Guitar freaks, pick my new AMP!!!!

[BG]

Wassup all. I'm in the market for a new amp and I am as giddy as a schoolgirl. Lot of thought, played alot of amps(open for more suggestions) but I think I am settled on a stack. Mesa Boogie Triple rectifier #1, Marshall TSL2000 #2, Soldano SLO 100, #3, Marshall plexi #4.

Right now I have a Rivera 4x10. Three(really two) channel amp. Not bad but not what I really want in terms of sound and options. All the amps I listed xcept for the Soldano and Plexi have boosts on each channel. I really dig that. From what I have played out of the Mesa, you can dial in any tone you want virtually. Vintage(comes close) Hardcore shred with sustain and good clean(not like a twin but good enough for me) I hate fender's overdrive tone.

I utilize as many styles of music as possible, and I love a good clean tone to play rhythm and lead but I really really love a fat super overdriven "brown" tone.

What do you all think. Any suggestions?

I'm taking a mzssive loan on this...it's gonna kill me but I think I deserve it.

[codeorama]

I personally had the Peavy 5150 II and it was seriously awsome, but it was just too much. Way too much. I sold it and have a combo with an open back 12 and an extension cabinet with a closed back 12, 120 watts total power.

I have played throught all three you listed, the Mesa is awsome for heavy stuff, the Marshalls in my opinion are more traditional, but definately more hot rodded than older models and the Soldano is a little more juiced than the Marshall.

Personally, for the music I like (deftones, Tool etc...) I'd go with the Mesa. But I'm not sure what you are using it for.

[DaFunky1]

I don't play seriously, but I really like my Peavey Classic 50. I think it only has reverb, and for me it meets all my needs. Very heavy though. When I played my G&L Comanche through it the first time it blew me away. I would check the Peavey amps I think they are under rated from what I have seen.

Can't comment on the Marshall or the Soldanos as I am not to familiar with them.

Peace

[GSF]

IAMBG,

If you plan on doing a lot of shredding, The Mesa and the Peavey are both awesome. If you're going for pure tone, the Marshall 4 input plexis can't be beat IMO. Try out several of them though b/c they all sound a little different. Keep in mind that you have to use a pedal for your distortion with the plexi. I played for years with a Mesa v twin pedal into a plexi. Awesome clean and overdriven tones with crunch almost as heavy as a mesa rectifier. If I wanted serious crunch I would add in a metal zone. Good luck and enjoy the bliss of playing through a stack.

[BG]

I thought the Plexi, though one channel, had a TON of gain??? I must be mistaken then. I had two studio guys tell me about the plaxi the other day. You really have to have a pedal? Damn!!( wonder if they thoug it was a different Marshall amp...)

I do really want something that is two/three channel or has the option to boost each channel for lead playing.

THe Mesa has it, the Marshall TSL and the Soldano SLO(i think). I really don't want to sink a sh*tload of money into somthing that you have to have a pedal along with to get your "high-gain" tone. The other guitarist in my band has an old twin that he hooks a tube screamer up to. He's been set up this way for years while I have definitely shifted around a bit with pickups, guitars and effects. I can't stand the sound of that tubescreamer although his clean sound is absolutely amazing. I am hoping to get something that I'll be comfortable with for, well, EVER!!!!!

I play rock with funk/jazz kinda jammy band feel. I have had my way as of late throwing some heavy riffs and progressions around and I play with alot of gain live. So I guess you could say I do alot of shredding. Although I don't throw down like Tool or Deftones do.

Peavey's site is down right now. I wanna look into their stuff a bit more. I play a wolfgang and I love it. Believe it or not, and as gay as it looks, it is one of the most comfortable and killer sounding guitars IMHO. I have played many....

So holla back and I will let you all know what I get a chance to play later this week when I am off.

PS--

My band will be on tour coming up there to DC at Madam's Organ then onto NYC from there...

[codeorama]

IAMBG, The wolfgang rocks... I've played one several times. BTW, when Ernie Ball Music Man produced the VanHalen Model, I had one the first year, best guitar I've ever owned... Sadly, I had to sell it back in 94 so I could stay with my brother in Montana. I actually sold the guitar for more than I bought it. Damn nice to say the least. (sad to say, I played guitar in a van halen tribute band for a short time....lol)

If you haven't bought one of the amps yet, try the Peavy 5150 II, it is amazing.

