Chrisbob74 Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 I know this gets discussed a lot but I just thought I'd throw some thoughts out that I had rattling round in my head. First off, we hear some of the arguments against Monk for the Hall (by some certain people in the media) and some of those involve Gary Clark being the guy who made the big play. I wonder how much Clark and Monk (along with Ricky Sanders, who had some very good years as a Redskin) hurt each others argument for being a HOF'er. Now, if I try to be objective, I can buy to a (very small) degree that they helped each other by spreading the threat as it were, but if that has to be taken into consideration shouldn't it also be objectively considered that both hurt each others numbers (again, factor in Sanders as well). I know it all annoys us so much that Art is screwed by the Hall each year and if you speak to many of the fans of other teams that pop into here and on other sites, ever they put aside their dislike for the Skins and in the main agree he is worthy of the accolade - but it also annoys me that each year Clark isn't even on any short list (and I mean the short list that comes out September time with about 75 players on it). Just some numbers to ponder: - In 11 NFL seasons, Clark caught 699 passes for 10856 yards resulting in 65TD's and a 15.5 average per catch. - 549 receptions for 8,742 yards and 58 TDs came in 8 years as a Redskin. - He also caught 66 passes for 821 yards and 3TD's in two years with the NFL Jacksonville Bulls (he caught 56 passes in 1984, 10 in 1985, I am assuming he must have missed most of the '85 season injured).......remember, it's the Pro Football Hall Of Fame! - That gives Clark a total of 765 receptions for 11677 yards and 71 TD's as a professional. - Clark became the first player in NFL History to catch at least 50 passes in his first 10 seasons in the league......not Rice, not Monk, not Largent............Gary Clark. - Clark also added 58 receptions for 826 yards and 6TD's in post season play with the Redskins. - Clark scored TD's in both Super Bowl XXII and Super Bowl XXVI. He enjoyed a 100+ yard day vs the Bills in SB XXVI. - While never leading the league in yardage or receptions any year, Clark did come top 4 in yardage four times in his NFL career and top 10 in receptions four times. - Clark went to 4 Pro Bowls and made All-Pro twice. And that isn't even worthy of getting on the shortlist!!!!!???? A few other numbers to throw at ya all: - In the 8 years that Art Monk and Gary Clark played together in Washington, Art Monk totalted 545 receptions for 7,372 yards and 41 TDs. - In the 7 years that Clark, Sanders and Monk played together, Sanders also added 356 receptions for 5216 yards and 32TD's (Monk and Sanders also played together in 1993 but Clark left to join the Cards after the 1992 season). - A couple of receivers on last years shortlist, Micheal Irvin and Mark Claytons numbers compare pretty well with Clarks. Clayton caught 582 passes for 8974 yards for 84TD's with a 15.4 average per catch over 11 seasons. Irvin caught 750 passes for 11904 yards and 65TD's with a 15.9 average per catch over 12 NFL seasons. Now, I do think Irvin is HOF worthy, I was glad he didn't go first ballot 'cos that would have rubbed Monks face in it even more IMO but while the Cowboys did have some other weapons in their passing game, no one was putting up close to Irvins production (maybe Novecak in receptions for a few years) whereas both Clark and Monk were putting up big numbers at the same time along with Ricky Sanders whose numbers probably aren't HOF worthy but are by no means sloppy. Clayton, while a decent receiver, benifited from the Dolphins and Marino throwing it all over the place, though he did have to share balls with Mark Duper and Nat Moore at times. Basically, I think we all know the reasons why Monk keeps getting dissed by the Hall every year and agree they are petty to a point and he has being campaigned for so much by fans and other media members that it seems to be alienating the people who need to be convinced to vote Monk in, even more against him. But how about a case for Clark as well. This guy was a deadly weapon, putting up big numbers and making big plays. I know there are a lot of guys from Gibbs first era and before (Hanburger for example) who also have a worthy case, but I wanted to press Clarks case upon you all because of the link to Monks case and also 'cos Gary was my first real favourite Redskins player *Thanks to the search function here which provided me with some data/numbers from this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinking Skins Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 As much as I love Gary Clark and Art Monk, the recent talk that I'm hearing about Dan Reeves and Tim Brown being Hall of Fame worthy, kinda makes me think that just about anybody could be 'argued' into the Hall of Fame. The fact that Monk wasn't voted in on a first ballot, and the things that are being said as far as the reasons why not, kinda let me know the opinions that the Committee has of him. Now I feel like that parent at school who is arguing with the