Henry Posted December 9, 2004 Share Posted December 9, 2004 Originally posted by NavyDave GBear she isn't the ultimate role model when you consider she was cheating on her US Marine hubby while he was out at sea with Nomar in Hawaii and was caught, danced around the question. Besides Soccer hinders girls from geting an early start on mastering the culinary and domestic upkeep skills they have to bring to a relationship before they get a hubby Navy, you bring this up anytime anyone brings up Mia Hamm. So I ask you, since you've chosen Doug Williams as your avatar, do you consider him a role model or pioneer of any kind in sports? Just wondering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardi gras skin Posted December 9, 2004 Share Posted December 9, 2004 I like team sports. Tennis, golf, the NBA, bowling and most other individual sports bore me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilmer17 Posted December 9, 2004 Share Posted December 9, 2004 I'll never forget the look on one of the dream teamers early on when the ref correctly called him for palming the ball. It was as if he had never heard the rule before. If the NBA called the rules by the rulebook, it would be a bettr game. But the fault lies with all parties. The refs for not calling it right. The League for not making the refs do so. The teams for not forcing the league to do so. And the players themselves for getting away from playing a great 5 man game and making it a 1 or 2 man showboat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Posted December 9, 2004 Share Posted December 9, 2004 Originally posted by 5Arrington6 Excuse me Einstein, I did watch the olympics, and if your telling me that the losses the USA team had was because of officiating, your in denial. The "Dream Team" was not only beat, but beat like a drum. They didnt lose by just 1,2 or 3 points. Its not just the fact that they SUCKED against the international world, its just that if they are a "Dream Team" shouldnt they have blown every team out so that a sorry excuse like officiating can be used? I thought this was the "elite" players. AND then you come into the NBA season and you see guys like Kobe and his off court problems, Artest and his Shenanigans, and you have to ask yourself? Why do I attend or watch games to support these morons. I open my mouth simply because fools like you who open theirs about the NBA are in denial about the "DECLINE" in the NBA. You're right, the team being several years younger in average means nothing. You're also right, the spread of basketball academies and greater cultivation of international talent means NOTHING. You're also right that poor coaching and a poorly selected team with few jump shooters(and what ones were are streakier) means nothing. You're right that the top shooters still being American in the NBA(and the top FT shooters) and the best passers still means nothing. The fact that all the knowledgeable basketball commetators said that the world would catch up sooner and that they'd need to select teams the right way and get the RIGHt coach(not one who hates young talent like Brown and doesn't paly to their strengths) means NOTHING. Just what YOU say matters. Artest and Kobe--wasn't there some guy who cut someone at USC with a samurai sword? Are the stories not fileld with such incidents (And real sexual assaults?) You just are hypocritical about it. I can at least respect someone who is consistent enough to say "Hey, football and basketball have some bad actors I won't watch them" rather than "oh just the NBA is the problem, no issues with MLB(steroids,chairs in the stands, fans beating up coaches) or NFL." BTW, I think the NBA is stronger because of young talent that is emerging than it has been in the last couple years. Also some of the good teams have established some continuity like the Spurs and Sonics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Posted December 9, 2004 Share Posted December 9, 2004 Originally posted by Kilmer17 I'll never forget the look on one of the dream teamers early on when the ref correctly called him for palming the ball. It was as if he had never heard the rule before. I'll never forget the look on Michael Irvin's face when he was called for a push-off. I'll never forget Tra Thomas face when he was called for a hold. I'll never forget the look on Barry Bonds' face when they called a strike on the edge of the zone. We can go on. How someone who watches football(including me) could talk about officiating in other sports is HILARIOUS. The Nba refs actually do the most intense study and work for their jobs. The NFL is the place plagued by terrible officiating and it means more because the NFL's games are more easily decided by one big play than the NBA is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ancalagon the Black Posted December 9, 2004 Share Posted December 9, 2004 Mia rocks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMac Posted December 9, 2004 Share Posted December 9, 2004 Im hypocritical about every sport to a point and admit especially with the NBA. With the contracts they give these players in the NBA I think its right. They dont play by the rules. I was a huge Laker fan in the late 