3DaysLatr Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 Of the available players left in FA who is out there that can be a vocal leader on the field and contribute to the play on the field? To me Warren Sapp is the only one that comes to mind. I've watcched a number of TB games over the past 2 years and one thing that is constant is that Sapp is the leader of that Defense. It's debateable as to where exactly he may fit in as far as who's the biggest contributer but Sapp is unquestionably the leader out there. I've seen him grab teammates and drag them to the huddle or off the field and then get right in their face for doing something stupid (ie: off-sides, personal fouls, late hits, any of this ringing a bell LA?). This is why I welcome Sapp, I know Vinny and Gibbs have both said he doesn't fit what we are doing but I can still pose the question. Who else can do it and why do you think so? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wwninja420 Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 Sapp would be one hell of an upgrade despite his mouth. But hat we really need is a good DE. Not really sure whos left but we have to get soeone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The X-Factor Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 We have a player named LaVar Arrington. I think he's a damn good leader for the D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3DaysLatr Posted March 11, 2004 Author Share Posted March 11, 2004 Originally posted by LaVar 56 Leap We have a player named LaVar Arrington. I think he's a damn good leader for the D. Arrington is not a leader. He's got great talent but how many times do you bite on the naked bootleg or commit an ignorant penalty on the sidelines before you learn. We need a guy that gets in other players faces or raises the level of play from those around them, LA doesn't do that, at least he hasn't yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjinhan Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 i agree that we do need a true leader on D and Sapp could be the answer... Lavar is seen as a leader of our D by most including me but when you watch the games you are dont get a feeling that players on D are following his led like the feeling you get when you see Ray Lewis play... not sure why that is the reason but Lavar along with coaches need to inspire people around him to play their max potential... maybe he need to get in people face more between plays just reminding them or maybe he needs to more vocal in the locker room... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The X-Factor Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 Yes he has made his fair share of mistakes. But what player hasn't? The guy plays with a level of intensity that few can match. A leader doesn't have to say anything to make a difference with their team. Their play can speak for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjinhan Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 Originally posted by 3DaysLatr Arrington is not a leader. He's got great talent but how many times do you bite on the naked bootleg or commit an ignorant penalty on the sidelines before you learn. We need a guy that gets in other players faces or raises the level of play from those around them, LA doesn't do that, at least he hasn't yet. being a leader doesnt mean that you are perfect... heck Ray Lewis who is prolly the best example of a leader on D makes mistakes time to time... D Green during last few years here did not play much on the field but he was still a leader on the D.... yeah he Arrington was single handedly costing us games repeatedly with his mistakes then its something we need to seriously worry about but not the best players on the team is always the leader... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parlett316 Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 Originally posted by LaVar 56 Leap Yes he has made his fair share of mistakes. But what player hasn't? The guy plays with a level of intensity that few can match. A leader doesn't have to say anything to make a difference with their team. Their play can speak for them. Armstead said publicly he waited for Lavar and Trotter to step up and be leaders. No one did so he had to do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The X-Factor Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 How did Armstead show that he was a leader? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3DaysLatr Posted March 11, 2004 Author Share Posted March 11, 2004 To this point Arrington's actions have cost us an awful lot of first downs and easy TDs near the goaline. Talent does not equal leadership and our defense has been totally without discipline for years. We need someone on the field that the players know will challenge them if they blow an assignment or do something stupid. Sapp will drag a guy right off the field after a successful 3rd down stop before he engages in a shoving match that results in a first down. Arrington will get involved in the shoving match and extend the opposing offense's drive, a leader doesn't do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjinhan Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 Originally posted by LaVar 56 Leap Yes he has made his fair share of mistakes. But what player hasn't? The guy plays with a level of intensity that few can match. A leader doesn't have to say anything to make a difference with their team. Their play can speak for them. umm playing great does help but just solely letting their play does not work inspiring others.... now maybe if you pull one of those Drew Bledsode thing two years ago when he had a deep cut on his neck only to have someone use a stable to close the gash so that he can come back into to play. now that can inspire people by them just observing... but mostly all great leaders no matter how great they are need to be vocal or at least have one of those stare downs that make these teammates feel accountable for even clapping half beat late coming out of the huddle. A perfect example can be easily seen in the NBA. When Jordan was in his prime in chicago, everyone knew if they did anything wrong they would have jordan whispering something nasty in their ear or most likely recieve one of this infamous looks... T-Mac on the other hand is prolly the best player in the NBA right now but he cant even kiss Jordan's feet when talking about leadership... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATCRedskin82 Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 At first i was opposed to Sapp. Now i dont think its such a bad idea. We need somone to get in some players faces. At the right price why not???