Fox News' Juan Williams takes a stab at being a racist

[nelms]

http://www.washtimes.com/op-ed/20051004-092417-2060r.htm

Here's the last paragraph:

On Fox News Sunday, NPR's Juan Williams claimed that Mr. Bennett's remark "really speaks to a deeply racist mindset." Unfortunately, as Opinion Journal's James Taranto shows, to prove his point, Mr. Williams winds up proving Mr. Bennett's. "f I'm sitting here," Mr. Williams said, "on a national talk show and I say, you know, maybe if we killed off these white people, we wouldn't have so many mass murderers in America, you'd say, Juan, you're out of your mind." Mr. Williams also suggested killing Christians for "being involved in a lot of wars"; Jews, for "dominating the economy"; and older people, for causing "a great burden on our Social Security system." As Mr. Taranto concludes, "No fewer than six times in a 10-minute segment, Williams did exactly what Bennett did... namely, offer an outrageous hypothetical to illustrate a point."

What Mr. Bennett did wrong was forget that the mainstream media holds conservatives to a different standard.

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I won't hold my breath waiting for Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, Nancy Pelosi, and the rest of the usual suspects to denounce these remarks. We all know that liberals never make racially insensitive remarks.

[Art Monk Fan]

The finer points of both rhetoric and irony are lost on most -- more's the pity. Juan's a smart man, he understood the rhetorical technique, used it himself, and yet was oblivious to the irony. :doh:

Either the press is stupid and lazy, or they're so blinded by the sensational that they've lost their souls. I don't know which option frightens me more.

[Destino]

Wait a minute, you're faulting the media for not making a big deal out of a guy that is talking about what another guy did wrong and using the same terms to explain why what the other guy did was wrong?

[lckelsey4]

Juan Williams is not the brightest guy out there, but to say what he said is racist is absurd.

[Art Monk Fan]

Wait a minute, you're faulting the media for not making a big deal out of a guy that is talking about what another guy did wrong and using the same terms to explain why what the other guy did was wrong?

I dno't know about anyone else, but I'm faulting the media for not taking the time to understand what Bennett was saying in the first place and running with the sensational headline.

[wskin44]

Wait a minute, you're faulting the media for not making a big deal out of a guy that is talking about what another guy did wrong and using the same terms to explain why what the other guy did was wrong?

I think that what he is saying is that media did the right thing not to make a big deal out of Juan Williams' statements.

What he is saying is that the media was wrong to make a big deal out of Bennett's statements which were basically crafted the same way that Williams' were.

I agree with him. Bennett's statements were taken out of context. Bennett has some blind spots for sure, but he is not so stupid to have meant what the media accused him of meaning. He was calling out the racist implications of what a listener had said using a common debating technique.

[Thiebear]

Wait a minute, you're faulting the media for not making a big deal out of a guy that is talking about what another guy did wrong and using the same terms to explain why what the other guy did was wrong?

Wait so your faulting the people for faulting the the people for - faulting the media for not making a big deal out of a guy that is talking about what another guy did wrong and using the same terms to explain why what the other guy did was wrong?

[Destino]

I dno't know about anyone else, but I'm faulting the media for not taking the time to understand what Bennett was saying in the first place and running with the sensational headline.

I took the time to understand and I came to the conclusion that what Bennett said was insulting. The reason is he unintentionally landed on a nerve ending. When using any racial comment you have to be aware that certain segments of the population have certain sore spots, you may not like it but the fact is this is 100% true. I'll look at it from the point of view I'm more familiar with, as a hispanic american.

The hispanic community is constantly equated to illegals. We get jokes about "hey go pick some more strawberries" from idiots that think such comments are just oh so so funny. So then a sore spot is developed. If a radio host goes on and says "if you aborted every latin american baby you wouldn't have anyone to pick your strawberries " that would piss me off even if he followed it with a disclaimer that abortion is wrong or that such a move is bad. Why? Because he just succeeded in equating me with a stereotype that happens to be a sore spot.

That was Bennett's mistake. It was the fact that people think he was saying that abortion was a great idea for controlling the crime rate. It was that his hypothetical equated blacks with crime. And it did exactly that.

I dont' think the man is a racist, but he certainly stuck his foot in his mouth.

[Destino]

Wait so your faulting the people for faulting the the people for - faulting the media for not making a big deal out of a guy that is talking about what another guy did wrong and using the same terms to explain why what the other guy did was wrong?

Yes. The difference between what Williams said and what Bennett said are easy to see. Williams is explaining why certain hypotheticals are insulting, and crafting other insulting versions to better relate and convey this message. Bennett wasn't doing that. He was arguing against an abortion point when he accidentally equated blacks with the crime rate.

[SkinInsite]

Wait so your faulting the people for faulting the the people for - faulting the media for not making a big deal out of a guy that is talking about what another guy did wrong and using the same terms to explain why what the other guy did was wrong?

