Glenn X Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 <a href="http://www.msnbc.com/news/639057.asp" target="_blank">http://www.msnbc.com/news/639057.asp</a><br /><br />The above is a link to an excellent and thoroughgoing article written by Newsweek's Fareed Zakaria shortly after the Sept. 11th attacks. However, the fact that Zakaria's piece is almost six months old now does not detract from it merits or its insights.<br /><br />The following is a quote from Zakaria, who is Muslim, that should be of interest to his spiritual "brother," Kefka:<br /><br /> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Israel treats its 1 million Arabs as second-class citizens, a disgrace on its democracy. And yet the tragedy of the Arab world is that Israel accords them more political rights and dignities than most Arab nations give to their own people. Why is the focus of Arab anger on Israel and not those regimes?</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riggo-toni Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 Excellent articles! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romo Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 I remember i read a piece shortly after Sept 11 featuring Toronto Maple Leafs hockey player Dmitry Yushkevich. Sorry i tried to find it but i was unable.<br /><br />Basically he described his childhood in Soviet Russia and how is taught to hate all things American, how his history texts were skewed with anti-american sentiment.<br /><br />For me it at least helped explain how people growing up in an Anti-American society, like that of the Taliban, and other parts of the Islamic world could hate America so much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest <Kefka> Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 Bismilla'hir Rahmaa'nir Raheem.<br /><br />In the name of Allah, the Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful.<br /><br />"The Politics of Rage: Why Do They Hate Us?"<br /><br />"THE ONES WE HAVE HEARD so far have been comforting but familiar. We stand for freedom and they hate it. We are rich and they envy us. We are strong and they resent this. All of which is true." <br /><br />All of which is not true. I'll start with the easiest one. "We are rich and they envy us". Sadly this is a very, very, poor argument. Quite childish in fact. You see in Islam the life of this world is only a temporary stay. We are born one day, we die one day. Fact of life. In fact, it is a temporary stay for everyone. Every single living creature will taste death in one form or another. I will die one day, as will Art, even Diehard, hehe. Not a single person can escape this fact. In Islam, Muslims believe. We believe that we will be resurrected before God and answer for our actions good and bad. Therefore for every practicing Muslims man and women, the true life, the eternal life is in the hereafter. Practicing Muslims by faith are not and can not be materialistic. Yes we work, and earn a living lawfully, but Muslims are not to be money hungry. Because all the money in the world will not avail us, nor you on the day of Judgement. Stating Muslims are all poor is hardly true. Stating all Americans are rich is hardly true. Therefore this arguement has no basis. <br /><br />Neeeeeeeeext.<br /><br />"We stand for freedom and they hate it." <br />The US definately does not stand for freedom. Well freedom to oppress, yes. You say, this is a democracy and people have a right do as they please. Actually this is more a republic than a democracy. And people don't do as they please. They live under a certain set of rules, ie- The Constituion. Who sets these rules? The people you say? So if the majority of the people state that black Americans are 1/3 of a person (as it once was) it's the law and the way of life. If the majority vote that marajuana is legal, than it too is the law and way of life (ie alcohol, drugs, etc...). What I'm trying to say is, the majority is not always what is just and fair. I'm sure you agree. When you vote for your President, your votes me squat. It is the electoral college which actual "votes" for the President. In contrast,in Islam, practicing Muslims live under the set of rules provided by God Almighty. Sent in His books [Taurat (Torah), Injeel (Gospels or Bible) and the Furqaan or Quraan] to His Messangers (Adam, Noah, Joseph, Jacob, Abraham, Isaac, Ishmail, Moses, Jesus, and Muhammad, peace be upon them all) to guide all of Mankind. Who is more just, who is more fair? Ask yourselves this question. In Islam we believe God is the better judge. Thereby living under the laws of the Qur'aan and the examples of Muhammad (peace be upon him).<br /><br />"We are strong and they resent this."<br />The US government thinks it's strong. But in reality God is the All Mighty and All Wise. God clearly states in His books, of how he destroyed past nations much stronger than the present. God is eternal, we are not. Histroy repeats itself.<br /><br />"But there are billions of poor and weak and oppressed people around the world. They don’t turn planes into bombs. They don’t blow themselves up to kill thousands of civilians. If envy were the cause of terrorism, Beverly Hills, Fifth Avenue and Mayfair would have become morgues long ago. There is something stronger at work here than deprivation and jealousy. Something that can move men to kill but also to die."