/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjinhan Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 Originally posted by 3DaysLatr To this point Arrington's actions have cost us an awful lot of first downs and easy TDs near the goaline. Talent does not equal leadership and our defense has been totally without discipline for years. We need someone on the field that the players know will challenge them if they blow an assignment or do something stupid. Sapp will drag a guy right off the field after a successful 3rd down stop before he engages in a shoving match that results in a first down. Arrington will get involved in the shoving match and extend the opposing offense's drive, a leader doesn't do that. actually i have yet to see Arrington lose control and go after someone... i have seen him get called for questionable roughing penalties... i have seen him get pulled offside trying to make a play... i have seen him overpurse because he was trying too hard to make a play... the player we should look for is not someone who does all his assignments thus other players feel responsible for making mistakes here and there, obviously mistakes cant be too much. Instead we should be looking for a player who is respected by his teammates that other teammates will not allow themselves to disappoint the leader by not leaving everything on the field... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKINtil8tin Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 He'd definitely keep it interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3DaysLatr Posted March 11, 2004 Author Share Posted March 11, 2004 Arrington's shoving antics cost us twice at the end of the first half against the Giants last season. Extended their drive when we needed the ball back. Arrington plays out of control and loses his cool. I like Arrington but he's not holding the defensive players accountable. Some people are just not leaders, he's had plenty of time to take over as the leader of this defense and hasn't done it. It's not like I'm saying he sucks or that he should be traded or cut, I'm merely saying that is not a leader on the field and with the lack of discipline that has existed on this team we need a leader on the field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parlett316 Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 Originally posted by LaVar 56 Leap How did Armstead show that he was a leader? How did Lavar? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjinhan Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 we need a player who will bring some arrogance to the team... i am not talking about arrogance that Moss brings to the field which is taking plays off cause he thinks he is too good to just run around when the ball is not coming to him... i am talking about arrogance that Lewis, and maybe Sapp, brings toe the field is that they think they are too good to be losing so they will be making sure everyone is busting their arse to win at all cost... people will prolly crucify me for this but i think TO has some of the positive arrogance because he does bust his ass for every play to help the team win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjinhan Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 you talking about that shove? i think that was more of an automatic response that 90% of all NFL players would have just that Lavar got caught for it... and what that is like one or twice he got called for shoving back out of how many times that is just overlooked by the officials... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3DaysLatr Posted March 11, 2004 Author Share Posted March 11, 2004 Come on, do you really believe that about the shove? How often do you see offensive players start looking for altercations after coming up short on third down? It's like an automatic thing that happens, sure the fifteen yards is tough if they get caught but it's well worth the risk of extending the drive and getting fifteen yards when some dumb clout starts shoving back. A true leader recognizes this and pulls someone out of the fray before the yellow laundry flies. BTW, I checked and I owe LA an apology, Trotter got hit with the flag for unecessary roughness in the Giant's game not LA. Still, I've watched Sapp pull guys like Rice and McFarland away from altercations. That is what I'm after, a leader. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
novascotiadiesel Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 ah ha people are beginning to see the light, i have posted a thread on this topic before, now let me preface what i am about to say, i really like arrington and i think he is a tremedous talent, but he is no leader and him trying to take control and be the leader could actually have a negative effect on the performance of the d. this guy just doesnt have the skills to fill that role, and nothing is a bigger downer for a team than a "leader" who just doesn't say and do the right things at the right time. lavar just can't do it, end of story. it would be great if we got someone who could, i think it would really push us over the top, just not sure who could do it for us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedskinsMarchingBand Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 I think he(LAvar) will eventually be the leader of this team. HOW long before Daryll became the leader?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hogwash Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 Originally posted by LaVar 56 Leap We have a player named LaVar Arrington. I think he's a damn good leader for the D. ::shhh: That's our lil secret! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirk Diggler Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 We have enough chickens running around with their heads cut off on defense. We don't need another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlobberKnockinFootball Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 Originally posted by 3DaysLatr Arrington is not a leader. He's got great talent but how many times do you bite on the naked bootleg or commit an ignorant penalty on the sidelines before you learn. We need a guy that gets in other players faces or raises the level of play from those around them, LA doesn't do that, at least he hasn't yet. Man this is too funny. You're basing someone's leadership skills because he gets burnt on plays? Now that is true comedy. He's the leader on this team. That's why he got the the big payday. If you watch any of the games closely he's always talking to his teammates trying to get them going. He's the only one that really seems to care about what he's doing. I can't say that for many players in the league today. The guy is our leader end of story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Lavarminator Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 In time I think Lavar will be the leader of this D and TEAM, but he is not ready yet in my opinion. he still makes tons of mistakes himself. After that you would have to look at Trotter( i see leadership qualities in him) and Wynn, but the problem is how long are they going to be around-----this year if that even. Smoot will never be a leader though I love his intensity and confidence(some may say ****iness....lol). Someone will emerge though, im sure of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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