80's and early 90's when basketball wasnt what it is today. My favorite player to watch was James Worthy and his baseline, no fancy dunks. It was a team sport back then. Boston-LA, NY-LA, now that was basketball. Its simply a different game now and no better than the WWF. Thats MY opinion, BUT Im not the only one who feels the same. The NBA is in decline. Its in decline because this generation of basketball is not what it used to be. That article that was posted here from the writer in KC was right on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drex Posted December 9, 2004 Share Posted December 9, 2004 What I find interesting is that the same people who criticize the players in the NBA today for occurrences such as the palming violation, were probably the same individuals rooting for players during the "golden age" such as Michael Jordan, Patrick Ewing, who were notorious for palming/carrying, and traveling violations. Am I the only one here who recalls how often Jordan carried the ball, or how he blatantly pushed off of Byron Russell in Game 6 of the 98 Finals to hit the shot that sealed the win for the Bulls? Or how about Ewing taking 50 steps before he takes a jump shot? Speaking of trash talking, were there bigger trash talkers than M.J., or Larry Bird? Thats my whole beef with the people who criticize the players of the league today: it's not as if they are the only culprits of what your accusing them of, these problems have been taking place for years. As for the performance of the so-called Dream Team this season, blame that on the individuals responsible for selecting the team, as well as the top players who bailed out of their committments. The team was chosen badly, essential factors such as team chemistry and shooting the basketball were not taking into enough consideration while selecting this basketball team, with the end result being a team, while extremely talented, also being extremely young and rough around the edges. You send a team with the likes of Garnett, Kobe, T-Mac, Bibby, Pierce, Kidd, and others, and that team wins the Gold medal every time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMac Posted December 9, 2004 Share Posted December 9, 2004 I will also add this. If you give me a league full of Tim Duncans like someone else mentioned above, I would watch again. I can live w/o the Iverson's and Artest's and Rodmans Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drex Posted December 9, 2004 Share Posted December 9, 2004 Originally posted by 5Arrington6 I will also add this. If you give me a league full of Tim Duncans like someone else mentioned above, I would watch again. I can live w/o the Iverson's and Artest's and Rodmans The thing is, there are more Tim Duncans in the league than you would believe. It's just that negative press of the Artests and the Iverson's block out the plights of those players. Look at Grant Hill, a good citizen on and off the basketball court, who is having a tremendous comeback season from ankle injuries that have plagued him over the last few years, while helping his team be quite successful thus far this season. Or maybe the Seattle Supersonics, with Ray Allen, Rashard Lewis, etc., defying the odds by beating the Spurs last night while holding one of the top records in the Western Conference. Or the Phoenix Suns, and their exciting and fundamentally sound brand of basketball. The problem that exists today is the media pays little or no attention to the several positive occurrences of the season. Instead, they want to play the Artest/Pacer Piston brawl over and over on the TV screen, or focus on the likes of Latrell Sprewell yelling expletives or fans, or the utterly tiresome coverage on the Kobe-Shaq rift, despite the fact that its been months since they have been teammates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Posted December 9, 2004 Share Posted December 9, 2004 Tim Duncan...LOL, I love it "hell, he's light-skinned, speaks pretty well, no cornrows and hell he's even married to a white woman ---he's ok" It's like the cats who talk about Shane Battier, "that's a good guy to follow." Why isn't Dwyane Wade good to follow, how the hell do they not know who he is if the claim the NBA is in such bad shape? I've already gone through the list of players on the US team and pointed out the only potential bad actors. I've even gone through the NBA rosters and done the same exercise. It doesn't matter. Haters wanna hate, lovas wanna love, I dont want to do none of the above, I want to piss on you. :laughs: Perhaps it's because NBA rosters are smaller than football teams and thus the bad apples are magnified. Or maybe there is a certain dehumanising element to the helmets and pads and the intimate nature of basketball puts everything on display. Does anyone remember a few years back the worry over gang members in pro sports(or at least guys who had associations back in the neighborhood) Some of them had even flashed a sign(one was a WR with the Dolphins.) Now, I realize that there ARE people who lump in the characters in football with basketball and at least they are consistent. I've worked in retail as security and I wish I could tell yuou how many "nice" "upstanding" people were involved in big-time theft in these stores, both employees and 'customers.' Last time I checked none of you are refusing to walk into Target or wherever because of the percentage of bad actors at these stores(and there are a LOT.