Breaking Down The Defensive Backs

[The Fourth King]

But really it's going to look like this.

FS Landry Backup FS Stuart Schweigart

SS Doughty

CB Smoot

CB Springs (until Rogers is healthy)

NB Rogers

4B Tryon

Are you saying you think we should put Smoot as our number one? Because that CANNOT happen. I LOVE Smoot...but he is not a number one corner anywhere. Do you not remember how reliable Springs was down the stretch? 2 int's against the Bears!

[TheLongshot]

Are you saying you think we should put Smoot as our number one? Because that CANNOT happen. I LOVE Smoot...but he is not a number one corner anywhere. Do you not remember how reliable Springs was down the stretch? 2 int's against the Bears!

Well, I also remember him getting smoked by the Cowboys and Seattle.

I think it all depends on who is playing well at the time Rogers is ready for full time duty. Hell, if both are playing well, Rogers might not see the starting lineup.

Jason

[Area51]

People aren't "creating" a position battle. The coaches have said that its a battle between Stu and Reed for the safety spot. Thats why they signed Stu. Then they also commented that Moore could get some playing time at strong safety. These are Blache's words too. I posted the link earlier. The coaches are saying this, not the fans or the press.

It makes sense for the coaches not to just hand over Reed the safety spot, even though they know it is all but his(seeing as how solid he was as a second year player forced to start in an emergency situation). Doughty has been an overachiever who has had to face adversity and competition against higher ranked/more athletic players his entire time in the NFL. This is just Blache's way of keeping him hungry.

Reed is going to be the starter on SS when we open the '08 season against the Giants. I'm willing to sig bet on it. They said its a battle between Stu and Reed for the safety spot? Did they mention which safety spot? Because last time I checked, Reed was a SS and played horribly in his short stint at FS.

And yes, the fans and press blow everything up and even make **** up all the time. Take Sean Taylor(RIP) last year supposedly missing OTAs because he didn't like his new contract compared to LL's.

WTF are you talking about? Landry was looking GREAT much before his move to FS. He was a freakin Pro Bowl alternate for heavens sake. He was putting punishing hits on people and having them afraid to go across the middle. He was getting game winning hits, and furious solo tackles. He was everything we were hoping to get out of Arch Deluxe. To just dismiss his play at SS is just crazy.

If you're talking about a pass happy league, then isn't it even better to have a FS and a SS who can cover? We both agree that Landry can cover, so if we keep him at SS and put Stu at FS, then we have two players back there who can cover those passes as well as Landry helping out on the run. Do you really want teams trying to develop packages to expose Doughty as a liability in coverage?

The question is who's a better safety next to Landry, Stu or Doughty? People are assuming that its Doughty, not because of Doughty outperforming Stu in training camp, but because they want to see Landry at FS. I'd rather have my best 11 men on the field, so I say let Stu, Doughty, Moore and whoever else fight out the battle in training camp and we'll see who's back there next to Landry.

The better question is WTF were you watching? Landry was nowhere close to looking like a GREAT player before his position switch. Even many fans on this board were disappointed in his play(myself included). ST looked GREAT the moment he stepped foot onto the football field against the Broncos in the HOF game. In '06, playing more a SS role than FS, he had easily his worst season. And please don't bring up Pro Bowl(especially alternates) to prove how good someone is. Roy Williams has been to 5 straight Pro Bowls. So by your logic he has been one of the best safeties in the past decade.

Landry preserved ONE victory for us with his big hit on Kevin Curtis(who ****ed up by not tucking in the ball to his chest, btw). I also seem to recall Landry in that very same game missing a lot of crucial tackles, including at least one on Westbrook that lead to a big gain. People were afraid to go over the middle because of the punishing hits of ST, not Landry. Most of Landry's punishing hits on receivers came AFTER his switch to FS.

Yes, having two Safetys that are good against the pass is a good thing to have in this league. But guess what? Doughty did pretty damn good in coverage at SS, where he was even able to cover Jason Witten 1-on-1 in the end zone succesfully.

With Landry at FS, he would be able to make the big hits against receivers that not only cause alligator arms, but also cause incompletions on would-be big plays(Plaxico Burress). Not only that, but he has the ability to basically take away the deep ball, kind of like Sean Taylor. Do you think Stu would be able to do that? Or break up passes with big hits, especially against a receiver the size of Burress? HELL NO.

Doughty, OTOH, showed last year that he is more than capable of being a solid tackler and do a good job covering TEs. Doughty played much better at SS than Ryan Clark ever did. And with Landry's play at FS coming close to ST's, we could have a S tandem as good/even better than the one everyone seems to have loved(Clark/Taylor).

Think about it this way: Would you have moved Taylor to SS for Ryan Clark(who is a FS in Pittsburgh)?

I'd take an outstanding FS and a solid SS over a solid/possibly very good SS and average FS any day.

Here is a link from an article(although from pasquarelli) that says how a great FS is much more important and coveted by teams than a great SS.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/draft07/columns/story?columnist=pasquarelli_len&id=2847400

"Every team covets an enforcer at the safety position, a guy who provides aggressiveness and run support skills, but locating a safety with cover abilities is absolutely golden. Such a guy allows coordinators to play more coverages without having to use situational substitutions. It's almost a must anymore to have a safety with at least a hint of cornerback characteristics. In this year's draft, Landry clearly embodies those skills more than any other prospect.

The other top safeties are big hitters, but none comes close to Landry in coverage, and some of the others display too much stiffness."

[Geneva]

I hope we move away from using the Tampa 2 scheme this year. We simply do not have the LB's needed or the D-line needed for the scheme. It burned us more times than helped under Williams.

This has always been our problem. We can stop the run but have no pass rush. Our Defensive Backs can only cover for so long. Cover 1 or Cover 2, ?? If you don't blitz or get a pass rush from your DEs , your in trouble.....

[TheLongshot]

Here is a link from an article(although from pasquarelli) that says how a great FS is much more important and coveted by teams than a great SS.

Actually, it says nothing about a safety who can cover like a CB should be playing FS. In fact, the reason why it is becoming more important to have safeties with that kind of ability is because of the trend toward more athletic TEs. Before, you could just put a LB on the guy. But, now you need a guy with not only the size, but the speed to keep up with them. You'd want that guy to be the SS, since he's going to be closer to the line anyways. It is good if you don't have to platoon that guy with someone who is a better cover guy.

One thing the article points out is how versitile Landry is. He not only had 12 ints, but 8 sacks as well. The guy not only can cover, but he can rush the QB and penetrate the line. He has a lot of value beyond just being a cover guy.

I think my point still stands: because of his versitility, the team has the luxury to put out the best guy at the other safety position because Landry can play both positions about equally well. If that ends up being Doughty or Schweigert it doesn't matter much. It will all be good no matter where Landry plays.

Jason