Atlanta Skins Fan Posted May 12, 2003 Author Share Posted May 12, 2003 Originally posted by Kilmer17 that it relied on a "We know a guy" guestlist scam? My take is that they *did* know a guy in the Secret Service, who was supposed to be at Longboat Key, who could authorize the entrance. That this person wasn't located at 6am doesn't mean he didn't exist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelM Posted May 12, 2003 Share Posted May 12, 2003 Originally posted by Atlanta Skins Fan My take is that they *did* know a guy in the Secret Service, who was supposed to be at Longboat Key, who could authorize the entrance. That this person wasn't located at 6am doesn't mean he didn't exist. My question is, if he did exist, why did another Secret Service agent not recognize the name? I'm not the President, but I would expect the Secret Service to know at least the names of other agents protecting the President. It doesn't strike me as a duty where the agents rotate daily to various locations and jobs. Another hole I see in this is that the Secret Service agent didn't go check out the men in the van (if they existed). If someone called you and said, hey there is a group of ME men here to talk to the President, don't you think you might be a bit suspicious and look into it more than just saying I don't know anything about it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbooma Posted May 12, 2003 Share Posted May 12, 2003 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riggo-toni Posted May 12, 2003 Share Posted May 12, 2003 Actually, the plane that went down in PA. was likely headed for either the White House, Congress or CIA headquarters. This was the main reason Bush was not taken directly back to Washington, and his exact whereabouts were not disclosed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riggo-toni Posted May 12, 2003 Share Posted May 12, 2003 ASF, One thing about all your theories about the W "Cabal" being behind all this - Plotting for the 9/11 attacks began while Clinton was still in office. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atlanta Skins Fan Posted May 12, 2003 Author Share Posted May 12, 2003 Originally posted by riggo-toni ASF, One thing about all your theories about the W "Cabal" being behind all this - Plotting for the 9/11 attacks began while Clinton was still in office. And that's the genius part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redman Posted May 12, 2003 Share Posted May 12, 2003 Originally posted by Atlanta Skins Fan Getting Bush out of the White House made him much more vulnerable to assassination. If this indeed was an assassination attempt directed by a U.S. conspiracy, the chain of evidence for his travel plans should lead directly to the masterminds or their lieutenants. Let's try a sip of sanity here, shall we? Bush was less vulnerable to assasination in the White House, eh? I suppose that's true if you rule out the two jets intended to crash into DC targets and whose primary destinations appear to have been the White House. Fortunately, that's a difficult target to see from the air to an unpracticed flier, so the one hit a secondary target - the Pentagon, and the other appears to have crash landed in PA as a result of passengers fighting for control of the plane. So what does this mean with the van? Well, for starters, while you have to plan out a plot like 9/11 weeks in advance (I believe I read that the plotters got the final go-ahead around mid-August, and bought their plane tickets 2-3 weeks beforehand), the President's travel schedule can often change week to week depending upon political needs. So what this smells like to me is - if it was indeed an assasination attempt - was an attempt to kill Bush after they realized that he would not be anywhere near their targets on 9/11. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atlanta Skins Fan Posted May 12, 2003 Author Share Posted May 12, 2003 Originally posted by redman Let's try a sip of sanity here, shall we? Bush was less vulnerable to assasination in the White House, eh? I suppose that's true if you rule out the two jets intended to crash into DC targets and whose primary destinations appear to have been the White House. Fortunately, that's a difficult target to see from the air to an unpracticed flier, so the one hit a secondary target - the Pentagon, and the other appears to have crash landed in PA as a result of passengers fighting for control of the plane. So what does this mean with the van? Well, for starters, while you have to plan out a plot like 9/11 weeks in advance (I believe I read that the plotters got the final go-ahead around mid-August, and bought their plane tickets 2-3 weeks beforehand), the President's travel schedule can often change week to week depending upon political needs. So what this smells like to me is - if it was indeed an assasination attempt - was an attempt to kill Bush after they realized that he would not be anywhere near their targets on 9/11. My assumption here is that the White House and/or Capitol were strictly symbolic targets, assuming either was ever a target. The flights that were targeted at D.C. were second-wave flights that were less effective as assassination vehicles -- since at minimum, the White House and Capitol could be evacuated in time. (Cheney was reportedly evacuated by the Secret Service at 9:03, well ahead of both D.C. flights.) Bush's