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KTrainSkinsFan Posted December 10, 2004 Share Posted December 10, 2004 Originally posted by 5Arrington6 I will also add this. If you give me a league full of Tim Duncans like someone else mentioned above, I would watch again. I can live w/o the Iverson's and Artest's and Rodmans The thing is, the people you have named, Artest, Iverson, and Rodman aren't selfish/bad basketball players. They know the game. They are good at what they do. Rodman and Artest are well known for their DEFENSIVE abilities. That seems to go against the "players today are all offense, razzle-dazzle, selfish" mantra. If you don't like their character or off the court antics...that's fine...but I am tired of the "players today don't play the game" argument. Like somone said before, watch a game like the Wiz/Nuggets game the other night and tell me that they don't know how to play the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeSkins Posted December 10, 2004 Share Posted December 10, 2004 Originally posted by Skin-N-NY While I hate soccer, men's or women's, I don't mind seeing that on ESPN at all. I have a 11 y/o girl. I think Mia was a great role model. I would much rather have my daughter following her than Brittany Spears or Courtney Love. While I also find soccer boring, I will agree with you to that extent. Only because the husband thing hasn't gotten enough press to make younger people aware of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeSkins Posted December 10, 2004 Share Posted December 10, 2004 Originally posted by Kilmer17 It IS fake. They dont play real basketball. They play a new ****ized version of the game. They said that about the forward pass. Whoever invents the game gets to make the rules. Whatever the NBA is doing right now is basketball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMac Posted December 10, 2004 Share Posted December 10, 2004 Originally posted by Ghost of Nibbs McPimpin Tim Duncan...LOL, I love it "hell, he's light-skinned, speaks pretty well, no cornrows and hell he's even married to a white woman ---he's ok" It's like the cats who talk about Shane Battier, "that's a good guy to follow." Why isn't Dwyane Wade good to follow, how the hell do they not know who he is if the claim the NBA is in such bad shape? You missed Rodman and Carmen Electra in your analysis. Keep on! :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Posted December 10, 2004 Share Posted December 10, 2004 Originally posted by 5Arrington6 You missed Rodman and Carmen Electra in your analysis. Keep on! :laugh: :laugh: I think stability like adds extra points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilmer17 Posted December 10, 2004 Share Posted December 10, 2004 Originally posted by Ghost of Nibbs McPimpin Tim Duncan...LOL, I love it "hell, he's light-skinned, speaks pretty well, no cornrows and hell he's even married to a white woman ---he's ok" It's like the cats who talk about Shane Battier, "that's a good guy to follow." Why isn't Dwyane Wade good to follow, how the hell do they not know who he is if the claim the NBA is in such bad shape? I've already gone through the list of players on the US team and pointed out the only potential bad actors. I've even gone through the NBA rosters and done the same exercise. It doesn't matter. Haters wanna hate, lovas wanna love, I dont want to do none of the above, I want to piss on you. :laughs: Perhaps it's because NBA rosters are smaller than football teams and thus the bad apples are magnified. Or maybe there is a certain dehumanising element to the helmets and pads and the intimate nature of basketball puts everything on display. Does anyone remember a few years back the worry over gang members in pro sports(or at least guys who had associations back in the neighborhood) Some of them had even flashed a sign(one was a WR with the Dolphins.) Now, I realize that there ARE people who lump in the characters in football with basketball and at least they are consistent. I've worked in retail as security and I wish I could tell yuou how many "nice" "upstanding" people were involved in big-time theft in these stores, both employees and 'customers.' Last time I checked none of you are refusing to walk into Target or wherever because of the percentage of bad actors at these stores(and there are a LOT.) My comments had nothing to do with attitudes or off court activity. But your quick leap to assume that shows your own biased nature. I like Tim Duncan because of the way he plays the game. People who insist that others who hate the game are racist, are hiding something themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cfujskins Posted December 10, 2004 Share Posted December 10, 2004 Originally posted by Kilmer17 My comments had nothing to do with attitudes or off court activity. But your quick leap to assume that shows your own biased nature. I like Tim Duncan because of the way he plays the game. People who insist that others who hate the game are racist, are hiding something themselves. Well if I'm not mistaken, Tim Duncan is not the only one in the NBA who consistantly plays on a top notch level.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilmer17 Posted December 10, 2004 Share Posted December 10, 2004 Of course there are. I me4ntioned Duncan because he's the most visible. I could name them all, but the mods wouldnt like it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