So are you faulting the people for faulting the people for faulting the people for faulting the media for not making a big deal out of a guy that is talking about what another guy did wrong and using the same terms to explain why what the other guy did was wrong?

[Thiebear]

Yes. The difference between what Williams said and what Bennett said are easy to see. Williams is explaining why certain hypotheticals are insulting, and crafting other insulting versions to better relate and convey this message. Bennett wasn't doing that. He was arguing against an abortion point when he accidentally equated blacks with the crime rate.

No he wasnt, he was doing what the above is: Using other stupid illustrations to show that using a stupid illustration is not part of the solution.

= same thing.

[Destino]

No he wasnt, he was doing what the above is: Using other stupid illustrations to show that using a stupid illustration is not part of the solution.

= same thing.

The context in which the statements were used is different. Context matters though I can see why people arguing that both men are guilty of the same thing, would want to ignore it.

[nelms]

No he wasnt, he was doing what the above is: Using other stupid illustrations to show that using a stupid illustration is not part of the solution.

= same thing.

Both of them were idiots and possibly racists for what they said. You could actually make the case that what Williams said was worse because those were words that came directly from him. I wish Williams would have elaborated on the "Jews dominating the economy". Sounds kinda Nazi to me.

[Destino]

Both of them were idiots and possibly racists for what they said. You could actually make the case that what Williams said was worse because those were words that came directly from him. I wish Williams would have elaborated on the "Jews dominating the economy". Sounds kinda Nazi to me.

Have you considered that "sounds kinda Nazi" was the point he was trying to make? It's exactly what I was talking about with "sore spots".

[nelms]

Have you considered that "sounds kinda Nazi" was the point he was trying to make? It's exactly what I was talking about with "sore spots".

That may have been his point, I don't know. No one knows 100% if someone is racist or not, unless they come out and say it. It's all conjecture. So at a minimum Williams (and Bennett) were just ignorant and stupid. On the other extreme maybe Bennett is a white supremacist and Williams is an anti-Semite Farrakanian.

[Art Monk Fan]

I took the time to understand and I came to the conclusion that what Bennett said was insulting. The reason is he unintentionally landed on a nerve ending. When using any racial comment you have to be aware that certain segments of the population have certain sore spots, you may not like it but the fact is this is 100% true. I'll look at it from the point of view I'm more familiar with, as a hispanic american.

The hispanic community is constantly equated to illegals. We get jokes about "hey go pick some more strawberries" from idiots that think such comments are just oh so so funny. So then a sore spot is developed. If a radio host goes on and says "if you aborted every latin american baby you wouldn't have anyone to pick your strawberries " that would piss me off even if he followed it with a disclaimer that abortion is wrong or that such a move is bad. Why? Because he just succeeded in equating me with a stereotype that happens to be a sore spot.

That was Bennett's mistake. It was the fact that people think he was saying that abortion was a great idea for controlling the crime rate. It was that his hypothetical equated blacks with crime. And it did exactly that.

I dont' think the man is a racist, but he certainly stuck his foot in his mouth.

I take your point. But I'm not sure that it's really a stereotype; there is a higher crime rate among African Americans at this time, especially for young males. Bennet was the first drug czar and spent a lot of time in the trenches and on the front lines in the worst parts of the most roubled communities trying to get to the root of the drug problem. He's been on the front line ans speaks from experience. I'm sure it's a sore spot with some, but that doesn't make it untrue.

I'm sorry poeple have made fun of you for being hispanic; I'm half Polish and people have been picking on us for so long, we're not even allowed to be offended anymore.

[Destino]

I take your point. But I'm not sure that it's really a stereotype; there is a higher crime rate among African Americans at this time, especially for young males. Bennet was the first drug czar and spent a lot of time in the trenches and on the front lines in the worst parts of the most roubled communities trying to get to the root of the drug problem. He's been on the front line ans speaks from experience. I'm sure it's a sore spot with some, but that doesn't make it untrue.

I'm sorry poeple have made fun of you for being hispanic; I'm half Polish and people have been picking on us for so long, we're not even allowed to be offended anymore.

I agree with your point of view here that there is a lot of truth to this particular sore spot. It's sad. I just wanted to explain why his comments could lead to some people getting upset. I do not however think the guy should be fired.

Also - I'm not as easily insulted as I let on in my last post. I wrote that to demonstrate how a sore spot can come into play in situations like this. If you heard my group of friends joke around you'd think we were Carlos Mencia junkies.

[Art Monk Fan]

Also - I'm not as easily insulted as I let on in my last post. I wrote that to demonstrate how a sore spot can come into play in situations like this. If you heard my group of friends joke around you'd think we were Carlos Mencia junkies.

Yeah, me either, hell Polish jokes are funny. And I'm also Scotch/Irish so between the vodka, scotch, whiskey and beer, I don't care what they say about me, I won't remember it anyway. :laugh: