OT: BREAKING NEWS: Man shot in Ashland, Virginia.

[Johnny Punani2]

This has to be Al-Queda terrorists.

[OaktonSkins/BushFan]

Originally posted by JJredskins00

They just reported that the shell casing found in the truck at the rental place in MD is not related to the sniper...there goes another potential lead in this case...:doh:

Any reliance on the perpetrator(s) slipping up is absurd. They need to execute a massive and multifaceted response the next time this happens. Something on the level of a paramilitary response involving counter sniper teams, troop (NG?) deployments, quarantine/shut down large areas, etc.

They'll probably call this latest "tactical response" over in just a few hours after they come up empty handed.

I'm not trying to disparage the efforts of local law enforcement and conventional law enforcement practice, but the time has passed to take this to a new level - even if that level is unprecedented.

[OaktonSkins/BushFan]

Just reported on FoxNews that all of the major roadways have been reopened. Once again, they have found nothing. Back to the old drawing board. Like I said, I think it the manner in which these "tactical responses" are conducted and some of the apparent strategies used are, at best, inadequate.

[Kevin West]

My gut feeling is this is a copycat killing. While the location and the time frame are consistent with the previous shootings, a few differences stand out:

1. Rear parking lots are seldom as well lit as the previous shootings.

2.Such parking lots are usually shallow in depth (and/or length). If the "wooded area" has any density, it's unlikely that the usual 100 yard distance would be available.

3. The victim was moving. Most of the others were stationary.

4. He was shot in the abdomen. All previous victims, as far as I know, were shot either in the head or upper torso. which leads me to...

5. Efficiency. Most of the victims were killed instantly. The teenager in Bowie would have died without immediate hospitalization. This victim was concious all the way to the operating room.

6. Ballistics. I know nothing about ammunition, but from what I've read, a.223 through the abdomen would have left an exit wound-- and enough hemmoraging-- to have killed this victim.

P.S. As I was leaving the bank this morning, a midlle-aged goof, walking parallel to me, grabbed his chest and pretended to be shot. "Just kiddin' ya, buddy," he said. Oh well, I thought, every one living in the DC Metro area has to deal with this in their own way.

[Ford]

Originally posted by 56Arrington56

This has to be Al-Queda terrorists.

I really don't think so. I was thinking about it, and I'm far from an expert on their religion, but would one of those islamic extremists ever write 'I am god' on a tarot card? I really don't think so. What I've seen from their religion is that those who practice it are very submissive and would never make that hubristic a statement.

[Art]

I've gone back and forth on whether this is terrorism or just domestic crime. The more I think about it the less likely I think it can be organized international terrorism. Even if they had the restraint not to take credit for it, the fact is, the whole of the Middle East would be buzzing with what is happening and our operatives over there would hear something. It's like with Bin Laden. If he were still talking to people, we'd know he was alive. Right now, we don't have a clue, which means he's dead, or run so far underground as to amount to the same.

If a terrorist group was responsible for this, there'd be a leak and the Middle East would be dancing in the streets again.

[bulldog]

of course it could be another disaffected American working on his own and supporting a cause from afar, but in all likelihood I think when they catch this guy it will be someone who has a rage against authority and specifically the police or military.

perhaps he failed to make it through police training or the military because of behavioral problems?

or maybe its a guy with that in his background that had ANOHTER event such as a crushing divorce or loss of a child put on top of that prior rage that set him over the top?

in either case, it appears the police are really at the beginning again. we don't know any more now than we did after the first week.

unless that shell casing found in the box truck rental is significant and gives the police something solid to follow, we could see several more killings before this guy gets caught.

Remember, a guy like David Berkowitz, even though he killed fewer people, was on the loose for months in New York City despite the mobilization of forces and participation of the FBI.

[Buddha]

With this latest shooting further into Virginia, I can't help but wonder if this is the work of our own "local" terrorist enclave-- the Al Fuqra. If you aren't familiar with them, read this...

Al Fuqra in Virginia

[ChrisM]

"The use of anti-sniper special forces will probably be necessary. Perhaps a deployment of National Guard units would assist in blanketing areas part of a dragnet. "

OaktonSkinsFan, do you always over-react to such a degree?

Do you really think anti-sniper forces would be effective in this situation?

How would you possibly deploy Guard units to the site of a shooting in time to do any good?

[OaktonSkins/BushFan]

Originally posted by ChrisM

"The use of anti-sniper special forces will probably be necessary. Perhaps a deployment of National Guard units would assist in blanketing areas part of a dragnet. "

OaktonSkinsFan, do you always over-react to such a degree?

Do you really think anti-sniper forces would be effective in this situation?

How would you possibly deploy Guard units to the site of a shooting in time to do any good?

I don't know, you tell me. That's what these guys are trained for. Why do you think they wouldn't be effective in this situation?

NG forces -

I think they could be deployed fairly quickly and assist in blanketing an area. Manpower is required to provide an overwhelming presence in any given area to conduct exhaustive searches.

Am I really overreacting? We have the FBI, ATF, VA/MD State Police, DC Police, and a score of local police forces working this case with absolutely no success to speak of. An analyst on Fox (ex FBI Counter-Terrorism agent) made the very interesting comment that we have civilian agencies engaged in what is essentially a paramilitary like operation. These guys are not trained or equipped to engage in this type of operation. At a minimum, it seems that could use extensive military support.

If this continues for much longer, and we have every indication to believe it will, then I suspect many people will begin to revisit their initial fears of bringing in military assistance.