codeorama Posted December 10, 2004 Share Posted December 10, 2004 Originally posted by Ghost of Nibbs McPimpin I've worked in retail as security and I wish I could tell yuou how many "nice" "upstanding" people were involved in big-time theft in these stores, both employees and 'customers.' Last time I checked none of you are refusing to walk into Target or wherever because of the percentage of bad actors at these stores(and there are a LOT.) I did the retail security thing too while I was in college playing baseball... I caught an engineer at NN shipyard that made more than 100K per year and I caught the Police chief's wife (NewportNews Va) among others. You are right, theives come in all sizes shapes and income brackets. However, I doubt seriously that Kilmer's admiration if Tim Duncan has anything to do with Duncan being of whatever shade. If you are racist, you are racist, I doubt that someone honestly grades them based on the degree of thier "darkness"...:doh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweet Sassy Molassy Posted December 10, 2004 Share Posted December 10, 2004 Originally posted by gbear Do you have a daughter? Do you want her to think that a woman can make a living in sports outside of tennis or golf? No! You're joking right? Because that'd be pretty funny if you were. Originally posted by gbear Do you want her to think that a woman can be successful enough in sports to get advertising contracts on a level with Jordan at the end of his career? C'mon, now we all know that's not true.I'm just kidding. I respect Mia Hamm. And I think that she deserves time in the spotlight as much as the next famous male sports-person. I have watched female soccer, and it is a pretty good sport. Not my favorite. But I've caught myself watching, and I respect their abilities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Posted December 10, 2004 Share Posted December 10, 2004 Originally posted by codeorama However, I doubt seriously that Kilmer's admiration if Tim Duncan has anything to do with Duncan being of whatever shade. If you are racist, you are racist, I doubt that someone honestly grades them based on the degree of thier "darkness"...:doh: Just so Kilmer knows, I wasn't talking about him with that but with 5Arrington6 and I was kidding. But if you don't think people who have such feelings take it easier on light-skinned blacks who 'seem more like them' than you'd be dead wrong. Not only does that exist within the black community(light skinned vs dark) but it was fostered by some slave owners back in the day who preferred light skinned blacks. Light-skinned blacks could also "pass" even when the whites around them actually suspected they might be black. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
codeorama Posted December 10, 2004 Share Posted December 10, 2004 Originally posted by Ghost of Nibbs McPimpin Just so Kilmer knows, I wasn't talking about him with that but with 5Arrington6 and I was kidding. But if you don't think people who have such feelings take it easier on light-skinned blacks who 'seem more like them' than you'd be dead wrong. Not only does that exist within the black community(light skinned vs dark) but it was fostered by some slave owners back in the day who preferred light skinned blacks. Light-skinned blacks could also "pass" even when the whites around them actually suspected they might be black. I know it exists within the black community, I work with alot of them and they have told me about that, I was only referring to it from a white perspective. Black is black IMO, shades don't matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilmer17 Posted December 10, 2004 Share Posted December 10, 2004 Originally posted by Ghost of Nibbs McPimpin Just so Kilmer knows, I wasn't talking about him with that but with 5Arrington6 and I was kidding. But if you don't think people who have such feelings take it easier on light-skinned blacks who 'seem more like them' than you'd be dead wrong. Not only does that exist within the black community(light skinned vs dark) but it was fostered by some slave owners back in the day who preferred light skinned blacks. Light-skinned blacks could also "pass" even when the whites around them actually suspected they might be black. Fair enough. It did seem though it was directed at me. It also made me think of an old SNL skit with Garrett Morris. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mookie0720 Posted December 10, 2004 Share Posted December 10, 2004 Nobody cares about Women's soccer thats the thing...If she was in a bigger women's sport, maybe people would care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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