pros, no one cares about the parents. Non issue. 

Lavar Ball approves this message. 

12 minutes ago, Sacks 'n' Stuff said:

Go to YouTube and search Purdy anticipation throw. This one was my favorite example.

 

Thank you for sharing your perspective.

In your opinion, how frequently did Purdy execute completions like these per game? I'm not trying to come off as condescending, but I do acknowledge having some skepticism at this point. Just want to clarify my stance. 
 

Any chance you took a look at the Mahomes video I sent, were there any anticipatory throws?