smashmowf Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 Over the last 7 or 8 years we have seen a lot of shotgun formation from various Redskin coaches. This is a formation that Gibbs rarely used.....I wonder if this will hold true in his second tenure? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redskin56 Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 He used it sparingly, especially when he had a relatively immobile QB (Rypien). I would suppose that he may be more inclined to use it with Ramsey than with Brunell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nycskinsfan Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 Are you implying Brunell is still mobile? As a redskin fan the last thing I want to see is us having to depend on his mobility. I think he should take the Marino approach a little early and start buying his lineman some new toys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldskool Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 If I recall correctly, even when he had max protection for his QB, he rarely had many shotgun formations. So I really don’t think you’ll see many either for Ramsey or Brunell. As for Brunell being mobile, well he isn’t Mike Vick or even Brett Favre right now. What he can do is get out of the pocket and escape from situations where most non mobile QB’s would take a sack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nycskinsfan Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 Bottom line is the less hits he takes the better we'll all feel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldskool Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 Originally posted by nycskinsfan Bottom line is the less hits he takes the better we'll all feel. Well that’s true of both QB’s, whether it be Mark (due to his age/history of injuries) or Pat (due to the beatings he took last year). Like many posters before me have said, one thing that Gibbs does is protect his QB’s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nycskinsfan Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 Thanks to Mr. Bugel! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thinker Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 If I'm not mistaken, Gibbs' theory was that the shotgun had its downsides as well for two main reasons 1) possible bad snap, and 2) All the time the qb is focused on the snap and trying to catch the ball he isn't able to look at the defense. Under center the qb is looking at the defense the whole way and on his full backpedal. So with the shot gun, the qb does start further away from the rush but doesn't have the same amount of time to survey the field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smashmowf Posted May 7, 2004 Author Share Posted May 7, 2004 Originally posted by thinker If I'm not mistaken, Gibbs' theory was that the shotgun had its downsides as well for two main reasons 1) possible bad snap, and 2) All the time the qb is focused on the snap and trying to catch the ball he isn't able to look at the defense. Under center the qb is looking at the defense the whole way and on his full backpedal. So with the shot gun, the qb does start further away from the rush but doesn't have the same amount of time to survey the field. Hmmm......excellent observation, as much football as I watch I never thought of it that way (reason #2).......but if the quarterback has the confidence in his center to but the ball were it should be I would think he should be able to concentrate less on whether or not the ball will make there and more on scanning the defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@DCGoldPants Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 Brunell is the quickest guy we'll have on a starting roster in a long while. However, if the OL is coached well. He shouldn't have to run much at all. This isn't Philly where the QB's legs are more valuable than his arm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redskin56 Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 Are you implying Brunell is still mobile? Comparatively speeking............. yes. Brunell at this stage of his career is more mobile than Ramsey. I'm not trying to encourage him to scramble to make plays, what I'm saying is that he can still make one or two guys miss and still get rid of the ball. (I still would rather see Ramsey under center than Brunell, but when Ramsey is in, the shotgun would serve the underlying purpose better than having Brunell in the same formation.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. S Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 Brunell has been known to be relatively mobile. Also, Ramsey can be mobile I feel. Sure, I dont think neither are Scramblers, but Ramsey can break out of pressure in the pocket and Brunell can move around to throw if needed. I'm not much a fan of the shotgun, too risky, and I wonder how much extra time it really does give. Plus bad snaps are always a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fifty Gut Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 I emphasize that the mobility Brunell still has is best used for avoiding sacks while still getting rid of the ball. But this is obvious, no one is asking him to be Vick or McNabb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yomar Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 Gibbs doesn't use the shotgun, never has, never will Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kosher Ham Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 Originally posted by Yomar Gibbs doesn't use the shotgun, never has, never will This is true. I cant ever recall the Skins using the Shotgun back in the Day. That was one of the things i was proudest of because i always related the shotgun to the Cowboys. Since i believe it was Landry who created it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thinker Posted May 8, 2004 Share Posted May 8, 2004 The shot gun also limits the range of plays that you can run from that formation. You can run - but only generally draw plays or reverses. The key to Gibbs' offense in the past was that 90% of the playbook could be run from the 100's of different formations that he employed. He never had a huge number of plays and you don't have to to be successful. You just need to keep the defense off guard and not be able to anticipate plays. If the defense stacks one side of the field they'll get killed if the play goes the other way. If they play straight up, then we're man to man across the board and we just have to beat one guy to have a successful play. It's much easier to defend against more different kinds of plays that are run from fewer formations than the other way around. Because what ALL DC's do is study the film and determine the tendencies from particular situations and formations. If you constantly change that then defenses can't really game plan for you and you have the advantage. You want, as an offense, for the defense to not have the slightest clue as to what play you will run when you snap the ball. With the shot gun you've given up more than 60% of your options. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spanishomelette Posted May 8, 2004 Share Posted May 8, 2004 Originally posted by SkinsandTerps This is true. I cant ever recall the Skins using the Shotgun back in the Day. That was one of the things i was proudest of because i always related the shotgun to the Cowboys. Since i believe it was Landry who created it. There was one significant time that is was used in the '84 playoffs against the bears. Gibbs used it because the offensive line was plagued with injuries, and it was thought this would be the only way to give Theismann time against the aggresive bears D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCS Posted May 8, 2004 Share Posted May 8, 2004 If Joe Gibbs watches film and figures the best way to beat a team is to use the Shotgun, you better believe he will run it. He did use it in the past and will do so again if need be. That's Joe Gibbs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ravens777 Posted May 8, 2004 Share Posted May 8, 2004 I think the NFL of today is Defense Defense Defense......... Seems to be the flavor of the last few years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joey T Posted May 8, 2004 Share Posted May 8, 2004 Joey T lined up in shotgun quite often when our Oline was banged up. Even when it wasn't, Gibbs used it quite a bit with Joey on third and long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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