teacher because she says that her student deserves an award too. Of corse we're going to feel great about Monk and Clark and their leegacy as Hall of Famers, but the fact that others dont, kinda tells you the chances they have of getting in there. Its sad but true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrisbob74 Posted July 15, 2005 Author Share Posted July 15, 2005 Well, Clarks mum can't even say to the teacher that he "deserves an award" because as far as I am aware, he has never even being on the shortlist. As I stated in my original post, I mean the shortlist that comes out in Spetember when the whole process starts. I remember reading a while back that tp get on that first shortlist, the only requirement was to have made the Pro Bowl at least one (which Clark did). The year I read that (maybe things have changed since) Jay Schroeder and Johnnie Johnson (ex Cards and Jets RB) were on the list!! Last year, Louis friggin' Lipps was on the first shortlist. It can be argued til the death about whether such a player should get in to the Hall, but in Clarks case, to not even be on the shortlist is a friggin' joke! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prophet Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 clark is the best wr i've watched in a skins uniform... no hate towards the others.. but thats just my opinion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 Gary Clark at one point was second to Rice for a few year period(maybe even a 5 year period.) He had great numbers and played in the USFL too. How is he NOT in HoF discussions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dreamingwolf Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 if they are saying the other recievers made each other better, induct them all!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLongshot Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 Originally posted by Ghost of Nibbs McPimpin How is he NOT in HoF discussions? I don't think he was great long enough. He started to peter out around '91. Art Monk gets considered because he actually broke records, but his case is hurt because he was more of a possession receiver. He made a lot of catches, but not usually for big yards. It is a good point tho, because even tho Art played about 5 years longer, their career stats are pretty close. Jason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boobiemiles Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 How is Lynn Swann and Stallworth in and not Monk and Clark. They got just as many rings. I think as fans we have a responsibility to make sure the Hof recognizes the contribution these players made. The critics saw them play on highlight reels, we saw them play like champions. And Dan Reeves and Tim Brown deserve to be in the Hof without a doubt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLongshot Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 Originally posted by boobiemiles How is Lynn Swann and Stallworth in and not Monk and Clark. They got just as many rings. No. Clark has two, Monk has three. Both of those Steeler guys have four rings. (And Lynn Swann was MVP of one of those Super Bowls.) Jason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 I think you have some very valid points. Clark was undoubtedly our most feared WR from about 1986 until 1991. Whether that is good enough for him to get into the HOF, I don't know. I like your stat compilation though, it does seem like Clark should at least be considered! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walking Deadman Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 I'd love to see both Monk and Clark in the HOF, However, I'm worried that neither them: Green, or any of the other hogs may make it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrisbob74 Posted July 15, 2005 Author Share Posted July 15, 2005 Originally posted by goskins I'd love to see both Monk and Clark in the HOF, However, I'm worried that neither them: Green, or any of the other hogs may make it. Green walks in first year he's up. If not, the Hall is truely a joke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yank Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 Grimm not in is the biggest travesty of all. He was voted on the All-Decade team of the 1980s. Nuff said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lachey79 Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 nm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowghost Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 I think Clark was awesome. I don't think he will make in HoF. It is a shame that Monk isn't in yet, but there are others that should have been voted in by now, and have not made it. If you have the chance to watch some of the Skins games, during Art's last 2 yrs here, even the announcers would say "future HoF'er Art Monk. Its just too bad they don't vote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard saunders Posted July 16, 2005 Share Posted July 16, 2005 Monk-Clark-Jacoby-Grimm One year..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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