Otherwise, a couple of things to remember. You are correct that the plexi may require a pedal... when recording, you will usually use less distortion and more volume to get the TONE of choice. The more distortion you use, the more buzz you get. With the Mesa, you can use the distortion or not. You can use volume to get distortion which is warmer or artificial distortion, which that head does supply, and get a buzzier distortion.

Examples.... EVHalen is clearly a Volume distortion, the 5150 II can replicate his tone with less volume as well as the artifical pregain distortion.

Pantera is clearly pregain distortion. DD uses his preamp to saturate the line signal and gets that metal chainsaw buzz.

The Mesa and Peavy 5150 will do both, but the 5150 is better suited for replicating the volume (post gain distortion) at lower levels.

[BG]

Code, do you know what I mean when I speak of this "brown" sound. I know they have used that term to describe EVH's tone and that is real close to it. Kind of rubbery, low ended-with less bite/harshness???

I'm confused cuz I definitely hear that in DImebag's tone at times.

So you are saying that in essence, EVH and other cats are just volume and master all they way up? WHereas Dime and other guys are Pregain way way up and master low?

Artists sounds I love:

the afformentioned dudes,

Eric Johnson, Derek Trucks, Warren Haynes, Frusciante(on blood sugar and Mother's)Santana. there's a few for now.

I will definitely look into the 5150...

Thanks y'all:high:

[codeorama]

Totally know what you mean about the brown sound... being in a VH cover band for a while, I had to duplicate it.

NOTE: Eddie's sound is different on each album. I prefer the Fair Warning sound. IF you listen to the Diver Down sound close, it's more shrill and buzzy. His sound gets more processed and wet sounding until F.U.C.K., then he's using the Peavy 5150.

All the guys like Eric Johnson, Trucks, Haynes and so on that you have named use "post gain" distortion. They crank it, the tubes heat up. The wide open tubes give it the sound they want. The Best way in my opinion to get that sound is the Marshall Power Brake.

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/sid=030728125829065164132086440448/g=home/search/detail/base_id/37239

This lets you crank your amp wide open, but you can turn the volume down so you dont get kicked out of the club you are playing in. That's why I got rid of my stack. I could never get the right sound at a lower volume. I have played through the power brake since then and it is legit. I wish I knew about it back then, I'd still have a stack. However, I would still have a combo for smaller gigs, lugging a stack sucks for something small.

But back to your question, Yes, Dime uses a solid state head, he doesn't even go for the tube sound. Randall makes the "warhead" which is his signature sound.

The Mesa head is what Wes Borland in LimpBizkit used and the guys in Korn used (before they switched to Rivera with the Subwoofers) and Godsmack use. The "rectifier" processes the sound differently and gives you that signature sound.

Finally, you could go with a "Line 6" head which has ALL of those sounds in it. Stephen Carpenter of the Deftones used one on their newest album. I've played through one of those too... pretty sweet. They truly replicate every amp on the market, plus they let you experiment.

One word of advice: Don't let the "name brand" or "looks" force you into buying something. Go to a music store and play through them. Take your time. You are about to make an big investment that should be the last amp you'll ever buy. Enjoy trying the different amps and making a decision based on your needs.

Just for fun, my old rig was an Ernie Ball Music man EVH model for standard tuning, a Kramer for Drop D tuning, CryBaby wah, MXR Phaser, MXR Flanger, Boss Digital Delay and a 5150 Half Stack.

We played stuff like Mean Street, Unchained, Running with the Devil, Dance the Night Away, Romeo Delight, Fools, I'm the One, Ice Cream Man, Hang Em High, Little Guitars, Pound Cake, 5150, The Dream is Over, Top of the World, Drop Dead Legs.... I could go on. I used to have a blast.

More recently, I've been in a cover band that has played Korn, Deftones, Tool, Limp Bizkit, Godsmack, Creed, Rage against the Machine and other current stuff...

I currently use an ESP MI with a Floyd Rose with the EVH D tuner on it, And ESP 7 string tuned down 1 whole step for Korn and an ESP 7 string strung up for Limp Bizkit.. (1 1/2 steps down, 2 high e strings)I used it for a few Deftones tunes too.. and a beat up telecaster restrung with 4 strings to play Nookie from Limp Bizkit.

I have the amp that I posted earlier and I have the following pedals: Steve Via Bad horsey Wah, Whammey II pedal, Boss Digital Delay, Danelectro Echo, Ibanez Echo/Delay, Ibanez ring filter, MXR Phaser, Ibanez Flanger, and an Ibanez Chorus

[RiggoDrill]

Yeah, the new line 6 stuff is really good. I have the Pod XT and love playing through it. Plus you can use it for direct-to-disk recording in the studio (or recording on your own).

[codeorama]

Originally posted by RiggoDrill

Yeah, the new line 6 stuff is really good. I have the Pod XT and love playing through it. Plus you can use it for direct-to-disk recording in the studio (or recording on your own).

I agree... IF I were buying a Head now, that's the way I'd go. I love the direct recording method, eliminating Mics are a good thing...lol

[DaFunky1]

Be careful of the old Flextone II's that Line Six put out. they had a problem with them. I had one and would get some terrible hum in it, no instrument plugged in and volume on about 2. Beat it with a rubber mallet and it went away for awhile, then would come back.

I've heard good things about the newer stuff though.

I wish you guys lived closer, maybe I could get a lesson or two during halftime.

Peace

[BG]

Sounds like with most of the amps I am interested in, I'll need that power brake. Though the Mesa sounded juicy at a pretty low volume.

For kickers, it's funny you mentioned the Rivera's that Korn uses. There are a few other bands out there right now using their stuff. I use an early 90's 4x10 combo. Not impressed with it. It's got some power, but the breakup sucks at higher volumes. In the studio, that has been what has turned me off the most. THere is way too much bite on the high gain channel, and the clean has a bit of the same issues. I upgraded the tubes recently(used mostly 12ax7 lps's)and I am sure if I used the correct rated tubes, it would have sounded a bit better in the studio. However, the gain was never enough and the clean channel is too bland. For me at least. This is definitly a "blues" amp. It doesn't excel in the high gain dept or jazz/funk tone dept.

Line 6 is the digital amps correct? They have the built in effects? What do you all think of those versus tube amp tone? Its been my experience that the digi amps and digi processors never replicate the nasty sounds of a tube amp.

Reason for asking is that I ma hoping to sink my teeth into a TC Electronic G major effect processor. If I can get the tone I want and all the effects I want all built into an amp witht the ability to call up any sound I want by hitting a pedal. Then that would require me to rethink my whole thought process....

Code you got some highly sought after gear there. My buddy who lives in the Mclean area, also used to be in a band with, has alot of the same gear you have...........

[GSF]

IAMBG,

Sorry to add to the confusion. Code gave a great description of how plexis work. You can get them to distort, but you have to jack them way up. This is no problem in the studio or at concerts, but your bandmates will kill you if you try to play this way at practice or at small to medium size gigs. The power brake is pretty cool, but it's hard to go back and forth between clean and dirty with it.

There probably is no better brown sound than a jacked up plexi. Hendrix, Eddie, Page, as well as most of the other guys you mentioned, all plexis. I saw Page on tv not too long ago and he was using Plexis with a distortion pedal and he had some serious tone cookin'. The 5150 II is a great amp and would probably be the easiest for you to use live, but I don't think it sounds quite as sweet as a good plexi. A Vtwin or similar tube pedal, into your TC processor, into a plexi would be a seriously sweet setup. There are a few different types of plexis, but mine looks like this.

[codeorama]

IAMBG... The Line 6 is digital, make no mistake, it's not power tube driven like the others. But in some cases, that's not such a bad thing. The technology has improved big time in the past 5 or 6 years and it's getting hard to tell the difference. I have a 32 track digital recorder on my computer and I record guitar several different ways. Sometimes, I've used the cranked amp and mike combo and it always gives me that classic sound, but now, you can get programs that replicate any amp. My bandmates couldn't tell the difference between what I played with the amp and what I plugged directly into my sound card on the computer. Crazy stuff.

Personally, I would go with the Line 6 because only a person with a serious trained ear would have any hope of telling the difference. However, If you want to duplicate the original greats for the sake of accuracy, the plexi and the powerbrake are the way to go.

I've been in bands for about 12 years so I do have some pretty good gear that I've collected over the years. I bought a drum set a year and a half ago and have a regular home studio. I lay down guitar, bass and drums down and my brother comes by and puts vocals down. When we finally find a bass player, we'll start recording in a studio. I'll probably play drums and guitar separately. We've played out so much that it isn't a big deal anymore, we really want to write some orignals and record them in a studio. On my 32 track digital program, I can get everything sounding professional except for the vocals. None of the rooms in my house sound right and I don't have a vocal processor that sounds professional enough to do the job.

Also, Yes, Line 6 has effects built in, so that's a cool piece too. You get alot for your money.

Like I said before, I would take you time and try each amp several times. Enjoy yourself.

[BG]

Thanks Gaskinsfan!!! That totally clarifies things for me. I thought my sources were confusing that amp with the JCM800. WHich looks to me to be the total shred amp. One channel. High Gain. Definitly part of what I want but I do want the ability to switch and boost channels. The Plexi sounds real nice.I mean real real nice. i just don't think that I can handle more pedals and set up during gigs just to switch back and forth between clean, lead and dirty. That is where some of the other amps mentioned seem applicable.

At the same time, I really want to know what my options are and learning the secrets of the sickest guitar players is what I want to know before I sink a few grand into something that I hope resembles the better tones in rock history.

So as far as simple set ups, why would you say the 5150 is an easier amp to work then a Mesa?

[codeorama]

I'm not sure if this is what he meant, but the 5150 II has 4 completely different channels that you can set for live playing with different sounds and a really cool footboard that is lit up for easy viewing on a dark stage. If I remember, the Mesa only has 2. With the 5150, you can go with a clean channel, light distortion, med distortion and heavy all with out using a pedal. The 5150 is also 120 watts. It has an extra pregain tube as well.. or wait, I believe the 5150 II has 2 extra pregain tubes. Anyway, try it out, it's easy to use and remember, when eddie VH had it created, they based the tone on the original plexi that eddie had. So it's already capable of what you are trying for AND is more versatile.

[BG]

One day I hope for something like this:

but not now. So I was reading this article about Warren and how he gets his tone. His Soldano which is his "lead" tone has a modification in the preamp section which I called Soldano about. It will bring the amp to a whopping $4225 with that modification added on to it. :twitch:

Amp has no boost settings:finger: No thanks Soldano.

[codeorama]

yeah, that's a pretty nice AND pricey set up. The one thing I always tried to remember is that as a muscian, your ear is three times as sensitive as the ear of the people you are playing too... many wouldn't honestly notice the difference between amp a and amp b. Recording is the hard part. It's on tape forever. It's also much harder to get a good tone down.

Regardless, good luck, I envy you in a lot of ways.

[BG]

Code, I'm definitly going to go check it out hopefully tommorow. Hope to bring my Les Paul and fire it up in there.

"If I remember, the Mesa only has 2. With the 5150, you can go with a clean channel, light distortion, med distortion and heavy all with out using a pedal."

You mean all without a stompbox? From the looks of it it seems that there are two channels. No boost switches on the pedal. I am trying to d/l the owners manual right now.....

[BG]

Originally posted by codeorama

yeah, that's a pretty nice AND pricey set up. The one thing I always tried to remember is that as a muscian, your ear is three times as sensitive as the ear of the people you are playing too... many wouldn't honestly notice the difference between amp a and amp b. Recording is the hard part. It's on tape forever. It's also much harder to get a good tone down.

Regardless, good luck, I envy you in a lot of ways.

Well I just got done with the studio and used the Rivera to track the whole album. Also used my old ADA preamp direct for a few things. Kinda convienient that I waited until now to shop for an amp, huh?:thud:

Well, for one I didn't have the money or the option for a loan a few weeks agao, and I know my Rivera won't make it through another tour. So I am confident the timeing is right. Just a funny coincidence though....:bong:

[GSF]

Originally posted by IAMBG

So as far as simple set ups, why would you say the 5150 is an easier amp to work then a Mesa?

I've never owned either, but I've played through both. They're both about equally simple, but I think the Peavey might sound more like the tones and players you described. Both of those amps kick ass, you just need to spend some time to see which one sounds better to you. Also, no disrespect to Code, but I'd stay away from the digital amps like the Line 6. I think you can hear and feel the difference when you play. The digital amps just don't have the meat to me. There is no subsitute for a cranked up tube amp IMHO. Anyway, I understand why you don't want to get into too many pedals, the cords and batteries can really be a pain. I'm just suggesting not to rule it out. I've played through many different rigs, some of them were pretty sophisticated, but I always wound up going back to pedals and tube amps like a Plexi or Super Reverb.