<br /><br />True, there are billions of "poor" and weak" oppressed who don't committ to such acts. But I ask you, if you are poor, and weak, and you have no arms, and you are constantly put down. How can you expect these "poor and weak" people to fight back? They simply can not. He is right in one aspect, there is something stronger behind this. Something in which men and women are willing to sacrifice their own lives for. Lets continue.<br /><br />"Osama bin Laden has an answer — religion. For him and his followers, this is a holy war between Islam and the Western world. Most Muslims disagree. Every Islamic country in the world has condemned the attacks of Sept. 11. To many, bin Laden belongs to a long line of extremists who have invoked religion to justify mass murder and spur men to suicide. The words “thug,” “zealot” and “assassin” all come from ancient terror cults—Hindu, Jewish and Muslim, respectively—that believed they were doing the work of God. The terrorist’s mind is its own place, and like Milton’s Satan, can make a hell of heaven, a heaven of hell. Whether it is the Unabomber, Aum Shinrikyo or Baruch Goldstein (who killed scores of unarmed Muslims in Hebron), terrorists are almost always misfits who place their own twisted morality above mankind’s." <br /><br />Ok, first and foremost let me explain something. Islam, or the religion of Islam does NOT belong (as in ownership) to the people of mankind, nor the Muslim followers, nor myself, nor Art, or even his counterpart Ariel Sharon. Not even to Muhammad (peace be upon him). Islam is the religion, the way of life, which God has choosen for mankind. So, for example, when God says pray five times a day in His book. We as Muslims pray. When he states fast in the month of Ramadaan. We fast and obstain ourselves from wrong-doing. Now when the situation arises. When the "poor and weak" are being oppressed, when they are being killed, and their homes are being destroyed. God has ordered, has commanded the Muslims to fight for their cause. But at the same time, not to transgress the limits or bounds which God has set up. Meaning, you can only fight those who are fighting against you. Muslims can not kill the women, children, old, weak, religious scholars. Muslims can not destroy plants, trees, crops. They can not destroy peoples homes and possesions. Muslims are ordered to fight until they either accept Islam or stop fighting. Plain in simple. Basically Muslims can not resort to what the Israeli zionists are doing to the Palestinian people. To what the US government is doing in Afghanistan. <br /><br />"But bin Laden and his followers are not an isolated cult like Aum Shinrikyo or the Branch Davidians or demented loners like Timothy McVeigh and the Unabomber. They come out of a culture that reinforces their hostility, distrust and hatred of the West—and of America in particular. This culture does not condone terrorism but fuels the fanaticism that is at its heart. To say that Al Qaeda is a fringe group may be reassuring, but it is false. Read the Arab press in the aftermath of the attacks and you will detect a not-so-hidden admiration for bin Laden. Or consider this from the Pakistani newspaper The Nation: “September 11 was not mindless terrorism for terrorism’s sake. It was reaction and revenge, even retribution.” Why else is America’s response to the terror attacks so deeply constrained by fears of an “Islamic backlash” on the streets? Pakistan will dare not allow Washington the use of its bases. Saudi Arabia trembles at the thought of having to help us publicly. Egypt pleads that our strikes be as limited as possible. The problem is not that Osama bin Laden believes that this is a religious war against America. It’s that millions of people across the Islamic world seem to agree."<br /><br />Yes, millions agree that the US governments support of Israel is without a doubt wrong. <br /><br />"This awkward reality has led some in the West to dust off old essays and older prejudices predicting a “clash of civilizations” between the West and Islam. The historian Paul Johnson has argued that Islam is intrinsically an intolerant and violent religion. Other scholars have disagreed, pointing out that Islam condemns the slaughter of innocents and prohibits suicide. Nothing will be solved by searching for “true Islam” or quoting the Quran. The Quran is a vast, vague book, filled with poetry and contradictions (much like the Bible). You can find in it condemnations of war and incitements to struggle, beautiful expressions of tolerance and stern strictures against unbelievers. Quotations from it usually tell us more about the person who selected the passages than about Islam. Every religion is compatible with the best and the worst of humankind. Through its long history, Christianity has supported inquisitions and anti-Semitism, but also human rights and social welfare."