[Tommy-the-Greek]

Sniper units will never have any affect on a highly mobile target that strikes and runs in a matter of minutes. This isn't a battleground where there is a clearly defined front line. The killer is not giving notice in advance to possible targets.

Now if you turned the whole tri state area into a martial law setting with national guardsmen at all primary and secondary road intersections and searched all vehicles night and day until this Ahole is caught then it would be effective,but at what cost? Even if you catch the killer they won the war because they achieved there goal in terrorizing the area and changing our way of life. Quite frankly this is a no-win situation. It sets a new precident for future copy cats foreign and domestic. There is no shortage of morons in our world who see this as a chance to be famous or to get people to listen to there warped logic or for there cause. My only question is how long before other wacko's use this new method to act out there sick desires.

[OaktonSkins/BushFan]

Originally posted by tommy-the-greek

Sniper units will never have any affect on a highly mobile target that strikes and runs in a matter of minutes. This isn't a battleground where there is a clearly defined front line. The killer is not giving notice in advance to possible targets.

Now if you turned the whole tri state area into a martial law setting with national guardsmen at all primary and secondary road intersections and searched all vehicles night and day until this Ahole is caught then it would be effective,but at what cost? Even if you catch the killer they won the war because they achieved there goal in terrorizing the area and changing our way of life. Quite frankly this is a no-win situation. It sets a new precident for future copy cats foreign and domestic. There is no shortage of morons in our world who see this as a chance to be famous or to get people to listen to there warped logic or for there cause. My only question is how long before other wacko's use this new method to act out there sick desires.

Are you speaking authoratively - speaking from experience - in regards to your comments about anti-sniper units? I'm certainly not, but at least one of these talking heads have suggested that such methods could be successful.

Quite frankly, it would seem the only way to catch this POS would be to close off EVERY roadway and search EVERY car within a resonable and calculated circumference of the crime scene. We can either sit back, bend over and take it or react accordingly. I, for one, am prepared to give a little in return for increased security. It's a different world.

[Tommy-the-Greek]

I have an uncle who was a trained sniper and did his 20+ years in the Army. I am closer to him then anyone else on my mother's side. Since she died when I was very young he is the only one on that side of my family I spend alot of time with. I have gone hunting with him dozens of times and he is the best shot I have ever seen with any weapon. We have spent time talking about this and he told me if he was within 2000 yds of this guy and had a clear line of sight he would drop him with one shot.

He has told me the biggest problem is they don't know what his target is going to be or when he is going to strike. If they had some idea of location and time then they could position snipers to take him out, but they don't have that crucial information.

I am the ultimate military brat. All of my uncles and my Dad served in the arm forces. I am the only one of my male siblings who didn't go in. I was born at Walson Army Hospital at Ft Dix/McQuire's AFB and spent most of my young years bouncing around from base to base. Everytime I talk to my relatives they tell me there opinions which I believe them to be experts and not talking heads with an agenda.

[ChrisM]

Tommy-the-Greek is exactly right.

Anti-sniper squads are not trained for nor intended to be used on these type targets.

In this situation ALL RESPONCE, regardless if its civilian or military is limited by the fact that they have no idea when or where the next shooting will occur. Therefore they can only respond after the fact. to an area that may be some distance away. This is far different than on a battle field where a know sniper is operating and can be "hunted" and taken out.

Even deploying the Guard at every intersection, checking vehicles etc.. untill this creep is caught would prove ineffective because he/they could simply cease activity untill the "lock down" was ended.

The fact is that law enforcement authorities, be it local, state, FBI etc.. are far better trained to deal with this situation than the military.

I personally believe that doing road checks etc.. after each shooting have little chance of success. It simply takes too much time to set up and there are to many "holes in the net".

I suspect capture will come the old fashion way. A tip from suspicious neighbor or perhaps a witness with a cell phone following the get-away. Someone noticing a suspicious van watching an area and calling law enforcement prior to the shooting, or maybe something a lucky as the shooter being envolved in an accident during the get-away etc..

These common occurances are far more likely to end this rampage than any military "gun flash detecting eye in the sky".

BTW, I put about as much stock in the "talking heads" as I do in the sports reporters!!

[Potato Sack]

Originally posted by codeorama

I'm watching now too. The media is making this whole thing worse. First they say the schools are safe, so he shoots a child, then they say he does it in unpopulated areas, so he shoots someone at Home Depot. Now, they have said he doesn't kill on the weekends, so look what happens. He is obviously paying attention to what the media is reporting and proving them wrong.

We all know the media sucks in relation to football, now they are clearly showing they just plain suck.

Wait a minute! The media is going to report on incidents such as this because it IS newsworthy whether you like it or not. They are merely stating a fact before it happens. Because a psychopath is paying attention to a media outlet and going against what they're saying does not place blame on the media. Would you rather the media said nothing? The media is the best medium about which to generate clues about this madman. We now know he's in a white van with a blown taillight. We know what his MO is! Without the media we know nothing, nationally. The more we see, the better a witness will we become. Don't blame the media for everything. Believe it or not, police USE the media as a resource. I know, I'm part of the media, and we have HELPED police CATCH criminals. There was an armed robbery in our area in which an innocent woman was killed. We got the info out quickly and then it went to America's Most Wanted. The two killers were caught in the midwest, some 1000 miles away from us. Think people didn't get the info from the media?

Without us, the man in the white van wouldn't have to worry about hiding out as much. He has to change his gameplan every time news hits the air. The people you should be blaming are the law enforcement individuals who are letting this idiot slip threw their fingers.

Sorry, I have to disagree with you. I say continue to use the media as a resource. This man will be caught soon enough!