Here's one more tip for you, and I'll stop blabbering. No matter what kind of amp you play through, you need to use something to boost your signal going into your amp. I played for years before I was finally turned on to this fact by a vet player I used to know. A lot of metal guys, like Dimebag, use EQ pedals to do this. I found a vintage 70's mxr micro amp pedal, and it changed everything for me. You can play with so much more dynamics like that and no more thin guitar sounds that get lost in the mix. I never turned mine off. Good luck!

[BG]

Originally posted by GaSkinsfan

I've never owned either, but I've played through both. They're both about equally simple, but I think the Peavey might sound more like the tones and players you described. Both of those amps kick ass, you just need to spend some time to see which one sounds better to you. Also, no disrespect to Code, but I'd stay away from the digital amps like the Line 6. I think you can hear and feel the difference when you play. The digital amps just don't have the meat to me. There is no subsitute for a cranked up tube amp IMHO. Anyway, I understand why you don't want to get into too many pedals, the cords and batteries can really be a pain. I'm just suggesting not to rule it out. I've played through many different rigs, some of them were pretty sophisticated, but I always wound up going back to pedals and tube amps like a Plexi or Super Reverb.

Here's one more tip for you, and I'll stop blabbering. No matter what kind of amp you play through, you need to use something to boost your signal going into your amp. I played for years before I was finally turned on to this fact by a vet player I used to know. A lot of metal guys, like Dimebag, use EQ pedals to do this. I found a vintage 70's mxr micro amp pedal, and it changed everything for me. You can play with so much more dynamics like that and no more thin guitar sounds that get lost in the mix. I never turned mine off. Good luck!

Please...Blab all you want. I think us gearheads (at least me) feel we've struck a goldmine here with the freedom to talk shop about amps and waht not.

I think I did something similar to you with an eq. I hooked it into my slavemaster on my Rivera. Served as my lead shannel except it was affected by the channel that I slaved off of. EG: on chan 2(gain cahnnel) I would have the gain halfway up and the master pretty high, using the effects loop as an attenuation device. When I turned the slave on, it acted as a boost but didn't have a good tone until I threw the eq on there. It never really sounded the way I wanted it to no matter how I tweaked the eq.What's more is that it o/d'd the tubes even more. I have gone trough about 4 tube changes(preamp) in the last year and a half.

I guess I bring this up thinking for a second that my current amp still has a life of sorts, but I think we are definitly past that.:paranoid:

[BG]

Firing this one up again as well.

So I had to put this one off due to financial constraints but all the while have been testing some amps out on the side. I now have saved enough money as well as gotten some flow form other sources so I am ready here in the next week or so.

First, I started to get turned on to the new digi amps. Couldn't find anyone locally with the Line 6 Vetta. Really wanted to try that, but got to try the Cyber Twin. IT SUCKS!!!!! So fake sounding it disgusted me. THe amp really isn't all that prgramable IMHO but whatever. Not a Fender fan at all......

Tried a Johnson, same deal. DIGI amps looking bad so far. Still interested in the Line 6s but really hope htey get close to sounding like a real amp...

Went back for a second try on the 5150 II and Mesa Boogie triple recto. Both Rip but the 5150 is hardcore. A bit too much for me and is only two-channel without a boost. Triple sounds just bad-asss, the d*ckhead wouldn't let me turn it up. So I am a bit worried. I wanna hear the breakup. That was the main problem with my existing amp. I also tried a Mark IV. It was real nice, however I could have used more gain in general and on the rythym II side as well.

So last one for me is the Marshall TSL 100 which I hope to try tommorow. Just checking to see if anyone has any more ideas......

PS: right now my effects are just Wah, Volume, Boss digital delay/reverb and the little Zoom box. Not bad for a cheap price mind you. I hope to purchase a TC electronic g3 and run it as well....if anyone knows about that, love to hear from ya.....

[Ancalagon the Black]

This is the first thread I have ever bookmarked. Kudos to all of you for the knowledge and proficiency demonstrated here.

One day, when I'm all grown up and can afford something real, I will be surfing this thread again. Until then, I will have to be happy with my Marshall AVT100.

Side note: I was comparison shopping with a local sound engineer (he engineered for the Lemonheads and played with the Ramones when they were here), and he says that if you're stuck between two models, go with the Marshall. A lot of people will diss on Marshall these days, calling it "overrated," but it still dominates with the warm overdrive sound AND it has the highest resale value of any amp (not that you'll ever be selling yours).

[DaRock]

Gotta go mesa mane! Especially if you're thinking about the triple?..good lord!