<br /><br />Alhamdulilah. The attack on, what was it, Oct. 11? Has led people to awake from their sleep of ignorance. And has led people to read and research about Islam and its history. Islam IS the fastest growing religion in America. And I invite all of you to learn about Islam as well. Now back to the article. "The Quran is a vast, vague book, filled with poetry and contradictions (much like the Bible)". Sadly my brother he is vastly incorrect and seems to be much like the other "born" Muslims who are only Muslims because it was their parents religion. Islam is nothing more than a tradition (what the US government wants all Muslims to be like). Like I have stated time and time again. The Qur'an was revealed in the Arabic language, and has been kept in tact, unlike the Taurat (Torah) and Injeel (Gospel or Bible)in its original form. To fully understand the Qur'an one MUST learn the clasical Arabic language. The language which was spoken at the time of the Quraish (the people of Makkah). Had he understood this he would have known that the Arabs of that time were the best in poetry. When the Qur'an was revealed it was unlike anything the people had read, or heard. Much like the miracles of Jesus (peace be upon him), giving life to the dead and curing sickness. The Miracle given to Muhammad (peace be upon him) was the Qur'an. In it was a challenge to all of Mankind then to come up with a verse, a single verse like it. The challenge was given then and is still here today. <br /><br />"Searching the history books is also of limited value. From the Crusades of the 11th century to the Turkish expansion of the 15th century to the colonial era in the early 20th century, Islam and the West have often battled militarily. This tension has existed for hundreds of years, during which there have been many periods of peace and even harmony. Until the 1950s, for example, Jews and Christians lived peaceably under Muslim rule. In fact, Bernard Lewis, the pre-eminent historian of Islam, has argued that for much of history religious minorities did better under Muslim rulers than they did under Christian ones"<br /><br />Holy Moly. Someone finally states what I've been stating.<br /><br />"All that has changed in the past few decades. So surely the relevant question we must ask is, Why are we in a particularly difficult phase right now? What has gone wrong in the world of Islam that explains not the conquest of Constantinople in 1453 or the siege of Vienna of 1683 but Sept. 11, 2001?"<br /><br />Yes true. The Muslims should ask themselves. What has gone wrong. The answer is, they have left the teachings of the Qur'an and the Sunnah of Muhammad (peace be upon him). The Muslim world has become ignorant, rather the Muslims have taken the religion of Islam for granted. <br /><br />bbl... conintue it late inshallah. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romo Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 Kefka- Are there no translations of the Quran? or are you just saying that to fully understand that Quran you should read it in its original language untranslated? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest <Kefka> Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 Hi Romo sits to pee,<br /><br />There are plenty of translations of the Qur'an. Just go to <a href="http://www.quraan.com/" target="_blank">Qur'aan</a> . Yes that is what I'm saying. To fully understand it, one must read it in its origianl untranslated language. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inmate running the asylum Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 I dont think most Arabs hate Americans. Yeah we see them on the 6 o'clock news shooting machine guns up in the air and burning American flags, but those are not the real Arabs. Most of those are put-on demonstrations for the press. I never travel on prearranged tours, but have backpacked through Arab countries on more than one occasion -- Jordan, Egypt, etc., -- and I never found the Arabs to be hostile. In fact they were kinder and more helpful to me, than people you would find on streets of New York for example. The trouble with most Americans is that if they happen to go to the Middle East, they go on these guided tours, where they are bused around with other Westerners, and they never get to meet the real Arabs on the streets.<br /><br />I hate to see this Arab bashing that is going on now because of 9/11. Its noteworthy that of all 19 hijackers involved in 9/11, they were all imported from outside the U.S. to do the job. None of them where American Arabs.<br /> <br /> <small>[ March 12, 2002, 08:43 PM: Message edited by: inmate running the asylum ]</small> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest <Kefka> Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 Just to let the you guys know, who don't know, Being an Arab doesn't mean they're Muslims. A common sterotype. Though the majority of the people in the Middle East are Muslim, there are Arab Christians, even Arab Jews. <br /><br />Inmate running the asylum, you are welcome to come to my house in Saudi Arabia anytime you like. hehe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romo Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 Thanks Kefka Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest <Kefka> Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 np... <img border="0" title="" alt="[smile]" src="smile.gif" /> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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