Florida trip was long planned. I believe the Secret Service was infliltrated well ahead of time, as is indicated both by the Longboat Key van incident and the Salon.com report of an Israeli spy campaign targeted at infiltrating the Secret Service, among other agencies. In this scenario, the Secret Service would always know in advance where the president was staying in Florida, and in fact chose the Colony resort on Longboat Key. While not a failsafe assassination plot, the Florida assassination plot had a reasonable chance of succeeding, and could be regarded as icing on the cake if successful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atlanta Skins Fan Posted May 12, 2003 Author Share Posted May 12, 2003 One interesting puzzler on the morning of 9/11 is that the Secret Service evacuated Cheney from his White House office at 9:03 am, but allowed Bush to continue his scheduled elementary school appearance at 9:00 am. This appearance lasts until Bush's departure at 9:34 am. Recall that the jet hitting the Pentagon was reportedly a "surprise", as the Pentagon was given no warning before Flight 77 hit it at 9:38 am. Why did the Secret Service evacuate Cheney at 9:03 am? Why was Bush allowed to continue a public appearance until 9:34 am, on a morning when it was becoming all too clear that America was under terrorist attack -- a fact that was so clear to the Secret Service that they evacuated Cheney from the White House? I thought the primary duty of the Secret Service was to protect the president. What explains the half-hour delay in protecting the president? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phanatic Posted May 12, 2003 Share Posted May 12, 2003 I for one am not convinced that 19 Arabic jack-legs were able to pull off such a stunning attack all by themselves. We're talking about flying huge airliners in such a manner that they hit their precise targets at their weakest points and brought down two skyscrapers. Heck, go online and check out the path and altitude changes of flight #77, the one that made a near perfect 360 degree turn and flew at ground level into the Pentagon. Well considering the auto pilot on all commercial airliners can takeoff, fly and land the plane without any assistance... no I'm not surprised. This isn't the age of, oh my god the pilots dead, what do we do. And yes as stated on many news programs at the time, they are capable of being programmed with the global coordinance from the sites choosen. Then the pilot can make the last second(s) adjustments to hit the target where they choose to. They even had simulators that had the NY skyline "in play". Hit wat you want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phanatic Posted May 12, 2003 Share Posted May 12, 2003 Heres a discussion thread BY PILOTS. Even some of them did not know there are aircraft that can auto takeoff. Interesting stuff for you frequent fliers. Link Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phanatic Posted May 12, 2003 Share Posted May 12, 2003 This one for ASF so he can further fall into insanity! Heres a post from the above link. Read the last paragraph. Username: Md88Captain From United States, joined Nov 2001, 627 posts, RR: 53 Reply: 22 Posted Wed Jul 17 2002 18:24:57 UTC+1 and read 1742 times: >the standard line airliner with the standard line pilot cannot do an auto takeoff.< True, but that's not stating it strongly enough. No airliner anywhere is certified for "autotakeoffs". No airline pilot anywhere has done a part 121 "autotakeoff". The term "autotakeoff" does not exist in any MD, BA, AB flight manual. Autopilots generally cannot even be engaged on the ground. Autotakeoffs DO NOT exist. I take exception to saying that certain aircraft have the "ability" to "autotakeoff" because it gives the impression to many here that airliners have this "ability" that the pilots/airlines just choose not to use. Airliners just do not have "autotakeoff" capability. Now I will concede that you can take just about any airplane and retrofit it to fly remotely like NASA/Military had done many times, but that's not what we are talking about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimboDaMan Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 I wouldn't minimize the skill it took for the pilot to hit the Pentagon. My neighbor talked to his AF buddies in the Pentagon soon after the attack. These guys had analyzed the flight pattern and felt it took amazing skill to manipulate a passenger jet that precisely, that low to the ground. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tmoney03 Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 I wonder if the talks about assasination, conspiracy, or plots of these natures are monitored by the FBI or something.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy-the-Greek Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 Only if Isreal chooses to alert them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stratoman Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 Originally posted by Ax ASF, you are a strange creature. Put down the drugs. Push away from the computer. Open your window and take a deep breath. (watch out for the snipers of course) Find the nearest clinic, and check yourself in. It might not be too late. Then again it might. :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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